Ok so with my bolt gun build getting very close to being done, I am wanting to build a precision AR. I want the .223 not sure on a barrel length 16 or 18? I don't know the max range of this weapon maybe shooting target out to 100 to 600yds. Also I would like to build it as cheap as I possibly can. Any suggestions? I've seen Palmetto Armory has a few kits are they worth the money?
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Noob to ARs
- Thread starter BenY 2013
- Start date
Re: Noob to ARs
The PSA kits are great...especially those with the hammer forged barrels. You're going to have to narrow things down a bit. Iron sights or optics?, barrel length...I'd go for an 18"+ if you're looking at ranges beyond 300m. Precision ARs and low cost are a relative matter. Barrel, trigger and ammunition are most important components next to shooter and his/her capability. A basis PSA kit on top of a $60-$80 lower will land you in the $675 range. This is going to be a basic A2/A3 upper rifle with a 16" barrel. I would advise you start here (if new to the AR-15) and work your way up. The front sight base can be swapped for a railed gas block and with an A3 upper you can run optics. Drop in match triggers start at $90 and go north from there. ARs are Barbie for men. You can accessorize at any time...but I'd start out boot camp simple and go from there. Maybe start out with a good old 20" M16A2 clone with an A3 (flat top) upper? This will give you a better sight picture on the iron sights and a little more stability than the carbine.
The PSA kits are great...especially those with the hammer forged barrels. You're going to have to narrow things down a bit. Iron sights or optics?, barrel length...I'd go for an 18"+ if you're looking at ranges beyond 300m. Precision ARs and low cost are a relative matter. Barrel, trigger and ammunition are most important components next to shooter and his/her capability. A basis PSA kit on top of a $60-$80 lower will land you in the $675 range. This is going to be a basic A2/A3 upper rifle with a 16" barrel. I would advise you start here (if new to the AR-15) and work your way up. The front sight base can be swapped for a railed gas block and with an A3 upper you can run optics. Drop in match triggers start at $90 and go north from there. ARs are Barbie for men. You can accessorize at any time...but I'd start out boot camp simple and go from there. Maybe start out with a good old 20" M16A2 clone with an A3 (flat top) upper? This will give you a better sight picture on the iron sights and a little more stability than the carbine.
Re: Noob to ARs
Thank you for the reply! I am planning on running an optic on the gun. So I would prefer a gas block instead of the fixed sight. Also how are the PSA barrels on accuracy? Thanks
Thank you for the reply! I am planning on running an optic on the gun. So I would prefer a gas block instead of the fixed sight. Also how are the PSA barrels on accuracy? Thanks
Re: Noob to ARs
You could do 600 with a 16" barrel, but if you're concentrating on target use only, you may want an even longer tube to maximize ballistics (like a 20" or even 24").
I've shot 16" guns to 800 meters and on a calm day they will hit an E type silouette every time.
You could do 600 with a 16" barrel, but if you're concentrating on target use only, you may want an even longer tube to maximize ballistics (like a 20" or even 24").
I've shot 16" guns to 800 meters and on a calm day they will hit an E type silouette every time.
Re: Noob to ARs
When faced with the the 16" vs 18" choice I opted for 16". It works just fine to 600 yards but I can definitely see the reasoning behind 20-24" rigs. I built mine the way I did because I was caught up in the recce/SPR concept. In hindsight I'm glad that I have a sub moa platform that only weights 9lbs, but a longer tube would be better suited to the kind of shooting I actually do.
Moral of this story: if you don't have to lug it around, go long.
When faced with the the 16" vs 18" choice I opted for 16". It works just fine to 600 yards but I can definitely see the reasoning behind 20-24" rigs. I built mine the way I did because I was caught up in the recce/SPR concept. In hindsight I'm glad that I have a sub moa platform that only weights 9lbs, but a longer tube would be better suited to the kind of shooting I actually do.
Moral of this story: if you don't have to lug it around, go long.
Re: Noob to ARs
16 is nice - the RRA ATH upper or a White Oak build are solid and very respected tools for 'precision' AR work
have fun and don't get too spun up over stuff....but stick with quality.
16 is nice - the RRA ATH upper or a White Oak build are solid and very respected tools for 'precision' AR work
have fun and don't get too spun up over stuff....but stick with quality.
Re: Noob to ARs
I will post this as my opinion and move on. A lot of people will disagree with me, but some won't.
Don't get caught up in brand name ARs. I've built 1/2" ARs using all stock parts except the barrel for over 10 years. Too many people get caught up in the RRA, DPMS, or "Whatever" uppers. You are only throwing your money away. If you want a quality upper then build one yourself, and choose a premium barrel and upper to match your standard lower. Ninety-nine percent of the time I will find the cheapest milled lower I can find, find a good quality upper, and have them 'matched' by a machinist friend of mine. This will eliminate the play between the two parts, and will cure 80% of your accuracy issues.
I could go on and on about building your own AR and am in the process of writing a book about it. So, I'm not gonna go any further on the topic.
Let's just say I'm going to make a lot of 'Premium' AR manufacturers mad with the information included, and I am almost guaranteed to get slammed by a few. However, the seasoned gunsmiths will know I am not full of it, and several have agreed with me on the topics I'm covering.
I will post this as my opinion and move on. A lot of people will disagree with me, but some won't.
Don't get caught up in brand name ARs. I've built 1/2" ARs using all stock parts except the barrel for over 10 years. Too many people get caught up in the RRA, DPMS, or "Whatever" uppers. You are only throwing your money away. If you want a quality upper then build one yourself, and choose a premium barrel and upper to match your standard lower. Ninety-nine percent of the time I will find the cheapest milled lower I can find, find a good quality upper, and have them 'matched' by a machinist friend of mine. This will eliminate the play between the two parts, and will cure 80% of your accuracy issues.
I could go on and on about building your own AR and am in the process of writing a book about it. So, I'm not gonna go any further on the topic.
Let's just say I'm going to make a lot of 'Premium' AR manufacturers mad with the information included, and I am almost guaranteed to get slammed by a few. However, the seasoned gunsmiths will know I am not full of it, and several have agreed with me on the topics I'm covering.
Re: Noob to ARs
"Matching" the upper to the lower has nothing to do with accuracy in an AR platform. Same concept as the accu-wedge, and this myth has been debunked for some time now. For ARs, the things that matter for accuracy are: Barrel, Trigger, Ammo (as already stated above). Having a free-floated barrel is also important, as differing pressure on the hand guard can throw off your POI quite a bit. Some will true up the face of the barrel threads on the upper receiver and bed the barrel extension, but I'm not convinced that even these measures make a significant enough difference. ARs can be tricky to shoot accurately, and are much less forgiving than a bolt gun. Followthrough is extremely important.
Be forewarned: there is no cure for black rifle disease (BRD). It will consume your life.
"Matching" the upper to the lower has nothing to do with accuracy in an AR platform. Same concept as the accu-wedge, and this myth has been debunked for some time now. For ARs, the things that matter for accuracy are: Barrel, Trigger, Ammo (as already stated above). Having a free-floated barrel is also important, as differing pressure on the hand guard can throw off your POI quite a bit. Some will true up the face of the barrel threads on the upper receiver and bed the barrel extension, but I'm not convinced that even these measures make a significant enough difference. ARs can be tricky to shoot accurately, and are much less forgiving than a bolt gun. Followthrough is extremely important.
Be forewarned: there is no cure for black rifle disease (BRD). It will consume your life.
Re: Noob to ARs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: johngfoster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Matching" the upper to the lower has nothing to do with accuracy in an AR platform. Same concept as the accu-wedge, and this myth has been debunked for some time now. </div></div>
Told you some would disagree. Not going to hijack this guys thread, but it does matter. Whoever told you it didn't matter? I'd like to know.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: johngfoster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Matching" the upper to the lower has nothing to do with accuracy in an AR platform. Same concept as the accu-wedge, and this myth has been debunked for some time now. </div></div>
Told you some would disagree. Not going to hijack this guys thread, but it does matter. Whoever told you it didn't matter? I'd like to know.
Re: Noob to ARs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DPRoberts</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When faced with the the 16" vs 18" choice I opted for 16". It works just fine to 600 yards but I can definitely see the reasoning behind 20-24" rigs. I built mine the way I did because I was caught up in the recce/SPR concept. In hindsight I'm glad that I have a sub moa platform that only weights 9lbs, but a longer tube would be better suited to the kind of shooting I actually do.
Moral of this story: if you don't have to lug it around, go long. </div></div>
If you don't mind me asking what components did you build yours with? I really like the idea of an Mk12 looking rifle. I think I will go with a 16" barrel...probably a mid length free float handguard. Please correct me if my terminology is off, I am brand new to ARs only shot a few!
Also is there any brand I definantly need to stay away from?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DPRoberts</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When faced with the the 16" vs 18" choice I opted for 16". It works just fine to 600 yards but I can definitely see the reasoning behind 20-24" rigs. I built mine the way I did because I was caught up in the recce/SPR concept. In hindsight I'm glad that I have a sub moa platform that only weights 9lbs, but a longer tube would be better suited to the kind of shooting I actually do.
Moral of this story: if you don't have to lug it around, go long. </div></div>
If you don't mind me asking what components did you build yours with? I really like the idea of an Mk12 looking rifle. I think I will go with a 16" barrel...probably a mid length free float handguard. Please correct me if my terminology is off, I am brand new to ARs only shot a few!
Also is there any brand I definantly need to stay away from?
Re: Noob to ARs
Why not just get a Colt HBar Match Target (flap top w/ stainless barrel) and call it done? I have one because I wanted exactly what you do and outside of a trigger I haven't touched it. It is a very accurate gun, as with most of my guns it shoots much better than I can.
Why not just get a Colt HBar Match Target (flap top w/ stainless barrel) and call it done? I have one because I wanted exactly what you do and outside of a trigger I haven't touched it. It is a very accurate gun, as with most of my guns it shoots much better than I can.
Re: Noob to ARs
I would prefer to build it, also I am trying to do this on a budget! I may just start by building my lower now and then ordering parts for the upper as I can afford.
I would prefer to build it, also I am trying to do this on a budget! I may just start by building my lower now and then ordering parts for the upper as I can afford.
Re: Noob to ARs
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BravoSector1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> barrel length...I'd go for an 18"+ if you're looking at ranges beyond 300m. </div></div>
I'd say so, too. If you plan to do a lot of shooting past, say, 500 yards, you probably want to go with a 20 - 24 inch heavy barrel. You'll probably want to use optics at those distances, which calls for a flat-top upper, and you're going to have a fairly unwieldy product no matter what barrel length you choose. You'll also probably want a free-floating stock. On top of that, you'll probably be driving heavy bullets at 69 or 77 grains to pump up the ballistic coefficient, and you'll need to pay attention to the twist rate.
And having said all that, as I keep reminding myself, it's not the arrow, it's the Indian.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BravoSector1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> barrel length...I'd go for an 18"+ if you're looking at ranges beyond 300m. </div></div>
I'd say so, too. If you plan to do a lot of shooting past, say, 500 yards, you probably want to go with a 20 - 24 inch heavy barrel. You'll probably want to use optics at those distances, which calls for a flat-top upper, and you're going to have a fairly unwieldy product no matter what barrel length you choose. You'll also probably want a free-floating stock. On top of that, you'll probably be driving heavy bullets at 69 or 77 grains to pump up the ballistic coefficient, and you'll need to pay attention to the twist rate.
And having said all that, as I keep reminding myself, it's not the arrow, it's the Indian.
Re: Noob to ARs
Barrel, trigger group, quality ammo, clamp style gas block, heavy walled upper, free float handguard, and a reliable optic.
And if it makes you sleep better at night about upper to lower fitment buy an accuwedge or shave the lower to fit. Oh and one other thing I figured out about the AR platform...cheap and accurate never worked out somehow in the same sentence!
Barrel, trigger group, quality ammo, clamp style gas block, heavy walled upper, free float handguard, and a reliable optic.
And if it makes you sleep better at night about upper to lower fitment buy an accuwedge or shave the lower to fit. Oh and one other thing I figured out about the AR platform...cheap and accurate never worked out somehow in the same sentence!
