Rifle Scopes Nf beast vs. wait for new razor

F

FlyfishNM

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Full Member
Minuteman
Jul 20, 2014
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Albuquerque
#1
So, I have been patiently waiting, ( or not so patiently), for the new razor gen 2 4.5-27. I preordered the new razor five weeks ago. Unfortunately I didn't have the foresight of some to preorder a year in advance. My new xlr chassis will arrive on Monday and I really do not want to wait a couple months to put glass on this thing. I also do not want to swap scopes between rifles. I've got multiple ladder tests ready to go, have a beat on a BEAST, and am already comfortable with the nf reticle I have now. The beast or the razor will more than serve me well on the new .338.
My experience with "high end glass" consists of a nf 5.5-22 nxs, so needless to say either one would be a giant Step up.

Is the cost/benefit ratio worth the extra $800 or so with the BEAST?

From the reviews I have read it seems the razor will be the one to beat and I do have the nxs on a qd mount so i could swap scopes until I received the razor, but swapping scopes between a 6.5 and a .338 is not something I really wanted to do.
 
#2
I have the BEAST mounted on a delicious SRS A1 and love it. I'm biased, but here's a TAG.
fd6mv8.jpg

egcv12.jpg
 
#5
Rhyno said:
Who did you preorder from? Might give them a call and see how far back you are on the wait list as people are starting to get the new razors.
Click to expand...

I have done this and was not able to get an idea as to when they would be receiving them. Judging by other posts it seems those who preordered right after shot are maybe receiving some of them now? I'm sure the vendors are sick of people asking about them and I don't think even they know when they will be receiving certain models, reticles, etc. Just looking at options and the BEAST caught my eye from day one. Am I leaving anything on the table NOT going with the BEAST? They are both heavy but I could probably use the extra weight on the .338.
 
#6
I would swap scopes and wait for the Razor. I've been a NF fan for a while, but I do not like the clutch system they put on the elevation turret. "Do not like" is me being PC compared to what I really think about it. The glass itself is great and I liked the reticle.

On the other hand, from what little Ive got to play with the new Razor in the field, I have no complaints about it. The glass is very nice. The turrets are great.

People begged and begged and begged for a NF FFP 5-25 scope.....now that it's out, there is a reason it's not "all the rage".
 
#8
I got my BEAST from Mile High. I got lucky. I called to find out how long the wait was and they said they had a BEAST in MIL sitting on the shelf. I got it right then.
 
#9
Don't own either but have played with both, the glass is impressive in both and either reticle is fine. I love my F1, just wish it was 20x. The beast turrets I'm still not sure about unless I used one for awhile, the turrets on the vortex felt good and were low profile. The vortex is 1k cheaper also, I don't know, tough choice. Let us know what you decide.
 
#10
My advice is get behind a BEAST and see if you can "live" with the turrets. After playing with mine since they came out, I ultimately didn't like the turrets and sold it. Only real gripe I had about it, in the end. Its a solid scope....but like the AI stocks....it'll be a love/hate relationship with those turrets.
 
#11
Foweis said:
Get the BEAST man. It's awesome. I love mine.
Man that razor is just too damn heavy at over 3lbs!
Click to expand...

Yeah that extra 9 ounces over the BEAST will kill most men LOL When mounted it becomes white noise. My rifle feels the same when I mounted the Razor II on it as it did when the S&B 5-25x was on it and that weighs an ounce less than the BEAST.
 
#12
When you say clutch are you referring to the brake or tbe zero stop set up?


trevor300wsm said:
I would swap scopes and wait for the Razor. I've been a NF fan for a while, but I do not like the clutch system they put on the elevation turret. "Do not like" is me being PC compared to what I really think about it. The glass itself is great and I liked the reticle.

On the other hand, from what little Ive got to play with the new Razor in the field, I have no complaints about it. The glass is very nice. The turrets are great.

People begged and begged and begged for a NF FFP 5-25 scope.....now that it's out, there is a reason it's not "all the rage".
Click to expand...
 
#14
Rob01 said:
Yeah that extra 9 ounces over the BEAST will kill most men LOL When mounted it becomes white noise. My rifle feels the same when I mounted the Razor II on it as it did when the S&B 5-25x was on it and that weighs an ounce less than the BEAST.
Click to expand...

Bahahahaha! Love it bro...just love the griping on the weight! Like I said before...take the money you save and go get a personal trainer to get ya ready for ALL that extra weight!
 
#17
You guys are comical,

you'll bitch about the weight and never travel farther than the parking lot of you local range, or worse take your pick up into the field and roll out the driver's door and "heft" the rifle out of the bed.

Bitch about the "look" of the turrets or the "brake" and never acknowledge the fact if you don't need it, you never have to touch it. Just ignore it. Or complain about the "size" of the turret ignoring the fact in the "up" or unlocked position the Bushnell it not only taller but bigger.

The lever, for 32+ years the USMC MST-100 or Unertl had a similar design, and nobody ever bitched. In fact with the scope the lever was a necessary part of your dope unlike with the NF.

If it's not the weight, it's the reticle, turret, availability, color, length, height, glass, price, on and on, with you same guys. Buy it, sell it, won't buy it, don't like it, can't get it, tried it didn't like it, couldn't see Mars, could see your Anus.

I'm gonna add a tag to you same guys who never stop. Serial complainer with no logic, label you with more money than sense who enjoy the conversation about the buy over any actual use.
 
#18
Lowlight said:
You guys are comical,

you'll bitch about the weight and never travel farther than the parking lot of you local range, or worse take your pick up into the field and roll out the driver's door and "heft" the rifle out of the bed.
Click to expand...

Thats funny right there! I have hiked with my full load and rifle for 2 days up 5k foot elevation changes to remote locations. It's funny how many shooters are concerned about weight, but never actually haul their rigs any distance.
 
#19
The good thing about being a double above knee amputee, I get to have other people help me carry my gear hahaha.
*I still carry most of my gear and am grateful for those that help....
 
#20
trevor300wsm said:
I would swap scopes and wait for the Razor. I've been a NF fan for a while, but I do not like the clutch system they put on the elevation turret. "Do not like" is me being PC compared to what I really think about it. The glass itself is great and I liked the reticle.

On the other hand, from what little Ive got to play with the new Razor in the field, I have no complaints about it. The glass is very nice. The turrets are great.

People begged and begged and begged for a NF FFP 5-25 scope.....now that it's out, there is a reason it's not "all the rage".
Click to expand...

NF scopes are great. I think they avoided a lot of middle ground with the SPF and FFP scopes though. An ATACR in FFP in the $2,500 range would be nice. The new razor II seems to have found this middle ground sweet spot
 
#22
Well, I decided to wait and go with the razor. I think it will be well worth the wait. I'll put the money saved towards the next build. Maybe I'll put a BEAST on that one, that is if I have any money left over from the personal trainer!
 
#23
In my opinion the choice is very simple. Go with the Beast. Look at the track record of Nightforce versus the track record of vortex. All sorts of people are happy with vortex as they have great cs. Why would I want to put my money into a company that sure seems to have a LOT of failures throughout their product line, only good part is they seem to replace them, bad part is if you are at a shoot, or out hunting you just totally f'd your trip unless you happened to bring a spare scope. NF is known for their reliability and spot on tracking.
 
#24
seven mm said:
In my opinion the choice is very simple. Go with the Beast. Look at the track record of Nightforce versus the track record of vortex. All sorts of people are happy with vortex as they have great cs. Why would I want to put my money into a company that sure seems to have a LOT of failures throughout their product line, only good part is they seem to replace them, bad part is if you are at a shoot, or out hunting you just totally f'd your trip unless you happened to bring a spare scope. NF is known for their reliability and spot on tracking.
Click to expand...

The majority of reported problems are with the PST line. Not the Razor or Razor II line. Compare apples to apples. Not apples to oranges.
 
#25
seven mm said:
In my opinion the choice is very simple. Go with the Beast. Look at the track record of Nightforce versus the track record of vortex. All sorts of people are happy with vortex as they have great cs. Why would I want to put my money into a company that sure seems to have a LOT of failures throughout their product line, only good part is they seem to replace them, bad part is if you are at a shoot, or out hunting you just totally f'd your trip unless you happened to bring a spare scope. NF is known for their reliability and spot on tracking.
Click to expand...

LOL....have you actually used either?
 
#26
seven mm said:
In my opinion the choice is very simple. Go with the Beast. Look at the track record of Nightforce versus the track record of vortex. All sorts of people are happy with vortex as they have great cs. Why would I want to put my money into a company that sure seems to have a LOT of failures throughout their product line, only good part is they seem to replace them, bad part is if you are at a shoot, or out hunting you just totally f'd your trip unless you happened to bring a spare scope. NF is known for their reliability and spot on tracking.
Click to expand...

While my nxs has been rock solid, I own or have owned about a dozen vortex products and they too have been solid. I believe the new razor is no exception and seems to be built VERY well.
 
#27
I've seen enough razors fail at shoots to know I want nothing to do with them. I have been a fan of the 5-25 scmidt's but after using the NF beast I have started switching over to them, in fact I traded you p123 a Schmidt for a beast. You all can buy whatever, I was just giving some perspective from a reliability standpoint.
 
#28
seven mm said:
I've seen enough razors fail at shoots to know I want nothing to do with them. I have been a fan of the 5-25 scmidt's but after using the NF beast I have started switching over to them, in fact I traded you p123 a Schmidt for a beast. You all can buy whatever, I was just giving some perspective from a reliability standpoint.
Click to expand...

lol gotcha. I lose track of stuff I trade/sell.
 
#29
seven mm said:
I've seen enough razors fail at shoots to know I want nothing to do with them. I have been a fan of the 5-25 scmidt's but after using the NF beast I have started switching over to them, in fact I traded you p123 a Schmidt for a beast. You all can buy whatever, I was just giving some perspective from a reliability standpoint.
Click to expand...

Except your point is invalid because this is a complete redesign.

Kind of like saying ford makes a shitty small car because the pinto I had blew up when someone assholed me.
 
#30
I'll take NF's track record over Vortex any day of the week (regardless if it was a pst or razor). It may be a fine product (new razor) but it'll have to prove itself before I spend my hard earned $ on one.

For my needs and what I trust, I'll gladly stay with NF product line.
 
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#31
K_4c said:
I'll take NF's track record over Vortex any day of the week (regardless if it was a pst or razor, they still pushed a faulty product). It may be a fine product (new razor) but it'll have to prove itself before I spend my hard earned $ on one.

For my needs and what I trust, I'll gladly stay with NF product line.
Click to expand...

Exactly how did they "push a faulty product"? That implies they knew there was a problem and they still sold scopes with known problems. They haven't. Some PST scopes in the many thousands sold have had problems. Some Razors might have had problems as well. Do you think NF has never had a problem? My team mates F1 when we first got them went down on him. It can happen and the problem is that people bunch in the lower priced PSTs with the Razors and it's not the same especially with the new Razor II.

And how did the BEAST "prove itself"? Seems like it just came out as well so it's also an unknown except for some reports. You might have trust in the name but it's also not out in a ton of hands so I wouldn't hang the proven flag on it just yet. Same with the Razor II to be fair but from what I have seen of both scopes they are both excellent options.

Buy what you want but implying intentional wrong doing on a company is misleading and wrong.
 
#33
Rob01 said:
Exactly how did they "push a faulty product"? That implies they knew there was a problem and they still sold scopes with known problems. They haven't. Some PST scopes in the many thousands sold have had problems. Some Razors might have had problems as well. Do you think NF has never had a problem? My team mates F1 when we first got them went down on him. It can happen and the problem is that people bunch in the lower priced PSTs with the Razors and it's not the same especially with the new Razor II.

And how did the BEAST "prove itself"? Seems like it just came out as well so it's also an unknown except for some reports. You might have trust in the name but it's also not out in a ton of hands so I wouldn't hang the proven flag on it just yet. Same with the Razor II to be fair but from what I have seen of both scopes they are both excellent options.

Buy what you want but implying intentional wrong doing on a company is misleading and wrong.
Click to expand...

I'll retract the said statement in question.... but I can not concede to the idea that Vortex is in the same league as NF in reliability terms. The new Razor line may be the cats meow but I've still got a sour taste from MY prior experiences with vortex products. As for the BEAST, I said nothing about it being proven. Just the NF product line as a whole.

So I'll stand corrected and edit my last...
 
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#34
K_4c said:
I'll retract the said statement in question.... but I can not concede to the idea that Vortex is in the same league as NF in reliability terms. The new Razor line may be the cats meow but I've still got a sour taste from MY prior experiences with vortex products. As for the BEAST, I said nothing about it being proven. Just the NF product line as a whole.

So I'll stand corrected and edit my last...
Click to expand...

Fair enough. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions from their personal experience. I personally haven't had a bad NF scope but my team mate won't use them again. Personal feeling from his experience of the fail at a match.

We will have to watch both new scopes and see what the future holds for them as far as reliability and popularity with shooters.
 
#35
Unfortunately shit happens with optics and it doesn't matter which company you pick....We have run every vortex scope from the hst-to the razor line and soon the razor II and the only issues we have ever had was with one new and straight out of the box and it was just an imperfection on the reticle and it was handled the same day by customer service. We had a client drop one pst straight on the turret from about three feet and it survived just fine we have run both ffp and sfp pst scopes on 300 win and lapuas with no ill results.

I personally have run the xlr ffp 4-16 scope on several lapuas and a couple of normas for at least 1000 rounds or more and have never had a problem one with it. Now I am not going to put that scope on par with the razors or gen II razors, but its an example of heavy recoil and a mid priced scope getting along just fine.

We used to run a lot of nightforce and choose not to any longer based on a few issues we had... does that make them bad optics hell no just not what we choose to run based on our own personal experiences.

Optics choices and discussions often times leads to a chevy vs ford type conflict and I figure to each his own..we choose our optics based on performance, customer service, and function and for us the clear winner is Vortex.

Jordan@406
 
#36
I've ran them both. The gen 1 Razor, for me, was terrible. I used to work in a gun shop part time. I would go in on Monday make orders and then work friday evening and all day Saturday. I did massive amounts of sales in my 8 hour weeks and gained a lot of knowledge about how ordering products worked.

Two of my best sellers were the Vortex and Nightforce scopes. I placed an order for Razor scopes and decided I would invest my own money into one as a demo. Had nothing but problems from it. Sent it back. It worked for about 2 weeks and went down again. I went thru 2 more Razors that had the exact same problems. I had them all repaired and then sold them off.

Nightforce….. I have never had a problem and I have had and sold many of them. When I worked in that store I think we sold 30-40 scopes in 6 months. I have F1's and now a couple BEAST scopes. They perform, track, clear glass, and are just as clear as my S&B scopes. While I have not put one thru the rigorous paces of a class or match I can attest to its performance on a flat range. Tracking is spot on and its colors are very bright. It picks up colors much better then any other scope I have used. I think my one gripe about both scopes is the weight. They are bricks!

The BEAST scope line is just that, a beast. Its a big scope but the turrets are very nice. Positive clicks and I really like how the hardware for the turrets are all captured so you can't loose them when resetting your zero stop. I give two thumbs up for the BEAST and I look forward to trying out the new Razor Gen 2. At SHOT Show they looked great and the improvements were clearly visible from the original design.

If anyone has a specific question about the BEAST I will try and answer it here.
 
#37
Rob01 said:
Fair enough. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions from their personal experience. I personally haven't had a bad NF scope but my team mate won't use them again. Personal feeling from his experience of the fail at a match.

We will have to watch both new scopes and see what the future holds for them as far as reliability and popularity with shooters.
Click to expand...


I do hope the new razor lives up to the hype.... who doesn't mind saving 1k:) And as of lately, optic prices are ridiculous ($7k for a S&B and Henny). I'd rather save the $4k and spend it on components and travel expenses.
 
#38
I've been hanging around bench rest shooters for a while.. For some I think worrying about their rifle losing a little weight is the least of their worries. I would recommend a strength training regiment if that 17lb rifle is now too heavy being 17.5lbs.

Or maybe consider purchasing that tactical wheelbarrow.....
 
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#39
Javelin said:
I've been hanging around bench rest shooters for a while.. For some I think worrying about their rifle losing a little weight is the least of their worries. I would recommend a strength training regiment if that 17lb rifle is now too heavy being 17.5lbs.

Or maybe consider purchasing that tactical wheelbarrow.....
Click to expand...

I myself have a caddy carry my rifle stage to stage......
 
#40
it's funny to poke at serial complainers who don't have any standing for their complaints, but i think the weight issue is legit. for me, i want the lightest weight option that works, because i do like to hike with my rifle (and way too much gear). lightweight crap is no good, so if i have to use heavy stuff, i will (and maybe whine about it too) but i'll also pay a premium for a lighter weight alternative.
e.g. i'll pay extra for a titanium suppressor instead of a steel one.
i wish there was a lightweight pack with a scabbard, but i haven't found one so i stick with the heavier eberlestock.
i want a nomad, but it's NOT worth the weight to me

but the new vortex falls into the "worth the weight" category for me, so I'll just deal with it. hopefully their 2015 announcement will be one that is just as durable and only 25oz

to the OP, patience is a virtue. i've had a brand new rifle and suppressor for over a month without putting a round through it because i was waiting for my new vortex which just came this morning. don't spend the next few years regretting that you couldn't wait 2 weeks to get the scope you wanted
 
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