Rate these 223 semiauto's

#51
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

I have Noveske, Lwrc and Lmt with both 223 and 308 in the first two and they are all awesome guns, If you want accuracy Noveske, shooting with a suppressor I would go Lwrc, piston gun seems a bit easier to clean than the di guns. Anyway that is my two cents worth. All around I would go with the LWRC they are great guns and the prices have come down a little.
 
#52
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1943m1garand</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Also the irons no a Sig 556 are backup only. I highly recommend an Aimpoint M3. </div></div>

Do you guys have to qual with your irons first then optics (we do). Just curious. The Aimpoints are so durable I trust them, but can see both sides of the argument on the irons-first qual.
 
#53
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

Stan,are all those JP's 223?

I sure like em.They are AR-15 eye candy for sure.I'd settle for one.
wink.gif
I'd also like one of there big frames in 260 too!

Steve
 
#55
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

I have and have had many AR's; Bushmasters,Armalites,Colts,RRA,POF. All good. I prefere the POF but I can't really fault the others. I like the low heat and less cleaning of the POF. But for pure accuracy (Like on a varmit rifle at extended range), I don't know how well the pistons would perform.
I have a Sig 556 Swat folder and I love how it works. It eats all ammo with authority and has great accuracy. The weight is alittle heavy but I always keep one X-300 on the front right side and a M-3 combat light on the other side, a tango down grip and a Larue scope mount and a Luepy Mark 4 -1.5x5 lit reticle scope.....Yes it's heavy but I have built this rifle for a specific purpose and it works well. I use this rifle alot, actually more than any other. If a person gets use to a greater weight and practices /handles it constantly then you don't mind the weight, you adapt to it's feel. The best rifle is the one you build for the purpose at hand. If it has an issue, fix it. Make it what you want it to be. Certain rifles have their niches(did I spell that right?), utilize those qualities to your benefit........SmokeRolls
 
#56
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SPDSNYPR,

I'm in the process of getting a Rob Arms XCR right now in 223 as of a few minutes ago. That will be fun to try out and see if I like it. I should have it early next week.

Steve </div></div>

I think you will be impressed with the XCR, it is a great gun, just don't forget about the break in part. What configuration did you go with?
 
#57
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matt284</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oh yeah, as far as the DPMS/Bushy sidebar: WTF? Neither are complete garbage nor top tier.

Bushy makes solid guns but seems to let a few lemons through. I have one as my issued duty gun and now that I've broken it in I trust it. I would test a Bushy more extensively than some other top tier brands before I am comfortable with it though.

DPMS makes some very accurate guns and I would consider some of their models for a precision role. I would look elsewhere for a hard use carbine that is going to see a high round count. </div></div>

Exactly.

Bushy / DPMS - not junk, not the best. Worth trusting your life to (after extensive field testing, same as ANY firearm)
 
#58
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6mmFan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bottom line is that there are specific features that you look for in a quality AR - such as proper gas key staking for one- "H" marked buffer 2 - "m4" feed cuts 3 - and others that the Bushies and DPMS and Olympic just dont have. Also these companies dont properly test their bolts and barrels for structural problems. That being said I have a Frankengun that has none of those features that runs fine. Would I trust it - I mean really really trust it? NO.

And yes I am just a pimply faced wannabe.

By the way Steve- how long you been shooting now??? Ever heard of marking numbers on your mags and ditching the proven bad ones?

Is this remedial gun-nut or what???
smile.gif
</div></div>

Haha,

I may be a gun nut but I never claimed to be the brightest apple in the bunch,LOL.The good thing here and now is that I'm learning of some of the possible fixes for my gun.

Concerning the mags....That was all years ago.I got tired of buying different brand mags that didn't work.I must of spent about a couple hundred on them back then.I even bought new magpul followers and "zirconium zantilium" springs for the GI mags
wink.gif
.I seriously only have one mag that works good right now.This is one of those guns that sat in the back of the safe and wasn't used much.Then I decided to dig it out and try shooting out to 600Y just for the fun of it.It's always been very accurate,just a little unreliable.Now I got the bug to get it working right.

Thanks again for those links!

Steve
 
#59
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gregsjt</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SPDSNYPR,

I'm in the process of getting a Rob Arms XCR right now in 223 as of a few minutes ago. That will be fun to try out and see if I like it. I should have it early next week.

Steve </div></div>

I think you will be impressed with the XCR, it is a great gun, just don't forget about the break in part. What configuration did you go with? </div></div>

The XCR will be fun to test.It's the lightweight version, black with the new trigger in 223.Also it's used,so hopefully it'll be good to go.It comes with a Pmag too.

I'll do a range report about it after putting a bunch of rounds through it.

Steve

 
#60
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TheSmokeRolls</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have and have had many AR's; Bushmasters,Armalites,Colts,RRA,POF. All good. I prefere the POF but I can't really fault the others. I like the low heat and less cleaning of the POF. But for pure accuracy (Like on a varmit rifle at extended range), I don't know how well the pistons would perform.
I have a Sig 556 Swat folder and I love how it works. It eats all ammo with authority and has great accuracy. The weight is alittle heavy but I always keep one X-300 on the front right side and a M-3 combat light on the other side, a tango down grip and a Larue scope mount and a Luepy Mark 4 -1.5x5 lit reticle scope.....Yes it's heavy but I have built this rifle for a specific purpose and it works well. I use this rifle alot, actually more than any other. If a person gets use to a greater weight and practices /handles it constantly then you don't mind the weight, you adapt to it's feel. The best rifle is the one you build for the purpose at hand. If it has an issue, fix it. Make it what you want it to be. Certain rifles have their niches(did I spell that right?), utilize those qualities to your benefit........SmokeRolls </div></div>

The Sig556 is getting good scores/comments for it's reliability.That's good to know!!!

The niche I'm addressing right now is carbine versions of these types of guns.I have an AR upper in 6mmART with a 26" barrel that I use for reaching out there aways.It had some bugs too but I got them worked out OK.

Steve
 
#62
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

Here's a couple of pics of my favorite carbines in 223:
1st is Sig 556 Swat limited edition:
2010JanJenscamera621.jpg

Next is POF gas piston AR:
2010JanJenscamera618.jpg

They both work very well and I would recommend them to anyone.
.....................SmokeRolls
 
#63
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

Here's why I think you should go with a Decent AR... Add-ons, Parts, Parts availability, price of parts. Bottom line, you can find good and bad in all of your choices. Why is the Remington 700 the most popular bolt gun on this site? For the reasons I stated above!
You can go to any gun show and find AR parts and accessories. Try that with ANY of the others. The AR is just "America's battle rifle". If there's something wrong with an AR, there's someone out there that can tell you how to fix it... And they'll tell you for FREE... And you won't have to be without your rifle for weeks or months. Personally, I've owned MANY AR's. Colt, Armalite, POF, JP Precision, Bushmaster, RRA, DPMS, LMT, Noveske and last but certainly not least... Spikes Tactical (Which is where all of my AR's come from lately). If you want a Piston AR, you may want to consider one of the companies that retro-fit a piston system. That way if they're not the company that emerges from the rubble of the "Piston AR Wars" you can at least make it Direct Impingement again. My $0.02... FWIW.
 
#65
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Check out POF's piston ARs as well. Got one and love it. </div></div>

How about you Rob.What was the deciding force on your decision to get the POF ?

Steve
 
#66
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Man Smokerolls,your all set up nice!!!

I saw that Rob has a POF in one of the earlier posts. What made you guys decide to go with the POF say,over the REPR? Is yours a piston version?

Steve
</div></div>
Thanks.
When the piston rifles first started coming out and we were waiting on H&K's 416 then the POF was available and it had some great writups and did very well in torture test. This one is no exception. It performs very well. It has a 5R barrel and runs very cool. I can't knock this rifle. It does what it's supposed to..
There are many other gas piston AR's now, from Ruger, Remington (I beleive), and now Sig and probably more that I am not meantioning. Since I am in love with Sig stuff, I would not hesitate to try their new gas piston AR 516 version, they gave it a sweet writup in American Rifleman (Jan 2010).
I don't believe anyone is offering a bad rifle so just choose your direction and go for it....Enjoy the ride.....SmokeRolls
 
#67
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SPDSNYPR</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1943m1garand</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Also the irons no a Sig 556 are backup only. I highly recommend an Aimpoint M3. </div></div>

Do you guys have to qual with your irons first then optics (we do). Just curious. The Aimpoints are so durable I trust them, but can see both sides of the argument on the irons-first qual. </div></div>

I admit to talking out of my ass on this one because I have never been in a gun fight (thank God for that) but is anyone familiar with a single instance of BUIS being deployed in a LE or civilian firefight? Seems to me that the most likely scenario is as follows -- 1. Optic goes down, shooter transitions to sidearm 2. Optic goes down, shooter just uses the Aimpoint as a massive ghost ring. 3. Optic goes down and it makes no difference because by the time BUIS are deployed the fight is over.

Again -- my two cents -- buy an Aimpoint, leave it on all the time, at a low setting, change the batteries every six months. Although I think with the M4 Aimpoint the low setting battery life is 50,000 hours. Which works out to over 5 years.

Don't buy an EOTECH they always time out at the worst time.
 
#69
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can you guys tell me what you think about the Steyr Aug/MSAR carbines.Strengths and weakness's.

Steve</div></div>
Well for one......I can't get past the look. And I think the options for optics isn't the greatest but I'm not really sure on that. My buddy's got one...SmokeRolls
 
#70
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

I have a Robinson XCR 556 and it runs great. Also, I have a POF 415 on order since 20 FEB 2009, so almost a year now. I have a POF 308 and unfortunately it doesn't run and I have already sent it back to POF once. Next time I go to the range I am going to take picks to send to POF. That said I still can't wait to get my POF 415.

Jamie
 
#71
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Check out POF's piston ARs as well. Got one and love it. </div></div>

How about you Rob.What was the deciding force on your decision to get the POF ?

Steve</div></div>

I won mine at last years Tactics TPRC but I would definitely buy another one as it's accurate, reliable and I love the piston set up keeping the rifle's receiver area clean. Also the company itself is first rate. Frank the owner is a hell of a guy and he looks out for his customers. I'm looking at getting a POF 6.5 Creedmoor too.
 
#72
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

In regards to the bushmaster issues. I've got one that has well over 10k rds through it. Runs fine. Only had one failure during a 1k round count carbine course. Failure was due to a 1st gen PMAG filled with mud...

For some reason, I've got pretty decent staking on my bushmaster. I didn't have any issues with the castle nut backing off and only on a small few AR builds have I ever staked them. Usually, if it's installed with a proper castlenut wrench and torqued tight enough it will never back off.

Biggest issue I've seen with failing AR's is bad mags. Second biggest issue is people not running CLP. I've had 2 friends recently who were having issues with AR's running. After lubing with CLP, they've been working fine.

I've never understood the whole piston AR thing. Adding more parts and having them make the rifle front heavy is lame. Pistons of course don't shoot gas in your face, but they tend to be louder with a can.

I have an MSAR STG-556. Surprisingly it runs fine. The receiver gets really hot under rapid fire. My trigger is pretty good. Way better than the FS2000's I've tried. I don't get the balance comments. Having all the weight of the rifle towards the rear is really awesome for offhand shooting. In that way it feels like I'm driving a pistol around more than a rifle. (Well, except that it has way more support.)
 
#73
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Check out POF's piston ARs as well. Got one and love it. </div></div>

How about you Rob.What was the deciding force on your decision to get the POF ?

Steve</div></div>

I won mine at last years Tactics TPRC but I would definitely buy another one as it's accurate, reliable and I love the piston set up keeping the rifle's receiver area clean. Also the company itself is first rate. Frank the owner is a hell of a guy and he looks out for his customers. I'm looking at getting a POF 6.5 Creedmoor too. </div></div>

Dang Rob,what a prize!

I didn't even realize what the top pick on that table was that day.You probably even had free flight miles too I bet,Geez.I'm just flat out envious
smile.gif
So your deciding factor was sending off the entry fee,
wink.gif
LOL It sure pays to be a good shot!!!

Thanks for the response.I'm glad it's been a good gun for you.

Steve
 
#74
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

Nope actually had to pay for the plane ticket. LOL Hoping to win another in a couple of weeks
wink.gif



Seriously I have run the POF in a couple of 3 gun matches and around the range and it's never even hicupped on me. Ate everything I fed it and has been very accurate, 1/2 MOA, with good ammo. I couldn't be happier with mine.
 
#75
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Check out POF's piston ARs as well. Got one and love it. </div></div>

How about you Rob.What was the deciding force on your decision to get the POF ?

Steve</div></div>

I won mine at last years Tactics TPRC but I would definitely buy another one as it's accurate, reliable and I love the piston set up keeping the rifle's receiver area clean. Also the company itself is first rate. Frank the owner is a hell of a guy and he looks out for his customers. I'm looking at getting a POF 6.5 Creedmoor too.</div></div>
Rob.
I would be interested in hearing about the POF in 6.5. I have inquired with the company to see if they are going to offer a varmit style AR gas piston version with a 24" and they said "no" at that time (It was about a year ago when I asked.)
Find out what barrel length they are going to mate it with. When I asked what is the longest barrel they offered and they said 18" at that time..........SmokeRolls
 
#76
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Salmonaxe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I've never understood the whole piston AR thing. Adding more parts and having them make the rifle front heavy is lame.</div></div>
Salmonaxe: While I like both gas driven and piston driven, I do love the idea of having an AR with the best quality that makes the AK-47 what it is..........Reliability
Yes a person can lube the non piston AR and it will perform well but you have to admit the gas driven AR has it's drawbacks. It blows dirt where it doesn't need to have it. It heats up like a pot belly stove in your hands when you fire alot of rounds out of it. As far as having one or so more parts adding to the possibility that it may fail due to those extra parts...Think about the crap it's not depositing into the bolt area which can lead to more failures and added heat which can make matters even worse....
One thing I have yet to see is how a long barrel gas piston AR will perform in the accuracy department. Will it be on par with the top of the line gas driven AR?
.........Time will tell but I believe that the gas piston AR has the carbine / entry weapon roll well in hand..
.Just my 2cents............SmokeRolls
 
#77
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

My non piston AR's are reliable... My crappy bushmaster (which works by some miracle) only gets cleaned every 1k rounds. I just squirt some CLP on the bolt carrier from time to time.

I don't really think you can just point at one component of the AK and say that's why it's reliable. (Gas system) There's a multitude of design features on the AK which make it reliable. (Loose tolerances, 2 lug bolt, Sand/relief cut in bolt, large extractor captured inside the bolt face, fixed ejector, tapered cartridge, magazines which follow the natural contour of the bullet stack, no tilt follower, massive internal space around bolt carrier and fire control group. 2-stage trigger with a great deal of sear engagement as well as a large amount of disconnector engagement. Fixed charging handle. Fixed Gas piston. Fixed cam on bolt. Long camming geometry of bolt carrier.)

I just think that the AR is too elegant of a design to really benefit from adding just one of the systems of an AK.

Better to just go with a design that borrows certain ergonomic features of the AR and uses them with an AK method of operation. Like the XCR or the Sig 550 series of rifles.
 
#78
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

I agree with alot of what's been posted, but knowing the little bit about steve that I do, I would send him the same direction that Stan did-JP. Unless steve has started kicking down doors for a living, I think the JP will make him a happy guy.
 
#79
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

I can't comment much on POF (other than I'd really like to get one), but I know Frank is a huge supporter of our sport (esp locally!). If it were the the folks behind the rifle I'd give the nod to Frank over JP.
 
#81
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

In my experience, the chamber and gas system length have a big effect on AR reliability. A full-length gas system(18" or longer barrel) combined with a Wylde chamber have been perfectly reliable for me. I bought a Bushmaster predator that gave me nothing but grief: had a tight "match" chamber.

I do agree that for carbine length and suppressed rifles, a piston system makes a lot of sense. But, I like having an AR that allows me to replace barrels myself: don't want a proprietary system where I am beholden to the rifle manufacturer. So, I'd suggest the Adams Arms gas piston system as a great choice.

Had a SIG556 for a few months. It NEVER failed me. Can't say it was the most accurate...started walking shots as the barrel heated and was only 2MOA anyhow. It is also front-end heavy...noticeably so. But there is no question it is uber-reliable.

After trying a lot of different rifles, I've settled on a good old 20" AR for my needs: never had a malfunction but I'm not shooting 500 rounds in a day either. Put a Krieger barrel on and shoot 1/2MOA all day. Can't say that for most other choices.

PS. Larue makes great uppers...with Wylde chambers.
smile.gif
 
#82
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Salmonaxe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I've never understood the whole piston AR thing. </div></div>

Start shooting with a suppressor, and it will become perfectly clear. In less than 100 rounds fired (which is roughly the # of rounds when malfunctions will begin shooting DI gas AR with a can) .

 
#83
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Salmonaxe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My non piston AR's are reliable... My crappy bushmaster (which works by some miracle) only gets cleaned every 1k rounds. I just squirt some CLP on the bolt carrier from time to time.

I don't really think you can just point at one component of the AK and say that's why it's reliable. (Gas system) There's a multitude of design features on the AK which make it reliable. (Loose tolerances, 2 lug bolt, Sand/relief cut in bolt, large extractor captured inside the bolt face, fixed ejector, tapered cartridge, magazines which follow the natural contour of the bullet stack, no tilt follower, massive internal space around bolt carrier and fire control group. 2-stage trigger with a great deal of sear engagement as well as a large amount of disconnector engagement. Fixed charging handle. Fixed Gas piston. Fixed cam on bolt. Long camming geometry of bolt carrier.)

I just think that the AR is too elegant of a design to really benefit from adding just one of the systems of an AK.

Better to just go with a design that borrows certain ergonomic features of the AR and uses them with an AK method of operation. Like the XCR or the Sig 550 series of rifles. </div></div>

Salmonaxe and other responders,

I got a Rob arms XCR-L and a Sig556 carbine coming soon.I'm looking forward to seeing the difference between them at the same time.

I'll be running 3-4 types of different 223 ammo through them and testing for accuracy.

If you guys in Phoenix have or know of anybody that has a FN2000,Steyr-Aug/MSAR's,POF other piston AR's,ETC, let me know and we can all try to arrange a get together down there and compare all these carbines together at the same time.

Also it would be fun to compare a bunch of tuperware pistols at the same time too.I have a Steyr M9 to bring.Possible candidates are Glock,SW-M&P,HK,FN,SA-XD,Taurus,Ruger and any others I'm missing.

Steve
 
#84
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

What do you want to do with it. is the first question you need to ask yourself.? after that ask the group.

Just blasting. go cheap
competition. the list starts here
Shooting critters. what range. what bullet??
 
#85
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

arborpro,

I'm doing this comparison just for the fun of it
smile.gif
! I'm not MIL or LEO. Just a gun nut. I want too see how I like each system.Ergonomics,recoil impulse,balance,sights,trigger,accuracy,ease of field stripping and most importantly RELIABILITY!

I've been wanting to for the last 2-3 years and now's a good time before spring comes and I get too busy with work.

I've got different rifles for different purposes already.Most of the bases I want to cover...are.From precision air rifles to rifles capable of hitting things almost 3000 yards away.

Steve



 
#86
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">arborpro,

I'm doing this comparison just for the fun of it
smile.gif
! I'm not MIL or LEO. Just a gun nut. I want too see how I like each system.Ergonomics,recoil impulse,balance,sights,trigger,accuracy,ease of field stripping and most importantly RELIABILITY!

I've been wanting to for the last 2-3 years and now's a good time before spring comes and I get too busy with work.

I've got different rifles for different purposes already.Most of the bases I want to cover...are.From precision air rifles to rifles capable of hitting things almost 3000 yards away.

Steve



</div></div>
And after you do your comparison be sure to go back and shoot a reliable 20" AR....then you'll know why they are still #1!
smile.gif
 
#89
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

I have a Sig 556 and I really like it. I think it is a very robust design that is plagued by some penny pinching at Sig when it comes to accessories.

After a couple thousand rounds I still have not gotten mine to choke. It eats literally everything I can feed it and spits it out with authority. It flings brass 15+ feet and just keeps on running regardless of what I can find to load the mags with.

The backup iron sights are pretty cheap but they will work in a pinch. Plan on buying some better irons if you are going to really rely on them. The plastic stock and handguard can feel flimsy, which I think is what turns most people off during a first impression. I put on a Magpul UBR stock and Swat quad rail and that made all the difference. Now everything is tight and solid, it feels like I could use this rifle to jack up my car if needed. The stock trigger is excellent with an adjustable secondary pressure point so you can get it setup to your liking.

Some people report excellent accuracy out of the box, but I unfortunately did have to struggle through some accuracy issues. After trying many different things now the gun will shoot about 2” when cold with good ammo at 100 yards, haven’t tried to improve it with hand loads yet. I have also noticed the POI will wander as it warms up, but then it seems to stay at one place one warm. It is also sensitive to pressure on the forend as you would expect since the barrel is not free floated.

It is a little nose heavy but installing a set of 551 handguards makes a huge difference on the balance of the rifle. I don’t mind a little extra weight and enjoy how smoothly it shoots, nicer than other AR’s I have shot, it has less muzzle rise and is faster back on target. The short barrel 556 rifles are over-gassed, they need a smaller orifice in the gas block, so I am guessing that is where the extra felt recoil came from that one poster reported.

About the only thing I would trade my 556 in for is a LWRC. I have fired my buddies 14.5” LWRC M6A2 in 6.8 SPC a bunch and it is a very nice rifle. I know there are plenty of other great makers out there as well but the LWRC accuracy and overall package has impressed me the most. The stock trigger is terrible, and it doesn’t seem to cycle as smoothly as my Sig, but it is much more accurate and of course also runs great.

I have spent about as much as a nice AR to get my Sig 556 where I like it, but I feel it was worth it. It’s too bad they didn’t make it correct out of the box, I think they would have had a real winner if they hadn’t hampered a great design with some cheap accessories. Sig is having a $300 rebate on the 556 rifle right now, so combine that with great prices from places like Topgunsupply and you could get a nice rifle for dirt cheap.


24152990206_large.jpg

 
#91
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brett B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a Sig 556 and I really like it. </div></div>


Brett -

I'm curious....

What lead you to have both a fwd grip and a scope on your Sig? The scope is for precision, and the fwd grip is for CQB - they don't seem to go together. (I would think you'd have a red dot with a fwd grip, or a scope w/o a fwd grip) In my thinking anyway, but then every "mission" is different....

Anyway, sweet gun. I really like the 550/551 look.....just can't afford it right now.
 
#92
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hum, funny, I dont buy anything but Armalites. Have two 10's and a 15, they run like machines. Really like LMT products also and RRA, never impressed with DPMS. To each his own.

okie</div></div>
I agree with you liking Armalights, I own two AR-10's in 308 and I love them and they have had zero malfuntions. I have never had an Armalight AR-15 but since the guy meantioned that he was wanting to compare 223's "Rate these 223 semiauto's", I didn't think to include the 308's . We aren't leaving out Armalight.. Because that's one of my favorite brands....It's all good....
...............................SmokeRolls
 
#93
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brett B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a Sig 556 and I really like it. I think it is a very robust design that is plagued by some penny pinching at Sig when it comes to accessories.

After a couple thousand rounds I still have not gotten mine to choke. It eats literally everything I can feed it and spits it out with authority. It flings brass 15+ feet and just keeps on running regardless of what I can find to load the mags with.

The backup iron sights are pretty cheap but they will work in a pinch. Plan on buying some better irons if you are going to really rely on them. The plastic stock and handguard can feel flimsy, which I think is what turns most people off during a first impression. I put on a Magpul UBR stock and Swat quad rail and that made all the difference. Now everything is tight and solid, it feels like I could use this rifle to jack up my car if needed. The stock trigger is excellent with an adjustable secondary pressure point so you can get it setup to your liking.

Some people report excellent accuracy out of the box, but I unfortunately did have to struggle through some accuracy issues. After trying many different things now the gun will shoot about 2” when cold with good ammo at 100 yards, haven’t tried to improve it with hand loads yet. I have also noticed the POI will wander as it warms up, but then it seems to stay at one place one warm. It is also sensitive to pressure on the forend as you would expect since the barrel is not free floated.

It is a little nose heavy but installing a set of 551 handguards makes a huge difference on the balance of the rifle. I don’t mind a little extra weight and enjoy how smoothly it shoots, nicer than other AR’s I have shot, it has less muzzle rise and is faster back on target. The short barrel 556 rifles are over-gassed, they need a smaller orifice in the gas block, so I am guessing that is where the extra felt recoil came from that one poster reported.

About the only thing I would trade my 556 in for is a LWRC. I have fired my buddies 14.5” LWRC M6A2 in 6.8 SPC a bunch and it is a very nice rifle. I know there are plenty of other great makers out there as well but the LWRC accuracy and overall package has impressed me the most. The stock trigger is terrible, and it doesn’t seem to cycle as smoothly as my Sig, but it is much more accurate and of course also runs great.

I have spent about as much as a nice AR to get my Sig 556 where I like it, but I feel it was worth it. It’s too bad they didn’t make it correct out of the box, I think they would have had a real winner if they hadn’t hampered a great design with some cheap accessories. Sig is having a $300 rebate on the 556 rifle right now, so combine that with great prices from places like Topgunsupply and you could get a nice rifle for dirt cheap.


24152990206_large.jpg

</div></div>

Brett,

Nice Sig!!!

They must be extremely reliable.I haven't seen one post complaining about that issue.

Guys,

I'm glad your AR-15's are running good.Honestly I've seen plenty of them jamm before in 3 gun matches and in service rifle shoots too.

I checked the gas key on mine it's GTG.Checked for the M4 feed ramps,nope,so I got out the dremmel tool and created some along with a high polish.I got new Magpuls coming.Soon I'll see if it's more reliable.

Steve

 
#94
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: garandman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brett B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a Sig 556 and I really like it. </div></div>


Brett -

I'm curious....

What lead you to have both a fwd grip and a scope on your Sig? The scope is for precision, and the fwd grip is for CQB - they don't seem to go together. (I would think you'd have a red dot with a fwd grip, or a scope w/o a fwd grip) In my thinking anyway, but then every "mission" is different....

Anyway, sweet gun. I really like the 550/551 look.....just can't afford it right now.

</div></div>
I see your point sort-of but not always. I run a scope on mine but mine is very low power (1.5x 5) Mark 4 (The dark earth Sig 556 way up in this thread). The fwd grip doesn't exactly make a carbine a slouch at hitting targets at the range that they are designed for even with a higher powered scope. It's just a method of holding onto the weapon. While I prefer a lower power for quick follow up shots and wider field of view. Many scopes say a 3x10 work just fine on a carbine as long as it serves the purpose that you are using it for. When I want to steady the rifle I lean up against something when I can or when it's suitable. It's the same with a hunting rifle... Hold steady take a breath......exhale........squeeze.......drop the target
.......................SmokeRolls
 
#95
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: garandman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brett B</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a Sig 556 and I really like it. </div></div>


Brett -

I'm curious....

What lead you to have both a fwd grip and a scope on your Sig? The scope is for precision, and the fwd grip is for CQB - they don't seem to go together. (I would think you'd have a red dot with a fwd grip, or a scope w/o a fwd grip) In my thinking anyway, but then every "mission" is different....

Anyway, sweet gun. I really like the 550/551 look.....just can't afford it right now.

</div></div>

Thanks for the compliments and that's a good question.

I typically use this rifle for hunting and target practice. I am always trying to find one optic that can do it all, and of course there is no good answer, so that 3-9x illuminated Burris is holding me over for right now and I have been pleased with it. Ideally I would have an Aimpoint and a NXS 2.5-10x, both on Larue quick release mounts that I could swap out as needed. But I just can't justify that kind of money on this rifle right now.

When I take the 556 hunting the grip really helps with the additional front end weight. The grip is also useful to rest on whatever happens to be nearby when trying to stay still and not scare off the critters, especially since I'm rarely in a perfect prone or seated position.

If I am going to be shooting the rifle at 100-200 yards at the range, I typically remove the grip and bolt on the bipod. The rails make it pretty quick and easy.
smile.gif


24152990209_large.jpg
 
#96
Re: Rate these 223 semiauto's

Well, my personal preference is bullpup - because of its (in my opinion) vastly superior ergonomics compared to AR15 and AK - great balance, shorter & more controllable size, natural aiming, quicker pointing, etc. My experience is with AUG & MSAR (similar handling-wise), and I really love how it handles (for the price - it better!
smile.gif
) - especially in tactical, much better (for me) than either AR15 or AK clones. Factor trigger - no worse than factory trigger on AR15. Optics - put ACOG TA11H and loved it. The native scope isn't bad either (and it looks cooler) - but ACOG is better in practice.
 
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