Had a customer (friend) come in shop today with prototype .510 brass bullet. Will tell final bullet weight after testing is done. What is your opinions?
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New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
- Thread starter excaliber
- Start date
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
OMG!! What kind of twist rate are you going to need for that thing??
OMG!! What kind of twist rate are you going to need for that thing??
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
If he uses a 1: 10", or tighter, twist-rate he will gather some useful information.
The weight will be slightly over 1,000 grains, so he is not going to be contending with high muzzle velocities. There will be an excessive pressure spike, perhaps dangerously so depending on shaft design/tolerances.
If he uses a 1: 10", or tighter, twist-rate he will gather some useful information.
The weight will be slightly over 1,000 grains, so he is not going to be contending with high muzzle velocities. There will be an excessive pressure spike, perhaps dangerously so depending on shaft design/tolerances.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Looks to be similar to the special .510 diameter bullet by GS Customs except without the bands. I asked GSC what that bullet was for and he said his was specifically designed for the Anzio 20x50 (20mm shell necked down to accept 50BMG bullets).
GSC Bullet:
http://www.gsgroup.co.za/5871690SP011.html
Anzio 20x50:
http://www.anzioironworks.com/Anzio-20-50.html
Looks to be similar to the special .510 diameter bullet by GS Customs except without the bands. I asked GSC what that bullet was for and he said his was specifically designed for the Anzio 20x50 (20mm shell necked down to accept 50BMG bullets).
GSC Bullet:
http://www.gsgroup.co.za/5871690SP011.html
Anzio 20x50:
http://www.anzioironworks.com/Anzio-20-50.html
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
The GSC is actually a full caliber longer, and a credible report of it ever flying successfully has not been published.
The GSC is actually a full caliber longer, and a credible report of it ever flying successfully has not been published.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
halcyon575:
The GSC link you provided is to a 14.9mm projectile, not a 510. The first three digits are the caliber.
Link looks to me like a bullet for saojao's 14.9x102mm SOP
halcyon575:
The GSC link you provided is to a 14.9mm projectile, not a 510. The first three digits are the caliber.
Link looks to me like a bullet for saojao's 14.9x102mm SOP
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
My apologies, I meant this one:
http://www.gsgroup.co.za/5101100sp097.html
The reason this initially caught my eye was the 1.928 BC. Then I saw the 3700fps which caused red flags in my head so I asked them about it and they said the stuff about the Anzio 20x50.
My apologies, I meant this one:
http://www.gsgroup.co.za/5101100sp097.html
The reason this initially caught my eye was the 1.928 BC. Then I saw the 3700fps which caused red flags in my head so I asked them about it and they said the stuff about the Anzio 20x50.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
This bullet is close to being 4" long. Of course we will try it in the 50BMG but a bullet this big needs alot more powder than what the BMG can hold.
This bullet is close to being 4" long. Of course we will try it in the 50BMG but a bullet this big needs alot more powder than what the BMG can hold.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Excaliber,
I was estimating 3.5" @ ~1,000 grains (assuming C36000 brass).
If it is longer, or heavier, you are taking some significant risks... with little or no return potential.
Excaliber,
I was estimating 3.5" @ ~1,000 grains (assuming C36000 brass).
If it is longer, or heavier, you are taking some significant risks... with little or no return potential.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: saojao</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Might want to think that through, before you pull the trigger...yikes!!! </div></div>
That's what friends are for.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: saojao</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Might want to think that through, before you pull the trigger...yikes!!! </div></div>
That's what friends are for.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Or at least film the whole ordeal so we can see what happened to you when you touched it off.
Or at least film the whole ordeal so we can see what happened to you when you touched it off.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Just making it bigger and longer does not always make it a better bullet. As said above I think you would be just as safe shooting this in a standard BMG as you would stuffing a brass rod down the bore with a couple hundred grains of red dot.
Just making it bigger and longer does not always make it a better bullet. As said above I think you would be just as safe shooting this in a standard BMG as you would stuffing a brass rod down the bore with a couple hundred grains of red dot.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
I would be scared to shoot that thing... looks WAY more than 1000 grains and with a lot of bearing surface.
I would be scared to shoot that thing... looks WAY more than 1000 grains and with a lot of bearing surface.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
From the looks of it, that projectile will create a pretty dramatic wound cavity going end over end unless the barrel is about a 5-twist (LOL).
Edit: I had to know, so I did a quick check using an estimated length of 3.44". Looks like an 11-twist would be minimal (1.504 stability index) and a 10-twist would be plenty (1.820). It sure looks awful long though.
From the looks of it, that projectile will create a pretty dramatic wound cavity going end over end unless the barrel is about a 5-twist (LOL).
Edit: I had to know, so I did a quick check using an estimated length of 3.44". Looks like an 11-twist would be minimal (1.504 stability index) and a 10-twist would be plenty (1.820). It sure looks awful long though.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Looks like someone has been studying up on the Sears-Haack Body and then chopped off the back end while leaving just enough to get a decent boat tail.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sears–Haack_body
Looks like someone has been studying up on the Sears-Haack Body and then chopped off the back end while leaving just enough to get a decent boat tail.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sears–Haack_body
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Damn, the bullet is longer than the 50 BMG casing!! It's gonna kick like a mofo!!
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Damn, the bullet is longer than the 50 BMG casing!! It's gonna kick like a mofo!!
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Perhaps rocket fuel would be more suitable than mere power.
'lift off'...
Perhaps rocket fuel would be more suitable than mere power.
'lift off'...
A
Augustus
Guest
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Someone is going to make some very expensive football shaped holes. That is if they ever hit paper. Looks like the LM Viking with the tail chopped off. Put Granny and the kids in the cellar when you torch this thing off, they ain't no tellin where this thing will go!!!!!!
Someone is going to make some very expensive football shaped holes. That is if they ever hit paper. Looks like the LM Viking with the tail chopped off. Put Granny and the kids in the cellar when you torch this thing off, they ain't no tellin where this thing will go!!!!!!
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
How much for just the projectile. That would be a great conversion piece.
How much for just the projectile. That would be a great conversion piece.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Hey old95b10, we can try some in your 50cal as soon as we get it finished.
Hey old95b10, we can try some in your 50cal as soon as we get it finished.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Excaliber,
If this is a joke then you need to say so pretty soon.
If you are serious, then you owe it to potential users to shoot this abomination yourself first... after you have updated your life insurance policy.
Even then, it may not do your family any good... suicide is normally excluded from coverage.
Excaliber,
If this is a joke then you need to say so pretty soon.
If you are serious, then you owe it to potential users to shoot this abomination yourself first... after you have updated your life insurance policy.
Even then, it may not do your family any good... suicide is normally excluded from coverage.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Hey Noel Carlson, why do you think this is a joke. What makes everybody think it won`t work. If the barrel has the right twist, why wouldn`t it stabilze. Everybody is saying too much bearing surface but yet nobody knows how much it has besides me. Why do you call it an abomination? What`s wrong with experimenting?
Hey Noel Carlson, why do you think this is a joke. What makes everybody think it won`t work. If the barrel has the right twist, why wouldn`t it stabilze. Everybody is saying too much bearing surface but yet nobody knows how much it has besides me. Why do you call it an abomination? What`s wrong with experimenting?
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Let me know when you shoot it. I will be in the basement with a flak jacket on. This will be a grenade.
Let me know when you shoot it. I will be in the basement with a flak jacket on. This will be a grenade.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Can we try them in Col Kurtz's windrunner first?
Hate to break in a new barrel with a untested load!
Can we try them in Col Kurtz's windrunner first?
Hate to break in a new barrel with a untested load!
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).</div></div>
Does not take a string to see that will friggin' explode. Might as well just thread the bore and screw in a bolt.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).</div></div>
Does not take a string to see that will friggin' explode. Might as well just thread the bore and screw in a bolt.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).</div></div>
Does not take a string to see that will friggin' explode. Might as well just thread the bore and screw in a bolt.</div></div>
As I recall, Bluegrass Armory did that before with their .50 BMG to prove the safety of their action.
Just pointing out that the only way someone's going to find out for sure is by testing it, and if they want to gamble their money on the outcome, and use appropriate safety precautions...then that's their business.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).</div></div>
Does not take a string to see that will friggin' explode. Might as well just thread the bore and screw in a bolt.</div></div>
As I recall, Bluegrass Armory did that before with their .50 BMG to prove the safety of their action.
Just pointing out that the only way someone's going to find out for sure is by testing it, and if they want to gamble their money on the outcome, and use appropriate safety precautions...then that's their business.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).</div></div>
Does not take a string to see that will friggin' explode. Might as well just thread the bore and screw in a bolt.</div></div>
As I recall, Bluegrass Armory did that before with their .50 BMG to prove the safety of their action.
Just pointing out that the only way someone's going to find out for sure is by testing it, and if they want to gamble their money on the outcome, and use appropriate safety precautions...then that's their business.</div></div>
Fair enough. Like Ron White always says "you can't fix stupid"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Noel Carlson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">- There is no twist-rate that will stabilize an eight caliber brass bullet, even at a low muzzle velocity (assuming it ever reached the muzzle).
- The mass alone will give you a chamber pressure exceeding safe limits.
- Your photograph does not give a hint of an engraving band, which means either:
* The entire shaft is bore diameter (see second comment).
* The entire shaft is groove+ diameter, and your rifle becomes an explosive device.
This is a prank, correct?
</div></div>
That's why man invested long string. Very long string...for the testing of very long range projectiles.
There's far too little insane tinkering going on at the upper ends of the DD spectrum, more is always to be enjoyed (from a safe distance).</div></div>
Does not take a string to see that will friggin' explode. Might as well just thread the bore and screw in a bolt.</div></div>
As I recall, Bluegrass Armory did that before with their .50 BMG to prove the safety of their action.
Just pointing out that the only way someone's going to find out for sure is by testing it, and if they want to gamble their money on the outcome, and use appropriate safety precautions...then that's their business.</div></div>
Fair enough. Like Ron White always says "you can't fix stupid"
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
I have complete confidence in you excaliber, just try and set up some sort of live feed online when you put one of these bad boys down range (or where ever it may travel to). It'll make you famous.
I have complete confidence in you excaliber, just try and set up some sort of live feed online when you put one of these bad boys down range (or where ever it may travel to). It'll make you famous.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
I have a friend who has shot 1000+ grain bullets out of a .50 Improved case. The problem is three things, availability of powder of appropriate burn rate, case capacity and if it a bore rider type bullet, he had to go down to a .490 bore, .510 land configuration to keep from stripping the driving band. If it a full caliber bullet with a long bearing surface, I would even bother to try...
I have a friend who has shot 1000+ grain bullets out of a .50 Improved case. The problem is three things, availability of powder of appropriate burn rate, case capacity and if it a bore rider type bullet, he had to go down to a .490 bore, .510 land configuration to keep from stripping the driving band. If it a full caliber bullet with a long bearing surface, I would even bother to try...
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
Bet they called the first guy who thought of using a .50 on man type targets with a M2 at range stupid also.
Oh hell thats right!!!
Now they all praise him.
If you dont know their mojo, better leave them alone.
As not to look like an asshole.
Bet they called the first guy who thought of using a .50 on man type targets with a M2 at range stupid also.
Oh hell thats right!!!
Now they all praise him.
If you dont know their mojo, better leave them alone.
As not to look like an asshole.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
The problem, Old95B10, is that *they* don't know their "mojo"... and it is not necessary to try every possible stupid idea to know that they are stupid/dangerous.
If you will notice *they* have also been very quiet.
This thread was bait for discussion, and it will have served it's purpose if readers that may not understand the hazards of this type of experimentation, begin to.
The problem, Old95B10, is that *they* don't know their "mojo"... and it is not necessary to try every possible stupid idea to know that they are stupid/dangerous.
If you will notice *they* have also been very quiet.
This thread was bait for discussion, and it will have served it's purpose if readers that may not understand the hazards of this type of experimentation, begin to.
Re: New 2 Mile 50 cal bullet?
I used to make custom bullets for the .50 back when you either shot military ball or Thunderbird Cartridge bullets. Also made dies to make bullets out of 2.5" magnum rifle brass filled with lead shot. Be carefull with how much bearing surface you have. Sometimes it's better to undercut the center of the bearing surface slightly and have a short band that is the size of the bore up front and have a short drive band at the rear. Ken Johnson at K&P Gun Company used to play with these a bit and did alot of playing with rifling and groove geometry. I made sets for him all the way up to 1000gr and a few lighter sets for Skip Talbot(RIP).Funny how this stuff surfaces every few years.
I used to make custom bullets for the .50 back when you either shot military ball or Thunderbird Cartridge bullets. Also made dies to make bullets out of 2.5" magnum rifle brass filled with lead shot. Be carefull with how much bearing surface you have. Sometimes it's better to undercut the center of the bearing surface slightly and have a short band that is the size of the bore up front and have a short drive band at the rear. Ken Johnson at K&P Gun Company used to play with these a bit and did alot of playing with rifling and groove geometry. I made sets for him all the way up to 1000gr and a few lighter sets for Skip Talbot(RIP).Funny how this stuff surfaces every few years.
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