Pack for Mammoth 2020

[texag0842]

@PrepareSmarter

I run these three usually. Water, Kestrel, and one AI mag.

If I run a range finder I do it with Swaro EL Range with their chest suspenders

 

[Eustice]

I like the Kestrel and rangefinder(?) holders. I'm having mixed thoughts about lots of gear on my waist belt.

Using the belt is nice when you’re moving. But if the stage requires you to move with everything then it’s nice to be able to clip the belt backwards around the pack so it doesn’t get in the way donning/doffing it. Or catch on spare mags on your belt and yank them out. I had one pouch big enough for a 16 ounce Nalgene and the belt could still be snapped around the back of the pack.

Load out as though you’re going to start a stage. Spare mags, pistol, pack on, rifle slung. Then run a mock stage moving with all the gear.

 

[PrepareSmarter]

Do the stages typically require you to keep all your gear on you? I was thinking about running a small chest pouch to carry my mags, kestrel, and rangefinder.

 

[POGPride]

I am considering using my ilbe. I saw it missioned above but didn’t get much attention.

It’s a little big and slightly heavy compared to some options but not out of the question. I cut off a ton of extra straps and attachments I won’t need. I am not against buying another pack but I am finding it hard to justify.

Looking for more insight here...

 

[diablodawg]

Do the stages typically require you to keep all your gear on you? I was thinking about running a small chest pouch to carry my mags, kestrel, and rangefinder.

You had to start with all your gear. Both my partner and I ran Hill People Gear Kit bags and just put them in the pack between stages. Worked well.

I am considering using my ilbe. I saw it missioned above but didn’t get much attention.

It’s a little big and slightly heavy compared to some options but not out of the question. I cut off a ton of extra straps and attachments I won’t need. I am not against buying another pack but I am finding it hard to justify.

Looking for more insight here...

It would work fine for the weight, just not a good place to put the gun besides under the lid. What happens when the frame snaps in the cold?

 

[POGPride]

It would work fine for the weight, just not a good place to put the gun besides under the lid. What happens when the frame snaps in the cold?

Thanks... That's what I need to hear. I am looking the mystery ranch overload now. 50L and can carry a rifle.

 

[Eustice]

It would work fine for the weight, just not a good place to put the gun besides under the lid. What happens when the frame snaps in the cold?

The ILBE doesn’t have the plastic DE frame like the FILBE or MOLLE II. A rifle can be strapped to either side with the buttstock in the side pouch. Rifle on one side, tripod and ammo on the other balances nicely. But crucifix carry does well, too.

 

[diablodawg]

Yep, I did not specify; we call the current pack the ILBE thought it is actually the FILBE.

 

[ClangClang]

Thanks... That's what I need to hear. I am looking the mystery ranch overload now. 50L and can carry a rifle.

Overload is heavy as hell, but certainly bombproof. MR makes a couple other packs with the same overload shelf system, but 30%-40% lighter by virtue of using the Guide Light frame instead of the NICE, using 500D fabric instead of 1000D, and less molle. I'd rather have the the lighter weight, but YMMV.

 

[rmillemon]

So this year I turn 40. Call it a planned midlife crisis but I have set a goal to compete in mammoth next year.

I started with a personal trainer last month and have given myself a year to hit a target fitness goal.

Obviously the fitness piece is what clears the field at mammoth and pack weight is huge.

I need help with selecting a pack and hope to draw on the fields experience. Packs considered at this point.

Eberlestock Gunslinger II gen2
Exo Mountain Gear K3500
Kifaru Nomad2

Obviously weight of pack, stability, ease of use and cost are all factors.

I love the versitilty and build of the Kifaru. But big money.

The new gen 2 gunslinger II shaves some weight vs the earlier versions. It’s the least expensive which frees up money to upgrade to some other lighter weight gear specificly a lighter weight quilt/sleeping bag

The exo mountain k3500 seems like the perfect middle ground between the two. I love the weight of the exo and the clean simple layout and design, but it is significantly more cost than the eberlestock and I feel it has the worst rifle attachment of the bunch.

Thoughts ?

I think you will be doing yourself a great disservice to not look into the stone glacier R3.

 

[POGPride]

Overload is heavy as hell, but certainly bombproof. MR makes a couple other packs with the same overload shelf system, but 30%-40% lighter by virtue of using the Guide Light frame instead of the NICE, using 500D fabric instead of 1000D, and less molle. I'd rather have the the lighter weight, but YMMV.

I looked at the terraframe in comparison to the overload. It is a bit lighter, but talking to MR on the phone it didn’t have all the same features. The over load is several pounds lighter than the ILBE and definitely a better size. The rest of my gear is really super light, I am willing to sacrifice 2ish lbs to have the overload.

 

[fordsoldier]

I'm looking at the eberlestock destroyer for my pack. Site says 8 pound but with the new design in material Austin at eberlestock says it is closer to 7

Or the MR Metcalf which is 6.1

 

[teddy12b]

If it helps at all, I've been using that Osprey of mine and just haven't fallen in love with it. I'm going to pick up a mystery ranch Selway, mostly because it's a bigger version of their scree and I absolutely love how that pack rides.

 

[fordsoldier]

Just ordered the metcalf.

 

[DarrinW]

I have seen Hill People Gear mentioned a few times but nothing about running their packs. Has anyone ran one here?

 

[RTH1800]

Tag

 

[Aaros143]

I have seen Hill People Gear mentioned a few times but nothing about running their packs. Has anyone ran one here?

I have an Umlindi that I use for army stuff quite a bit. Not packing as much as you in Mammoth though.

 

[DarrinW]

I have an Umlindi that I use for army stuff quite a bit. Not packing as much as you in Mammoth though.

Me and my son in law are doing the Bushnell sniper challenge in KY in Feb. I already have a Tarahumara and it would attach right to a Ute or Umalindi for some added space. I really like the harness and was hoping they would work well.

 

[ClangClang]

I used a HPG Ute at the November Run N Gun at Rockcastle last year. I entered "Mule" division, where the competitor who carried the largest percentage of their body weight across the 12km course would win a Thunderbeast suppressor. I carried just about 140 lbs of mostly pea gravel in my Ute, took me close to 7 hours to finish the course. It carried wonderfully with my rifle in the HPG Pack Bucket. The only real downside was by the end of the match, the lumbar pad on the pack had caused some pretty intense friction hot spots on my lower back, but I attribute that to carrying a relatively crazy amount of weight and nothing to do with the pack itself. Certainly never had that happen before, even with a "standard" heavy load in the 70 lbs range. Actually thinking of selling my Ute off cause I have no plans of using it in the upcoming year. Will sell it cheaply. Not interested in carrying heavy packs any more

Side note - I didn't win the TBAC can. Another competitor carried 165 lbs (plus his rifle and pistol) and wound up winning.

 

[Aaros143]

The HPG packs have been great. Take a bit of getting used to over military packs. Actually improve your posture.

 

[teddy12b]

I can't speak to HPG packs, but I really like the chest pouch I've got from them. I only bought it to pack a pistol while backpacking, and it looks like something a hiker would wear, I don't have one of the models covered in molle just to blend in a bit on the trail. I would imagine their packs are pretty great if they fit you well.

My Selway arrived a couple days ago and when I put it on everything just clicked for me. I haven't done the final adjustments to the sizing or used it yet, but I'm hoping to change that tonight. I've been rucking with a large Alice that has a bag of salt in it and it's all bundled up and sitting by the door. In the mean time my selway does take a little bit of tinkering with to really understand how it all works and fits together. It's a different kind of setup entirely for me, but that's ok.

When I got my selway, I also ordered one of their semi auto pistol holsters. It's pretty generic, but fits onto the hip belt of the pack pretty well. I'm a complete Mammoth noob, so I don't know what's allowed or not allowed on Ft Gordon for rucking around with a pistol on your side.

 

[fxdwgkd]

Just heads up, brownells has
Gunslinger II on sale as are a few other eberlestock packs

 

[teddy12b]

It's getting closer, and I've been going through my gear. Last night I did a mock loadout and I was at 50# fully loaded. That's food, water, ammo, mags, sleep system etc. I was really hoping to be at or under #40 for this, but 32# of my gear is weapons and ammo. I'm really considering a less accurate rifle that's lighter just to cut down some of the suffering.

 

[slick19]

It's getting closer, and I've been going through my gear. Last night I did a mock loadout and I was at 50# fully loaded. That's food, water, ammo, mags, sleep system etc. I was really hoping to be at or under #40 for this, but 32# of my gear is weapons and ammo. I'm really considering a less accurate rifle that's lighter just to cut down some of the suffering.

DONT DO IT!

 

[Gotlag1789]

It's getting closer, and I've been going through my gear. Last night I did a mock loadout and I was at 50# fully loaded. That's food, water, ammo, mags, sleep system etc. I was really hoping to be at or under #40 for this, but 32# of my gear is weapons and ammo. I'm really considering a less accurate rifle that's lighter just to cut down some of the suffering.

Eeesh. Thats heavy :/ I dont think id skimp on the rifle tho haha

 

[slick19]

Eeesh. Thats heavy :/ I dont think id skimp on the rifle tho haha

IDK, I carried 75-80 LBS 3 years ago. so 50 sounds pretty nice. I think I usually haul around 60ish

 

[teddy12b]

IDK, I carried 75-80 LBS 3 years ago. so 50 sounds pretty nice. I think I usually haul around 60ish

60 ish for Mammoth events? How many have you done?

 

[slick19]

60 ish for Mammoth events? How many have you done?

3. Rock Castle when it as -2*, Arena when it went from 75 and wet to 25* and frozen, then Ft. Gordon Last year when it was 75 and wet

 

[never_summer]

How much does your rifle weigh? 32lbs sounds like a lot in ammo/weapons

 

[teddy12b]

3. Rock Castle when it as -2*, Arena when it went from 75 and wet to 25* and frozen, then Ft. Gordon Last year when it was 75 and wet

I keep seeing the pictures from Ft. Gordon from last year and everyone was in shorts. It'd make my day if the weather got that warm, but I'm packing for worst case scenario right now. Coming from northern Indiana I think the odds are good it'll be warmer than home either way.

 

[teddy12b]

How much does your rifle weigh? 32lbs sounds like a lot in ammo/weapons

If I remember right the rifle with scope, sling and bipod was just shy of 17#. Then add 120rds of 6.5 at 1# per 20rds, then 2 10rd AICS mags, then a G17 with three loaded mags and a holster it seems to add up pretty quickly. I think at the time I weighed all that in I was also using a Hill people chest pouch before deciding to go with a regular owb holster.

 

[never_summer]

If I remember right the rifle with scope, sling and bipod was just shy of 17#. Then add 120rds of 6.5 at 1# per 20rds, then 2 10rd AICS mags, then a G17 with three loaded mags and a holster it seems to add up pretty quickly. I think at the time I weighed all that in I was also using a Hill people chest pouch before deciding to go with a regular owb holster.

sounds pretty close to what I’ll be using, gonna take the weight kit out of my rifle and it’ll hopefully be around 12.5lb to 13lb, haven’t put it on the scales stripped yet.

 

[D_TROS]

IDK, I carried 75-80 LBS 3 years ago. so 50 sounds pretty nice. I think I usually haul around 60ish

Last year my everything weighed 62 lbs. But that was with a 18 lb rifle. Id way more prefer a 12 lb rifle and be in the 50lbs. Next year I will use a MDT LSS stock and try save some weight there...

GL
DT

 

[oda175365]

Weight of the ruck is kinda dependent on how the event is scored and events are weighted. I shot the 2016 Mammoth and it paid heavily to move quickly. Ounces equal pounds and pounds equal pain. I went without a lot- and shared gear between. For example - my teammate and I shared a one man shelter. Prioritize your equipment. Think when I stepped off from the lodge I weighed 45 pounds with rifle.

1:What will win the match (Rifle/Optic/Ammo)
2: What will help me win (Bags, binos, tripods)
3: What will keep me moving (Food, water)
4: What will keep me comfortable/protected ( Clothing/ shelter).

The question to ask prior competitors- what did you bring that you never touched? I watched dudes carry the kitchen sink and suck ass for it. Also-all those overbuilt military heavy duty bags and molle gear carry a weight penalty. I carried a light civilian hiking bag, and bypassed any mag pouches ( They are called pant pockets- work great.) I stripped every unnecessary food wrapper and cut every loose piece of webbing off my gear. If it didnt have a job- it got the knife. To be honest on the final afternoon I ran out of food ( Not on purpose- but suffering is a good teacher)

Physical training was what probably got a good bit of dudes crushed too. Want a simple benchmark? Be able to move ~ 4 miles over varied terrain with short shooting event in between- non stop for 36 hours. Take care of your feet and stay ahead of hydration.

Mammoth is a different beast than any Competition Dynamics event- kinda falls into its own category. Its fun- and what I seek in a real tactical match. The gamers showed up and were beat down by the elements. ( See what happens when all that fancy gear get a good coating of rain and ice)

 

[Kane0519]

Well, that bag stands out in a crowd of mystery ranch & eberlestocks!
Almost looks like a fashion statement. It says “I don’t care, it works”.

 

[never_summer]

@oda175365 what type of shooting bags if any would you recommend for mammoth?

 

[oda175365]

Well, that bag stands out in a crowd of mystery ranch & eberlestocks!
Almost looks like a fashion statement. It says “I don’t care, it works”.

It definitely stood out. Made my stuff easier to find in the woods and snow to say the least!

 

[oda175365]

@never_summer

To be honest - I wish I had brought either a light fill Chinese Cheater Bag or Game Changer. All I had was two plain jane rectangular bags.

Any of the light fill that suits your need would be my recommendation. Joe Harris’ match had a ton of gear restrictions on stages- and not sure what the current crew running it has as far as limitations.

 

[teddy12b]

Weight of the ruck is kinda dependent on how the event is scored and events are weighted. I shot the 2016 Mammoth and it paid heavily to move quickly. Ounces equal pounds and pounds equal pain. I went without a lot- and shared gear between. For example - my teammate and I shared a one man shelter. Prioritize your equipment. Think when I stepped off from the lodge I weighed 45 pounds with rifle.

1:What will win the match (Rifle/Optic/Ammo)
2: What will help me win (Bags, binos, tripods)
3: What will keep me moving (Food, water)
4: What will keep me comfortable/protected ( Clothing/ shelter).

The question to ask prior competitors- what did you bring that you never touched? I watched dudes carry the kitchen sink and suck ass for it. Also-all those overbuilt military heavy duty bags and molle gear carry a weight penalty. I carried a light civilian hiking bag, and bypassed any mag pouches ( They are called pant pockets- work great.) I stripped every unnecessary food wrapper and cut every loose piece of webbing off my gear. If it didnt have a job- it got the knife. To be honest on the final afternoon I ran out of food ( Not on purpose- but suffering is a good teacher)

Physical training was what probably got a good bit of dudes crushed too. Want a simple benchmark? Be able to move ~ 4 miles over varied terrain with short shooting event in between- non stop for 36 hours. Take care of your feet and stay ahead of hydration.

Mammoth is a different beast than any Competition Dynamics event- kinda falls into its own category. Its fun- and what I seek in a real tactical match. The gamers showed up and were beat down by the elements. ( See what happens when all that fancy gear get a good coating of rain and ice)

View attachment 7185581

I've never tried to mount a rifle on the side like that and it just never seemed like it'd come close to balancing out especially with a heavier competition rifle. Did you shift all your ammo and water to the other side to make it all work? Anytime I've ever rucked with a rifle the rifle was slung and at the ready. I see a lot of picture of guys throwing the rifles on top of Alice packs and just keeping it simple.

 

[oda175365]

Yeah- wanna say I started with it on the side- but once I got through the first stage I just strapped it on top. Just put a scope/action protector on it and moved out. Balance didn’t seem to be a big issue.

When you load your ruck you want your heavier items, such as ammo, hi-mid center close in your back. Your lightest items, like a sleeping bag, go on the bottom. And weight should rest on you hips via the hip belt. Shoulder straps are really just there to keep the load close and centered over your hips and CoG.

 

[teddy12b]

Yeah- wanna say I started with it on the side- but once I got through the first stage I just strapped it on top. Just put a scope/action protector on it and moved out. Balance didn’t seem to be a big issue.

When you load your ruck you want your heavier items, such as ammo, hi-mid center close in your back. Your lightest items, like a sleeping bag, go on the bottom. And weight should rest on you hips via the hip belt. Shoulder straps are really just there to keep the load close and centered over your hips and CoG.

That's how I've got my pack setup now. I've got the rifle against my back in the overload compartment, ammo inside the pack in the camelbak pouch, sleeping bag on the bottom and everything else all around and on top of that. I may play around with top loading the rifle. Part of the fun of this event for me is that it's breaking my out of what I've ever done before.

 

[Kane0519]

Has anyone tried the Vorn backpacks or at 45L are they just too small for this event?

 

[slick19]

Ive always strapped my rifle to the side of the ruck. I put my tripod, pistol, ammo and spotting scope on the other side. It balances pretty well for the first two days. The 3rd day it kinda pulls towards the rifle a little. I always hated the dudes that carried it horizontally. Usually they'd use trekking poles too, so you'd get a trekking pole on the toe, trip, and as they looked to see what happened you'd take their barrel to the face. I usually just ran ahead as fast as I could to get away from the pack with those face/toe wreckers

 

[teddy12b]

Yesterday my partner and I had a mini training session. We started with a full shakedown of everything we were planning to take and how we were planning to take it as a full loadout. Up to this point most of our training and gear selection has been as individuals, this time we laid it all out together looked for excess, missing equip, and opportunities to reduce redundancies in team gear. I'm always impressed by how my partner packs his gear, he showed up ready for Mammoth with his Kelty Redwing 44 with plenty of room leftover. It's the same one he used in Alaska when we went there last year so I know he's squared away. His plan was to sling his rifle the whole time.

All I ended up removing from my pack was a base layer top and bottom that I'd been debating on previously anyway. After seeing how he was setup I reloaded everything in my redwing 50L when I got home and had plenty of room left over. Between switching packs, removing a baselayers, and I'm going to swap my rain gear for some lighter & more compact frogg toggs I cut about 5 ish pounds out. With this arrangement, I'll end up humping my rifle like the old days and end up just hating myself for it by day 3, but that's fine.

After all the messing around with packs that I've done and I ended up going with a small pack that I've had and loved for years.

 

[never_summer]

@oda175365 how and what did you use for shelter? Hard to visualize sharing a one man tent ?

 

[FishDr]

I don’t want to see that ^^^^. ?

 

[oda175365]

@oda175365 how and what did you use for shelter? Hard to visualize sharing a one man tent ?

Called spooning man. Ain’t above it. First night we caught shelter in a barn. 2nd night was in the tent as sleet turned into snow. Warm and dry. Some dudes roughed it in “poncho” shelters. Looked so sad you could actually hear the Sarah MacClachlan music over their suffering.

 

[teddy12b]

Looked so sad you could actually hear the Sarah MacClachlan music over their suffering.

LMAO,

That's the first I've heard of there being an availability of any form of shelter during the event. I kept thinking the site would be a wide open wet field with wind blowing through it constantly. What kind of sites do they make people set up for the night in?

 

[oda175365]

The movements were rewards based. For example- 1st team to arrive got to select the firing order, maybe got a few bonus points, or at night would get a hard stand shelter. Point driven in by the match director (Joe Harris) is that is pays to be a winner.

Overall the sites were near a semi improved road- and tucked in the woods. Pretty sure the first night was at the SASS cowboy town. Nothing crazy. Wind and precipitation protection given priority. Move quick when the site is shown. Like westward expansion- the good land goes quick.

 

[RTH1800]

What is the average total milage covered for this event? I realize it changes each year. Is it mostly over roads and trails or bushwhacking? The pictures I see are on two tracks and gravel roads IIRC.

Thanks