Advanced Marksmanship Reading Mirage

[goober]

I have been looking for some info on the site on reading mirage but havent found what I would like to know .Can some one tell me what angles the mirage tips to give away what the wind speed is .Is there any other finer points about mirage one should be aware off - .What happens with the mirage at different wind angles
I really no little of this subject and want to grow my knowledge to have another tool in the shooting box.Thanks Guys

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Reading Mirage

The Wind Book for Rifle Shooters

http://www.amazon.com/Wind-Book-Rifle-Shooters/dp/1581605323

Has some very good illustrations of what to look for as far as mirage, as well as a lot of other good wind reading tactics & strategy. Oriented towards KD / Target shooting, though.

 

[scaxeman]

Re: Reading Mirage

Above all else, practice with somebody else to pull targets for you. The instant feedback between "snapshot" of mirage view and shot placement is the only way to connect the subtleties of mirage and the wind's affects on your projectile.

The book Monte recommends is a good one. The theory it explains is good, the wind flags have changed in weight since the book was written however, so their described effects of a wind flag may not match your experience.

Darrell

 

[Zilla]

Re: Reading Mirage

Another good book is: Prone and Long-Range Rifle Shooting by Nancy Tompkins.

http://www.rifleshootingbynancy.com/

 

[goober]

Re: Reading Mirage

Thanks for the advice on what books to purchase .Can some of you guys give me your own experiances of angles and velocities and what it does to heat waves and what to look for .cheers

 

[Unsichtbar]

Re: Reading Mirage

Figure 3-21 http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/23-10/ch32.htm but mirage is not there alot of the time like in cool mts, night, wind over 8 mph and its only one condition close to the ground. Best to go shoot in the wind, alot of good Palma shooters from NZ, find a club with pit service.

 

[USFTR]

Re: Reading Mirage

+1 on Nancy's book and hit the range as Darrell says. I started learning mirage from diagrams, but most of my knowledge comes from actual practice. You will not fully understand it until you experience it. The instant feedback that Darrell talks about is wonderful. Hold center for each shot, note the mirage in a log, fire the shot, then log where the bullet hit. Do this over several days under different conditions. Then, go back and read the "book" you just wrote.

 

[goober]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Unsichtbar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Figure 3-21 http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/23-10/ch32.htm but mirage is not there alot of the time like in cool mts, night, wind over 8 mph and its only one condition close to the ground. Best to go shoot in the wind, alot of good Palma shooters from NZ, find a club with pit service. </div></div>

That diagram in the link is what I was after-I had seen it before but had forgotten where so thanks for that .I shoot FClass along side palma shooters but havent really discussed in detail mirage .Our climate here is mild and whilst I do observe mirrage it is often hard for me to see what angle it is showing -maybe thats just a thing of practice though .The diagram gives 3-5 5-8 and so on but are you guys able to be fairly precise or is it a dollar either way deciding if it is 5 or 8 mph when looking at the heat waves

 

[scaxeman]

Re: Reading Mirage

Assuming you have a good spotting scope of some sort, you should be looking for guidance not from the mirage at the target distance, but much closer to you, the shooter. Focus your spotting scope on the target, observe the mirage there, then manipulate the focus knob slowly back up the range, closer to where you are stationed. I strongly recommend that you do this on as long a range as you have available. The effect will be *much* more pronounced on a 1000 yard range vs. a 300 yard one. You will be able to note the differences in the strength and behavior of the mirage as the scope's focus moves back up the range.

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Reading Mirage

Re: your references to angle and mirage...

Some folks claim to be able to use mirage to give them a 'composite' vision of the full-value wind across the range, including the angular component... but I've never really been able to make that work. I'm not saying it can't be done, and if you don't have anything else handy I suppose you could use mirage (somewhat) for direction, but I (and most people I know) use mirage for speed/velocity, and flags (or dust, grass, trees, etc.) for direction/angle. Very rarely do I get to see conditions mild enough that the mirage is just 'leaning' one way or the other - usually its a matter of how fast it is 'running' up until it gets wiped out. For the times that it does just 'lean' one way or another, it seems to cause more problems distorting the view of the target (optically displacing the aiming point) than any actual wind present at the time.

Or maybe I'm mis-understanding what you're asking...

 

[goober]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: memilanuk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Re: your references to angle and mirage...

Some folks claim to be able to use mirage to give them a 'composite' vision of the full-value wind across the range, including the angular component... but I've never really been able to make that work. I'm not saying it can't be done, and if you don't have anything else handy I suppose you could use mirage (somewhat) for direction, but I (and most people I know) use mirage for speed/velocity, and flags (or dust, grass, trees, etc.) for direction/angle. Very rarely do I get to see conditions mild enough that the mirage is just 'leaning' one way or the other - usually its a matter of how fast it is 'running' up until it gets wiped out. For the times that it does just 'lean' one way or another, it seems to cause more problems distorting the view of the target (optically displacing the aiming point) than any actual wind present at the time.

Or maybe I'm mis-understanding what you're asking... </div></div>

memilanuk and others thank you for your replies -I really wanted to find out what angles represent what sppeds and are there any other weird and telling things with in the mirage one should know about .I shoot mostly in wind that ranges from 2-10 mph , I know you guys in the states have some more consistant 10+ winds often -I love to get in the wind cause it makes me shoot bad and learn .I was watching the mirage on the range last saturday -picked it 50/60 degree angle 7mph and dropped 6 outa 10 shots onto the 12 inch centre ring-at 900 yards -maybe a little luck with my guess = anyways your advice is appreciated

 

[ARP]

Re: Reading Mirage

roughly

60 degrees 1 - 3
45 degrees 4 - 7
90 degrees 8 - 12

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Reading Mirage

Ah. I wasn't sure if you meant angle relative to vertical, or 'clock' angle (full value = 3/9 o'clock, etc.) from the way it was worded. Darrell & Jeff spend a lot of time on ranges with very visible mirage. The ranges I shoot on most have mirage, but it's generally all the way laid over...

From the book I mentioned before:

Boiling: 0-1mph
Leaning (shows approx. 30 degrees from vert, or 60 from horiz.) 1-3 mph
Laid over and flowing gently: 4-7 mph
Flowing rapidly i.e. 'running: 8-11 mph
Flat-lining: 12-14 mph

Beyond that it tends to disappear. Some ranges seem to have 'heavier' air than others in that the same amount of tilt or run may be worth a little more or or a little less than on another range. Thats where the notes that Jeff mentioned earlier come into play - and local knowledge is priceless.

The above is all 'thumb rules'; it may or may not work any give day on any particular range. Sometimes the flags lie, sometimes the mirage lies, sometimes both lie due to some terrain feature that throws a kink in things; the trick is figuring out which one is lying less

 

[goober]

Re: Reading Mirage

Sorry , I should have said angle from the verticle or horozontal .I think with time I will learn to spot those flows that are fast and more gentle .Its a really interesting subject!!

 

[goober]

Re: Reading Mirage

I thought I would add to my post with some extra visual info for any others like me that are learning to read mirage -hope others do to

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raomhthlmaE&feature=related

 

[Zilla]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: memilanuk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ah. I wasn't sure if you meant angle relative to vertical, or 'clock' angle (full value = 3/9 o'clock, etc.) from the way it was worded. Darrell & Jeff spend a lot of time on ranges with very visible mirage. The ranges I shoot on most have mirage, but it's generally all the way laid over...

From the book I mentioned before:

Boiling: 0-1mph
Leaning (shows approx. 30 degrees from vert, or 60 from horiz.) 1-3 mph
Laid over and flowing gently: 4-7 mph
Flowing rapidly i.e. 'running: 8-11 mph
Flat-lining: 12-14 mph

<span style="font-weight: bold">Beyond that it tends to disappear. </span> Some ranges seem to have 'heavier' air than others in that the same amount of tilt or run may be worth a little more or or a little less than on another range. Thats where the notes that Jeff mentioned earlier come into play - and local knowledge is priceless.

The above is all 'thumb rules'; it may or may not work any give day on any particular range. Sometimes the flags lie, sometimes the mirage lies, sometimes both lie due to some terrain feature that throws a kink in things; the trick is figuring out which one is lying less

</div></div>

Like Bisley?

 

[scaxeman]

Re: Reading Mirage

Yes, very much like Bisley!

Or like Monte's other favorite range: Douglas Ridge

Just ask him about it, he'll complain about the strange atmospheric conditions. The conditions tend to do unusual things to some people's hearing protection?!?

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: memilanuk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Sometimes the flags lie, sometimes the mirage lies, sometimes both lie due to some terrain feature that throws a kink in things; the trick is figuring out which one is lying less

</div></div>

There's a lot of good stuff in this thread, and if one is paying attention you can pocket gems.

All too often people think of mirage only being a wind indicator, but one great point Monte made that is too important to not repeat is the one referring to the optical displacement that mirage induces into your view of the target-this can make precise shots very tricky at times.

I just really like the above quote alot!

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Reading Mirage

Darrell... ya only get one bar for that... it's losing its effect

I'd rather shoot Rattlesnake or Raton than that place. Might as well use a ouija board for wind calls there for all the good the flags and mirage do.

 

[Bushmaster55]

Re: Reading Mirage

By no means am I an expert at reading marage but I have shot at Camp Perry for several years. Its location on lake Erie means there's always wind in some direction. In some cases several directions. Most of the time the mirage is running flat or very close to it. I have found that when the mirage is running flat the best way to use it is by watching for subtle mirage changes to hold or fire in. Fortunately these matches allow sighters so, watch the mirage and find a period of the most consistant mirage,remember what it looks like, value the wind, correct you sights take your first sighter during that same mirage look. If you have doped the wind correctly you have established your base line for the next shots. Shoot when the mirage looks the same. Obviously this only works when you have the time to wait for the mirage to look right. Since wind seldom remains constant and when time is critical, another way to use this method is to study the mirage,find the extremes. High/Avg/and Low, Value each with hold offs, fire, check mirage for next shot, correct, and fire again. In rapid fire situations I've found it best to fire as fast as your experience allows, since the wind has a shoter time to effect each shot. Practice, Practice, Practice the only real way to get it right. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Reading Mirage

All,

Unless I've missed something here, using a spotting scope will usually preclude any need for understanding whether the wind is full or half value, as the image of mirage is always in a directional relationship with the scope. In such a relationship, as earlier I think alluded to by memilanuk, velocity and direction are considered full value.

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
using a spotting scope will usually preclude any need for understanding whether the wind is full or half value
</div></div>

Yeah... like I said - it sounds good in theory. I'm still waiting to see it work like that in the real world - and I'm not using cheap optics either. You can pick up some gross changes in direction as the mirage will appear to pick up in speed or slow to a boil with big direction changes... but not fine enough relative to the very small distance separating an 'X' from a '9' on the LR-FC target face. On targets with larger dimensions, it may be enough.

And then there are the days when the sun disappears behind a cloud - and so does the mirage...

YMMV,

Monte

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: Reading Mirage

Mirage may tell you direction and velocity but it does not give angle value worth a hoot.

Try heading west of the Mississippi sometime Skip - we got REAL wind out this way, not that pussy-ass stuff you have out east.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bushmaster55</div><div class="ubbcode-body">By no means am I an expert at reading marage but I have shot at Camp Perry for several years. Its location on lake Erie means there's always wind in some direction. In some cases several directions. </div></div>

Perry is the easiest range I shoot all year.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Reading Mirage

All,

As, I'm certain, you have seen for yourselves, turning the spotting scope three hundred sixty degrees you will clearly see, at two points, a boil. From such positions you would treat the wind as having no velocity or direction. And so it goes, at any other point, you treat the wind for the velocity/direction perceived from the perspective at the eyepiece with no need to determine half, full, or no value. Be realistic too. You use any device available to understand what you've got. For me, success at LR has been about finding the X-ring and thereafter shooting while my perception, from what I see and feel, is of prevailing conditions. On more occasions for me than not the spotting scope has no value for mirage as in my neighborhood, the Ohio Valley, overcast precludes the visualization of mirage. Of course, then countering the effects of wind is all about how it's effecting ground features on the range.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: Reading Mirage

From Dictionary.com:

"
wind
1&#8194; &#8194;/n. w&#618;nd, Literary wa&#618;nd; v. w&#618;nd/ Show Spelled[n. wind, Literary wahynd; v. wind] Show IPA
–noun
1.
air in natural motion, as that moving horizontally at any velocity along the earth's surface: A gentle wind blew through the valley. High winds were forecast. "

Note the use of it both in singular and plural form. What we deal with in rifle shooting is WINDS in the plural form. Most discussion of it in the singular form is inaccurate and incomplete.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Reading Mirage

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: _9H</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From Dictionary.com:

"
wind
1&#8194; &#8194;/n. w&#618;nd, Literary wa&#618;nd; v. w&#618;nd/ Show Spelled[n. wind, Literary wahynd; v. wind] Show IPA
&#150;noun
1.
air in natural motion, as that moving horizontally at any velocity along the earth's surface: A gentle wind blew through the valley. High winds were forecast. "

Note the use of it both in singular and plural form. What we deal with in rifle shooting is WINDS in the plural form. Most discussion of it in the singular form is inaccurate and incomplete.

</div></div>


The discussion being inaccurate and incomplete does not negate an attempt to deal with it. In the context of shooting, what's average about it is what's considered meaningful as a formula taken off the average can be applied to counter its effects.

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: Reading Mirage

You can't figure out the average if you don't understand the individual components that make up the sum total of the affect on the projectile and evaluate them as pieces, then come up with their total affect over the path of the bullet.

Shooters often trick themselves into thinking they have wind figured out just because they figure out one or two indicators on their local honey hole shooting area. They do not.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Reading Mirage

You go with what you know, not what you'd like to know, because, like what, if you can't get it all, you're not gonna shoot?

Generally, I look at what's going on at mid range, and, by what I see in the scope and/or on the range, I multiply distance (less one's and ten's place) times mph and divide by 10. That's it. I favor or adjust the sight and shoot. What else are you gonna do. There's no tricking yourself into believing anything about it. If the shot goes on call you got the job done. BTW, I don't know anything about "honey hole" ranges, perhaps you've had some experience with such and can enlighten me.