PTR91F Accuracy

[jannilsson50]

I have a PTR91F (18" barrel) with a Magpul stock and a Williams trigger. I'm can't get it to shoot better than 3-4" groups at 100 yards with a 9x scope. I'm actually shooting the same using iron sights. I don't know if it's me the gun or maybe the optics.

Let me know how accurate your PTR91 is??

jan

 

[ORD]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Janne</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a PTR91F (18" barrel) with a Magpul stock and a Williams trigger. I'm can't get it to shoot better than 3-4" groups at 100 yards with a 9x scope. I'm actually shooting the same using iron sights. I don't know if it's me the gun or maybe the optics.

Let me know how accurate your PTR91 is??

jan </div></div>

Well...to give you the most "direct" answer I can: "It Depends!"

Can you provide details on your entire setup, including:

1) what mount/base/rings setup you are using (standard claw mount with built-in rings; Stanag claw mount with removeable rings; picatinny adapter rail...if so, what make/model; etc.)?

2) what scope are you using?

3) WHAT AMMMO (this is an important part of the equation, second only to the person squeezing the trigger which is the biggest issue I see with accuracy problems on this platform)?

Answering those questions may help somewhat in diagnosing your issues, BUT...your average PTR-91 in my experience, right from the factory, is generally capable of 3MOA accuracy or better with decent ammo/shooter/etc. With an upgraded trigger (like the Williams you are using), with quality ammo (NOT MIL SURPLUS ball ammo or cheaper commercial ball ammo), and with an experienced shooter, you can get them into the 2MOA (maybe slightly better) range in my experience.

With all that in mind, it sounds like your rifle is still performing within the specifics for which it was designed to perform (guessing on your ammo of course). The PTR rifles are main battle rifles...not precision instruments...and they can vary somewhat in terms of the expectations you can have for them from the factory. Yes, they can be made to shoot EXTREMELY well with a lot of work and a LOT of money...but 3MOA out of a base rifle (even with a trigger job, new stock, etc.) is not unexpected. Again...take a look at the questions above and fill in some details and maybe there is some room to squeeze some additional accuracy from your rifle.

 

[BCP]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Make sure your scope mount is rock solid & that your scope is good and try some match ammo (168 FGMM).

 

[BigBoss0311]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

3-4" at 100 yards with a battle rifle. Sounds just right to me........

 

[jannilsson50]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Ord,

Thanks for your help here....To answer your questions....

1. I have used 2 different types of claw mount with picatinny rail with the same result. This is the last one I used http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-Low-Profile-Scope-Mount-118p1919.htm. I have not used the high end mounts (> $100), so that could defenitely be a potential problem.

2. I have been testing 2 diffrent scopes. The first one I used was a 3-9x Super Sniper. Then I changed to a Bushnell 4200 that I used on a bolt rifle with very good result. The rings I use are the Super Sniper low rings. Same as I use on my bolt rifle that shoots < 1" @ 100 yards. Both scopes give pretty much the same result.

3. I have been using everything from cheap mil surplus to match ammo 168 and 175 grain (SMK and others). The match ammo gives me 3-4" and surplus 4-5".

Maybe I just have to accept the fact of a 3" accuracy, but before I do that I would like to understand I pushed it to the limit. It's a great gun and a lot of fun to shoot, even if I don't do better than 3"

Thanks...

 

[ORD]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

I would venture a guess that it is a combination of things, but first and foremost would be the $H!TTY UTG mount. UTG stuff is basically airsoft quality to put it mildly. They flex like crazy and even when they seem like they are tight on the receiver, they generally can still move about. If you want a quality, low profile mount similar in function/appearance to the UTG but one that will hold solid and offer you a stable mounting platform for your PTR-91, get with Adam (HKParts) about the MFI low profile mount. It is more expensive, but in terms of quality, you can get the MFI for around $130 or move up to the B&T mount for around $180. Here is a link to the MFI:

http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-Low-Profile-Scope-Mount-For-HK-Rifles-Pistol-118p762.htm

Since you have the adjustable comb/cheek riser on the Magpul PRS2 stock, you could also try to find a deal on a used A.R.M.S. claw lock mount (which you can still use your SS low rings on) and just raise your cheek riser up to get a comfortable cheek weld. They pop up here and on HKPro once in a while for $150 or less and they are generally good mounts.

I don't see any issues with your optics choices or ring selection. The 3-9x SS is a really great option for the HK91/clone type rifles given it's size/features. Just make sure that your cross bolts and ring cap screws are torqued down to whatever values that SWFA recommends for them.

Aside from that, stick to FGMM or other quality match ammo for accuracy testing purposes and see how she goes with a different mount installed.

The other, somewhat more depressing issue to consider, is that you may just have one of those PTRs that just won't perform any better than 3MOA. Some of the early rifles in particular suffered from accuracy issues (among other issues). Again, the rifle is a main battle rifle in nature (even in the its current configuration). If you want outstanding accuracy from a semi-auto, look toward upgrading to any of the large-frame AR platforms (AR-10, LR-308, P-308, etc.) all of which are capable of FAR greater accuracy out of the box than any of the HK clones (unless you want to spend several thousand more dollars on something like an MSG-90 clone, PSG-1 clone, etc.).

 

[boltstop]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

I had a PTR 91 that had been produced before the sunset of the AWB, so no flash suppressor.

Nothing I could do with handloads would make that rifle shoot better than 6 MOA. With SA or Australian surplus, it would shoot numerous ~1 MOA rounds, with fourth or fifth round mysteriously dropping out of the group by 4".

I never got it sorted and just sold the rifle. Scope was a Bushnell 10x40, mount was a Brugger and Thomet. If I had to guess, I'd say it was a question of overall length of the shells. If I knew then what I know now, I would have likely found a seating depth that would have been a load that the rifle liked.

I always suspected that it was more accurate than the results I achieved.

I have a HK93 copy (a Vector V93) and it's a sub MOA tack-driving .223 nightmare. I suspect many .223 chamberings are tighter than .308, esp. when the application is "battle rifle." If you reload, you should try Tresmon's five posts in "Reloading" for discovering the best load for your rifle.

 

[jannilsson50]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Ord,

I agree, the rail could be the problem. I ordered the MFI rail today. Will report back as soon as I can get it tested, probably in a week or two.

In the mean time. If anyone have shot a PTR91 better than 3"-4", let me know.

Thanks....

 

[Archer762]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

You may also be a 3-4 MOA shooter...

 

[Chancellor]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Janne,
Haven't shot mine for about 1 year, if i remember correctly it shot 2 MOA or better with POF surplus and 4x24 hensoldt and claw clamp. I will take it out tomorrow or tues and let you know.(Gives me an excuse to take out)

 

[Limey-]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

The PSG1 was only just capable of 1 MOA and the MSG90 DMR barely got near there. They were very different animals than the G3 or HK91 and clones. The G3's and HK91's I have shot have never been much better that 3MOA, pretty decent for a Roller Battle Rifle.

 

[1shot2kill]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

imo if you can get a g3-cetme style rifle to hit soda cans all day long you should be pretty happy i would never expect that style of rifle to be sub moa regardless of the scope,mount or ammo

 

[Chancellor]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Shot mine yesterday 3 moa was the best i could do for 5 round groups.

 

[jannilsson50]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

The result is in....

I got the MFI rail and went out to the range. I would say that the result is similar, maybe slightly better with the new MFI rail. So my results are....

I shoot 4"-5" @ 100 yards using iron sights and surplus ammo.
I shoot 3"-4" @100 yards using 9x scope with the MFI rail and surplus ammo. (could probably do 1" better with match ammo)

Looks like this is the best I can do, without investing in a new barrel. Have been shooting my friends AR10 with better results (maybe < 2" @ 100 yards), so that might be the way to go for better accuracy.

Thanks for all helpful comments.....

 

[Prairie Dog Dundee]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Mine is an HK91. When I was shooting it regularly I could get 1 1/2 moa with good handloads worked up for it with a 6X scope. Good surplus would yield 2-2.5 moa some junk surplus even bigger. It did like Aussie.

 

[57Strat]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

This is my HK91 at 100 yards using Aussie F4 mil-surp ammo. The trigger pull is like 8 lbs of gritty drag, so it is hard to get consistent good groups. With a good trigger and match ammo, I'm betting sub-MOA easy.

 

[NoveSPR]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

Thats not a PTR is it Strat? The magwell and trigger group (not "navy style?)look a little different, just curious.

 

[57Strat]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoveSPR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thats not a PTR is it Strat? The magwell and trigger group (not "navy style?)look a little different, just curious. </div></div>

I stated in my post that it is an HK91.

 

[NoveSPR]

Re: PTR91F Accuracy

I see that. The mag release kinda threw me through a loop thats all.