Hey guys, I'm building my first large frame AR. I honestly don't rememer if I've even shot a large frame before but I'm jumping in. Here's my list of stuff so far, and intended goals. I have an Aero Precision lower (Betsy Ross edition) that I've built with Aeros LPK, Magpul PRS stock with rifle length buffer tube, JP Silent Captured Spring (Heavy version, two tungsten, one stainless weight I believe), and I fought myself picking a trigger between a Geissele NM, an AR Gold straight trigger, or Timneys new Calvin Elite AR trigger. I chose the Timney even though there is little to NO info I could find on it. It's the lightest and shortest trigger I've EVER used before so the 1.5lb pull and super short reset is going to take some practice learning and bettering my trigger control. So my needed advice is for a barrel. Recommendations, reviews (positive and opportunistic welcome), brands, etc are welcomed. I only know I want to go 6.5 Creedmoor, and my intentions with it are strictly target shooting, nothing else, hence the trigger choice. I will not be reloading so good quality factory ammo will be used. I will be limited to about 1000 yards but 6ish will be more realistic to how far I'll be going. Due to my distance limitations and running a can I would like to use an 18", but 20" would be ok as well but I'd like to stay no longer than 20". I am asking for the Hides help because I'm not familiar with barrel manufacturers and who is the best for the dollar. I will not say money is no object, because a Proof would be great but in all reality just a good off the shelf match grade barrel that will be an MOA rig if I do my part will suit me fine. Thanks guys. God bless!
-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
Need help/advice/guidance on barrel selection.
- Thread starter GoatPilot04
- Start date
Also, which adjustable gas block would be preferential with a suppressor, and using the JP SCS to best tune it and take recoil characteristics. I have been reading about the Superlative Arms bleed off gas block and like the reviews and it seemed it worked great preventing gas blow back from a can. Also looked at SLRs, and Syrac I think it was? Not familiar with adj blocks much either, my SBR and other ARs have never had one but I would think I would like one with an easy to access detent instead of a set screw to back out on me. The handguard will be one of Aeros if that makes a difference for gas block selection. Hope I've given you guys enough info to help me out, and thank you in advance.
I was unsure if I'd end up liking the 6.5 Creedmoor when I built mine. That being the case I went with readily available barrels as my criteria before dropping the time on a custom cut barrel.
I ended up going with an Ultramatch from Rainer on mine. It's been great so far. More accurate than I am and consistent. It's heavy due to the profile, but it fit what I was looking for. Didn't know if I'd like the fluting, but it's fine and has grown on me. The Wilson Combat Match I used on my 6mm Creedmoor has been nice too so far. I would go with either again.
I have SLR adjustable gas blocks on both of mine. One clamp on and the other set screw. Both have worked great and were quick and easy to tune/adjust. I'm going to stick with the SLR's until I receive my can. Then, if I run into any issues I'll switch one to a Superlative Arms bleed off and see how it does.
I don't have an Aero handguard so I can't give any info on fitment using those. Both handguards on mine are SLR offerings.
Both mine are built on Aero receiver sets. I like them and they have worked well.
I have an AR Gold in my 6.5 Creedmoor and a Triggertech in my Grendel. I used an MBT I had laying around in my 6mm Creedmoor, but that will get changed out for another Triggertech and fast.
The JP Silent Capture Spring works well with the PRS. I've used both the standard weight and heavy (one tungsten weight and heavy spring). I believe with one weight it is the equivalent of an H buffer and with two it is the equivalent of an H2. There is a video from JP that states that i believe. You'll need the spacer that's included with the buffer system for use with the PRS. I recently switched all my PRS stocks for XLR's. They work well for me and even though there is not much recoil on any of the rounds I use that soft butt pad is nice.
Hope the little info I provided helps you out a little. I really like the Creedmoor rounds. Hope you like the 6.5 Creedmoor as well.
I ended up going with an Ultramatch from Rainer on mine. It's been great so far. More accurate than I am and consistent. It's heavy due to the profile, but it fit what I was looking for. Didn't know if I'd like the fluting, but it's fine and has grown on me. The Wilson Combat Match I used on my 6mm Creedmoor has been nice too so far. I would go with either again.
I have SLR adjustable gas blocks on both of mine. One clamp on and the other set screw. Both have worked great and were quick and easy to tune/adjust. I'm going to stick with the SLR's until I receive my can. Then, if I run into any issues I'll switch one to a Superlative Arms bleed off and see how it does.
I don't have an Aero handguard so I can't give any info on fitment using those. Both handguards on mine are SLR offerings.
Both mine are built on Aero receiver sets. I like them and they have worked well.
I have an AR Gold in my 6.5 Creedmoor and a Triggertech in my Grendel. I used an MBT I had laying around in my 6mm Creedmoor, but that will get changed out for another Triggertech and fast.
The JP Silent Capture Spring works well with the PRS. I've used both the standard weight and heavy (one tungsten weight and heavy spring). I believe with one weight it is the equivalent of an H buffer and with two it is the equivalent of an H2. There is a video from JP that states that i believe. You'll need the spacer that's included with the buffer system for use with the PRS. I recently switched all my PRS stocks for XLR's. They work well for me and even though there is not much recoil on any of the rounds I use that soft butt pad is nice.
Hope the little info I provided helps you out a little. I really like the Creedmoor rounds. Hope you like the 6.5 Creedmoor as well.
Large frame is not really a lego like small frame. I am not a Aero fan, but understand they make reasonable receivers and are lower priced. Personally, i would look at another receiver, but the accuracy is in the barrel and the chambering job, so get that right. with 6.5 CM, I would go with 20" barrel and rifle gas. 18" cuts it short and there have been some gas issues, or I should say pressure issues with an 18."
I am a bit of a barrel nerd. My recommendation would be either Kreiger or Bartlein, but Criterion is making a better and better buttoned barrel and for 1,000 yards, you will save some money on the Criterion and be very happy. I like stainless. I would send bolt and ask Frank at Compass Lake to chamber the barrel for you with the bolt. Again, that is me. You will never regret that decision, but someone else (here) will most likely recommend an off the shelf barrel that is less expensive. Keep in-mind that you can always upgrade the receiver and anything else later, as long as you keep the bolt and barrel together.
I am a bit of a barrel nerd. My recommendation would be either Kreiger or Bartlein, but Criterion is making a better and better buttoned barrel and for 1,000 yards, you will save some money on the Criterion and be very happy. I like stainless. I would send bolt and ask Frank at Compass Lake to chamber the barrel for you with the bolt. Again, that is me. You will never regret that decision, but someone else (here) will most likely recommend an off the shelf barrel that is less expensive. Keep in-mind that you can always upgrade the receiver and anything else later, as long as you keep the bolt and barrel together.
Rcnut, how do you like the Superlative Arms gas block? Like the OP I've done some reading on it and it's interesting. Would like to hear your impressions and experiences. Thanks in advance.
SLR gas blocks are great. I went with Aero for the lower, Gibbz Arms for the upper as I like a lefty non-reciprocating charge handle, Criterion barrels have always shot well for me, Geisselle SDE is my favorite trigger.
Thanks for all the advice guys. Meant to jump on here earlier but got sidetracked. I have been looking at the fluted BA, the fluted Rainier Ultramatch, and Criterion so far. I think I'd like to stay in that ballpark price wise. I don't want to drop a lot on a custom or super high end barrel just yet and end up wanting to stick with a bolt gun and lose even more trying to sell it. Anyway back to the point. Do any of you guys have details or real life results using the Superlative Arms gas block AND an SLR or something that isn't a bleed off? What were the perceived differences/changes, good and bad.
I really like the superlative gas block, simple instillation, easy to adjust ( have the instructions yet) and fits under my Diamondhead forearm. planning on getting another with my new barrel,(different size), my rifle just came in alittle heavy for me and that is why I am replacing the barrel , shoots lights out, better than I can ever do , but getting older and humping this thru the woods gets a little tiring .
The SLR on my suppressed AR15 freezes up. Perhaps there’s maintenance involved, but I don’t really adjust it much. I think all types of adjustable gas blocks that work like the SLR will freeze to some degree.
I’m not sure I’d consider it a big deal, but it is something to be aware of.
I’m not sure I’d consider it a big deal, but it is something to be aware of.
So how does the inner workings of the bleed off from SA differ? And would the SA help running suppressed as far as gas blowback? It's a precision rig so I won't be blowing through rounds like my SBR which absolutely sprays my damn glasses with gas, to the point of being choking if there's no wind.
I started this thread strictly for barrel advice but as I mentioned in my OP I got the new Timney Calvin Elite AR trigger, has any body in here shot one? Any tips or advice? It's my first aftermarket trigger for an AR, other than the ALG ACT in my SBR, and at 1.5lbs with a super fast reset it's gonna take some practice. My bolt guns are about two pounds, maybe less, but there no second shot behind it to double. I know I know, better follow through and trigger fundamentals needed, but anyway have you guys even seen or experienced one? I do like the different shoes I can swap around.
My SLR blocks do get carbon buildup. The Superlative is supposed to be less, but I don't know if that's true as I've never used one. Right now mine are adjusted and left. Going with a suppressor requires some
The superlative uses two holes that intersect. One for the adjustment screw and the other smaller next to it as the bleed off port. The adjustment screw is shielded somewhat from my understanding. The main part is the detent and spring are external and not in the gas path so fouling is less likely to affect them. I think there is still some fouling on the threads, but it's supposed to be less.
The superlative uses two holes that intersect. One for the adjustment screw and the other smaller next to it as the bleed off port. The adjustment screw is shielded somewhat from my understanding. The main part is the detent and spring are external and not in the gas path so fouling is less likely to affect them. I think there is still some fouling on the threads, but it's supposed to be less.
Ok cool. I'm still trying to understand what they mean by bleed off if it still uses restricting ports isn't that the same as the others? Or am I looking at this wrong? I guess by my reading the description and reviews it changed recoil pulse "feel" even more different than it would from going with a regular gas block, to a typical adj one. Sorry if I'm delving to deep into this, I just find I can use my gear better if I understand the details, even if it's only in my head lol. I work on cars for a living so I feel I have to know the minutiae of everything I'm doing to be the utilize it. Plus I don't wanna buy gimmicky shit...pardon my French.
A Superlative gas block is a bleed off block this means instead of "limiting" the amount of gas down the gas tube by restricting the amount of gas that goes down in, they open up more to "feed" less gas down the tube and expels the gas out the block around the hand guard, this limits the amount of gas moving the bcg therefore less carbon build up on the bolt and less force put on the bcg for less wear and tear on parts. if someone can explain it better please do, hope this was helpful
Rcnut explained it pretty well. From what I've read and seen the venting/ bleed off is a small amount and cuts down just a little not much on the gas blow back. The bolt will unlock and move back at a certain pressure. The only thing being bled off is the excess that results from overgassing instead of being kept in the system.
I do like the idea of the detent and spring being outside and maybe being a little cleaner. The SLR can be broken down and cleaned if desired, but that carbon does tighten up and seal the fit. The only gas block I've seen with a really tight interference fit was a Noveske. It had to be warmed up to expand and fit down over the journal. If built to spec I believe standard bases are mechanically press fit, but commercial offerings are probably looser because average builders don't have the tooling to perform that.
Seems the trend has been towards longer gas systems to reduce dwell time on longer barrels. Perceived recoil could be less as a result. I have no experience with longer gas systems. I know it will probably draw criticism, but I just stick with rifle length gas systems. Then again I don't have barrels longer than 22".
I do like the idea of the detent and spring being outside and maybe being a little cleaner. The SLR can be broken down and cleaned if desired, but that carbon does tighten up and seal the fit. The only gas block I've seen with a really tight interference fit was a Noveske. It had to be warmed up to expand and fit down over the journal. If built to spec I believe standard bases are mechanically press fit, but commercial offerings are probably looser because average builders don't have the tooling to perform that.
Seems the trend has been towards longer gas systems to reduce dwell time on longer barrels. Perceived recoil could be less as a result. I have no experience with longer gas systems. I know it will probably draw criticism, but I just stick with rifle length gas systems. Then again I don't have barrels longer than 22".
Either gas block will be fine. In my experience, the longer the gas system, the easier to tune. When the gas system is longer it does not seem to be as sensitive to gas pressure, i.e. maybe able to get away with not adjusting gas pressure between suppressed and not suppressed. The longer tubes also seem to have less perceived recoil and easier on brass. But this is not a hill to die on.
As far as barrel, look to padoms posts on his builds. Alot of good info. Cant go wrong with any large barrel manufacturer that fits your design criteria. Ive had good luck with rainier ultramatch and christensen carbon fiber. Pick your target, and find a krieger, bartlien, rock creek, lilja, etc. That fits your design.
As far as barrel, look to padoms posts on his builds. Alot of good info. Cant go wrong with any large barrel manufacturer that fits your design criteria. Ive had good luck with rainier ultramatch and christensen carbon fiber. Pick your target, and find a krieger, bartlien, rock creek, lilja, etc. That fits your design.
I have been trying read about the +2 gas systems and was looking at the Rainier bbl. For typical range time and such is the extra length a necessary thing for 6.5 and 6mm Creed? Sorry for all the questions I'm just trying to cover my bases and build this into a quality but not over the top expensive rifle. Got another little one (second girl) on the way so it will probably be the last for a while. Also trying to build it to maximize the difference of using the 6.5 instead of another .308 (minus my need of a typically shorter bbl than most use).
Its badass. I have one in my 3 gun rifle, definitely makes it easier to get sub .14 second splits consistently. Never had it double but right out of the box I had it fail to reset once. I don't fully trust it yet because of that but if it proves reliable this upcoming season it'll get my official seal of approval. My 3 gun rifle is actually stealing my SPR's job because of the CE.
To be honest I don't shoot my ARs a lot, or should I say haven't as much as I used to in a while. As I said the CE is the only aftermarket I've ever used besides the ACT in the SBR. So the double was admittedly my inexperience with light triggers in semis and no follow through. I guess I'm used to having a loose grip on the trigger with a 5lb pull and not worrying about the recoil bouuncing my finger like it did so lesson learned. As light as it is with the super quick reset I'm amazed how you guys that do 3 gun control something so precisely.
You'll definitely need it pulled into your shoulder, even more so with a large frame gun. After that it doesn't matter if you're using it for precision or speed, with some practice it's truly awesome.
I guess with doing single, well placed shots and with good follow through then letting it reset it won't be a problem. That's another reason I'm inquiring about good barrels and good gas blocks, and got the JP SCS to try and build a smooth shooting rifle instead of something overgassed and tossed together.
Tony, which trigger shoe have you preferred? When I tried it in my sbr I just put the curved one back on that came on it and haven't tried any others. I'm still curious how I'd like the JP/Armageddon roller trigger as well.
I went with the flat w/ hook at the bottom. Mostly because I used to run a CMC flat with the same shape and it feels similar to my pistol trigger. It's actually exactly the same weight and reset as my pistol so it works out well. I'd like to try the JP roller someday, its an interesting concept.
How do you think the CE is going to fair on a precision rig like I'm building? I kept hearing Geissele NM was end all be all, and I may still get one and thoroughly test both then sell the other, or save for future use. I just really like the feel of flat triggers that I've tried before even though I've never owned one. I wish that NM came in a flat, or dynamic trigger. Back on topic, I was seriously surprised when I looked up weights from BA and Rainier comparing fluted and non fluted bbls how little weight was actually saved. Unless they were listed wrong I thought itbwas only a quarter lb on 20" bbls. I like the way they look but don't think I'd pay a huge difference for fluting since it's just gonna be a range gun.
I just had a 22" Bartlein 6.5cm fluted . 6 straight flutes 3/8 diameter. went from 5.2lbs to 3.5lbs. almost 2lbs off and it was very noticeableand balances the rifle much better now
Assuming the reliability is there I can't see why it wouldn't be the kitties titties on a precision rifle. If your fundamentals are already solid I don't think it'll buy you any group shrinkage off the bench (compared to any other quality light trigger) but I immediately noticed a higher hit percentage on 50+ yard offhand plate racks and 300+ yard steel off barricades and tank traps. I don't own any Geissele's but I've shot enough of them to be fairly underwhelmed. I have another Timney and a Hiperfire that break around 2lbs that I used to really like, but the CE is in a different league.
Last edited:
Padom, what did that barrel run you if you don't mind me asking? As for the weight differences I saw, the BA 22" fluted weighs 67.8oz, the regular 22" weighs 75.9oz. Price wise fluted is $292, unfluted is $252. Those prices are off BAs website, and they look to all be on sale. Their claims of weight savings is kind of off to say the least. They state "Featuring functionally aggressive flutes and crisp, clean lines, BA Fluted barrels deliver the perfect balance of weight and rigidity. Utilizing six and eight flute designs we’ve achieved weight reduction up to and exceeding 16 ounces. Confidently lighten your kit without sacrificing an ounce of accuracy." Going through their 6.5 bbls I didn' find a single one that took that much off? Even looking at the 24" bbls they weren't shaved down a full lb.
I have looked at the Faxons before and they are on my list of prospects. I like their prices and the fact that they're 5R. Maybe it doesn't matter about being rifled that way I've probably been sucked into the hype.
profile barrel is lite contour (heat up quick), trying to get away from traditional 6 groove barrels in my Ar platforms. My load data is much lower than other barrels. 5r or 3r rifling + added befits of nitride all help turning the load up a little bit
....I've been running the SLR AGB's on all of my builds (300BO(10.1", 16"), 223Wylde (16"), 556 NATO(7.5", 10", 16") and .308Win (16") and have been very pleased with them, have used all generations of them as well, with no problems. I've never had one "freeze up", but what I typically do is after a shooting session I first BACK OUT the adjuster fully, then run it IN to fully closed X2 then back to the settings for that particular firearm. I found going OUT first was easier and required less effort and actually eased the inward adjustment to close. Seemed like a simple process to add to my post shooting sessions to save alot of potential misery later on down the road, just like I run a boresnake and wet patch thru the tube before I pack them up before heading home (where a thorough cleaning is done at my leisure).
