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New Norma "Match" Offering
- Thread starter jdodd
- Start date
I would imagine RWS manufactures it, just like TAC-22 and the "white box" Match-22 they had before...hopefully this version of Match is better than the last one...heard mostly disappointment over it. I have a few boxes of "White" Match-22, got from a friend, he said it wasn't very good out of his rifles, I haven't tested it yet.
They also have a Sub Sonic Hollow Point available now, it has the same "numbers" as RWS SSHP...so I'd imagine it is the same thing there too.
I shoot the Norma TAC ammo at close ranges with good success. Both my Bergara's seem to like it. It's got excellent numbers for the price 1163V/7.3SD.
Will be interested in seeing how this shoots side by side to the TAC, and of course Lapua, SK red, yellow, tan, etc..
Will be interested in seeing how this shoots side by side to the TAC, and of course Lapua, SK red, yellow, tan, etc..
Since my CZ is tested with RWS ammo, this should shoot well out of my 457
Probably buy a bunch once I run thru my bricks of regular TAC22
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I'd imagine (and I'm just guessing) it will be a sorting for consistency and those that don't make the cut will be normal Tac-22.
Tac-22 is an odd duck, some places are selling it for $4 a box or $10 a box, even Norma now sells it direct for just over $4 a box. I bought a couple bricks of the Tac-22 recently to try at $40 a brick. Shot in 3 guns (CZ 457 Varmint Precision Chassis MTR, JP AR upper, Volquartsen deluxe) versus what I consider to be other cheap but accurate for the $ ammo, basically CCI STD Vel, and Wolf Match, and I threw in Midas for giggles.
It was interesting, at 50 yds, in all 3 guns it did slightly better than CCI, and slightly worse than Wolf, and of course worse than Midas. However at 100 yds Tac-22 really opened up in all 3 guns, and did worse than CCI, Wolf, and of course Midas. I basically just dialed in 1 MOA high and shot 50 rounds of each out of each gun, 5 rounds at a time, switching guns every 10 rounds and looked at groups. It seemed like velocity issues were the biggest problem in Tac-22. The L-R group size was as good perhaps a bit better than CCI, but the vertical was almost 2x what CCI was at 100. I noticed this a bit at 50 as well, overall the Tac-22 groups were tighter than CCI, and the best Tac-22 groups were better than the best CCI groups, but when tac-22 did have a flyer, they were worse than CCI flyers. Even at 100 yards, if you took the best 25 of 50, Tac-22 probably did as well as wolf, but the worst 10 shots of all 3 were far worse with Tac-22 than any of the others.
That said, at 50yds, or if I was just looking to buy 22 handgun rimfire ammo, for $4 a box I'd happily buy it, esp. since the newer CCI STD I've tried recently haven't been as impressive as it once was. If the Match version gets rid of those bad flyers, it might do as well or better than Wolf for a similar price.
Tac-22 is an odd duck, some places are selling it for $4 a box or $10 a box, even Norma now sells it direct for just over $4 a box. I bought a couple bricks of the Tac-22 recently to try at $40 a brick. Shot in 3 guns (CZ 457 Varmint Precision Chassis MTR, JP AR upper, Volquartsen deluxe) versus what I consider to be other cheap but accurate for the $ ammo, basically CCI STD Vel, and Wolf Match, and I threw in Midas for giggles.
It was interesting, at 50 yds, in all 3 guns it did slightly better than CCI, and slightly worse than Wolf, and of course worse than Midas. However at 100 yds Tac-22 really opened up in all 3 guns, and did worse than CCI, Wolf, and of course Midas. I basically just dialed in 1 MOA high and shot 50 rounds of each out of each gun, 5 rounds at a time, switching guns every 10 rounds and looked at groups. It seemed like velocity issues were the biggest problem in Tac-22. The L-R group size was as good perhaps a bit better than CCI, but the vertical was almost 2x what CCI was at 100. I noticed this a bit at 50 as well, overall the Tac-22 groups were tighter than CCI, and the best Tac-22 groups were better than the best CCI groups, but when tac-22 did have a flyer, they were worse than CCI flyers. Even at 100 yards, if you took the best 25 of 50, Tac-22 probably did as well as wolf, but the worst 10 shots of all 3 were far worse with Tac-22 than any of the others.
That said, at 50yds, or if I was just looking to buy 22 handgun rimfire ammo, for $4 a box I'd happily buy it, esp. since the newer CCI STD I've tried recently haven't been as impressive as it once was. If the Match version gets rid of those bad flyers, it might do as well or better than Wolf for a similar price.
I bought several bricks of TAC-22 a few weeks ago, and have shot it in several rifles, including V22S, V22, Three-60, and a CZ 457 VPT w/Shilen ratchet rifled match bbl w/EPS chamber. Also ran around 15 rounds of it through a Browning 52C sporting repro rifle a couple of days ago. It shot best in the V22S, which has a Nevius chamber, pretty decent in both V22 repeaters, with EPS chambers, and also pretty decent in the 457/Shilen, which also has an EPS chamber. And it was pretty close to how SK Std+ shot in the Browning. But - it's harder to close the bolts on in all three of the Vudoo rifles and the Browning 52 than it was in the CZ457. It shoots good enough in all those rifles to be well worth the asking price of $4.29/box, but I didn't like how hard it was to close the bolts of the V22s & the Browning 52. Looks like I'll be shooting it mostly in the CZ 457s - and will also be trying the new Match ammo to see how it performs.
TAC22 shoots pretty well in our CZ rifles so I ordered some Norma Match ammo. Unfortunately, in my informal testing, the Match was not significantly different from TAC11. I need to do more testing, including a blind test.*
* It's my opinion, that ammo comparisons need to be a blind test, i.e., the shooter should not know if they are shooting the "known good stuff" or the test ammunition.
* It's my opinion, that ammo comparisons need to be a blind test, i.e., the shooter should not know if they are shooting the "known good stuff" or the test ammunition.
A few days after I'd placed an online order for the TAC-22 ammo, I got an email from NormaShooting.com asking for a validation reply, as their banking institution was concerned that it was a 'fraudulent' transaction. Having never seen a reply like that, I was pretty curious as to why it was a concern in the first place, as I'd ordered with a long-held CC, and had given the required information, including the three digit security code. So I called the phone number they'd given in this message, and that satisfied them - and a few days later, the order was delivered. So, a week or so ago, I placed an order for a couple of bricks of he new Match ammo, and darned if they didn't send another message just like the one I described above. This time instead of calling, I replied to the message, and did get a fairly prompt reply, stating that the order would be shipped. Is this standard practice in today's world? I've never had anything like this when placing online orders before dealing with Norma, and was slightly miffed when it happened again, since I'd used the same CC and none of my information had changed. Still waiting on the Match ammo to be delivered...
I have most/all of my CC's set up to notify me of any purchases via a text to the cell phone, but this is a service offered by the issuing bank thru their banking app. Some CC companies offer similar apps, etc. With the recent changes in how gun related purchases are now coded with a "new" transaction type code to indicate "firearm related", the emails you received could be a thing of the future.
Some companies banking providers offer their own version of fraud control, in other words it's not your bank/CC that's raising a concern, it's the banking provider of the store. Most of the time the store doesn't even get the information needed to tell you why it was flagged as potentially fraudulent. I used to have problems similar to this with Academy Sports, they would refuse to process orders because their banking provider would throw a fraud flag on some purchases, however unlike your situation no one from Academy could figure out how to rectify it. If I tried using a different card, it just made their fraud control even more upset because it thought I was making a second fraudulent purchase with another card. I simply stopped doing business with them.
A bit off track but it's going to be interesting to see how this new CC oversight of gun related purchases works, I know competitive shooters buying pallets of ammo preseason for Trapshooting, and you can easily drop $20k at a gun store on a single competition shotgun. My guess is CC companies have no understanding of how much enthusiasts and competition shooters spend annually and even on a single purchase at times for their sport/hobby. It will also be interesting if more paranoid gun peeps start shopping at stores like Dicks, Cabelas, etc. that are multi-use sporting goods stores that have ammo/guns, as opposed to gun specific stores.
A bit off track but it's going to be interesting to see how this new CC oversight of gun related purchases works, I know competitive shooters buying pallets of ammo preseason for Trapshooting, and you can easily drop $20k at a gun store on a single competition shotgun. My guess is CC companies have no understanding of how much enthusiasts and competition shooters spend annually and even on a single purchase at times for their sport/hobby. It will also be interesting if more paranoid gun peeps start shopping at stores like Dicks, Cabelas, etc. that are multi-use sporting goods stores that have ammo/guns, as opposed to gun specific stores.
TAC 22 is one of the cheapest rimfire rounds when on sale and by far the best shooting 10 cpr or less round in my CZ 457 and Suhl 150. Since I don't shoot past 50 yards, I find that it is the perfect practice ammo, allowing me to ration use of my better Center X, Sk's, RWS, Eley Match and Tenex, etc. I would like to hear more reports on the new Match so I can decide if it might replace something like Sk Standard Plus, SK Rifle Match, or RWS Rifle Match.
Norma rep was at the Cool Acres PRS22 match in Swainsboro GA (north of Savannah - Norma now in Savannah) and presented some new Norma Match 22 to match director - they were distributed to some shooters at end of match through a drawing. Will be interesting to hear feedback. Norma was also at some recent Georgia NRL22 matches. Norma rep also at the PRS match Saturday at Cool Acres talking to shooters getting feedback on calibers used, reloading, etc. He got earful about needing primers but supposedly all they make going into ammo,
Hey I was a recipient of that giveaway ... I wish I had run into you and met ya. Great Rimfire matches there. I hope to get an invite back to the finales in Oct.
They gave away the TAC22 I had one lucky ticket....
I had the opportunity to take three rifles out this morning and try the Norma Match in them - CZ457 VPT w/22" Shilen ratchet/EPS chamber; RimX w/23" Green Mountain/Win M52D chamber; Gen 1 V22 w/22" Bartlein/Ravage chamber. Shot all three prone off bipod & rear wedge bag at 50yds in nice conditions - clear & sunny, 75* with light (4-5mph) wind from 11:00. None of these rifles shot the Match ammo nearly as well as SK Std+, SK Pistol Match, or Lapua Biathlon Extreme. In the CZ's Shilen, I only compared the Match to Norma TAC-22, and there was no comparison - the TAC shot nice tight little groups, while the Match was pretty scattered, hardly a group at all, compared to what I'm used to seeing out of the Shilen. Maybe the Match can do better if a person is able to buy various lots of it, but at $8/box compared to $4.28/box for TAC, I think I'll stick with TAC for now...
I thought it might just be the ammo I got, but this is aboout the same experience I had with Norma Match.
The norma rep was on "the shooters mindset" podcast recently and said Norma Match was RWS Rifle Match. IMO, RWS Rifle Match isn't worth the normal $12 / box price, but for $8 / box it's decent. Glad I got my stash of RWS RM when they were blowing it out at $5 / box a year or so ago.
Who or where did you get the Shilen 22” EPS chamber installed on the CZ 457?? I’m really thinking about changing mine out and jumping into open class but only if it’s that same setup.
Sorry for the sideline OP
I do my own barrel work. The OEM 24" bbl that came on the 457 VPT had accuracy issues. I put around 500rds through it before testing some known good lots of SK Rifle Match & LR Match at 100 & 200yds, and it really fell on its face at 200. Since I'd already done the same thing with my 457 American and had good results, I went the same route in replacing the VPT's factory bbl, only went with a .863" dia straight cylinder bbl.
Very nice … I need to find the drop in ready Shilen 22” EPS chamber barrel and try it out myself but I’ve only seen the blanks for sell.
Thanks.
What I meant was that I bought a .863" dia blank and then machined the tenon, chambered, milled the extractor slots, and finished the muzzle in my shop. I don't like the big ugly grub screw seat cuts, so left the tenon round, and glued it into the action with Loctite #609. There may be someone doing drop-in Shilen bbls for the CZs - I don't know.
I went to Norma's web site added 2 bricks of the Match-22 to my cart put all my information in and never checked out.
A day or two later I received an email that I forgot to check out and then a second email with a 10% off coupon code.
A day or two later I received an email that I forgot to check out and then a second email with a 10% off coupon code.
Tac22 seems to shoot well out of by B14R and my 10/22s--a bit better than CCI SV, not as good as SK Standard +.
When I saw the new 'match' stuff is the same price as the Tac22, I ordered 4 bricks. Even if it doesn't perform any better, I still have a few 'not precision' guns that need to be fed, so it won't go to waste.
When I saw the new 'match' stuff is the same price as the Tac22, I ordered 4 bricks. Even if it doesn't perform any better, I still have a few 'not precision' guns that need to be fed, so it won't go to waste.
I shot some match 22 yesterday out of my rimx with a 20 inch proof barrel. I was quite impressed with it enough I'm going to try it in a prs match this coming weekend. Mv was 1101 with sd of 5 and es of 17. It grouped better at 50 and 100 than my previous lot of sk rifle match I've been using.
Based on this thread, I ordered a brick. I shot it today and I was very surprised with the results. The norma match ammo is significantly worse than norma tac of my B14r. I was surprised as soon as I opened up a box and didn't notice any lube on the bullets.
Someone compared this stuff to SK Rifle Match. It's not even close in my set up. Below is a pic of the two side by side. Both are 10 shot groups at 50 yards. With that said, the SK Rifle match group isn't amazing, but the Norma is down right terrible, about 4 moa. Rimfire rifles are picky. For my set up, this Norma ammo doesn't work. Your mileage may vary.
Someone compared this stuff to SK Rifle Match. It's not even close in my set up. Below is a pic of the two side by side. Both are 10 shot groups at 50 yards. With that said, the SK Rifle match group isn't amazing, but the Norma is down right terrible, about 4 moa. Rimfire rifles are picky. For my set up, this Norma ammo doesn't work. Your mileage may vary.
I'm curious to how many rounds you shot over the chrono to get those numbers....those are amazing numbers if you shot 20 or more rounds. If you would share the groups you shot as well
I shot 2 different strings of 10 shots and got basically the same numbers both timesI'm curious to how many rounds you shot over the chrono to get those numbers....those are amazing numbers if you shot 20 or more rounds. If you would share the groups you shot as well
If there's any way that a person can order lot samples of the Match from Norma, maybe I'd be able to find a lot# that shot better than what they sent me when I bought a couple of bricks of it. The lot of Norma TAC-22 could've been a fluke in that it shot considerably better than Match did for me, but there were far more guys reporting the same results that I got than vice-versa. If Norma wants to appeal to a larger number of shooters who understand the need to lot test, they'll allow us to buy samples of various lots.
