Newbie Scope Advice needed

[colt.45]

I'm wondering what are some good options for me to get started in long-range shooting. Using a 308, I would like to know what people recommend in regards to reticles, mag. power, mag. range, parallax adjustment, among other things. I've done as much research as I can up to this point so I'm just going to list some things I think I know and some questions, and y'all can just correct me or add your .2 if you feel the need. Hoping to get out to the max effective range of the 308/7.62x51 nato. Mostly using factory hunting loads, a decent amount of bulk ammo for plinking/practice, and occasionally match grade when I can find good prices. 1 MOA avg is fine for me.

-As I understand it, the super high end/$$$$ scopes cost that amount due to the accuracy and consistency of the work that goes into making the adjustments as mathematically perfect as possible, as well as glass quality and some other things like mag. range. (but for example: S&B PMII is like $3,800, but only goes from 3-12). Whereas, the more affordable scopes gear their appeal towards reticles and holdover methods of ranging?

-Is it better to have a few decent scopes that each serve a distinct purpose, or get a really nice one that 'does it all'?

-what system (reticle vs dialing) would be better for me to learn ballistics, wind calls, and ranging on?

-what system is best for quickly switching between targets of varying range?- for example starting with 350, 600, 200, 750, then 100

-how important is my decision on focal plane?

-are there pros and cons to the Milrad vs MOA system when it comes to range, target size, speed, and ease of use? I understand the military uses M-rads. Is that because it was developed for human-type targets?

notes:
-budget is between 600-2000$ with flexibility, meaning I'm willing to go a little above or below if its the right decision.
-I will be getting a 6.5 cm barrel/rifle in the future, so please don't tell me to 'skip' the 308. I like the cartridge and shooting it keeps my fundamentals in check
-weight is of no concern to me
-I prefer not to go above 4x for my bottom range, but I don't know what max power I need- considering that I'd appreciate the ability to shoot past 1000 in the future (with a diff caliber), I'm not totally opposed to the 7-30+ range of scopes, knowing I almost never dial my current scope down from 9 power, and hardly ever shoot closer than 100 yds. Additionally, I can always offset or top-mount red dot/irons if I need to take shots between 5-60 yds
-not shooting in total darkness, but definitely in lowlight early morning/dusk
-for reference, I've been learning on a $200 Nikon prostaff 3-9 BDC with my Ruger American 270, which has allowed me to get out to 500 yds pretty easily, with 130 grain factory hunting rounds (remington core-lokt, federal powershok, herters, winchester super x)- I'm not a snob when it comes to optics, but I'm ready and willing to make a big investment

 

[eklarsen]

Your questions are hard to give you an easy answer...

Focal plane -
Not that critical - If you dont use the reticle for ranging then a 2nd focal plane will suffice, I prefer 1st but it is a personal choice

Mil - MOA
Doesnt matter, pick one, learn it, stick with it. If the guys you shoot with use one or the other pick that one unless you want to be the different fella

Do it all vs specialized
I match the intended purpose of the rifle, you sound like you will be moving this scope between rifles so get the best glass you can afford and you wont ever feel like you shorted yourself

Dial vs holdover
Since you intend to shot long you need to be able to dial, in that price range you will be getting both, dial and your retical will allow you to hold over as well

Given all your answers I would suggest a Vortex Gen2 Razor or a Nightforce NX8, both will do all you ask.

 

[colt.45]

Your questions are hard to give you an easy answer...

Focal plane -
Not that critical - If you dont use the reticle for ranging then a 2nd focal plane will suffice, I prefer 1st but it is a personal choice

Mil - MOA
Doesnt matter, pick one, learn it, stick with it. If the guys you shoot with use one or the other pick that one unless you want to be the different fella

Do it all vs specialized
I match the intended purpose of the rifle, you sound like you will be moving this scope between rifles so get the best glass you can afford and you wont ever feel like you shorted yourself

Dial vs holdover
Since you intend to shot long you need to be able to dial, in that price range you will be getting both, dial and your retical will allow you to hold over as well

Given all your answers I would suggest a Vortex Gen2 Razor or a Nightforce NX8, both will do all you ask.

Both nice scopes and what I was looking for. One guy told me that first focal plane makes it hard to see his target and be precise when dialed up due to the reticle getting in the way and being so large.

 

[diverdon]

The ideal is for each rifle to have a single optic that suits it's purpose, and that you understand and can use.

If you are talking one rifle and the purpose is shooting prone that's usually not going to be your home defence rifle.

Budget matters too. So purpose and budget then we can try to help.

 

[colt.45]

The ideal is for each rifle to have a single optic that suits it's purpose, and that you understand and can use.

If you are talking one rifle and the purpose is shooting prone that's usually not going to be your home defence rifle.

Budget matters too. So purpose and budget then we can try to help.

not a defense rifle for sure. budget is between 500-2500. I know that leaves a lot of options, which is why I need help. This is a world I know nothing about. I'm not even learned how to "use" a scope in regards to DOPE, reticles, ranging, holds, windage, etc. I simply superimpose my cross hairs on my target cuz at my local range that only goes to 300 it works fine

 

[Slash0311]

What do you consider "long range"? To some that may be 500 because of range limitations. Others may be 1500. That can help on magnification. With my NF ATACAR 4-16 FFP, I can make out bullet holes in my target at 300 yards.

Any way to look at things is your goals and length of time. For example if you go with a lower budget scope as you learn, it could free up more money for ammo. Then upgrade as your skills and knowledge improve. You may discover certain options or features you want over others. On the opposite side, the phrase "buy once, cry once" certainly applies. If you have the budget now, go all in because you can always move the scope to a difference gun if you decide to get a different caliber.

At the end of the day, no amount of money on a scope makes up for learning good fundamentals by putting rounds down range.

 

[TheHorta]

First, unless you absolutely HAVE to buy new, look for used in the PX. You can get some GREAT deals in your price range from guys that were in your exact position but are now making their way onto the next stage. They’ve already taken the depreciation hit, and you’re likely to get most or all of your money back when you get ready to up your game.

20x is plenty for just about anything .308 related, so don’t get hung up on numbers. Better to have a spectacular 4-16x than a mediocre or even a decent 3-30x.

As was mentioned, Gen 2 Razors pop up all the time on the PX for ~$1500-1600 in like new condition with box, etc because another dude saw the light and got sucked into Satan’s Playground — i.e. the devilish world of high-end optics where the End Game is total financial ruin.

There are decent third-tier optics like SWFA and Athlon that punch well above their price point.

Or you can just go straight to the top and graduate from BOCO University with Honors by jumping right into a ZCO/TT/Hensoldt/SB and get your doctorate.

 

[colt.45]

So to anyone still on this thread, I have spent some time looking and have my options narrow down between NF, Leupold, Zeiss, eotech, Khales, & Vortex. I know you're thinking that's still a huge list and it is. But I didn't want to leave anything off the table for my first nice scope purchase.

That list I made was in order with the first 3 being my first choices in order, and so on. I only found one Khales that I liked it was the 624i 6-24 (really annoying when companies use alphanumeric codes for models). I was into vortex a lot for the value proposition but couldn't find any with a good reticle, so that's not really on my list anymore. I kind of like the Vudu. Zeiss had a lot of good options at good prices and with great reticles, so def still on the table. Leupold just as well, especially now that the Mark 5 is on sale. But my favorite so far, (as well as the only NF I can afford) are the NX8 line, in either 2.5-20 or 4-32. Both amazing mag ranges and makes me wonder how they are so cheap compared to others in that range. Europtic had a handful of the NX8s with both the Tremor and the MOAR reticles that I liked the most, all on sale as "demo" models between 1800-2200$. If I had to pick right now it would be one of those two NFs. Neither are FFP I believe. 2.5-20 would be awesome for hunting, but honestly I've shot at targets under 50 yards on 3-4 power with no issue at all, so that extra 12 power could be a huge advantage going out to 1000 yards and beyond.

I was only on europotic (I find the optics planet website insufferable to use) so that may have limited my options to some part, but I could not find any Steiners or S&Bs in my budget. I may consider a used one if it really speaks to me, but the other problem was reticles. I really do not like a reticle with any red color on it. For precision and focus it just bothers my eyes. More to that, I like a more simple reticle that doesn't have too much "stuff" in the way of my target. For this reason, I don't really mind the "Christmas tree" reticles I see on NF because at low power FFP they are so thin that it actually helps draw my eye to the center by creating what really looks like a transparent shade of a tree on low power, combined with no verticle crosshair above the center, which I also prefer (vintage german style). It allows me to draw my eye to my target from bottom to top, the natural way my eye likes to. So seeing that most the options in my price point with those brands did not provide reticles I could tolerate, it helped me narrow down further (unless I can find better reticles on another website).

 

[~JM~]

I'm very new & have recently performed some of the same searching/study.

Check out: http://sportoptics.com & https://cameralandny.com

You might also consider Burris & Meopta.

I was looking at the NX8 line for a while. Looked very promising. Found a few posts that stated the magnification rate was a draw-back. I'm not experienced enough to understand the reasoning behind those posts.

I think the red reticle appearance you are referring to, is due to illumination. That feature can be adjusted in intensity, turned off & some models can be green.

I found this interesting: https://www.snipershide.com/precision-rifle/stop-the-debate-mils-vs-moa-vs-iphy/

Take your time & keep digging. Good luck.

 

[colt.45]

I'm very new & have recently performed some of the same searching/study.

Check out: http://sportoptics.com & https://cameralandny.com

You might also consider Burris & Meopta.

I was looking at the NX8 line for a while. Looked very promising. Found a few posts that stated the magnification rate was a draw-back. I'm not experienced enough to understand the reasoning behind those posts.

I think the red reticle appearance you are referring to, is due to illumination. That feature can be adjusted in intensity, turned off & some models can be green.

I found this interesting: https://www.snipershide.com/precision-rifle/stop-the-debate-mils-vs-moa-vs-iphy/

Take your time & keep digging. Good luck.

Okay that’s really helpful I didn’t know that it could be turned off. Annoying that they wouldn’t include a picture of what the reticle looks like non illuminated since that’s how you’d be using is 90% of the time

 

[~JM~]

Here are several articles:

So you want to Buy a New Rifle Scope

Follow Sniper's Hide and pick up the latest information on all things precision rifle related. Sniper's Hide Training is for the serious tactical marksman.

www.snipershide.com

https://www.snipershide.com/precisi...shide-precisionrifles/snipershide-riflescope/

 

[WY_Chas]

If you have not yet decided, I'd highly recommend FFP and mrad (logical and easy to use).

 

[~JM~]

Here is one of my previous posts: https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...-22lr-precision-elr-etc.7044278/#post-9065132

There are some very helpful suggestions on that post. Here is another interesting source of info: https://www.youtube.com/c/ikoshkinDLO/videos

 

[Cade4436]

Check out Tract Optics. Their YouTube has a lot of info for the new LR shooter-Plus the web based Impact ballistics program they use with their scope/reticles is a cool feature when learning behind your new optic. My Toric UHD 4-20X50 30mm MOA/PRS has been flawless.