Niihau Incident

[pmclaine]

I thought this would be an interesting piece of trivia for the board to know.

Recently my daughter, 4th grade was getting an education on the Japanese Internement camps during WWII.

I truly think they were a shame and I let her know that if anything take from that knowledge that from those camps came the 442nd RCT the most decorated unit of WWII. Those Americans were treated very unfairly yet when asked to fight for their country they volunteered and got sent to some of the roughest fighting in the war and kicked ass.

I also mentioned to her about the never mentioned Niihau Incident that played a mighty big role in why those camps came to be yet know one knows of it.

Niihau Island in the Hawaii Island chain was the designated landing spot for stricken Japanese aircraft attacking Pearl Harbor. Pilots were told to land there and await a sub pickup.

Niihau is privately owned and only a small number of people live there at the permission of the owners. Its still privately owned by the same family as far as I know.

Anyway the population on Dec 7, 1941 was Hawaii Natives and some Americans of Japanese descent as well some Japanese permitted to live there. The owners actually lived off island.

Well on Dec 7, 1941 a Japanese plane had to use the services of Niihau Island and crashed his plane there. The local islanders made contact with him but they were unaware of what happened at Pearl Harbor. Some were suspicious, some were nervous.

The pilot was taken captive for a short period of time but than the Japanese assisted the pilot in capturing the rest of the islanders.

Some of the islanders had some important military articles from him and the Japanese islanders helped him try to locate them.

A couple of brave islanders ended up getting in a gun fight with the pilot and killed him and at least one of his Japanese helpers killed himself upon realizing he was screwed.

Anyway the military learned of Niihau as did Roosevelt while much of it was kept secret from the general population.

All the military authorities knew was that in at least one case with a very small population of Japanese on American soil those Japanese had taken up arms to assist Japan.

It played a role at a time the country was in shock and terrified of invasion.

It doesnt make the confiscation of property and forced resettlement of American citizens kosher.

But it kind of puts some understanding to what the authorities were worried about.

Educate people about this and also remind them it was a Socialist Democrat that ordered and built the internment camps

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niihau_incident

http://www.historynet.com/the-niihau-incident.htm

http://www.hawaiireporter.com/niiha...-wwii-medal-for-merit-purple-heart-1891-1962/

http://www.pbs.org/opb/historydetectives/video/1915656990/

 

[Fig]

There were local papers in Hawaii at the time that reported Japanese helping down pilots on more than just Niihau. I've seen the articles from early December 1941 detailing the locals arming themselves and going after the down pilots, and the Japanese residents sheltering them, and in one case providing a pilot with a pistol. It wasn't just one incident. It was widespread across Hawaii, and there were a lot of Japanese living there, as there were in San Francisco.

But, your point is well made. It's easy to throw rocks generations later, for people who weren't there. At the time it was a perfectly legitimate caution to worry about what a large minority population would do.

They were worried about the German population during WWI. It changed society and the culture, because St. Louis had a huge German immigrant population at the turn of the century, and we had a ton of super German culture (beer halls, breweries, German Resturants, etc.). A ton of it (not all of it) died out during WWI, because Germans didn't want to be seen as being too German.

 

[W54/XM-388]

The levels of Propaganda, mindless group think as well as harsh government oppression of all dissenting opinions leading up to WWI and WWII were on a level that most people can't imagine possible today. If you want to know how evil your government can get... study the domestic history before, during and right after WWI and WWII carefully.

 

[EddieNFL]

And those interned were treated so much worse than the people of China, Korea, Philippines...pretty much throughout the Pacific. Oh, yeah, and the POWs held by Japan.

We have our flaws. I'm bettin' we make another mistake sometime in the future.

 

[W54/XM-388]

And those interned were treated so much worse than the people of China, Korea, Philippines...pretty much throughout the Pacific. Oh, yeah, and the POWs held by Japan.
We have our flaws. I'm bettin' we make another mistake sometime in the future.

A bit different, those were citizens (in some cases even citizens born in this country), who on a government whim had their entire lives destroyed, were imprisoned in harsh camps in climates much more brutal than they had been used to. Lost all their savings and all their possessions, had their homes and businesses destroyed, then at the end of the war were simply tossed back out on the street.

Then after 50 years of fighting they got an apology letter and $1000.
Like that would even make a dent in the current value of the properties their families owned on the coasts.


And yes I'm sure the government will do it again, the Liberals/Communists/Democrats/SJWs are all itching to do it to us and anyone else interested in freedom and decency, they just don't have the political numbers yet.

 

[pmclaine]

Yep some serious farm land and thriving business was lost by these citizens. That's crazy.

The damage to civil liberties for all was worse than had they taken up arms to fight for the empire.

Still though the plan to create the camps wasn't done on a whim. There were events of concern.

Over reaction seems to be the norm through history in our Republic.

 

[W54/XM-388]

Over reaction seems to be the norm through history in our Republic.

The government using any "emergency" excuse to destroy your civil liberties & constitutional rights is practically a mainstay of big government for almost as long as this country has been around.

 

[EddieNFL]

A bit different, those were citizens (in some cases even citizens born in this country), who on a government whim had their entire lives destroyed, were imprisoned in harsh camps in climates much more brutal than they had been used to.

A bit, but I wonder if the citizens of China, Korea, etc., could draw a distinction?

Africans were enslaved by their own people, sold and shipped to America, Romans enslaved Brits, the Jews were enslaved by everyone. It happened, still happens and will happen in the future. I like to think Americans (at least some of us) learn from the past. If we had not, I'm betting a certain demographic would be hatin' life in the US.

 

[MtnCreek]

Now we filll our country with our enemies, which is worse. The country can (did) survive a Temporary infringement on the rights of some, but will never recover when the people are replaced with a foreign breed.

 

[Redmanss]

Now we filll our country with our enemies, which is worse. The country can (did) survive a Temporary infringement on the rights of some, but will never recover when the people are replaced with a foreign breed.

They said the same about the Irish, the Germans, and the Italians in the mass migration movements of the 1800s. Seems we weathered that one pretty well too. It sometimes takes a generation or two, but most everyone who comes here eventually ends up with a Ford in the garage, a bottle of Jack in the cupboard, a baseball/football team to root for, and a gun in the nightstand.

The evil isn't from the outside, it's from the coasts trying to squeeze out everyone in the middle. I'd rather have a Saudi move to town than a Californian or New Yorker. I know which one would join me on the gun range followed by drinks first.

 

[Fig]

The Saudi would shoot but wouldn’t drink. The communist would drink but wouldn’t shoot.

In the past all those immigrants wanted to BE Americans. You would never see them protesting carrying their native flag, or demanding we adopt their language here. This is different, because the left is very different. They don’t want “diversity”. They want to end Americanism through tribalism.

 

[Strykervet]

I thought this would be an interesting piece of trivia for the board to know.

Recently my daughter, 4th grade was getting an education on the Japanese Internement camps during WWII.

I truly think they were a shame and I let her know that if anything take from that knowledge that from those camps came the 442nd RCT the most decorated unit of WWII. Those Americans were treated very unfairly yet when asked to fight for their country they volunteered and got sent to some of the roughest fighting in the war and kicked ass.

I also mentioned to her about the never mentioned Niihau Incident that played a mighty big role in why those camps came to be yet know one knows of it.

Niihau Island in the Hawaii Island chain was the designated landing spot for stricken Japanese aircraft attacking Pearl Harbor. Pilots were told to land there and await a sub pickup.

Niihau is privately owned and only a small number of people live there at the permission of the owners. Its still privately owned by the same family as far as I know.

Anyway the population on Dec 7, 1941 was Hawaii Natives and some Americans of Japanese descent as well some Japanese permitted to live there. The owners actually lived off island.

Well on Dec 7, 1941 a Japanese plane had to use the services of Niihau Island and crashed his plane there. The local islanders made contact with him but they were unaware of what happened at Pearl Harbor. Some were suspicious, some were nervous.

The pilot was taken captive for a short period of time but than the Japanese assisted the pilot in capturing the rest of the islanders.

Some of the islanders had some important military articles from him and the Japanese islanders helped him try to locate them.

A couple of brave islanders ended up getting in a gun fight with the pilot and killed him and at least one of his Japanese helpers killed himself upon realizing he was screwed.

Anyway the military learned of Niihau as did Roosevelt while much of it was kept secret from the general population.

All the military authorities knew was that in at least one case with a very small population of Japanese on American soil those Japanese had taken up arms to assist Japan.

It played a role at a time the country was in shock and terrified of invasion.

It doesnt make the confiscation of property and forced resettlement of American citizens kosher.

But it kind of puts some understanding to what the authorities were worried about.

Educate people about this and also remind them it was a Socialist Democrat that ordered and built the internment camps

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niihau_incident

http://www.historynet.com/the-niihau-incident.htm

http://www.hawaiireporter.com/niiha...-wwii-medal-for-merit-purple-heart-1891-1962/

http://www.pbs.org/opb/historydetectives/video/1915656990/

Daniel Inouye, MOH, US Senator, field commissioned 442nd, is one of those Socialist Democrats... Just saying. I was gonna say have your daughter contact him but he died in 2012. He's a real American badass. And probably knew more about what went on there than any of us.

Most of the US concentration camp victims (because that's what it was and that's what they were) from Manzanar were middle class families from WA and CA, particularly Seattle, LA and San Francisco IIRC. They were housed in substandard conditions, not as bad as Germany but still pretty bad. No respect was shown for the victims. It's a big deal here in Seattle every year and still talked about. One of the most fucked up was that when the camp was disbanded, and they showed up to reclaim their property, they were viciously told to "fuck off" by the new white owners. I've seen the exact same exchange in film from Holocaust survivors who attempted to regain their property. The Swiss gov. still actively conceals stolen Nazi wealth, and giving it back to the rightful owners is now called "wealth redistribution" with the same greedbag connotations there that it carries here. In US, Bank of America did essentially the same thing to the Japanese. They came out here to warn against doing it again after 9/11 when I first arrived here.

In that camp, rape, theft and abuse of the victims was rampant. There was no privacy, not even in the latrine. It wasn't a "good concentration camp" because US ran it. ALL concentration camps are bad and while stopping one will always be "illegal" it will also always be morally right. The victims didn't fight though, because like all concentration camp victims, they wanted to prove to their government they were useful and not a menace. When they did fight back, it was too late and known as the "Manzanar Riot". History has shown the only way to put down a concentration camp is to simply kill those associated with it and expose it for what it is.

After the war, they were still treated as subhuman. Watch some of those "This is your life" episodes. The one that comes to mind most is the one where they had a Hiroshima survivor on there. He didn't know what was gonna happen and was a child when the bomb fell. They brought out the navigator of the Enola Gay to meet him. The man that killed his family and friends. His look pretty much said it all, but the handshake was "taken by the American public as absolution and apology" for the war. That pretty much highlights the sentiment of the period. "Here's your $25, thanks for staying at our camp, fuck you, 'we' won, 'Murca" of the 1940's.

442nd DID have soldiers from the camps, but the majority were nesei from Hawaii. Once you got in the camp, it wasn't easy to get out.

All this is from actual survivors.

 

[pmclaine]

On a side note to this story.....

How would you like to be in the Robinson family owning an island in that chain.

Doesnt look to be a small Island either.

I think they cattle ranch it.

If you watch the PBS film where they try to ascertain if the valve and rocker arm came from the Niiahu Zero you get a little view of the island. Looks like you could grass feed beef there pretty easily.

But what would I know Im from East coast.

 

[Fig]

I’ve read that the original 9 Missionary Families own the majority of land in the Hawaiian islands, and cattle ranching is the primary operation.

 

[pmclaine]

I’ve read that the original 9 Missionary Families own the majority of land in the Hawaiian islands, and cattle ranching is the primary operation.

Heard Oprah is trying to move into their circle of ownership.

Hope they know better than to sell to her.