PortaJohn

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No, it is not forced. Free will still exists. If one decides that they desire to keep their job and take the vax then they have made a choice. That is not forced. Force is when they hold you down. There was an exit and it wasn’t chosen.

Maturity is owning your personal decisions and not making excuses for them. Maturity is also learning from one’s mistakes. Why people want to blame others for their decisions instead of learning from them is beyond me.
 
No, it is not forced. Free will still exists. If one decides that they desire to keep their job and take the vax then they have made a choice. That is not forced. Force is when they hold you down. There was an exit and it wasn’t chosen.

Maturity is owning your personal decisions and not making excuses for them. Maturity is also learning from one’s mistakes. Why people want to blame others for their decisions instead of learning from them is beyond me.
Coerced is a better word to describe it, still not a good look.
 
 
No, it is not forced. Free will still exists. If one decides that they desire to keep their job and take the vax then they have made a choice. That is not forced. Force is when they hold you down. There was an exit and it wasn’t chosen.

Maturity is owning your personal decisions and not making excuses for them. Maturity is also learning from one’s mistakes. Why people want to blame others for their decisions instead of learning from them is beyond me.
How about the government telling you that you can't buy car insurance or renew your license/registration if you don't get vaxed?
It's not "forced".
 
i have referenced this many times over the years.
who wanted war in syria and why?
the kingdom wanted assad out to clear the way for a pipeline to european markets, and british petroleum was going to build it.
you think the kingdom cared about the CF woke agenda and women's rights?


This would mean that Russia is in the mix in that area to prevent the SA kingdom from cutting into their European Union business. People on all sides are dying for revenue that their families will never see? Say it ain’t so.
 
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No, it is not forced. Free will still exists. If one decides that they desire to keep their job and take the vax then they have made a choice.
They are being forced to take the vax to keep their job.

That is forced.

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Your argument is literally splitting hairs.

Shaq is a stand up Guy and is 100% on point.
 
This would mean that Russia is in the mix in that area to prevent the SA kingdom from cutting into their business. People on all sides are dying for revenue that their families will never see? Say it ain’t so.
perhaps unsurprisingly, assad and russia were the good guys in this story.
brennan and obama knew they were arming al nusra front and other terrorists the whole time, while the kingdom armed isis in general.
 
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This is the worlds largest bulldozer ever built. It was never used for its intended purpose. It was built in Italy for Libya but was banned from being exported because sanctions on Gaddafi. Instead its sat, basically unused.

One of the casualties of US sanctions.
 
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There were nine Republicans on the Intel committee that knew and didn't say anything. They used the excuse that the closed door hearings with Brennan, clapper, comey and the others were classified. Even though shift came out and said that they had real tangible evidence, a lie, they didn't say anything.
The republicans are in on it!!




 
Is it just me, or does anyone else get the desire to punch a person on the balls when they pop in with a one word post “source?”??

Are you that fucking unable to do your own research? Maybe i am taking it the wrong way, but it strikes me as a smartass comment
i post so many .jpgs that i am not surprised people want a link to the information to read more.
sometimes i can provide one, sometimes i can't. in any case, people should do their own research rather than trust me or anyone else.
 
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How about the government telling you that you can't buy car insurance or renew your license/registration if you don't get vaxed?
It's not "forced".
People want to play semantecs with the word forced and say you have a choice, etc blah snort

Well, duh. I have a choice in everything I do right up till somebody puts a bullet in my head, doesn't mean I arrived in front of the barrel by my own choosing or because I didn't have pressure, influence, coercion, threats, etc. levied against me.

The idea of choice is being fucked with by faggots playing word games. Choice is synonymous with free will, that is the freedom... to choose between alternatives.

If you're having your arm twisted between a choice of your livelihood and the ability to care and provide for your family, some with special needs or critical illnesses, and being forced to make a medical decision by edict handed down by some dickhead politician that's not a choice.

I grant you it's definitely a decision, but let's not pretend it's the same as choosing between chicken or tuna for lunch which is completely consequence, threat, and ramification free.

Every asshole saying "you can always just quit and do something else" is part of the problem. Those people are sympathizers. They say that because their job hasn't forced it upon them, or perhaps they're self employed, or they left one job for another so they're feeling good about the decision.

The problem is, that noose will keep tightening. Till there's no job that's exempt. Till self employed have to take it. Till there's nowhere to quit and go work "somewhere else."

It's a way of dividing and conquering. We should all be standing together now, before we're all swinging from the rope.

Threatening somebody's job over a vaccine is bullshit, stop making excuses for the assholes doing it by telling those affected they have a choice in the matter. They didn't choose any of it, the whole shit sandwich is being thrust upon them.
 
People want to play semantecs with the word forced and say you have a choice, etc blah snort

Well, duh. I have a choice in everything I do right up till somebody puts a bullet in my head, doesn't mean I arrived in front of the barrel by my own choosing or because I didn't have pressure, influence, coercion, threats, etc. levied against me.

The idea of choice is being fucked with by faggots playing word games. Choice is synonymous with free will, that is the freedom... to choose between alternatives.

If you're having your arm twisted between a choice of your livelihood and the ability to care and provide for your family, some with special needs or critical illnesses, and being forced to make a medical decision by edict handed down by some dickhead politician that's not a choice.

I grant you it's definitely a decision, but let's not pretend it's the same as choosing between chicken or tuna for lunch which is completely consequence, threat, and ramification free.

Every asshole saying "you can always just quit and do something else" is part of the problem. Those people are sympathizers. They say that because their job hasn't forced it upon them, or perhaps they're self employed, or they left one job for another so they're feeling good about the decision.

The problem is, that noose will keep tightening. Till there's no job that's exempt. Till self employed have to take it. Till there's nowhere to quit and go work "somewhere else."

It's a way of dividing and conquering. We should all be standing together now, before we're all swinging from the rope.

Threatening somebody's job over a vaccine is bullshit, stop making excuses for the assholes doing it by telling those affected they have a choice in the matter. They didn't choose any of it, the whole shit sandwich is being thrust upon them.
I have yet to see anyone here advocating for the bosses who are trying to enforce vax requirements in their companies. You had to read that somewhere else on the web.

So say some father is put into the situation you describe. They take the shot and die of a clot, now there is no one to feed the family. Who is responsible for putting the rest of his family (who had no choice) into destitution when the information about the risks have been out there for some time?

I’ll take the words “choice” and “decision” out of the equation to drive the point home: Who is ultimately responsible? I submit it is the dad, whether he takes the vax or he doesn’t. Whether to take the shot or not is his responsibility either way. Always has been. Along with accepting the consequences of all decisions. It’s part of being the leader in a home.
 
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There should not be a choice to make.
Both of the view points are valid.
I have yet to see anyone advocating for the bosses who are trying to enforce vax requirements in their companies. You had to read that somewhere else on the web.

So say some father is put into the situation you describe. They take the shot and die of a clot, now there is no one to feed the family. Who is responsible for putting the rest of his family (who had no choice) into destitution when the information about the risks have been out there for some time?

I’ll take the words choice and decision out of the equation to drive the point home: Who is ultimately responsible? I submit it is the dad, whether he takes it or he doesn’t. Whether to take the shot or not is his responsibility either way. Always has been. Along with accepting the consequences of all decisions. Part of being the leader in a home.
A corrupted government has manipulated this scenario.
Leave me alone!! Better yet... Leave us alone!!!
 
I have yet to see anyone here advocating for the bosses who are trying to enforce vax requirements in their companies. You had to read that somewhere else on the web.

So say some father is put into the situation you describe. They take the shot and die of a clot, now there is no one to feed the family. Who is responsible for putting the rest of his family (who had no choice) into destitution when the information about the risks have been out there for some time?

I’ll take the words “choice” and “decision” out of the equation to drive the point home: Who is ultimately responsible? I submit it is the dad, whether he takes the vax or he doesn’t. Whether to take the shot or not is his responsibility either way. Always has been. Along with accepting the consequences of all decisions. It’s part of being the leader in a home.
I'm glad everyone in your family is healthy. I know guys where that's not the case. Some dudes don't have skills that translate well to other fields or that weren't in high demand in the first place.

Do you put your family in jeopardy for sure and leave or take the chance you'll be one of the ones who squeeks by?

Hell of a fuckin "choice"
 

Athlete says something I don't agree with: "Stick to sports!", "Shut up and dribble!", etc.

Athlete says something that I agree with: "Look at this respectable and popular person who is saying the same thing as I am!"

:cautious:

FWIW, I think Shaq has generally managed to articulate a thoughtful and nuanced opinion on the vax.
 
I'm glad everyone in your family is healthy. I know guys where that's not the case. Some dudes don't have skills that translate well to other fields or that weren't in high demand in the first place.

Do you put your family in jeopardy for sure and leave or take the chance you'll be one of the ones who squeeks by?

Hell of a fuckin "choice"
Indeed, but it is one that has to be made. We have seen both options taken by members here.
 
How about the government telling you that you can't buy car insurance or renew your license/registration if you don't get vaxed?
It's not "forced".

Well in order for me to drive in MA I have to have insurance so there is something in there related to force.

But on topic......

I hope nurses can use the fact that we have no choice about paying into Medicare/MedicAid.

How is it that they mandate a program than because of that program you lose your rights to bodily autonomy.

Based on that argument of fiscal responsibility they should be able to mandate daily forced PT as being fiscally responsible with Medicare/MedicAid funds.

Personally I welcome that as long as it is one of the paid eight hours in the regular work day but if forced upon the population in general we would have the streets full of pissed off people.
 
Indeed, but it is one that has to be made. We have seen both options taken by members here.
Only because other people are forcing it upon everyone. Usually by politicians and other fucking idiots that don't know shit about medicine or science.

CDC has backtracked on everything. Yes you can still catch it. Yes you can still carry it. Yes you can still give it to Grandma. No it doesn't do anything to stop transmission.

But we're still going to force it on people under penalty of blowing up their careers and livelihoods and call that a choice? Give me a fuckin break.

That's my point. It's not a choice it's a fucking ultimatum. Comply or else. Let's not soften up what's really happening by calling that a choice. Worst part? It doesn't even accomplish anything.

This is about breaking people's will and justifying the tyranny by saying "well...they had a choice" is just as bad as forcing it upon them.
 
What about smoking, drinking alcohol and eating at McDonald's? Do they dare go there? If they want to follow the science we know what kills the most.
Based on that argument of fiscal responsibility they should be able to mandate daily forced PT as being fiscally responsible with Medicare/MedicAid funds.
 
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What about smoking, drinking alcohol and eating at McDonald's? Do they dare go there? If they want to follow the science we know what kills the most.
This already happens to a degree: some companies will offer discounts on your insurance if you follow a healthy lifestyle such as maintaining a certain weight, working out regularly, not smoking etc. So that means those who engage in those activities are penalized with higher benefits costs from their employer because they increase the group premium. It’s the same thing with Covid vaccines, but on a bigger scale. It’s not a new ploy, but the consequences have definitely been ramped up.