New to ELR, need help with Cheytac M200 Intervention scope, mount, and zero.

[blackened]

I'm new to ELR, so please be gentle... with that being said, I recently traded for a Cheytac M200 Intervention in .408 caliber and I need some help.

CheyTac's M200 Intervention website says this rifle has a "40 MOA" rail built in.
I purchased a Spuhr 1.18" 0 MIL/0 MOA mount, and a Vortex Razor HD 3-36.
The Razor says it has a max of 36.1 MRAD of elevation adjustment.

Today I fired my first round through the M200. I dialed my scope all the way down, used the zero stop to attempt to zero the rifle at 100 yards... (because that's what I've always done)... and I can't get the scope to travel far enough to be able to zero at 100 yards.

Can someone explain to me how to resolve this situation. Do I need a different mount? Does the built in rail have too much cant for this scope? Would a higher mount like a 1.5" mount make any difference? I'd like to have enough elevation travel to take 1 mile shots at a later date with this setup.

Ammo is DesertTech .408 CT, 2760 fps, BC: G1 .983, 400 grain.

Thanks for reading and hopefully I can get some information to make a more informed decision on how to fix my issue.

 

[Taylorbok]

That scope has plenty enough travel for that rail.

my bet is the zero stop is set some where in the middle of the scope elevation preventing you from coming down all the way. You'll have to loosen/remove it so you can come all the way down to set zero and then you can re-set the zero stop.

 

[secondofangle2]

^this. Or it's not a 40MOA rail.

 

[Asgard1]

Zero stop if off the bottom . Even if it was a 50 min rail scope should still zero.

 

[SEPAboltrifle]

If your scope is a Gen 3 Razor 6-36 x 56 the adjustment process for zero is not associated with the zero stop setting.
The Gen 3 has “Micro Adjust” click-less elevation and windage adjustments for zeroing the scope.
Suggest bore sighting first.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

The problem is with the gen 3 razor your zero stop is automatic. So you need to loosen the turrets and turn the turrets past zero so you free up the space below the zero stop. The tighten it down and crank down to zero again. Hopefully you have enough movement now to zero. If not do it again until you have enough. 40 moa is not much. I ran 50 moa combined rail/mount with gen 3 razor and ZCO.

I hate the zeroing process on the gen 3 which is one the reasons I divested. ZCO and TT hands down easier and faster without having to remember which direct to turn a little knob on top of turrets.

 

[blackened]

I went to a small private range today and adjusted the zero stops. This range only goes out to 100 yards.

After firing a 3 round group, I made adjustments, and then fired two rounds into the #3 target, and one round into the #5 target.

I am now able to turn the elevation knob "upwards" (counter clock-wise) three full rotations which brings the crosshairs way below the 100 yard zero impacts.

I can't get the photos to upload or the link to imgur to work... if anyone has suggestions please let me know.

 

[Taylorbok]

You are able to zero at 100 now?

 

[blackened]

Yes sir!

 

[NightStash]

If you are able I would exchange the Spuhr mount for something with more cant to get the most out of your scope.

 

[blackened]

If you are able I would exchange the Spuhr mount for something with more cant to get the most out of your scope.

What do you suggest?
Also, how many MRAD of elevation change would I need to hit at 1000 and 2000 yards?

 

[secondofangle2]

You need to familiarize yourself with ballistics calculators to answer your question because you are going to need them to make any hits at those ranges anyway

Figure out how much elevation your scope has, and then try to get amount that has a can’t or taper that is about half of that elevation travel

Then you can keep a 100 yard zero more or less and use all of the elevation travel of that scope

 

[NightStash]

What do you suggest?
Also, how many MRAD of elevation change would I need to hit at 1000 and 2000 yards?

Easy since you already zeroed at 100 yards. How much travel do you have left to dial now?

 

[NightStash]

Easy since you already zeroed at 100 yards. How much travel do you have left to dial now?

Also I'm sure you can hit 2000 yards as it sits but that's just warming up.

 

[Rocketmandb]

What do you suggest?
Also, how many MRAD of elevation change would I need to hit at 1000 and 2000 yards?

Your scope has 36.1 Mil of elevation adjustment. If both your rail and mount added nothing to the equation, then you'd be looking through the center of the scope and would be able to adjust up and down equally (36.1 Mil/2 = 18,05 Mil each way).

As it so happens, this would probably be about what you'd be dialing at 2000 yards - not exactly sure because I have no idea what bullet/powder/velocity you're going to be at.

Now, your current rail is 40 MOA, which is 11.63 Mil, meaning you could now dial 18.05 Mil + 11.63 Mil = 29.68 Mil of elevation. Again, I don't know exactly what you're shooting, but that would be getting you probably close to 3000-3300 yards.

You could conceivably get another 6 Mil and change and still zero at 100, but you'd be just short of adding a 20 MOA mount. You could add a 10 MOA mount and still not be looking through the edge of the glass - not sure it's worth it until you work your way up to those ranges.

 

[blackened]

Your scope has 36.1 Mil of elevation adjustment. If both your rail and mount added nothing to the equation, then you'd be looking through the center of the scope and would be able to adjust up and down equally (36.1 Mil/2 = 18,05 Mil each way).

As it so happens, this would probably be about what you'd be dialing at 2000 yards - not exactly sure because I have no idea what bullet/powder/velocity you're going to be at.

Now, your current rail is 40 MOA, which is 11.63 Mil, meaning you could now dial 18.05 Mil + 11.63 Mil = 29.68 Mil of elevation. Again, I don't know exactly what you're shooting, but that would be getting you probably close to 3000-3300 yards.

You could conceivably get another 6 Mil and change and still zero at 100, but you'd be just short of adding a 20 MOA mount. You could add a 10 MOA mount and still not be looking through the edge of the glass - not sure it's worth it until you work your way up to those ranges.

Based on my current ammo, and how I sighted it in (0 mil mount and 40 mil rail), I can barely go past the 100 yard zero. I can dial up (which moves my crosshairs down) a little over 3 full rotations. Which with my scope is ten mil each rotation, or 30 mils of total travel. Based on this chart, I should be good for roughly 2400 yards. Would you agree with that?

I have access to a 1200 yard range if I drive about an hour. I do not have access currently to anything longer than 1200 yards without traveling several hours to the wife's parents property. I want to make sure I'm comfortable and capable at 1200 yards, and then I'll start looking for out of state ranges to visit.

My understanding is if I add more cant to my mount, I wouldn't be able to dial enough to get a 100 yard zero. Is that correct?

 

[Taylorbok]

Your understanding is correct.
You could add 6 ish more mils of cant to get absolute max travel out of the scope, but as was mentioned that's not a number you're gonna find.

 

[Rocketmandb]

View attachment 8579077

Based on my current ammo, and how I sighted it in (0 mil mount and 40 mil rail), I can barely go past the 100 yard zero. I can dial up (which moves my crosshairs down) a little over 3 full rotations. Which with my scope is ten mil each rotation, or 30 mils of total travel. Based on this chart, I should be good for roughly 2400 yards. Would you agree with that?

I have access to a 1200 yard range if I drive about an hour. I do not have access currently to anything longer than 1200 yards without traveling several hours to the wife's parents property. I want to make sure I'm comfortable and capable at 1200 yards, and then I'll start looking for out of state ranges to visit.

My understanding is if I add more cant to my mount, I wouldn't be able to dial enough to get a 100 yard zero. Is that correct?

I'm a little surprised at the velocity you're showing. I will get better than that with a similar weight bullet in my 37XC - was at 3050 fps with a 353 gr and will be launching the 410 Bergers as soon as they hit the market.

 

[secondofangle2]

Maybe when they hit the market you can load them on the IP

 

[Rocketmandb]

Maybe when they hit the market you can load them on the IP

I'm waiting for the IP Gen 2

 

[Taylorbok]

I'm a little surprised at the velocity you're showing. I will get better than that with a similar weight bullet in my 37XC - was at 3050 fps with a 353 gr and will be launching the 410 Bergers as soon as they hit the market.

factory ammo. That does seem really slow for that weight of bullet.

 

[blackened]

factory ammo. That does seem really slow for that weight of bullet.

Yes, I am currently just testing things out with the few boxes of DesertTech ammo.

Unfortunately, my Fortster Coax can't do .408 CT so I'm trying to decide if I'm getting a Forster Coax-XL, Zero press, or if there is something else better out there.

 

[Taylorbok]

Yes, I am currently just testing things out with the few boxes of DesertTech ammo.

Unfortunately, my Fortster Coax can't do .408 CT so I'm trying to decide if I'm getting a Forster Coax-XL, Zero press, or if there is something else better out there.

I'd skip the Zero for that size of case. It's nice to have something bigger that you don't have to scoop the bullet into when seating

 

[blackened]

I'd skip the Zero for that size of case. It's nice to have something bigger that you don't have to scoop the bullet into when seating

Agreed. Unless someone shows me something new and improved, I will likely start shopping for the best price on the Co-Ax CL tonight.

 

[A5scott]

German PraziPress is great for the big stuff
Scott

 

[Taylorbok]

German PraziPress is great for the big stuff
Scott

if your budget can handle it this is the way I'd go. I've got an RCBS ammo master and it works great but its not as bling that's for sure.
I didn't know about them when I got my press

 

[blackened]

if your budget can handle it this is the way I'd go. I've got an RCBS ammo master and it works great but its not as bling that's for sure.
I didn't know about them when I got my pres

As you can see below, I'm all about "buy once cry once"... I just want to make sure I get the best tool for the job. I'll start researching the PraziPress. @A5scott have you used both the Forster Co-Ax XL and the PraziPress?

 

[Rocketmandb]

As you can see below, I'm all about "buy once cry once"... I just want to make sure I get the best tool for the job. I'll start researching the PraziPress. @A5scott have you used both the Forster Co-Ax XL and the PraziPress?

View attachment 8579463

What are the stainless bars for?

 

[Taylorbok]

What are the stainless bars for?

I was looking at that also. I think it's a set of drawers under the bench top

 

[A5scott]

As you can see below, I'm all about "buy once cry once"... I just want to make sure I get the best tool for the job. I'll start researching the PraziPress. @A5scott have you used both the Forster Co-Ax XL and the PraziPress?

View attachment 8579463

blackened,

I use the regular size Forster Co-Ax, but not the XL.

I have the 140mm Prazipress and it's awesome. I also have it on an inline fab mount.

If you think you want to reload 20mm, get the 150 Prazi lol.

Scott

 

[blackened]

What are the stainless bars for?

Those are two drawers, it is a Husky Work Bench from Home Depot.

 

[blackened]

blackened,

I use the regular size Forster Co-Ax, but not the XL.

I have the 140mm Prazipress and it's awesome. I also have it on an inline fab mount.

If you think you want to reload 20mm, get the 150 Prazi lol.

Scott

Yeah I really enjoy my regular Co-Ax. Seems like the 140mm would be the biggest I'd need, no plans to reload 20mm anytime soon! lol

Do you ever wish you could swap dies quickly like on the Co-Ax? That would be my only concern.

 

[A5scott]

Yeah I really enjoy my regular Co-Ax. Seems like the 140mm would be the biggest I'd need, no plans to reload 20mm anytime soon! lol

Do you ever wish you could swap dies quickly like on the Co-Ax? That would be my only concern.

No, I don't worry about it that much. When I bought the Prazi, the XL wasn't a thing yet. for the big stuff I use the a Mighty armory BMG decap die, a Sinclair, Warner sizing die and a Warner Arbor seating die. It's kind of a slow but fun process, and I don't mind the time to swap dies. Not tedious like loading smaller cartridges.
Scott

 

[secondofangle2]

I have the PRAZI press. Both the 105 and the 150. There is another thread in the reloading section where I described the many difficulties I had getting them set up correctly. If you like bougie equipment, it is kind of top-of-the-line, and I believe Dan Warner said in that thread that they have some 140 for sale in stock, stateside, no hassles with the export licenses and the language barriers and the $300 shipping from Germany

On the other hand, let it be known that these things don’t make better ammo than the old RCBS 50 caliber press that I used to use to load 375CT. In addition, you don’t really need an oversized press for the Cheytacs. On most standard sized presses, you can just tip the bullet in for the seating operation. Despite not making better ammo, the Prazi is beautiful and my neighbors are impressed by my exquisite tastes.

 

[steve123]

I don't have the larger Prazi's but my old standard size has been flawless in every way. It seems like it's smoother than when it was when new. The tiniest bit of wear has happened to the lower linkages but I think this is more of a break in thing. I love this press and even though it was hugely expensive I'm glad I bought! Soooooo smooth too.