Whats everyones preference, if you could have a Flir T70 or a L3 LWTS, or a Rayheon W1000, which one would you get if money isn't an issue. I know many of you have these devices. I have several G3 NVDs but nothing in thermal, this will be my first thermal device.
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Night Vision Prefered therma device
- Thread starter tjwong
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Flir T-70 I have a W-1000 that has a focus issue and can not get it repaired because I did not buy it from people who sell them on this forum, they have limited parts and hold them for their customers, and Raytheon no longer supports this unit. So even if you got one from a dealer that supports it. they may at some point no longer have parts for repair. The FLIR is a commercial unit and will be supported for a longer time than one that is a gov contract
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Limited parts? I see a mound of spare parts. The person you bought yours from had no way to warranty the units and that's why you paid less. He then tried to send his customers to us for warranty repair so the statement was made about our customers. You can send us your W-1000 for evaluation and repair but it will not be covered under our warranty if it was not purchased from Ident Marking, MOD Armory, I2 Technologies or 1 of our many dealers.
As far as the OP. The W-1000 is a handheld or weapon sight with 3.1X optical magnification while the other 2 are handheld, clip-on or a weapon site with only a 2X digital magnification. When using the T-70 and L3 LWTS as a 2X weapon sight it drops the resolution to 320x240, which is what the W-1000 is at 3.1X. If you are looking for a clip-on then go with the L3 LWTS. We have used both the T-70 and the LWTS and will say that it is well worth the wait for a L3 LWTS
If you are not in the need for a clip-on then look hard at the W-1000. Half the price and all the performance!
As far as the OP. The W-1000 is a handheld or weapon sight with 3.1X optical magnification while the other 2 are handheld, clip-on or a weapon site with only a 2X digital magnification. When using the T-70 and L3 LWTS as a 2X weapon sight it drops the resolution to 320x240, which is what the W-1000 is at 3.1X. If you are looking for a clip-on then go with the L3 LWTS. We have used both the T-70 and the LWTS and will say that it is well worth the wait for a L3 LWTS
If you are not in the need for a clip-on then look hard at the W-1000. Half the price and all the performance!
I was not looking for warranty repair tried to contact I2 Technologies and got no response from PM or e-mail, talked to Mod armory as I have bought several components for the W-1000 from them, video adapters and battery's / charger and was told they could look at it for $250 but it sounded like a lens problem? and none where available (to me as I had not purchased it from them). I went on to contact Raytheon and talked to their service dept and was told they did not service them as they where outdated an no parts available. the person I bought it from at no time tried to pawn you guys off as warranty or as a repair station. that's great that you warranty what you sell, but and extra $4k to warranty a mill spec item for one year?
it still works fine, just limited focus/ limited travel clicks when trying to focus under 150 yards
it still works fine, just limited focus/ limited travel clicks when trying to focus under 150 yards
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I waited since the shot show for an LWTS. It was worth the wait. It is fantastic. I won't down the t70 though. I haven't had my hands on one. If it is any better than LWTS I would be shocked. Keep in mind I just got mine a couple weeks ago and haven't really put it through its paces yet on a hunt. I also have a flir hs324 pro with the 30hz 320 core. It is damn good but the LWTS is a shit load better. Well worth the money.
I have shot these side by side and although the T-70 is a nice clip-on thermal I think the L3 LWTS is a nicer unit. In my opinion the only thing the T-70 wins is the battery compartment. You can throw a handful of batteries in it and it will work however they land. If you need/want a clip-on go with the L3 LWTS. You won't regret it.
I normally shoot with NV and use a thermal for spotting. For that I use my W-1000 because the detection range is better than most available units.
I normally shoot with NV and use a thermal for spotting. For that I use my W-1000 because the detection range is better than most available units.
These decisions are hard enough but I'm going to toss out another option that you might want to consider. Take a look at the Nivisys line of UTAC's such as the UTAC-32M clip on thermal. It's a solid built military no frills thermal. Works great, VERY rugged and at $7075, it's a great price! You can see the Nivisys line at Nivisys.com
Does the W-1000 have a mil- based reticle? Or just simple crosshairs?
The value of 3.1x and 640x480 resolution diminishes if you can't obtain first shot hits at distance.
Obviously that is not a problem with clip-ons.
What about recoil rating? Is the W-1000 recommended to .338 Lapua? .50 BMG?
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It is an ACOG 4X-32mm TAO2 LED model, a dynomite little lighweight scope for my hog and coyote night hunts (it also has NV compatible reticule)
Skypup, that's a very nice system! Looks like I'm ordering a T70 tomorrow morning! I have a few gen three NV scopes but I have found them to be ineffective during very dark conditions when it's cloudy and no starlight. During those times a IR illumination is necessary which is illegal on public lands.
We have 800 acres in central oregon where its ok to use illumination on predators, but now I want to have some new technology that I can use on those really dark nights!
We have 800 acres in central oregon where its ok to use illumination on predators, but now I want to have some new technology that I can use on those really dark nights!
You will love the FLIR T-70, is truly is a hardcore mil-spec thermal instrument.
Whats on the front end of your rifle?
Skypup, Do you have any pics/videos of the T70 as a stand alone, showing the internal reticles? TIA...
The W-1000 is a mil system and has reticles for M16(A1 and A2), M4, M203, M249, M60, M24 and a M136(AT4). The Stinger reticle has been removed. The listed reticles are all the weapons that the W-1000 was tested on and rated for.
Here is my black ACOG TAO2 reticule cowitnessed with the RED 5.56mm T-70 internal reticule in white mode, in black mode the reticule turns white:
I think you can see some of the reticules in this video too:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/Night Vision/FLIR T70/T70 Coyote2/T70 Coyote.wmv
Most likely from what you said the lens has been driven past its stop by force or impact. Its a minor repair, I would send it to MOD or us. Raytheon typically refers us for repairs as we own all the spares and service the units for all the W1000 customers- regardless of where they were bought. You got a great deal an that unit but the seller didn't have any way to support them or warranty them- in the past he has sent people to us for small warranty issues and parts- that I took care it of because he couldn't. Our contract with Raytheon included spares and support to properly deal with customers. There was a price difference. Does that clear things up?
With regards to the W1000, T-70 and the LTWS: There are a lot of posts about the T-70. People have been pretty vocal about it. Skypup loves his based on the 3971 posts he made about it. We sell all the units mentioned by the OP and have, used and demoed each one. I think I have some video and stills of both clip on units units. When we demoed the T-70 against the LTWS for our clip on customers the users liked and bought the LTWS each time. Most of the users said they picked the LTWS based on the image quality and the menu. Like we said before, we sell both- we have nothing to gain by selling one over the other unit (as a matter of fact a money motivated dealer would sell the T-70 right now over the LTWS- they are more available as L3 is slow rolling them to civilians while they deliver on the DOD contract)... the multi-battery options of the T-70 awesome but the T-70 has a number of quirks that come up short when compared to the LTWS in our opinion. The LTWS has been hard to get but worth the wait based on our customer response. The W1000 is half the price but not a clip on. It's a little bit of apples and oranges when you look at all three units but I can expound on it more in a another post.
Stand by.
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I have the T-70 set so that the internal reticules only come on in 0.5X and 2X mode, staying off so I can use the ACOG in 1X mode.
That is something to think about! Maybe a W-1000 and a set of NVG's
If you decide to go with a clip-on seriously consider going with the L3 LWTS. Don't get me wrong, I think the T-70 is a good unit and the battery compartment is pure sex BUT from what I have seen the L3 LWTS is a better performer
I just bought the L3 LWTS. I used it as a stand alone scope and it worked pretty good. I also tried it in front of an ELCAN and it seemed really tunneled.
Overall I'm pretty impressed with the L3.
Overall I'm pretty impressed with the L3.
Head Shot with 7.62mm!
FLIT T-70 Head Shot Video:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/SIG 716P Coyote Head Shot/SIG 716P Coyote HeadsHOT.wmv
FLIT T-70 Head Shot Video:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/SIG 716P Coyote Head Shot/SIG 716P Coyote HeadsHOT.wmv
225 yard FLIR T-70 stops pork chop stealing coyote with 7.62mm!
FLIR T-70 pork chop stealing coyote video:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/SIG 716P Pork Chop Coyote/SIG 716P PorkChop Coyote.wmv
FLIR T-70 pork chop stealing coyote video:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/SIG 716P Pork Chop Coyote/SIG 716P PorkChop Coyote.wmv
And another 225 yard FLIR T-70 coyote:
FLIR T-70 video of 7.62mm coyote takedown:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/225 Yard Coyote/SIG 716P 225 Yard Coyote.wmv
FLIR T-70 video of 7.62mm coyote takedown:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/225 Yard Coyote/SIG 716P 225 Yard Coyote.wmv
FLIR T-70 takes down a 375 pound boar:
FLIR T-70 boar hog 175 yard kill video:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/SIG 716 Giant Boar/SIG 716P Giant Boar.wmv
FLIR T-70 boar hog 175 yard kill video:
http://www.phossil.com/thom/SIG 716 Precision/SIG 716 Giant Boar/SIG 716P Giant Boar.wmv
Giving credit where credit is do!
just got my W1000 back from Ident, good as new and no upselling on the repair needed, it did need parts and they had them for me even though I didn't buy from them, turnaround was reasonable as was repair cost.
thanks jason
just got my W1000 back from Ident, good as new and no upselling on the repair needed, it did need parts and they had them for me even though I didn't buy from them, turnaround was reasonable as was repair cost.
thanks jason
Awesome, Phil, now get off the computer chair and go bang some dogs and hogs with your thermal, and we want video too!?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk?
I have stock in L3, buy a dozen LWTS so LLL will rise on the NYSE!?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk?
LOL, I'm just flicking your nuggets. I bought a small chunk of FLIR stock about 3 weeks before SHOT and it did pretty well.
You guys are late to the party by about 15 years!
Maybe I better short my position now that mere mortals are getting onboard!!!!
L3 has paid better dividends over the years though and raises their dividends every year too, FLIR only started paying dividends in 2011.
My L3 dividends do pay for my FLIR equipment though!
Maybe I better short my position now that mere mortals are getting onboard!!!!
L3 has paid better dividends over the years though and raises their dividends every year too, FLIR only started paying dividends in 2011.
My L3 dividends do pay for my FLIR equipment though!
LOL,
Looks like I bought in to the wrong company. I didn't know what stock was 15 years ago!
Looks like I bought in to the wrong company. I didn't know what stock was 15 years ago!
You guys are late to the party by about 15 years!
Maybe I better short my position now that mere mortals are getting onboard!!!!
L3 has paid better dividends over the years though and raises their dividends every year too, FLIR only started paying dividends in 2011.
My L3 dividends do pay for my FLIR equipment though!
That is the graph for FLIR, not L3, but stick with FLIR, I would not short them even though they are at their 52 week high now, they still have a looong way to go after reorganizing all the internal divisions this year.
FLIR has increased by 23% since January 1, so your Shot Show investment is doing quite well.
FLIR has increased by 23% since January 1, so your Shot Show investment is doing quite well.
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Jeezus guys. Now we are comparing L3 and FLIR based on stock performance?
Next you're going to pull down the pants of the CEO's and compares who's is bigger...
I can see the conversation now: "FLIR's CEO may have 1/2x the length but more girth... Insight's CEO just has a pencil dick. It's all about the girth.."
Next you're going to pull down the pants of the CEO's and compares who's is bigger...
I can see the conversation now: "FLIR's CEO may have 1/2x the length but more girth... Insight's CEO just has a pencil dick. It's all about the girth.."
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