Then why do most scopes(including burris), fail to hold zero after impact?I dont think you're understanding how this process works. In a nutshell, zero retention, along with every other moving part, is tested ad nauseum with a multitude of stress and torture tests. One of the machines pictured mimics recoil. It can go from a 22LR, to a huge magnum to dropping it off a cliff. Far harder than banging it on a stool, or a Maple stump (though i do want to see those test results)
They can flat out wreck any scope on the planet with that machinery. And from that, learn it's weakness and it's breaking point.
It's not just about holding zero. There's lots of moving parts. The weak link could be anywhere, and no one builds a scope on smoke and mirrors.
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Nightforce Impact Test - SHOT Show 2023
- Thread starter Ichi
- Start date
I don’t have any XTRs, but I can’t say I’ve seen a ton of threads about them not holding zero. To the contrary, they’re very well liked.
I’m gonna make some arbitrary shit up here, but it seems if a scope is $1k+ and over 26oz or so it, it’s at least perceived as robust. Cheap heavy scopes and expensive light scopes do not share that reputation. I’ve firmly believed for a while that we just aren’t there yet; if we were the top tactical/comp scopes wouldn’t all weigh over 2#.
No reason to make them light when competitors are using 18-25 lbs rifles. It's just going to make the more expensive.
I don’t have one either, but would bet money they won’t hold zero from a side impact. Scopes are fragile creatures, and the majority of scope manufacturers don’t test them for the most important thing that matters. Zero retention.
Nightforce has had problems with the competition line too by the way. No manufacturer is immune it seems.
That's an anecdotal statement. What percentage of scopes fail to hold zero. What brands, what price points... etc etc.
I think most scopes do hold zero quite reliably. My 1000lb Morgan rolled over my rifle with a $75 Bushnell Sportview on it some years ago, it was still zeroed.
Any scope from the most expensive optic on down can fail. No one on the planet that has spent any time around firearms hunting or competing would deny that. Optics companies make a pretty great product these days, but its still a mechanical device with parts and pieces that can break.
The xtr’s I’ve owned which is 5 total have taken decent hits. One sliding off a rifle holder in a blind and hitting the floor on the scope objective/turret. Only a 4 ft or so drop though.
My NF Competition I put more in the lineup with say a Sightron SIII “toughness”. The comp is much more comparable to those in build and doesn’t have the “feel” if you will that it could take abuse like the atacr or NXS. Of course it wasn’t designed as that either. It’s more of a high mag/save weight aspect
This is probably the most false statement I have read on here. Most scopes absolutely do not hold zero.
The reason most people don’t realize this, is very few people actually shoot much.
Why do you think serious benchresters have scope checkers, and the Rokslide dudes started scope drop tests?
I do not have a answer. But for the record, I think the logical thing to do is save money for cocaine and hookers. Especially at SHOT. It’s got be fuckin vanilla and boring as fuck if not.
You fuckin Nightforce lickers need to quit being so shallow.
Nobody gives a fuck!
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Most Nightforce guys:
“My Nightforce is a Nightforce, did I mention I own a Nightforce. “
“My Nightforce is my kids godfather!”
“My Nightforce!!! How fuckin dare you talk down on my SHV!”
My ATACR, I own one, It’s a Nightforce!
Muh. My Nightforce is durable!! So fucking what George, you have diabetic nerve damage in your fat feet, you take the rifle from the bench to your f150. Durable for what, incase you have a fuckin stroke and drop it!?
Nightforce is becoming the 6.5 creed of the scope world. You shallow fucks wrap your entire existence and image aground your gear. Nothing about you is original. Nothing is rooted, it’s just drivin by fad, and is very fluid depending on the flavor of the cheerleaders that day.
You guys with what little bit of testosterone you have left need to chase away all the mainstream organic grass fed hypersensitive fuck boys before they ruin it.
Those of you so old that you don’t even make your own testosterone, sit down and shut up, quit arguing with the kids. You’re old enough to know better for Pete’s sake! Fuck!!
We get it, you retired and bought a Nightforce!
“My Nightforce is a Nightforce, did I mention I own a Nightforce. “
“My Nightforce is my kids godfather!”
“My Nightforce!!! How fuckin dare you talk down on my SHV!”
My ATACR, I own one, It’s a Nightforce!
Muh. My Nightforce is durable!! So fucking what George, you have diabetic nerve damage in your fat feet, you take the rifle from the bench to your f150. Durable for what, incase you have a fuckin stroke and drop it!?
Nightforce is becoming the 6.5 creed of the scope world. You shallow fucks wrap your entire existence and image aground your gear. Nothing about you is original. Nothing is rooted, it’s just drivin by fad, and is very fluid depending on the flavor of the cheerleaders that day.
You guys with what little bit of testosterone you have left need to chase away all the mainstream organic grass fed hypersensitive fuck boys before they ruin it.
Those of you so old that you don’t even make your own testosterone, sit down and shut up, quit arguing with the kids. You’re old enough to know better for Pete’s sake! Fuck!!
We get it, you retired and bought a Nightforce!
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My ATACR, I own 1 and only 1, she’s a 7-35 F1 mil c and she’s a bad bitch 
……
But I also own a Hens and a few S&B, sold my Tangents but may try a 7-35 when they come available.
……But I also own a Hens and a few S&B, sold my Tangents but may try a 7-35 when they come available.
The point is that equipment like you describe is great for design purposes or for sample testing. But it’s not used for QC of every scope that leaves the factory. Plenty of scopes are well designed and have the capacity for great durability. But some duds make it out.I dont think you're understanding how this process works. In a nutshell, zero retention, along with every other moving part, is tested ad nauseum with a multitude of stress and torture tests. One of the machines pictured mimics recoil. It can go from a 22LR, to a huge magnum to dropping it off a cliff. Far harder than banging it on a stool, or a Maple stump (though i do want to see those test results)
They can flat out wreck any scope on the planet with that machinery. And from that, learn it's weakness and it's breaking point.
It's not just about holding zero. There's lots of moving parts. The weak link could be anywhere, and no one builds a scope on smoke and mirrors.
Of course. But the rates vary depending on the depth and breadth of QC undertaken by each company. A company that tests (even without the time intensive test rig you showed) every single scope made is going to have a significantly lower rate of failure in customer hands than a company that only tests 10% of scopes by sampling, whether it is by hand or in a state of the art test machine.
Increasing durability through better design, aided by development testing with the rig you showed, will definitely lower the overall rate of failure. And you’re right that the optics industry has gotten better across the board. But manufacturing or material issues can still happen and slip through the QC cracks mentioned above.
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@Birddog6424 Surely Burris owns a collimator... do this same test on camera with no stopping the footage with one of those XTR3's and see how it holds up. Here's your chance to prove they're just as good as anything else like is constantly proclaimed. Surely it can pass this stupid test.
For NF to do this at shot show for anyone to come along and video takes confidence, lets see if Burris has it.
Bonus points if the video shows you walking up to an inventory shelf, pulling a random one out, and unsealing it to conduct the test.
For NF to do this at shot show for anyone to come along and video takes confidence, lets see if Burris has it.
Bonus points if the video shows you walking up to an inventory shelf, pulling a random one out, and unsealing it to conduct the test.
Hell yeh! Thats only fair.
I'm absolutely positive the NF used in that video was randomly chosen from a shelf and unsealed for this test. Not in a million years would a company ever hedge their bet in a live venue with a completely built by hand optic tested multiple times to make sure its up to the task. Possibly even modified for the job. That would never happen, so sure, it's a fair request..
Except... I have nothing to prove. I'm just a shooter like everyone else. And certainly not to you. You grind your Burris axe at every opportunity.
And Burris certainly has nothing to prove. You may or may not have noticed, but I dont see many people join in with you in your Burris bashing sessions. Burris proves their value where it matters most, the optics buying consumer. And every year for the last decade they have grown as a company and gotten more market share. People are happy with their scope. Five to eight years ago they rarely were mentioned here on the Hide. Never in a "What should I buy" thread. Now they come up constantly and people recommend them all the time.
I think they are passing the most important test. Their optics lines are selling faster than they can make them in Tactical, Hunting, and Thermal. And people like them. So you do you and keep doing your little dog in the yard routine, everyone else will continue to buy them and like them and Burris will continue to grow and be successful in spite of anything you say.
Most of the current Burris line up is outperforming many of the second tier optics.
Burris will pass the test.
Burris is a better scope just from user attitude alone.
I sold my NXS after looking through a XTR3, sure there is a big difference in the technology but I had a pile of money in that scope. In my opinion, NF is way over priced.
Hell yeh! Thats only fair.
I'm absolutely positive the NF used in that video was randomly chosen from a shelf and unsealed for this test. Not in a million years would a company ever hedge their bet in a live venue with a completely built by hand optic tested multiple times to make sure its up to the task. Possibly even modified for the job. That would never happen, so sure, it's a fair request..
Except... I have nothing to prove. I'm just a shooter like everyone else. And certainly not to you. You grind your Burris axe at every opportunity.
And Burris certainly has nothing to prove. You may or may not have noticed, but I dont see many people join in with you in your Burris bashing sessions. Burris proves their value where it matters most, the optics buying consumer. And every year for the last decade they have grown as a company and gotten more market share. People are happy with their scope. Five to eight years ago they rarely were mentioned here on the Hide. Never in a "What should I buy" thread. Now they come up constantly and people recommend them all the time.
I think they are passing the most important test. Their optics lines are selling faster than they can make them in Tactical, Hunting, and Thermal. And people like them. So you do you and keep doing your little dog in the yard routine, everyone else will continue to buy them and like them and Burris will continue to grow and be successful in spite of anything you say.
So that’s a no?
You came in here talking shit saying it’s a stupid test. You have the means to perform the same test with your optic but you’re making excuses instead. Can’t say I’m surprised.
Does your crystal ball tell you that or have you actually beat the shit out of one?
How the fuck does “user attitude” make a scope better?
How the fuck does “user attitude” make a scope better?
Is this some kind of left handed compliment to all NF users?
Judging by your attitude , it’s obvious.Does your crystal ball tell you that or have you actually beat the shit out of one?
How the fuck does “user attitude” make a scope better?
You’d be surprised what I actually beat the shit out of beta boy.
I’ve been around this industry for a long time.
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some of yall need to keep in mind a rifle scope holding zero after a drop/whack is just as much a test of the rifle/rings/mounting system as anything in the scope...and nope, just because someone buys expensive pieces of gear dont mean it was put together right and its going to survive every drop depending on how that drop is absorbed
id bet i could step on the line at any match and make plenty of rifles lose their zero without ever touching the scope
just cause the rifle is dropped and it loses zero...dont mean it was the scopes fault
id bet i could step on the line at any match and make plenty of rifles lose their zero without ever touching the scope
just cause the rifle is dropped and it loses zero...dont mean it was the scopes fault
Please explain more. Are you saying that I’m a typical NF fanboy/user because I responded to the Burris fanboy for talking shit about a test that his junk would never pass?
No explanation needed. People can see your interjecting yourself in the discussion by going after Birdogg in hopes some of your cheerleaders would join the bashing. But what your finding out is nobody here wants to be your friend including Nightforce, and I don’t blame them.
How’s that for a fuckin crystal ball prediction fuck boy?
Burris scopes have passed those tests a thousand times. Constantly, ad nauseum. That's how scopes are made, by pretty much everyone.
The fact that you don't know that shows you how ridiculous all your keyboard warrior sniping really is.
I won't argue with you further. As always, I'll let everyone read what you say and decide for themselves how serious they want to take you.
Good post. Thanks for interjecting some reason and logic into this thread.
Burris scopes have passed those tests a thousand times. Constantly, ad nauseum. That's how scopes are made, by pretty much everyone.
The fact that you don't know that shows you how ridiculous all your keyboard warrior sniping really is.
I won't argue with you further. As always, I'll let everyone read what you say and decide for themselves how serious they want to take you.
So what’s the issue doing it on camera to show the world then? You posted some pictures of the machines used. Not even any of optics passing or failing them.
The fact is I don’t even own a NF and I could be labeled a NF hater if anything. I sold them all after they were assholes about repairing a broken ATACR and in the end never repaired it.
I’m sure a guy with a bunch of shiny Savages with chinesium glass on them in his profile is the pinnacle of optic performance knowledge though.
I wouldn’t worry about my parody, Savage was part of that parody. You missed the irony, but that’s normal for slow learners.
If you dug that deep detective, dig a little deeper. Why are you on here jacking off Nightforce if you don’t like them. It’s because you’re a beta fuck boy tribalist that needs constant reassurance from your cheer squad because douche bags need like minded company. You’re only here to stir shit, but you got it all over you when you tried.
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Let me explain it to you like you're a third grader.
I dont work for Burris Optics. I live in Idaho, they are in Colorado. I'm a shooter, I work in medicine, I'm not a marketing agent. I don't get to tell them what to do.
If that weren't enough, I've already made it clear that I think whacking a scope on a chair is a silly marketing scheme. We have no idea if that's an off the shelf optic, and it's extremely unlikely that it is. If that scope broke while someone was videoing it, it would be all over YouTube and every shooter forum in 24 hours. And Nightforce knows that. They know damn good and well their scopes break just like everyone else's and they wouldn't risk it.
And as I've also made clear, neither myself nor Burris Optics has anything to prove to you.
You’re a funny guy, bet your real fun at parties too. I have no cheer squad nor have I jacked off NF. I simply called someone out for calling the test dumb that his optics would never pass, a diehard fanboy of the fullest. No wonder you two are such great pals though.
What the actual fuck is a “beta fuck boy tribalist”? Looks like you had an aneurism typing that reply.
It means you’re being a little bitch that needs his friends. You come here bashing Burris of all companies for being shit.
Burris, with the exceptional track record for durability in the XTR2 line.
One of the very few companies that actually makes a scope in the US.
Has a actual Burris factory the Philippines that contract for a few other companies that has a decent reputation so they need the quality Burris offers in its labs. I would seriously put the xtr2 right up there with any scope as far as durability is concerned. It’s a fuckin tank. I’ve had several, and after talking to a live person at Burris about the warranty, that’s another thing, a actual live person when I call. I wasn’t easy on them. They will hold up to about anything practical abuse wise. So you show up like your fuckin scope god, start puking your bullshit and wonder why you get called out.
YOU DONT KNOW SHIT!
You type utter bullshit, it’s ridiculous.
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So because you talked to a real person on the phone that told you what anyone at any company would tell you, they’re as reliable as anything else?
I’ve gotten a person on the phone every time I’ve called any optics company about warranty. That comment alone shows just how fucking dumb you are and how little you’ve dealt with shit which is funny for someone claiming to be in the firearms industry who’s hard on their stuff. I’ve dealt with Vortex (numerous times), S&B, Leupold, NF, Shield, Holosun, Premier, SWFA, Bushnell, Nikon, and…. BURRIS to name a few and have always talked to a person about on the phone when I called for warranty service.
This has nothing to do with Burris like you want to think. If anyone with shitty optics came here talking shit about this test I would have said the same thing… do it with your optics. But keep your head up your ass and believe whatever you want. You shoot savages with shit tier commie optics and think their good so that tells me all I need to know about you.
Again, YOU DONT KNOW SHIT.So because you talked to a real person on the phone that told you what anyone at any company would tell you, they’re as reliable as anything else?
I’ve gotten a person on the phone every time I’ve called any optics company about warranty. That comment alone shows just how fucking dumb you are and how little you’ve dealt with shit which is funny for someone claiming to be in the firearms industry who’s hard on their stuff. I’ve dealt with Vortex (numerous times), S&B, Leupold, NF, Shield, Holosun, Premier, SWFA, Bushnell, Nikon, and…. BURRIS to name a few and have always talked to a person about on the phone when I called for warranty service.
This has nothing to do with Burris like you want to think. If anyone with shitty optics came here talking shit about this test I would have said the same thing… do it with your optics. But keep your head up your ass and believe whatever you want. You shoot savages with shit tier commie optics and think their good so that tells me all I need to know about you.
Especially about me. You assume a lot though. Just like assuming about Burris.
The fact I don’t post it is by design, I don’t throw names out there for notoriety.
But I can assure you, I have more top pro shooters, scope companies, barrel companies and action companies in my contact list than you do. They answer when I call too.
You’re screaming about my commie scopes on the savages and got holosun, Nikon, and Bushnell in your comments.
Commie huh? Holosun huh?
“I know people but won’t say who”
Against my better judgement I gave Holosun a try and bought a few 507K’s, and they turned out to be shit just like I suspected they were based on my previous experiences with Chinese optics… Just like Phillipino optics.
If you want to have a dick measuring contest just let me know when I’ve pulled out enough to win.
The fact that I know who, and they know who, is fine with me. I don’t need to bring them into this shit thread.“I know people but won’t say who”
Against my better judgement I gave Holosun a try and bought a few 507K’s, and they turned out to be shit just like I suspected they were based on my previous experiences with Chinese optics… Just like Phillipino optics.
If you want to have a dick measuring contest just let me know when I’ve pulled out enough to win.
Maybe you should go away, this isn’t going to get better for ya. No need for a measure contest, everyone knows you’re the biggest dick here.
You’re a shit poster, but you suck at it bad.
That’s kinda funny coming from someone who constantly lets people get under their skin just because they don’t like nice stuff and hate when people that do.
Keep thinking your some kind of a god “troller of trolls” though. From were I’m sitting you just seem like some angry old man nobody. The “I know people” types are never somebodies.
Muh…. Burris is shit. Old man huh..
dig a little deeper detective. I would bet money you couldn’t follow me around for a day. I can guarantee that the “never somebodies” watching this thread would agree.
Some of you have never had to repeatedly beat a USO against a phone book to remove the anodizing flakes from the objective lens and it shows
Yes, because of the mental midgets of the world that post stuff like this:
I'm just so confused, I have NF, Vortex, Burris, and Sig optics...I'm not sure if I should hate myself or give myself a high five.
I wanted reiterate, I like trolling trolls. Got to admit, my mission in this thread was predictable. It was hook line and sinker.
Apparently you’ve never experienced cocaine and hookers and it shows.
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