So I got talked in to PRS shooting last year and it was fairly new for many at the club. But has gained an even more following which is great. But damn the matches take up too much time. At least at our range it does. 60-80 shooters. 8 stages and it’s 4 hours + to shoot. Two hours of travel and then help clean up. It’s a 7 hour day. It’s why I gave up golf. The other reason so many shooters attend is that the range has 4 matches a year so I think that adds to the need to attend. Not sure what others see out there at there local range but it’s not really keeping me entertained anymore. More of a grind.
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PRS comps take way too long
- Thread starter Bgriff008
- Start date
consider it 'social time' that involves shooting
I'm not sure how you can speed up the process except maybe having a time limit between shooters or some other way to compress time between shooters
I try to be standing on the start position as the last guy is gathering himself after his time's up
M
I'm not sure how you can speed up the process except maybe having a time limit between shooters or some other way to compress time between shooters
I try to be standing on the start position as the last guy is gathering himself after his time's up
M
I’ve made several suggestions such as every stage should have a shooter and all stages should be utilized. So they can make the groups smaller. But for right now they usually have 4 groups of 15+ shooters all shooting the same stage.
They also refuse to designate additional RO’s, so that keeps from breaking down the groups. I’m pretty sure they have plenty of iPads and timers. We all get 90 seconds to shoot. Anyway they just haven’t made it work.
I get the social aspect and I do enjoy it but I’m beat after hanging for 4 hours and have lost interest for the last few stages. I’ve actually seen several shooters shoot the first half of the day and then leave. So I don’t think I’m the only one. Others I know have just stopped going all together. Still get decent turnouts but it’s doing more harm than good I feel.
They also refuse to designate additional RO’s, so that keeps from breaking down the groups. I’m pretty sure they have plenty of iPads and timers. We all get 90 seconds to shoot. Anyway they just haven’t made it work.
I get the social aspect and I do enjoy it but I’m beat after hanging for 4 hours and have lost interest for the last few stages. I’ve actually seen several shooters shoot the first half of the day and then leave. So I don’t think I’m the only one. Others I know have just stopped going all together. Still get decent turnouts but it’s doing more harm than good I feel.
8 stages, 8 squads 10 or less people in each. If no designated ROs - have the squad RO themselves.
Next shooter should be just standing there with his gear ready to go.
Because you have a lot of new shooters from what it sounds like, mixing them up with more experienced shooters in the squads would get things moving.
The social factor is absolutely there - and i get to see people once a month that i don't normally see and catch up. But it's a long day, especially if I'm there to set up and clean up.
Next shooter should be just standing there with his gear ready to go.
Because you have a lot of new shooters from what it sounds like, mixing them up with more experienced shooters in the squads would get things moving.
The social factor is absolutely there - and i get to see people once a month that i don't normally see and catch up. But it's a long day, especially if I'm there to set up and clean up.
Yep 8 stages 8 squads. We have so many regulars that attend and everyone knows how to spot, be an RO and run a timer and iPad. The range has yet to allow if there isn’t a range approved RO. Maybe it’s a liability issue. Not sure, but I will keep pushing it and find out. But I’ve suggested appointed ROs for the matches. It’s rimfire for crying out loud.
I used to run bigger squads, then there was too much sitting around between shooting so now I run 5-7 person squads. We start at 9 and done by 1 - usually just 7-8 stages.
Squads RO for themselves, I select a squad leader who's most experienced and he keeps the squad moving. Assignment to squads is a good mix of new shooters and experienced once as mentioned before. Scoring on tablets and we coach every new person to keep score, time and spot so next time they show up, they're up on what's going on..
Ours are sanctioned matches by the club, so the rules are more relaxed on having dedicated RO on each stage
Before running my own matches, i shot a lot at different clubs and took notes and even then it was intimidating to be a MD and try to have things run smoothly.
Over time i adjusted and listened to shooters on how to improve the process - and we made changes for the better.
If there are 8 stages but four squads I'll spread them out so there is a empty stage between each squad so there isn't sitting around and waiting for the slow squad to get done.
In regards to Rimfire matches - shooters bring their kids and spouses to shoot these matches so sometimes you have to be accommodating and allow extra time, this the gap between squads.
I'm at the range at 6am and usually don't leave until around 4pm after clean up. Then still get home, unpack, put shit away, upload scores and update our own season standings....
But it's what we do....
Squads RO for themselves, I select a squad leader who's most experienced and he keeps the squad moving. Assignment to squads is a good mix of new shooters and experienced once as mentioned before. Scoring on tablets and we coach every new person to keep score, time and spot so next time they show up, they're up on what's going on..
Ours are sanctioned matches by the club, so the rules are more relaxed on having dedicated RO on each stage
Before running my own matches, i shot a lot at different clubs and took notes and even then it was intimidating to be a MD and try to have things run smoothly.
Over time i adjusted and listened to shooters on how to improve the process - and we made changes for the better.
If there are 8 stages but four squads I'll spread them out so there is a empty stage between each squad so there isn't sitting around and waiting for the slow squad to get done.
In regards to Rimfire matches - shooters bring their kids and spouses to shoot these matches so sometimes you have to be accommodating and allow extra time, this the gap between squads.
I'm at the range at 6am and usually don't leave until around 4pm after clean up. Then still get home, unpack, put shit away, upload scores and update our own season standings....
But it's what we do....
Yep sounds like your making the necessary adjustments. Our range is relaxed too. We let people finish the stage if time is up. We allow for help or assisting while the shooter is shooting. Like aim to the right or left a bit more. Everyone is awesome at our range and really everyone does their best to promote it, me included. I’d just like it to speed up some. I have yet to see kids at matches. Everyone shooting is 18+ years at least. Probably older. But it’s not to say someone younger hasn’t shot. Just may have happened when I didn’t make a match. Who knows.
Sounds like you already know what you need/want to do....
Until you have a Club thats more receptive your gonna have to suck it up or take a break.
Or heck, look for another club. We have 3 or 4 clubs here in eastern SD....many drive a couple hours to all the matches in a month. They were all NRL22. But now one is NRL22, two are P.R.O., and one has decided to basically change format to whatever they can come up with at the moment to provide something different. Then we still have a NRL22X match here and one in Marshall MN.
Another idea....one I've kinda contemplated myself. Go do your own "social shooting match." The entry fee goes to buy food and you supply a 10 stage walking courseon private land. No RO's. No scoring or scores (unless the shooters themselves want to keep it). Shooters supply their own drinks if they don't want what you supply. The stages can be uneven in size and difficulty. Just keep them interesting. And you just open the range at like 9am and it closes at 5pm. Food at noon or 5:30pm. Shooters can come (and go) as they like. And since your doing your own stages....you arent directly competing with your regular club for attendance. Pre-orders will determine how much food is needed. People who pay on the day are not guaranteed a meal. $20 entry should be able to get a decent meal.
Until you have a Club thats more receptive your gonna have to suck it up or take a break.
Or heck, look for another club. We have 3 or 4 clubs here in eastern SD....many drive a couple hours to all the matches in a month. They were all NRL22. But now one is NRL22, two are P.R.O., and one has decided to basically change format to whatever they can come up with at the moment to provide something different. Then we still have a NRL22X match here and one in Marshall MN.
Another idea....one I've kinda contemplated myself. Go do your own "social shooting match." The entry fee goes to buy food and you supply a 10 stage walking courseon private land. No RO's. No scoring or scores (unless the shooters themselves want to keep it). Shooters supply their own drinks if they don't want what you supply. The stages can be uneven in size and difficulty. Just keep them interesting. And you just open the range at like 9am and it closes at 5pm. Food at noon or 5:30pm. Shooters can come (and go) as they like. And since your doing your own stages....you arent directly competing with your regular club for attendance. Pre-orders will determine how much food is needed. People who pay on the day are not guaranteed a meal. $20 entry should be able to get a decent meal.
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Might just be me, but not that many years ago, I would get up at four (that would be Four AM) drive four hours, shoot a match that might last till 2:00, help get everything up and drive home. We had another match site that was really close at 157 miles and was almost all interstate. That was nice.
I am a touch long in the tooth to keep up that pace, but it was fun.
So, my thought is, aren't you being just a touch picky? I have never seen a participant sport that did not take time. the three I have participated in, water ski tournaments (as both a competitor and official) horse shows (lucky to get home before the next morning's sunrise) and shooting matches, all took time to get there, all took time to compete and all took time while other's competed. The point, was to have fun and enjoy being with other, like minded people (even if we were at each other's throat at horse shows). From what I have watched/ attended/ spectated at, these are not exceptions, but more the rule.
Participation sports take time, Be glad, 80 or so are showing up. Try setting up a range and sitting all day with not one competitor showing up. I've seen it happen. More than once. To different match directors, at different clubs, at different locations.
If I am harsh sounding, do accept my apology, as no one likes to be chastised. That said, its the nature of the game. its gonna take time.
I am a touch long in the tooth to keep up that pace, but it was fun.
So, my thought is, aren't you being just a touch picky? I have never seen a participant sport that did not take time. the three I have participated in, water ski tournaments (as both a competitor and official) horse shows (lucky to get home before the next morning's sunrise) and shooting matches, all took time to get there, all took time to compete and all took time while other's competed. The point, was to have fun and enjoy being with other, like minded people (even if we were at each other's throat at horse shows). From what I have watched/ attended/ spectated at, these are not exceptions, but more the rule.
Participation sports take time, Be glad, 80 or so are showing up. Try setting up a range and sitting all day with not one competitor showing up. I've seen it happen. More than once. To different match directors, at different clubs, at different locations.
If I am harsh sounding, do accept my apology, as no one likes to be chastised. That said, its the nature of the game. its gonna take time.
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"Participation sports take time, Be glad, 80 or so are showing up. Try setting up a range and sitting all day with not one competitor showing up. I've seen it happen. More than once. To different match directors, at different clubs, at different locations."
Ain't that right - for the love of the sport myself, even if i get one squad or less worth of shooters, I'll still come out and set up.
Shit, one month it was just me and my better half shooting the match....as those who signed up never showed (the forecast looked like shit, and it ended up being a beautiful day)
We shoot year round so the attendance drops as we get into the single digits days....
In my time, there has one been one match that i didn't think i would finish. 35 shooters, 10 stages - started at 9, at 430pm still shooting. Dozen times going cold, home made targets falling off, arguing about props and stage description with MD, inexperienced ROs, numerous ranges to walk to while supervised, tablets not working - just crazy stuff. Still 2 hour drive home.
Shit like that makes your appreciate well run matches!!
Ain't that right - for the love of the sport myself, even if i get one squad or less worth of shooters, I'll still come out and set up.
Shit, one month it was just me and my better half shooting the match....as those who signed up never showed (the forecast looked like shit, and it ended up being a beautiful day)
We shoot year round so the attendance drops as we get into the single digits days....
In my time, there has one been one match that i didn't think i would finish. 35 shooters, 10 stages - started at 9, at 430pm still shooting. Dozen times going cold, home made targets falling off, arguing about props and stage description with MD, inexperienced ROs, numerous ranges to walk to while supervised, tablets not working - just crazy stuff. Still 2 hour drive home.
Shit like that makes your appreciate well run matches!!
While do agree a bit with the poster above who thought that you are maybe being a bit picky, I also agree that your ideas are basically in line with expectations of a well run match. In my opinion, squauds should not be larger than 10 people and I prefer 6-8 people in a squad.
That said, I get up at 4:30, after mostly setting up the match a day before, do final details, raise popups and put out snacks and drinks. Run and usually shoot the match, give out kudos, plaques or whatever, clean up and police for trash, then drag home at 4-5:00. That’s how it is. We run 10 stages in that time and get a pretty good kid turnout.
I decided right off that my focus was going to be on encouraging young shooters, so they always shoot free and I cover associated costs for them. Anyone 16 or under. I try to balance challenging parts with enough larger targets to ensure that even newer shooters get hits to keep it interesting.
Matches are an event. Try organizing one. Most folks I know expect it to be worth their travel time. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve shot 10 stage informal games and been beat to crap when I got home, but understand some folks having a good time wanna keep going. For us 7 stages seems to be close to perfect. Calls of who’s up, next, and second in line speed prep time and we cycle through fairly smoothly. I don’t know if I could be at my best for a two day event, but would be willing to try.
As for necessity of R.O.s vs “it’s just a .22” that’s the exact thinking that spawns N.D.s and that’s the last thing we need. If I misunderstand I apologize in advance. By the way, don’t think I’ve ever been to any event, whether it’s prone, 3-4P, silhouette, rimfire sporter, or informal action events that didn’t make a day of it.
Our range is basically farm land purchased. They’ve done a great job putting it together. And I know every hobby takes up time. Actually reading some of the posts and the extremes some of you go to for matches mine isn’t that bad. But if I were to shoot at any other range it would be well over an hour drive. As for organizing one, I know the time and effort that goes into them. My coworker is the VP of the range and I see what he does all the time. But there are other parties involved in moving forward with these little changes. We still get dumb ass people that aren’t following range rules and put the range in danger of being shut down. These people are dealt with and have been. But it throws caution to those in charge and allowing for more freedom and moving forward. They implemented a required 300 yard qualification due to someone putting a round over the 2-3 story bank/berm meant to stop rounds. Farmers property and homes are behind the range. All be it a good distance but it happened. To be a member, has to come by referral knowing another member. Guests are allowed but it’s the members responsibility for that guest. Maybe I’m being nit picky but I’m just trying to move things along for the better. At least I see it as a better. I’ll continue to press the issue. So we shall see. Just wanted to hear what others thought. Thanks for the replies.
This right here. I understand the GAP Grind is a different type of event, but we had 20 shooters per squad. There was always 3 shooters standing in line with gear in hand. When one shooter was done the next was up and firing seconds later.
It was amazing how tight that was ran and quickly squads moved.
I've been on the fast squads and I've been on slow squads
The difference is pre-preparation: Get done shooting and immediately prep for the next stage: reload mag(s), set your scope, figure out what bag(s) you'll need, and be ready when it's your turn The slow squads don't do that as well. Oh wait! It's my turn?!
First stage or two I can see not remembering who you shoot after. After that? Nope
M
The difference is pre-preparation: Get done shooting and immediately prep for the next stage: reload mag(s), set your scope, figure out what bag(s) you'll need, and be ready when it's your turn The slow squads don't do that as well. Oh wait! It's my turn?!
First stage or two I can see not remembering who you shoot after. After that? Nope
M
My question would be, compared to what?
Most F class shoots I've been to take all day and you get to far 3x10 (+2 sighters) in a day, all prone, all whilst talking to funds about 15year old products they've just discovered.
Any other shoot that has 40+ competitors is just as bad.
If you are comparing it to shooting by yourself on a range, sure you can put 200 rounds of 22lr down range in 30 minutes but its unlikely you'll have pushed yourself.
Sometimes PRS shoots can feel a bit slow, especially if you are in a squad of slow people, i have found myself asking if it's worth it at times.
But trying different stages under time penalties someone else has set for you and competing against other people gives you something it's hard to replicate.
I've learnt far more skills from PRS type shoots than any other form of shooting I've done, and my basic skill level is massively improved since doing PRS type shooting.
Most F class shoots I've been to take all day and you get to far 3x10 (+2 sighters) in a day, all prone, all whilst talking to funds about 15year old products they've just discovered.
Any other shoot that has 40+ competitors is just as bad.
If you are comparing it to shooting by yourself on a range, sure you can put 200 rounds of 22lr down range in 30 minutes but its unlikely you'll have pushed yourself.
Sometimes PRS shoots can feel a bit slow, especially if you are in a squad of slow people, i have found myself asking if it's worth it at times.
But trying different stages under time penalties someone else has set for you and competing against other people gives you something it's hard to replicate.
I've learnt far more skills from PRS type shoots than any other form of shooting I've done, and my basic skill level is massively improved since doing PRS type shooting.
From my perspective, matches are about spending time with friends old & new and shooting steel while hanging out. The camaraderie of cheering each other on and heckling each other on the clock is what makes it all worthwhile. Yes, we're all there to test our abilities and challenge ourselves against our peers, but the friendships are what it's all about.
I guess I've been lucky. Never shot a match with more than 5 shooters in the squad and we rotate the shooters so I get to show the other shooters how not to do it every couple stages. We all call impacts or run a timer as needed. For me a close match is 4 hours away so I'm either getting an AirBnB or planning on a 12 to 13 hour day. Shot one this weekend that I left at 2:30 (crashed at my little brothers place), got to the range at 4:00, shot until 11:30 PM (We did break for dinner and some wicked thunder storms aka LOTS of lightning), hung out until 12:30 and got home at 4:00 AM. Full disclosure... I am too old for that shit but I had a great time.
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