New Sig CROSS

[oda175365]

Saw this picture in the Q thread- looks like Sig wants a piece. Very close looking to the Q and maybe a but of Christensen Arms MPr. Thoughts or info?

 

[MarinePMI]

And a dust cover....?

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

I think the Q Fix looks most like an AK, but this one looks AR as shit. Hopefully it uses prefits.

 

[XLR308]

I think the Q Fix looks most like an AK, but this one looks AR as shit. Hopefully it uses prefits.

I'm kind of curious if it's an action in there like a tube gun set up or a receiver like an AR with the bolt locking into an extension of some type.

 

[pmclaine]

Looks like they are gambling on the ban of ARs and getting ahead on a product that will replace them.

 

[ohiofarmer]

Well, it looks like COAL won’t be limited by a PMAG. I wonder if it takes AICS pattern magazines or something proprietary. Given the release location, hopefully AICS.

 

[Aaron47pb]

lol... All they needed to do is support and invest in the SSG 3000. Such an amazing rifle and they just abandoned it.

 

[pmclaine]

lol... All they needed to do is support and invest in the SSG 3000. Such an amazing rifle and they just abandoned it.

Lost the ability to ship them to the Western Hemisphere I heard.

 

[Aaron47pb]

Lost the ability to ship them to the Western Hemisphere I heard.

That’s a fixable problem. They just don’t have the will.

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

I'd like to know the industry's current fucking problem with curved bow triggers.

 

[ohiofarmer]

Lost the ability to ship them to the Western Hemisphere I heard.

That’s a fixable problem. They just don’t have the will.

Who “took” that ability away? Some red tape on this end or that end?

 

[Steel head]

I'd like to know the industry's current fucking problem with curved bow triggers.

They’re not cool.
This new Sig is obviously not designed and marketed for an old fashioned geezer like me.

 

[Spblademaker]

Has it become the new Official PRS gun, yet?

 

[pmclaine]

Has it become the new Official PRS gun, yet?

Has the Army bought it yet?

Seems .mil is buying everything Sig these days.

 

[enichols]

lol... All they needed to do is support and invest in the SSG 3000. Such an amazing rifle and they just abandoned it.

This right here. I wish I had bought an SSG3000 when they were $1500. Would love to see that rifle back on the market.

 

[kriller134]

And a dust cover....?

Heck yeah you gotta be able to put a molon labe cover on it.

 

[chevy_man]

I'd like to know the industry's current fucking problem with curved bow triggers.

A straight trigger done right is awesome. Their x5 90* break straight trigger is spot on. I've been using them in AR's for quite a while and love them.

Lost the ability to ship them to the Western Hemisphere I heard.

Who “took” that ability away? Some red tape on this end or that end?

The government.

They simply have to build and produce them here, couldn't import them because they're not marketed as "sporting" since they sell them as "tactical swat criminal killer" rifles.

I doubt it made sense to setup an entirely new production line for such a low volume rifle.

 

[Jimichanga]

I wonder if they are drop safe... Never early adopt any Sig product.

 

[THEIS]

Lost the ability to ship them to the Western Hemisphere I heard.

Who “took” that ability away? Some red tape on this end or that end?

Hi,

Red tape essentially lays on both ends.
German government found Sig firearms in Columbia and Kazakhstan (Both of which Germany Government does not issue export licenses for).
Come to find out it was Sig USA that had "legally" exported the firearms to those places under USA laws..but German laws still fined and penalized Sig Germany by not issuing export certificates for "most" Sig firearms to the USA....But that does not stop Sig USA from making them here.

Long story made short.....USA based Sig thought they only had to follow USA based laws instead of the "Parent" countries laws; which it does not work like that.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[roamin]

What's the difference between this and a bolt action AR upper?

Anything significant or no?

 

[Steel head]

Hi,

Red tape essentially lays on both ends.
German government found Sig firearms in Columbia and Kazakhstan (Both of which Germany Government does not issue export licenses for).
Come to find out it was Sig USA that had "legally" exported the firearms to those places under USA laws..but German laws still fined and penalized Sig Germany by not issuing export certificates for "most" Sig firearms to the USA....But that does not stop Sig USA from making them here.

Long story made short.....USA based Sig thought they only had to follow USA based laws instead of the "Parent" countries laws; which it does not work like that.

Sincerely,
Theis

interesting!

 

[Bender830]

I'd like to know the industry's current fucking problem with curved bow triggers.

Its not curved but its not straight either in the pic.
Just a bit...

 

[MarinePMI]

Seriously though, does anyone know how much they are supposed to retail for (MSRP or street price)?

Kind of looks like a European RPR...

 

[THEIS]

If I remember right it became such a big issue because Sig Germany knew that it was illegal and sent them here to launder the transaction while telling Sig USA it was “all cool” to do that.

But maybe I misremember. I just recall hearing their being willing malfeasance and not just dumbassery.

Hi,

Correct, but all the details of a 3 year investigation is way too long to type out here, haha...
Super short version of the reason why Sig Germany does not export them to Sig USA.....
GREED got the best of the executives on both side of the pond.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[pmclaine]

What will the Germans come up with next?

Faking emissions codes on their autos?

 

[Steel head]

They would NEVER do that.

Lol!

 

[waspocrew]

Interesting - definitely want to learn more about it.

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

OT but are the Virtus pistols worth a shit? Better than an AR? Accurate?

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

That's remarkable to hear. I was thinking of maybe jumping in on them now that things have been market-tested. I fucking loved the Sig 556 family, they were never more accurate than an AR and had some had mag problems though. I'm hoping the urge will pass, but they seem like a nice break from AR 556 and 300 pistols.

 

[FrankinND]

Why not throw there hat in ? Chances are being a Sig should be well engineered but sometimes the support isn’t there for many years to come down the road.

 

[IanHusaberg]

Check out elk 101 on YouTube. A broken leg and a big bull.

 

[DOA]

Front rail looks like a ripoff from Ruger PC carbine? And what's up with the dustcover?? I also prefer curved triggers. Easier and more consistent placement of the trigger finger.

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

Check out elk 101 on YouTube. A broken leg and a big bull.

Not much info about the rifle.

 

[IanHusaberg]

At the end of the video, they give you a look at the rifle. I guess we’ll just have to be patient and wait until shot show for the facts to roll out.

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

As the young man walks up to the elk, he handles the rifle with ease, leading me to believe it's not that heavy. If that's the case, I may have found a new deer rifle.

 

[srt-4_uk]

What's the difference between this and a bolt action AR upper?

Anything significant or no?

Just based on the picture
Doesnt take AR mags
Doesnt use AR trigger

 

[THEIS]

Theis, doesn't Germany have some strict export laws for guns? I seem to remember it was a factor in the CSASS hold up. The interpretation is that it is related to the national personality shaped by WWII. Hypersensitive of Germany being viewed as both an economic powerhouse in Europe and a militaristic nation. American troops seen on international news carrying German guns in areas of the world that Germany doesn't support armed conflict and intervention in. Despite having several large firearms companies

Hi,

No more than any other country really.....International Arms exporting is more of a global re-allocation program in reality.
X country does not export to Y country, but Z country does; so manufacturer in Z country for Y countries market...just change a feature, etc etc just enough to "remove" it from X country control.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[b6graham]

There's a reason Q posted the image. They're a stone throw away from eachother and if I had a few too many it would be hard to tell the difference aside from the dust cover and color schemes

I'd bet its light. I'd bet it takes a few magazines

 

[oda175365]

I agree that there is probably some cross pollination of tech between the two- and see it as a great thing. If the gun takes prefit barrels, much like the Fix, and is at lower price point I see it as a success. Sig has had some rougher roll outs but seems to make right and recover well. Could be a new backcountry rifle for sure.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

There is an obvious precision rifle market that is burgeoning. I don't see this as Sig getting ready for a ban, so much as being part of motion. I like the rifle more than the Q offering. The dustcover is cool- I've gotten veg and debris in bolt actions, I see the point of the dustcover. It's cool to see the rail machined into the action. I don't get the point of not putting a top rail on a handguard though. I would go for a lower rail profile, with a continuous top rail to get scopes objective clearance at a lower height over bore axis, personally. If it will reliably double feed from double stack mags, that's cool too.

 

[THEIS]

If it will reliably double feed from double stack mags, that's cool too.

Hi,

And double feeding is conducive to what again?? Other than jamming shit up that should not be jammed....

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Cheyenne Bodie]

I think he meant control feed from a double stack.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

I think he meant control feed from a double stack.

I think it would be cool if the bolt geometry was designed to feed from a double column double feed mag. M14's, AR10's feed just fine, it's easier to rapidly load and possible to top off a double column mag from the ejection port where an AICS mag lacks either advantage. AICS is a slow load, and no top off capability through the ejection port.

 

[MarinePMI]

I think it would be cool if the bolt geometry was designed to feed from a double column double feed mag. M14's, AR10's feed just fine, it's easier to rapidly load and possible to top off a double column mag from the ejection port where an AICS mag lacks either advantage. AICS is a slow load, and no top off capability through the ejection port.

You mean, it should take AW mags, right? ???

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

You mean, it should take AW mags, right? ???

In Vietnam Snipers carried like 120-180 rounds of ammunition. That makes perfect sense to me. They had rifles that could be top loaded like the M40, or the M70 sharpshooter.

There are marines that can run a M40A1 almost like a semi-auto- they just shuck rounds into the top- no mags needed.

If the service member or the end user is going to have a tactical precision rifle and won't be issued or own 10 to 18, 10 rd magazines to hold all the ammo in, then it is a nice feature to be able to just crack a box of ammo and top load through the ejection port.

I think the price of the AI mags is kind of high like the people never dreamed anyone would own more than 2-3 mags for a rifle. The loading speed is annoyingly slow for single column feed mags, and it's somewhat impractical to carry 18 mags, so it makes good sense to use a mag that can be top loaded IF an engineer can design a way for that to feed reliably with the rifle.

 

[roamin]

Just based on the picture
Doesnt take AR mags
Doesnt use AR trigger

Yeah ok. AR mags and trigger or not from looking at this pic it's evident to me that I'm looking at something that heavily resembles an AR or an AR with a bolt action AR upper. I didn't say I didn't like it because I do and no doubt there's a market for it. I just think it's comical that as some bolt actions "evolve" they evolve into an AR it's like that hasn't already happened once before.

 

[Aaron47pb]

In Vietnam Snipers carried like 120-180 rounds of ammunition. That makes perfect sense to me. They had rifles that could be top loaded like the M40, or the M70 sharpshooter.

There are marines that can run a M40A1 almost like a semi-auto- they just shuck rounds into the top- no mags needed.

If the service member or the end user is going to have a tactical precision rifle and won't be issued or own 10 to 18, 10 rd magazines to hold all the ammo in, then it is a nice feature to be able to just crack a box of ammo and top load through the ejection port.

I think the price of the AI mags is kind of high like the people never dreamed anyone would own more than 2-3 mags for a rifle. The loading speed is annoyingly slow for single column feed mags, and it's somewhat impractical to carry 18 mags, so it makes good sense to use a mag that can be top loaded IF an engineer can design a way for that to feed reliably with the rifle.

Do you know what an AW mag is? Does everything you just described.

 

[srt-4_uk]

Yeah ok. AR mags and trigger or not from looking at this pic it's evident to me that I'm looking at something that heavily resembles an AR or an AR with a bolt action AR upper. I didn't say I didn't because like I do and no doubt there's a market for it. I just think it's comical that as some bolt actions "evolve" they evolve into an AR it's like that hasn't already happened once before.

With that argument, an AI PSR is a bolt action AR.

 

[Tx_Aggie]

You mean, it should take AW mags, right? ???

Or AR10 mags. Ruger made the RPR work with AICS, and AR10 pattern mags. IIRC, they will also work with AW, and even some M14 mags.

It would be interesting if Sig(Q?) did the same with this rifle.

 

[Ravenworks]

Hi,

Red tape essentially lays on both ends.
German government found Sig firearms in Columbia and Kazakhstan (Both of which Germany Government does not issue export licenses for).
Come to find out it was Sig USA that had "legally" exported the firearms to those places under USA laws..but German laws still fined and penalized Sig Germany by not issuing export certificates for "most" Sig firearms to the USA....But that does not stop Sig USA from making them here.

Long story made short.....USA based Sig thought they only had to follow USA based laws instead of the "Parent" countries laws; which it does not work like that.

Sincerely,
Theis

I remember reading about that, it cost them a shit load of Jaundice eye and money.