Gunsmithing Remington 700 sa grouping issues

[Jheikki]

Well I did a nice custom build this winter on a Rem 700 sa .223 1-7 twist 5R 26” barrel, blueprinted Bolt to action, Timney trigger and a stockys accublock Alum bedded stock.
after about 200 rounds I started to develop unusual grouping at 300 and up yards I shoot five rounds cool down between each shot and end up with a .30 MOA with 3 rounds and find two more about 5-6” away with a .35 MOA happens most of the time.

i have the action torqued to 55 “ #s with the barrel lug all the way back in the bedding then torqued.

has anyone run into this? I’m kind thinking I need to glass bed the barrel lug if not the whole action and lug, any thoughts out there?

 

[4066.5]

Have you checked rings/ base torque as well?

I ran into this before. At 100 it was spot on, past 300-400 I would get a 3 shot group and 2 shot group when shooting 5. If shooting 10, I would (3) 3 shot groups or (2) 5 shot groups. It was me, breaking position or correcting cant. As soon as I started really practicing never breaking cheek weld or position it started getting tighter and tighter.

Are you breaking position at all? Getting off the rifle and looking through spotting scope, adjusting rear bag, correcting cant.

Im fairly new so take it for whatever it's worth. Haven't messed with bedding anything so I can't help ya there.

 

[Thud]

A few questions.
a. Hand loads or factory.
b. What weight bullet.
c. What powder, primer, charge weight. Using same lot of powder or have you changed lots.
d. why did you pick 55 inch pounds.
e. is the action and recoil lug bedded and approx. 1" forward of lug.
f. Cleaning schedule a how do you clean.
g. Was load developed in the winter and was it changed for warmer weather.
h. have you checked for any throat erosion.
i. Are you shooting single shot or from the magazine.
j. Have you made and changes in your loading if you hand load.
k. If factory same lot of ammo.
Answer these questions and it's easier to diaignose the problem then guessing

 

[Jheikki]

A few questions.
a. Hand loads or factory. Hand loads
b. What weight bullet. 80 gr Berger VLD
c. What powder, primer, charge weight. Using same lot of powder or have you changed lots. Hogdon BLC-2 23.5 gr same lot of powder Winchester primer
d. why did you pick 55 inch pounds. Stocks said alum bedded torque was 55“#
e. is the action and recoil lug bedded and approx. 1" forward of lug. Stockys accublock, stood up on but tightened and torqued action bolts
f. Cleaning schedule a how do you clean. After daily shoot will run a snake threw about every 50 rounds I will clean throughly
g. Was load developed in the winter and was it changed for warmer weather. temp has only changed 10 degrees I have been monitoring FPS
h. have you checked for any throat erosion. New barrel 200 rounds threw it but did not check for erosion
i. Are you shooting single shot or from the magazine. Single shot but I feed lock it in the mag so it feeds into the chamber smoothly
j. Have you made and changes in your loading if you hand load. None load to within .04 gr bullet seat same .4 jump
k. If factory samelot of ammo.
Answer these questions and it's easier to diaignose the problem then guessing

 

[Thud]

Some helpful hint.
a. Ok hand loads.
b. Good choice
c. try Varget up the charge. start safely. Check different load charts.
What primer.
d. try to increase torque to 65 in lbs. balence the torque front ,back and so forth. It's a pain at times but once set leavr it alone.
e. maybe it needs to be bedded. Some action blocks are not level.
f. Throw the friggen bore snake away it does nothing. Get a good set of rods and jags. get the aluminum ones so you don't get false positive reading of copper removel. Get a good carbon and copper remover boretech stuff is good, get good bonze brushes and learn to properly clean a rifle.
g. How do you monitor speed.
h. That you will need to record. Find where bullet touches the lands and record it then after shooting see where if the bullet needs to move out any > I do it after a 100 or so rounds.
i.You can slide the bullet into the chamber with your fingers, sometimes you get case and bullet damage fro the mag lips.
j. Try putting bullet into the lands not to deep about 004- .006 and see hout it shoots some rifles like it in some like it out.
k.
l. Remember to record changes try to make one change at a time. Record result. Then keep trying.
If you need more help let me know.
Thanks,
Thud

 

[PAYDIRT]

Nice thread title

 

[Jheikki]

Some helpful hint.
a. Ok hand loads.
b. Good choice
c. try Varget up the charge. start safely. Check different load charts.
What primer.
d. try to increase torque to 65 in lbs. balence the torque front ,back and so forth. It's a pain at times but once set leavr it alone.
e. maybe it needs to be bedded. Some action blocks are not level.
f. Throw the friggen bore snake away it does nothing. Get a good set of rods and jags. get the aluminum ones so you don't get false positive reading of copper removel. Get a good carbon and copper remover boretech stuff is good, get good bonze brushes and learn to properly clean a rifle.
g. How do you monitor speed.
h. That you will need to record. Find where bullet touches the lands and record it then after shooting see where if the bullet needs to move out any > I do it after a 100 or so rounds.
i.You can slide the bullet into the chamber with your fingers, sometimes you get case and bullet damage fro the mag lips.
j. Try putting bullet into the lands not to deep about 004- .006 and see hout it shoots some rifles like it in some like it out.
k.
l. Remember to record changes try to make one change at a time. Record result. Then keep trying.
If you need more help let me know.
Thanks,
Thud

thanks for the feedback, I am using BLC-2 because you can’t find Varget anywhere but I did a satarlee load tree and found my happy place at 2,630 FPS with 23.5 gr. I do have a micrometer dial to set my bullet seat I will dial it in to just into the lands. I do have a chrono but to be honest last few times I did not have it set up, I will set up next time.

i have a 5 R rifling cut and get very little fouling but I will order a carbon rod and clean from the breech

i am going to pull the stock off and take some measurements on lug depth and bedding inspection I might have to put a skim bed of glass

this will take a bit but if I run into something that does not seem right I’ll email you

thanks much

 

[Jheikki]

Some helpful hint.
a. Ok hand loads.
b. Good choice
c. try Varget up the charge. start safely. Check different load charts.
What primer.
d. try to increase torque to 65 in lbs. balence the torque front ,back and so forth. It's a pain at times but once set leavr it alone.
e. maybe it needs to be bedded. Some action blocks are not level.
f. Throw the friggen bore snake away it does nothing. Get a good set of rods and jags. get the aluminum ones so you don't get false positive reading of copper removel. Get a good carbon and copper remover boretech stuff is good, get good bonze brushes and learn to properly clean a rifle.
g. How do you monitor speed.
h. That you will need to record. Find where bullet touches the lands and record it then after shooting see where if the bullet needs to move out any > I do it after a 100 or so rounds.
i.You can slide the bullet into the chamber with your fingers, sometimes you get case and bullet damage fro the mag lips.
j. Try putting bullet into the lands not to deep about 004- .006 and see hout it shoots some rifles like it in some like it out.
k.
l. Remember to record changes try to make one change at a time. Record result. Then keep trying.
If you need more help let me know.
Thanks,
Thud

one thing I forgot to mention at 40”#action torque the bolt release button works fine but at 55”# doesn’t work at all I have to manually push the lever down, I am thinking I have some binding going on so I really need to look at the bedding

 

[Thud]

What type of die for your seater do you use.
I find the Wilson in line seater the easiest to use. If you don't have the micrometer adjuster. Get some shims to set your seater. Sinclair has them I think they are skip otto's .
They make fine adjustments easy.
Get 2 dewey rods and set one for a jag and the other for a brush. And a bore guide so you don't drip solvent into the action and trigger.

 

[Jheikki]

What type of die for your seater do you use.
I find the Wilson in line seater the easiest to use. If you don't have the micrometer adjuster. Get some shims to set your seater. Sinclair has them I think they are skip otto's .
They make fine adjustments easy.
Get 2 dewey rods and set one for a jag and the other for a brush. And a bore guide so you don't drip solvent into the action and trigger.

I use a Redding competition dies with a micrometer dial on top, I also have a bullet jump gauge

I’ll order up a bore guild as well

onece the brass is fire formed I only neck size, I am running Remington brass just now going to second time load

 

[FisherT&C]

My knee jerk reaction is a extreme spread issue. Second, this may be neck thickness inconsistency specifically in the inner diameter of the neck. Also weigh your brass and see how consistent the weight is, I have dealt with Remington brass being very inconsistent in weight even from the same lot. Simply upgrading to Hornady or Federal brass may fix the problem. I have found those two to be decent for the money. Peterson, Nosler, Lapua or Alpha would be ideal.