Re: question for a REAL sniper
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Texagator</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rackchaser71</div><div class="ubbcode-body">lmao yeah i know its a dumb question, i know nothing about any of it is why i asked, let me refrase, how does it work for leo and how does it work for military? thats all i wanted to know, im an electricain with a rem 788 from when dinosaurs roamed the land that thinks snipers are cool c'mon give a break lol i figured leo's are assigned a rifle but what about military? </div></div>
Before I can fully answer your question about how rifles are selected and issued among LEO's, you have to keep in mind that not all Police Departments are equal. With a few exception, SWAT teams can be divided into 3 groups which I label/describe thusly:
<span style="font-weight: bold">Tier One:</span> Only about 5% of American police SWAT teams meet this criteria. These are the full-time teams with their own budget and enough manpower to handle large events. They have fully-developed selection, training, and retention standards. The members of these teams do not have other responsibilities within the Dept. These teams usually train about 25% of their on-duty time. The rest of the time, they are working. Tier One teams are fully capable of executing multi-faceted hostage rescue operations and they possess and actually use specialized abilities/equipment such as explosive breaching, air support, multiple armored vehicles, and the like. It can take a decade or more to get on one of these teams. Many people are surprised to see that the average age on a Tier One team is somewhere between 35 and 40.
<span style="font-weight: bold">Tier Two:</span> A well-trained team with enforced shooting and PT standards that assembles and trains in earnest on a regular basis. The minimum training hours for these teams is usually 16 hours per month. Tier Two teams run the spectrum from "marginally competent" to "pretty good" to "damn those guys really know their shit." Most of the time, members of Tier Two teams have other jobs or responsibilities within the Dept. These teams have better training and much higher expectations of their members' abilities than the Tier Three teams described below. Most teams in this category have fully-developed selection, training, and retention standards. There are some extremely well-trained people working on Tier Two teams even if the team itself is not always capable of handling some of the largest tactical incidents. Approximately 45% of American SWAT teams are in the Tier Two category. Some of them are very good at what they do and many of them get a lot of work.
<span style="font-weight: bold">Tier Three:</span> A group of well-meaning but poorly-trained and sometimes incompetent, out-of-shape men who serve on a team that assembles and trains between 10 and 14 times per year. These teams are rarely used and when they are, good outcomes are often mistaken for good tactics or training. Some of my police bretheren may get pissed at me for saying this but Tier Three teams comprise about 50% of American SWAT teams and, in my opinion, should all be disbanded. Most of the legal, ethical, and public relations disasters involving SWAT teams have been caused by Tier Three teams.
In my personal experience and observation, Tier One and Tier Two teams always issue rifles to their members. Rifles are selected based on the needs of the team and the types of missions they are tasked with (e.g. a team that operates in a rural desert environment will need different equipment than a team that operates in a densely urban environment with harsh winters). It is not uncommon for LE snipers to be issued more than one rifle (e.g a bolt action .308 and a precision AR in .223). The selection process for both rifles and optics can be very strenuous and is often done via a pre-approved and pre-planned Testing and Evaluation (T&E) process in which suppliers/makers/vendors provide a sample for testing. The process is usually done in compliance with written requirements, bids, spec sheets, etc. which are provided to the equipment provider ahead of time. The T&E process is almost always administered by senior personnel who have significant real-world experience. By the time the process is all over, the "standard" package is decided upon and codified in formal policy and a purchasing agreement. While the "standard" Remington 700 Police model is ubiquitous, it doesn't always win. I have seen departments issue everything from 700's to AI's to custom rifles made by well known smiths. Optics are usually something like Nightforce or Leupold. Even though S&B or USO are "better," they are usually too expensive even for well-funded cities to justify purchasing 4 to 10 at a time. The snipers are then issued the package (rifle, optics, drag bags, sling, etc.) which they are responsible for zeroing, maintaining, and recording monthly performance with. As equipment breaks or wears out, it is replaced per SOP. The whole process is repeated every 10 years or so.
Some Tier Three teams allow individual members to provide their own rifles. The member is required to meet the Department standard (i.e. rifle qualification) with the rifle. However, most Tier Three teams usually issue "out of the box" Remington 700's, slap some optics on them and call it good. I have personally seen several Tier Three teams issue Savages only because they are less expensive...but truth be told...Savage is making a pretty good rifle these days. I even saw one SWAT team issue Rugers (a team in South Texas did that).
Hope this answers your question. Take care. </div></div>hey finally, thanks tex, and to everyone else, im far from a wannabe, i dont want to be a sniper, im not going to shoot 500 rounds every weekend, i want a rifle thats dependable, practical, and proven, and thought i would start out by asking the guys that know best,snipers, instead i got a bunch of smart ass's that probably sit in there moms house playing playstation 3 all day and think they are snipers,next time you see a topic for "snipers" think long and hard about what you are and what your NOT and maybe reconsider entering and having a smart ass remark for a new guy, i noticed that alot of people said to sign up for online training and go shoot my rifle as much as possible, again im not trying to be a sniper, ive shot guns all my life, my modified 22mag and rem788 are amazing guns that have allowed me to get years of practice, im wanting the .308 because i feel its a better round for deer, i know the model 700 is a proven rifle, so thats where i want to start, now that someone finally answered my question i can move on, thanks guys