Rank .308 Brass Brands

#3
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: USMCj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">#1 Lapua
#2 Winchester
#3 who gives a fuck, see #1 </div></div>

What about Federal Match? Not worth messing with?
 
#5
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

For actual test results rather than someone going on their feelings and impression, look at the Handloader magazine article of 12/08. According to that article, the most accurate loads using virgin cases were in decending order of accuracy:

1. Nosler
2. Federal (not nickel plated)
3. Lapua
4. Remington (nickel plated)
5. Remington (not nickel plated)
6. Norma
7. Hornady
8. Federal (military)
9. Federal (nickel plated)
10. Winchester

Overall there was only a 0.25 inch difference in group sizes between the various types of brass used.

Brass was also tested to failure. Brass ranking from best longevity to worst was as follows:

1. Norma (24 reloads to failure)
2. Remington (nickel plated) (22 reloads to failure)
3. Remington (not nickel plated) (20 reloads to failure)
4. Lapua (15 reloads to failure)
5. Winchester (14 reloads to failure)
6. Federal (nickel plated) (13 reloads to failure)
7. Federal (plain) (13 reloads to failure)
8. Hornady (12 reloads to failure)
9. Federal (military) (11 reloads to failure)
10. Nosler (11 reloads to failure)

So, decide what's most important to you.
 
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#6
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

My preference is

Norma (I'm at 9 loadings on one batch)

LC '71 and LC '72. I've had this brass for over 20 years and it's still GTG.

Winchester

Lapua did not do well in my rifle, so I don't use it.

Federal (15 years ago) was really good but only lasted 5 - 7 loadings before disposal. Now I wouldn't use it. Too soft.

I've never used Remington.

I've tried Hornady brass - so so.
 
#9
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Grumulkin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For actual test results rather than someone going on their feelings and impression, look at the Handloader magazine article of 12/08. According to that article, the most accurate loads using virgin cases were in decending order of accuracy:

1. Nosler
2. Federal (not nickel plated)
3. Lapua
4. Remington (nickel plated)
5. Remington (not nickel plated)
6. Norma
7. Hornady
8. Federal (military)
9. Federal (nickel plated)
10. Winchester

Overall there was only a 0.25 inch difference in group sizes between the various types of brass used.

Brass was also tested to failure. Brass ranking from best longevity to worst was as follows:

1. Norma (24 reloads to failure)
2. Remington (nickel plated) (22 reloads to failure)
3. Remington (not nickel plated) (20 reloads to failure)
4. Lapua (15 reloads to failure)
5. Winchester (14 reloads to failure)
6. Federal (nickel plated) (13 reloads to failure)
7. Federal (plain) (13 reloads to failure)
8. Hornady (12 reloads to failure)
9. Federal (military) (11 reloads to failure)
10. Nosler (11 reloads to failure)

So, decide what's most important to you.</div></div>

What was the load?

What was determined as failure?

What firearm was used?
 
#10
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 918v</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Grumulkin</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...
Overall there was only a 0.25 inch difference in group sizes between the various types of brass used.
</div></div>

What was the...?

What was ....?

What ...? </div></div>

Sounds like they got the wind variable under control to within 2mph.

That is great scientific method for a gun rag.

a) I saw a gun rag test on 17HMR ammo, where they used different guns and different shooters.
The guy takes his kids to the range, and didn't have time to use just one gun.

b) Massad Ayoob just sits down at the keyboard and makes stuff up.

What do you expect from a gun rag?


 
#11
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

lol!

It's amazing what they let people print nowadays. I personally do not like to go over ten loadings with high pressure loads because the web gets thinned out too much. Trimming .050" of case neck and sectioning the case reveals some scary stuff.
 
#12
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

If I were going for brass that I thought would last the longest it would be Lake City. If I were going for brass that I thought would be the most accurate it would be Winchester, and Lapua. But if you want to know what will be the most accurate in YOUR rifle, you will need to try differant brass in YOUR rifle. What works best in one rifle, might not be in the best for another. Rifles have personalities like people, what one likes another might not.
 
#13
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

To be honest I have tried 3 different brands in my 5r, Winchester, Remington and FGMM. I cant tell a damn bit of accuracy difference in them. All was once fired and I am on the 3rd loading. All are trimmed to 2.005 and FL sized or actually in the opposite order. Maybe in a few loads I will be able to see a difference. In my 233, I swear by LC. Have zero complaints out of it. My next choice is Remington, lots hate it, but I have had really good luck with it. Just my humble opinion and I am by far from being any kind of expert. Hope it helps
 
#16
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

The rifle: Sako TRG-22

The powder: 45 grains of Varget

The bullet: Berger 168 gr. match

Case failure defined as anything from incipient to complete head separation.

It was actually a pretty well done test with probably more valid conclusions than you'll find by perusing opinions on various forums.

The first and only thing I ever read by Massad Ayoob was a stupid article in which he used 3 different handguns in one day for concealed carry all because each one had some special feature he liked in a particular situation. But then, they don't pay me for writing gun articles so he can't be all that stupid.
 
#17
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I am just getting into reloading. My first reloads will be using my once fired factory Federal and Remington brass. I will eventually need to buy some brass I keep hearing rave reviews of Lapua. What makes it better? I need more info than, "It just is". Is it accuracy, number of times reloaded, tighter manufacturing tolerances?
 
#18
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

Lapua brass has better stadards, in that the case are more uniform,sized correctly,primer pockets and flash holes are good to go and have very consistant weights.

The Federal brass you are using will give up soon, there is a guy that shoots in matches I attend, that had Case head sepperation on the 3rd reload, if I remember.

My experiance with the Federals is they show pressure very early,as they are soft.

My Lapua's are on the 10 cycle of reloading and still do great.
Of course annealing and neck sizing have alot to do with it.

What it comes down to is how much time do you want to spend prepping brass and maintaining it ?

The inital cost of quality brass pays off in time saved.

 
#20
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

My Horandy brass is on 10 plus cycles as well and have no issues!!

If you run on the raged edge of pressure all cases will start breaking down.

The best brass out there is Hornady, Lapua, RWS, Norma.

It comes down to preference again.
 
#21
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

Of the USA brands, Hornady is definitely the best. Nosler is touted as best, but if you spin it in reverse on a runout gauge, you'd throw it awy.
 
#22
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

Friends don't let friends load nickel brass, I don't care what Handloader magazine says.

I have spent a lot of time with a NECO concentricity gage looking at runout of new and fired cases and also loaded rounds.

For both 223 and 308, Lapua is quite consistent but Winchester can be sorted to eliminate a few bad cases and then the remainder are every bit as good after flash hole deburring and neck trimming. I use Winchester in my 600-yd loads.

I have always found Remington and LC to be good hard brass for gas guns and adequate for 300-yd and less. I have always found Federal to be soft.

Regards,
dcat
 
#25
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I'll throw in my 2 cents but I'm not sure it's backed as well as some of the others.

Just holding Hornady Match brass and Lapua brass in your hand, you know which one "feels" stronger.

I've only reloaded Hornady Match brass for my .308. I have some Lapua on order, if it's anything like the .223 I'm sure I'll be switching soon!

I'd vote Lapua but it's just based off of my initial reaction.
 
#29
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I can't believe no one has any liking for good old LC LR match brass.
+1 Ol Rob

I hoard the stuff when available,

Top vote would be Norma, Most consistent, longest lasting brass ever (20+loadings)
Next would be Lapua......

I do like the fact that atleast for .308 the norma has almost 2 grains more capacity than the Lapua.
 
#30
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I like just about anything when it's free.

If I have to buy it I prefer Winchester. It seems to be a good balance of price and performance.

I don't shoot benchrest and I am not crazy anal about brass. So take it for what it's worth.

I save all the Federal I can get so if it's only good for a couple loads, then so be it.
 
#31
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clark</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
That is great scientific method for a gun rag.

a) I saw a gun rag test on 17HMR ammo, where they used different guns and different shooters.
The guy takes his kids to the range, and didn't have time to use just one gun.

b) Massad Ayoob just sits down at the keyboard and makes stuff up.

What do you expect from a gun rag?
</div></div>

That's some funny shit right there!

I like Lapua, LC Match and Federal. The main reason I like those three is that they are similar in capacity, so I can run the same load and have acceptable (for me) accuracy without changing dope and loads. I just started with Lapua, but ran an assload or cycles on my LC77 brass. I like the Federal for lost brass matches and forming my 7-08 from.

The Winchester I've had in the past couple years was as soft or softer than Fed, the primer pockets gave out quicker.
 
#34
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: seaaggie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i am giving the magtech brass a go round, i have some 700 pieces of it and will report after a few reloadings of it </div></div>

I'm glad to hear it loaded well. I've got a metric shit load of the magtech .308 brass floating around. I was just this morning considering trying it out in my gas gun.
 
#35
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I had about 500 Federal cases I was working through and found that after about 5 loads around 25% of the primer pockets were feeling loose so I don't go over 5 loads on Federals I still find myself with - this was with 44.5 grains of Varget and 175smks in a Remington factory rifle - pretty standard stuff.

I'm using Winchester now and culled about 15% of the 500 cases is sorted based on >.0015 neck thickness variation.

Have not played w/ Laupa or Nosler yet.
 
#37
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

Not to start an argument here, but I prefer LC Match. To begin with I used it for financial reasons, and have since used it almost exclusively, as I have found very little, if any difference shooting other brands.
 
#38
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I use Lapua, and Win. Norma is uniform and uniformly soft. I see no need to shoot brass for accuracy testing. Weigh it, measure it, spin it and the most uniform will shoot the best. I also agree that sizeing brass incorrectly causes failure more that shooting.
I full length size in a Redding bushing FL die and bump the shoulder back about .001 or a little less. I size the neck donw .002 when new and .003 when it gets older. (helps hold the bullet aginst the compressed charge) I load all the 4064 I can get in the case with any bullet and load 40 or 50 times. I never have a Lapua case failure. I trim when needed, I would guess about 4 or 5 times in the life of the case. Not a lot. Most case streching comes from the expander ball, not shooting. I do not use expander ball die and get very little lengthing of cases.
All bolt gun ammo.
 
#39
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I like just about anything when it's free.

If I have to buy it I prefer Winchester. It seems to be a good balance of price and performance.

I don't shoot benchrest and I am not crazy anal about brass. So take it for what it's worth.

I save all the Federal I can get so if it's only good for a couple loads, then so be it. </div></div>

I always save the Federal cases. I'm guessing lots of people read forums and hear Federal brass is junk so they leave it at the range for me to grab. I have 100 or so Federal caes that are at/over 10 reloads. I only neck size using lee collet dies. The laste Federal .308 I found at the range the guy was nice and even reboxed it for me and dropped it in the trash and i snagged it as i was throwing away targets.
 
#40
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

I have lots of Federal from Sniper Training/Class. I also have several hundred IMI Match cases. Right now I am loading the Federals until they die, and or my supply drys up. Which will probably not be in the near future.

I will probably go to the IMI Match at some point because I have it.

Like LoneWolfUSMC when I spend more of my money buying brass, it will probably be Winchester. Same reasoning Value vs Quality.
 
#41
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clark</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 918v</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Grumulkin</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> ...
Overall there was only a 0.25 inch difference in group sizes between the various types of brass used.
</div></div>

What was the...?

What was ....?

What ...? </div></div>

Sounds like they got the wind variable under control to within 2mph.

That is great scientific method for a gun rag.

</div></div>
Clark:

I beg to differ. Handloader and Rifle are NOT gun rags. They are the only true magazines out there, along with the Rifleman which still uses consistent standardized testing.

The rest of 'em-bleh. I hardly read them any more. When I want unsupported or poorly-substantiated opinion, mixed in with reliable reporting, I come here. And three other sites. No GlockTalk or AR15.com though. Not even sure of my usernames there...
 
#45
So, in this gun mag they did their accuracy test on virgin brass? I think that’s wrong. While not technically “fire-forming”, I consider unfired brass to fit that action incorrectly till it’s been fired once. I don’t load new brass for a match ever. I make sure it’s minimum x2. To me this is part of tuning the ammunition to the rifle.

Maybe that’s witchcraft, but I’ve had enough load development give me goofy results with virgin brass that now I consider it “unripe” and unfit to shoot for score.
 
#47
Grumulkin said:
Re: Rank .308 Brass Brands

For actual test results rather than someone going on their feelings and impression, look at the Handloader magazine article of 12/08. According to that article, the most accurate loads using virgin cases were in decending order of accuracy:

1. Nosler
2. Federal (not nickel plated)
3. Lapua
4. Remington (nickel plated)
5. Remington (not nickel plated)
6. Norma
7. Hornady
8. Federal (military)
9. Federal (nickel plated)
10. Winchester

Overall there was only a 0.25 inch difference in group sizes between the various types of brass used.

Brass was also tested to failure. Brass ranking from best longevity to worst was as follows:

1. Norma (24 reloads to failure)
2. Remington (nickel plated) (22 reloads to failure)
3. Remington (not nickel plated) (20 reloads to failure)
4. Lapua (15 reloads to failure)
5. Winchester (14 reloads to failure)
6. Federal (nickel plated) (13 reloads to failure)
7. Federal (plain) (13 reloads to failure)
8. Hornady (12 reloads to failure)
9. Federal (military) (11 reloads to failure)
10. Nosler (11 reloads to failure)

So, decide what's most important to you.
Click to expand...

Did they work up a load in each? No.
 
#48
DBC67862-2843-4994-BD07-BAF6FA7D8443.jpeg
 
#49
dan46n2 said:
Can someone please rank the most desirable .308 brass brands in order for long range shooting.
Click to expand...

It depends on the particular load (bullet/powder) you’re using. Some cases have desirable features, but also some flaws.

For example, I’m currently working on a load for my rifle using a very heavy bullet and a certain slow burning powder. Being a 308, it needs all the velocity it can get. So I decided to go with Winchester brass because it has the most capacity. The load maxed out at 2650 FPS. The accuracy came in 2530-2580. Happy, I grabbed some RP brass because it’s heavier with less capacity just to see what would happen. Well, the load maxed out at 2600 FPS. I bet in a Lapua case the load would max out even lower. And in a Federal case... forget it.

But Federal brass is perfectly fine with other loads, namely 175SMK/IMR4064.

So again it depends.
 
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