ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

[Crotalus]

I know these threads get a a bit redundant but I thought would got ahead anyway. I am starting a custom tikka build, have a Rock Creek .264 8 twist in the works. Original plan was for a 6.5 creedmoor.

Before the creedmoor I wanted a 6.5x284 build. However after more research I found that barrel life was too low. I want my custom rig to last a while, granted I don't get to shoot nearly as much as I would like. 1000 rounds is not enough though. so now my question is.....

what if I were to load a 6.5x284 to creedmoor velocities? light loads for the majority of my shooting 400-700yrds? then if I wanted to stretch it out to a 1000 or so I would load up to 2950fps with the 140's.

My main questions concern the performance of the 6.5x284 at lower velocities. Would accuracy be affected? I would think it should be in the same realm but I know how cartridges can be picky when it comes to loading.

Am I better off with the 6.5CM or should I just jump up to the 6.5x284?

 

[OutlawTen5]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Go with your original plan and build a 6.5 Creedmoor and don't look back. 400-1000 yards without a problem!
I run one of mine at 2860fps thru my TBAC 30-P1 and I'm 9.7 Mils up at 1300 yards.
(26" Rock 1/8tw shooting Hornady 140gr A-Max)

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

2950 is fast for the creedmoor.

 

[reloader-1]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Any thought to the .260 Remington? It's another easy to shoot 6.5 with good brass availability.

 

[coldboremiracle]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

6.5CM, definitely between those two.

 

[turbo54]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Forget about 6.5-284.

My opinion is you've gotta be SERIOUS to mess with that cartridge.

6.5CM will get you to 1000 easy.

Having multiple loads for a rifle sucks. Pick ONE load and learn it.

 

[Crotalus]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Ok, guess I was right to go with the creedmoor. With the popularity of this cartridge gaining, what are the odds of more brass options showing up? not that I have a propblem with hornady brass. It would just be nice to know that more is available.

and yes I thought long and hard about he .260, went with creedmoor because of the more modern case design. I don't want to have to trim my brass all the time.

 

[reloader-1]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Crotalus, hopefully Norma or Lapua will eventually pick it up, or at least Nosler. I doubt the big names (Remington/Winchester/Federal) will get in the game, but it should be reasonable to assume that one of the smaller makers will hop on soon.

 

[Boltfluter]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Personally I would go with a 6.5x47 Lapua. I have several customers that are getting 3000 fps.with a 123 Hornady with no issues. Lapua brass is hard to beat and super tough. One customer stomps them at 1000 yds. on a regular basis. Hope this helps. Regards, Paul.

 

[Mike]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

^^^^

OR we can stick to the OP's original question and forgo the short comings of the x47 such as loosing brass at comps gets expensive and the performance advantage is nil against the other 6.5s (my factory 6.5 CM was sending 120 amax's at 2950). Plus, factory Creedmore ammo is about $40.00 a box cheaper and is much easier to find.

So between the two the 6.5CM is the way to go. The x284 only outshines if you're really going to push the pills over 3100 and if you are, you will pay dearly in barrel life. The CM will do all you ask of it, has very inexpensive quality factory ammo, and can be reloaded very easily. There are ample established loads out there for the 120, 130, and 140 class of bullets.

 

[Sportin Wood]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

+1 for the Creedmoor. I just sold my 6.5-284 and got a 6.5 CM... I highly recommend the move!!

 

[FCS]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Hands down the 6.5 Creedmoor given choice between Creedmoor and 6.5-284 for use that you described.

If you open up the field a bit then there are other solid options.

140 Berger VLD or hybrid out of the Creedmoor would be my suggestion, 130 Berger as close second.
Can you make the 6.5-284 shoot at lower velocity with accuracy, yes you can. Still will take more powder then the Creedmoor to get same velocity.
To really take advantage of the 6.5-284 you'll be well over 3.000" OAL, so if you are running AICS type mags you end up hamstringing the -284.

 

[Crotalus]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

thanks everyone, your advice was a solid confidence builder. Now I won't have to wonder.... coulda woulda shoulda

I plan to shoot the 140 and 130vld's, which ever i get best accuracy. for hunting I'm looking a the barns 127grain LRX bullet. I know people use the vld's for hunting. recently I started reloading for a friend who does a lot of hog hunting on his property in up here in nor cal. Not talking about escaped piglets you see the guys on TV shoot. REAL wild mountain hogs that look more like a ware-wolf than any thing else. He has always been disapointed with most hunting bullets on these big nasty boars. until I started loading him the TTSX bullets. They blast through thick armor and still smash bone and don't come apart.

 

[Crotalus]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

oh yeah, on the 6.5x47L, doesn't do much for me. Not that it is bad, just don't see any ballistic advantage over the CM. Brass is likely to only be made by lapua, which is good but too expensive to be my only option. And every thing else I load for use large rifle primers. don't really need to add another component if not necessary.

I don't really plan to shoot any bullets much lighter than 130. Thats the reason I wanted a 6.5, to shoot heavy bullets.

 

[jake6547]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Personlaly you can't go wrong with any of the 4 main 6.5 cases. I do agree the 6.5-284 is overkill though.

 

[Jedi]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

OK
Fact my gun my info not here say
6.5x47
20" broughton 5C
123 scenar 3023fps via RE17

MAtch rig (sold)
31" broughton 5c
140 berger vld
2978fps RE17

So yes x47 can with long barrel n right load match 6.5-284 fps

Brass is crazy expensive, i will not build another
6XC norma brass 50% cheaper, neck up n you have a large primer version of x47

Norma brass is very good, only $8 x100 more than Hornady CM brass
pert easy decision there

SLR
308/260/243 done right, no fire forming, uses 243 brass

6/6.5 GAP
You can buy brass preformed so no fire forming needed
whole thread on it there somewhere

 

[majohnson2]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

The 6.5CM seems to have a lot going for it over several of the other loads. The more I read, the better the 6.5CM seem to be one of the better choices for long range shooting. Good barrel wear, large selection of bullets, and easy on the body.

 

[Dirty D]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

I have a 6.5/284 and it is a finicky sucker, I can't seem to find a consistent load. It has sat in the safe for the last 18 months, when I can squirrel away enough funds it will go to RWS for a set back and rechamber to 6.5CM.

 

[Mike]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Brass is crazy expensive, i will not build another
6XC norma brass 50% cheaper, neck up n you have a large primer version of x47
</div></div>

Jedi, so is my understanding correct that you just neck up 6XC brass and FF it to x47? Any other brass work?

 

[mtnhntr]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

The other issue with the 6.5x284 doesn't work well through a short action I have modified short actions to magazine feed them using Seekins extended mags for the 300 wsm. To save yourself some headache stay with the Creedmoor.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

6.5CM, 130 VLD, RL17, 26" 1 in 8 Bartlien gives me 3007 FPS and great accuracy. I get 2850 with RL17 and 142 SMK.
The CM brass from Hornady is good stuff. I have reloaded some of it 6 times and still have good primer pockets.

 

[STR]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

One more for the Creedmore. Had mine out to 1000 yards for the first time this weekend, and there was no problems ringing steel if I made the correct wind calls. Least expensive factory ammo in the 6.5. Bullets, lower recoil so you can spot your own shots. Just works great.

 

[Crotalus]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

all sounds good guy. Really helped me out, peace of mind.

Gun will be Tikka T3 action
rock creek #5 sporter fluted @27"
manners MCS-t
CDI BDM
roedale bolt shroud and handle

can't wait

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Just as a suggestion but the KRG chassis would be very nice for your new rig. I don't think the cost would be much more (if any) than the MCS and CDI.

 

[Crotalus]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shoot4fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just as a suggestion but the KRG chassis would be very nice for your new rig. I don't think the cost would be much more (if any) than the MCS and CDI.</div></div>

thanks for the suggestion but KRG is too bulky for me, and its definitely not my taste. this will be a hunting/precision shooting rig.

 

[shoot4fun]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

10-4
Understand that.

 

[jschroed]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

I was almost sold on the 6.5-284. Glad I took a look at this thread. Thanks for all the insight guys.

 

[Jedi]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Mike
Let me clarify you dont FF 6XC in a x47 chamber

basically they are twins ballistically, thou case is slightly different

6XC brass is made by NORMA, very good
neck up to 6.5cal and you have pert much a x47 with large primer

So if your enamored with x47, but hate cost of brass
6.5XC will give you same thing @ 50% savings in brass

Note
6XC NORMA brass is only $8 x100 more than Hornady CM brass

Hornady brass or NORMA brass
no brainer there

Yet folk still wanna build a CM, guess they just dont get it.

CM/XC/x47
all are pert much mirror of others ballistically

Very lil diff in case design

of the 3 cost wise the XC makes most sense

which would you rather run
Hornady or Norma brass

NOW
for a TAK rig where ya gonna lose brass
ya need good brass, cheap and good quality

The SLR
be it 6mm or 6.5 is perfect, no fire forming
uses 243 brass, WIN brand brass is good. more than good enuff for TAK rig
SLR
fix's all that wrong with 308 family of cases
better shoulder angle and longer neck
NO FIRE FORMING
http://www.6mmar.com/65_SuperLR.php

It maybe what i replace x47 with, thou with 800 cases and an annealer ... i might be shooting x47 for a long time to come, many report 20+ loads on brass and still going strong.

Another option 6/6.5-250
use WIN brass cheap n cheerful easy neck up
been winning hipower match's for yrs

6XC is in fact just a blown 22-250 necked up to 6mm

 

[NOMAD]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Do the 6.5 Creedmoor and dont think twice!!

You can buy 20 rounds of factory match for $24 a box

If you reload no matter how great you are at the bench you will be working real hard to duplicate the accuracy.

You will be able to bump up the speed some.

But from all the shooting we do with this round shoot factory when you can and reuse your brass and duplicate the load off the box and you will smoke the 308 and equal the .260 while not breaking the bank.

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

So what I am reading is that a shorter barrel (20"-22") is not a good choice for the 6.5CM? I have been thinking about a 6.5CM in a gas gun, but wanted to stay around 22" on the barrel. Sounds like the velocity would be kinda low?

 

[luvtolean]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NOMAD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do the 6.5 Creedmoor and dont think twice!!

You can buy 20 rounds of factory match for $24 a box

If you reload no matter how great you are at the bench you will be working real hard to duplicate the accuracy.

You will be able to bump up the speed some.

But from all the shooting we do with this round shoot factory when you can and reuse your brass and duplicate the load off the box and you will smoke the 308 and equal the .260 while not breaking the bank.

</div></div>

This is exactly why I'm shooting 6.5Cr and am very very happy with the choice.

 

[PowerstrokeOBX]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BgBmBoo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So what I am reading is that a shorter barrel (20"-22") is not a good choice for the 6.5CM? I have been thinking about a 6.5CM in a gas gun, but wanted to stay around 22" on the barrel. Sounds like the velocity would be kinda low? </div></div>

Yes it will be slower but it depends on what your using it for. UKD and matches I'd take the extra velocity and longest barrel possible.

 

[captrichardson]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Funny how often this comes up, just posted on this very topic a few days ago.

I think the 6.5-284 issue got beat up pretty good. I know plenty of F-Class Shooters who run them with good results, and for a single application where it comes down to driving a 6.5 to the max and you are willing to pay for ammo and barrels, then it makes sense. For across the board shooting with higher round counts, and trying not to empty the bank account, it doesn't make much sense IMHO.

In terms of the 6.5 Creedmoor vs the .260,

Funny because a lot of people are $#!@ talking the .260 when it comes to off the shelf ammo. A little reality check,

Do an ammo search at Midway:
6.5 Creedmoor
There are 5 choices that come up, with 2 in stock.

.260 Remington
There are 22 choices that come up, with 17 in stock.

Check out the HSM ammo on Sniper Central:
HSM Ammo
There are ZERO 6.5 Creedmoor offerings, and there are 3 for the .260 Rem.


Also consider when it comes to brass,
6.5 Creedmoor - ONLY 1! Hornady

.260 Remington - Lapua, Norma, Nosler, Remington


Don't get me wrong, the 6.5 Creedmoor is a good round, but when you get down to it, unless I am missing something, Hornady is currently the only manufacturer supporting it with ammo or reloading components. That means if you go that route, you are putting all of your eggs in one basket.

Also, not sure where the comment came from on having to constantly trim a .260? In my bolt guns, I can neck size my brass, shoot bug holes with it, and not have to full length size it or trim it for at least 2-3 loads. I also have some Remington Brass with 8-10 loads on it before I pitch it.

Not trying to put down Hornady (80% of the Bullets I shoot are Hornady) or the 6.5 Creedmoor, but I want to make sure that both sides of the coin are getting represented fairly, and then everyone can make their own well informed decision as to what works best for them.

Best of Luck,
M Richardson

 

[Mike]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: captrichardson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Don't get me wrong, the 6.5 Creedmoor is a good round, but when you get down to it, unless I am missing something, Hornady is currently the only manufacturer supporting it with <span style="font-weight: bold">BRASS</span>. That means if you go that route, you are putting all of your eggs in one basket.


Best of Luck,
M Richardson</div></div>

There, fixed it for you. The brass is the only thing "needed" that is Creedmore specific. Everything else is interchangeable.

 

[Mike]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BgBmBoo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So what I am reading is that a shorter barrel (20"-22") is not a good choice for the 6.5CM? I have been thinking about a 6.5CM in a gas gun, but wanted to stay around 22" on the barrel. Sounds like the velocity would be kinda low?</div></div>

Who is writing what you're "reading"?

GAP-10 6.5CM with 22" barrel. 120Amax factory ammo @ 2950 fps.

And if my GAP AR 260 was any indicator, I was moving the 139gn Scenar at 2800 out of a 22" barrel. So can you get faster velocities out of a longer bolt gun barrel? Absolutely. Will you suffer because you have a short barrel?

No

 

[luvtolean]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There, fixed it for you. The brass is the only thing "needed" that is Creedmore specific. Everything else is interchangeable. </div></div>

Exactly. It's just a 6.5mm, shellholder #1, short action bolts, lg primers, nothing fancy.

It's widely supported by die makers, caliber specific tools, like Giraud and WFT trimmers, chambering tools etc etc.

Overall the case design is a bit better than the .260, and you don't pay a premium to get it like 6.5x47, and there is nothing that changes in set up like firing pins etc. Just put a barrel on and shoot. If you have a few hundred cases you'll probably shoot out a barrel before you had a brass supply problem, but the brass is easily available and inexpensive.

BTW, this is not to say .260 won't work, it's currently ruling tac matches on the 1000yd range I shoot on...

As has been hinted at, unless you're starting with a long action, the 6.5-284 will cause you problems, it likes to be longer than typical short action mag length.

 

[rv7pilot]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Between a 6.5 CM (short action) and a 6.5-284 (long action), I'd choose the the 284 hands down. I can push 140's, using 58gr of Retumbo around 3075 fps very accurately.

I can push 140's around 2750 fps with 46gr of IMR 4350 and cover the holes with a dime at 100. But you really need a long action. I'm using 300 WM AICS magazines and they work great.

If I were to go with a short action, I'd go 260 Remington and never look back.

 

[turbo54]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Now lets talk about 7mm-08, 7mm Creedmoor and 284...

OP, had you considered a 7mm?

 

[Bayou1535]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

I'm curious of the 7mm-08 also.

 

[rusty815]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

The 7mm-08 is pretty close in ballistics, I think the 6.5CM has a slight edge. The 7mm-08 has more recoil and more stopping power, making it a little better suited for hunting.

Either will do fairly well, but for target shooting I'll take the 6.5CM, and I have a 7mm-08 (no 6.5CM yet).

 

[KYS]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: captrichardson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Don't get me wrong, the 6.5 Creedmoor is a good round, but when you get down to it, unless I am missing something, Hornady is currently the only manufacturer supporting it with <span style="font-weight: bold">BRASS</span>. That means if you go that route, you are putting all of your eggs in one basket.


Best of Luck,
M Richardson</div></div>

There, fixed it for you. The brass is the only thing "needed" that is Creedmore specific. Everything else is interchangeable. </div></div>

Nosler brass should not even be considered a choice due to how crappy it is....

 

[captrichardson]

Re: ok... 6.5creedmoor or 6.5x284.....?

Sorry that Nosler Brass doesn't meet your high standards! Of course I wouldn't expect you to shoot anything other than Lapua, can't see you lowering yourself to anything less.

Used to be plenty of people $#!@ talking Remington Brass, then Sherri Gallagher used a .260 with Remington Brass to win the 2010 NRA High Power National Championship, that shut a few people up, but some people still argue you can't do anything with it.

The 6.5 Creedmoor was released in 2007, and after 4-5 years, it still only has a single source for brass. Reality is, if there is a hiccup with the Creedmoor brass supply from Hornady, which there has been in the past, then you are pretty much screwed unless you want to have to form your own from another source.

If it works for you, use it, if it doesn’t, don’t!

Best of Luck,
M Richardson