Replace AICS Spigot with Rail

[Yerman]

Hey guys, a while ago there was a guy on here that was machining a new insert for the front of an AICS Chassis to replace the spigot receiver with a rail section that extended out a few inches.

Anyone have a link? I can’t seem to find it.

My spigot has a little play that is driving me nuts. Also, not interested in the Big Dog mount. I want the unit that requires you drive the pins out and replace the entire piece. Thanks.

 

[Rangemaster]

Those rails are nice and solid. I have one on my stock right now. Wish I could help you but I have not seen them around here for a few years.

 

[Polizei45]

I think his user name is Samb300. He's still around. I got one of his spigot replacements last year. It's first rate. Takes that play out. I don't know if he still having them made.

 

[-Time-]

I wish I would’ve know about him, instead of spending $400 on the badger IMUNS-C when I don’t have clip on NV... yet.

 

[jlficken]

He may still make them. I got 2 for the AT and 1 for the AE/AW series while I could.

That adapter is honestly the only reason I own an Atlas bipod as the spigot on the AI is garbage in my opinion.

@samb300

 

[Polizei45]

I found him on Facebook and told him a Hide member was looking for one. I don't know if he keeps up with Facebook.

 

[Yerman]

Thanks guys. I’ll send him a PM

 

[Polizei45]

Sam said if he if he gets enough orders he can do another run.

 

[kRcu]

I shot him a pm. I’m in.

 

[Waorani]

Got one from the first run. They are very nice, high quality.

 

[samb300]

Hey guys, thanks for the kind words about the mounts! Honestly, this past year has been crazy with having my first kid, so the mounts got pushed aside a bit. Also wasn't sure how many would still be interested in the spigot replacement with the Arca-Swiss rail gaining popularity in PRS-type shooting.

In any case, I have a line out with my machine shop to confirm they're still gtg should I want to place an order. I have a couple PMs from interested people, and I know there are a few people over the past year that have contacted me through facebook that may still be interested. So from here I should probably put a list of names together and get an idea of how many people want mounts. I will likely create a new group buy thread since the old one got nuked on the "old" new SH site haha. Give me a couple of days and I'll see if I can get things going again.

Thanks,

Sam

 

[Laseredge]

I’m still interested.

 

[texag0842]

Do we have pictures of this set-up?

I'm curious about the Arca-Swiss attachment

 

[tpe187]

 

[Yerman]

Yep, that's the one! Thanks Sam, looking forward to getting signed up.

 

[samb300]

Do we have pictures of this set-up?

I'm curious about the Arca-Swiss attachment

Maybe I should clarify: I was wondering if people were still interested in my bipod mount since it uses picatinny rails, rather than the Arca-Swiss system that many chassis seem to be going towards (i.e. MPA chassis and the HRD arca rails for the AIAT and AIAX).

I don't have any plans to do an Arca bipod block replacement any time soon, though I can envision what it would look like if it ever came to that.

 

[texag0842]

Thanks for the clarification.

I had thought in my head you were tying an Arca-Swiss rail into the spigot.

Essentially something like the HRD rail.

 

[carnageasada]

View attachment 6885507View attachment 6885508

So in installing this, you just pushed out the two rolled metal dowels and the spigot assembly just slides out? Do the flush cups stay in place?

 

[samb300]

Thanks for the clarification.

I had thought in my head you were tying an Arca-Swiss rail into the spigot.

Essentially something like the HRD rail.

View attachment 6885621

The bipod block could be redesigned so that it had an Arca Swiss rail coming out of the front, rather than the picatinny rail. But I just don't know if it's worth the redesign other than the fact that the Arca rail could be moved up, much closer to the bottom of the rifle's barrel. When I originally designed the mount I considered making the picatinny section closer to the barrel, but decided against it because anyone running a Harris bipod with a Pod-Loc wouldn't be able to use it unless it was stupid-long like the Big Dog Steel spigot.

I had also originally considered having a swappable plate for picatinny, sling stud, or Arca mounts (much like the MPA chassis spigot mount) but decided I wanted a clean, one-piece mount that was aesthetically pleasing as well as functional.

 

[samb300]

So in installing this, you just pushed out the two rolled metal dowels and the spigot assembly just slides out? Do the flush cups stay in place?

Once you take the skins off, you have to remove the flush cups. They are actually threaded through the square-tube chassis into the bipod block, and are screwed in pretty damn tight (with thread locker) from the factory. Then when those are out you can drive out the two roll pins, and the bipod block will slide out.

 

[samb300]

Works with the factory night vision mount as well.

 

[samb300]

Some glamour shots

 

[Rmas308]

I'd totally pick one of these up

 

[samb300]

Alright, the whole Arca-Swiss conversation really stuck in my head. When I originally designed this a few years ago this was what my original concept was like, minus the integrated Arca rail.

This would provide ~3.5" of Arca rail, which is about 3/4" closer to the barrel than the current bipod block. It has two M-Lok slots, which would facilitate mounting a 7-slot picatinny rail if you wanted to run off a pic rail instead. The only downside (which largely drove my current design), is a Harris bipod with a pod-loc likely won't work because it will interfere with the AI forend. Let me know what you think! I may bounce this idea out there when I create a group buy thread, since I'm sure my machine shop can handle this design.

 

[texag0842]

I would be in for the Arca-swiss design.

I'd love it to tie into an Arca-Swiss rail on the stock as well but haven't figured that out.

 

[Laseredge]

No interest in Arca-Swiss at all. The Mloc is a great idea, but if I can’t mount and use an Atlas CAL, it won’t work for me.

 

[samb300]

No interest in Arca-Swiss at all. The Mloc is a great idea, but if I can’t mount and use an Atlas CAL, it won’t work for me.

I will have to look into the CAL, as well as a Harris with the Pod-Loc. I’m not sure what the clearance will need to be to work with a set-up like this, but I’m pretty sure the CAL will work if it’s moved all the way forward on the mount. The Pod-Loc lever just may be slightly obstructed by the forend.

 

[kRcu]

I will have to look into the CAL, as well as a Harris with the Pod-Loc. I’m not sure what the clearance will need to be to work with a set-up like this, but I’m pretty sure the CAL will work if it’s moved all the way forward on the mount. The Pod-Loc lever just may be slightly obstructed by the forend.

This is my only worry as well. From photos I’ve seen, the lever for the lock is farther down than I would thought, so it may have plenty of clearance.

 

[Ruggedtouch]

I will have to look into the CAL, as well as a Harris with the Pod-Loc. I’m not sure what the clearance will need to be to work with a set-up like this, but I’m pretty sure the CAL will work if it’s moved all the way forward on the mount. The Pod-Loc lever just may be slightly obstructed by the forend.

This looks like a winner. As was noted, moving the CAL forward on a pic rail mounted to the plate would appear to allow full function of the Pod-loc. I just spent time putting small strips of velcro tape on my spigot where it interfaces with the chassis to try and remove some of the slop.

I’m done with that.

I’m in for the Arca-Swiss.

 

[Aaros143]

I would like a regular pica tinny version if possible.

 

[Yerman]

I’m new to this arca-swiss rail concept. Where can I learn more about it and how would an Atlas bipod attach to it?

FWIW, I think your new design above looks great compared to the older version. I would like this more especially since it would bring the bipod up closer to the center of the bore. As long as I can mount my Atlas bi-pod.

 

[ballisticdaddy]

Maybe I should clarify: I was wondering if people were still interested in my bipod mount since it uses picatinny rails, rather than the Arca-Swiss system that many chassis seem to be going towards (i.e. MPA chassis and the HRD arca rails for the AIAT and AIAX).

I don't have any plans to do an Arca bipod block replacement any time soon, though I can envision what it would look like if it ever came to that.

I would like to get the picatinny version if you plan on making a run of these!

 

[Laseredge]

I would rather have the picatinny version too. For an AT.

 

[reewik]

Very nice looking product that can solve some problems for folks but I actually prefer the spigot mount myself. I guess I do not understand why people do not like it. Please explain to me how this concept is a better option? I just want to understand.

 

[kRcu]

Very nice looking product that can solve some problems for folks but I actually prefer the spigot mount myself. I guess I do not understand why people do not like it. Please explain to me how this concept is a better option? I just want to understand.

Sam’s spigot is pinned in place to the chassis vs the pin design that has some slop regardless of how tight you crank the knob.

I’d also be lying if I didn’t say Sam’s spigot is far more aesthetic. It rings my bell.

 

[reewik]

But his is no longer a spigot right? Rather an extended pic rail. I am in no way discounting the accessory, just trying to gain an understanding as to why this is better. What environment are we utilizing this accessory? Range work or field work?

 

[carnageasada]

I dig the design of the pic model, but I will say the Big Dog Steel spigot system is sound, no play and locks up like a vault to a total of ~4" forward of the stock. It is a pig though, but some might see that as a more stable platform through more mass in a ELR scenario.

 

[samb300]

Ok guys, sorry I haven't posted on this board for a while. I heard back from my machine shop, and they are gtg on the "original" picatinny-only mount, though at a small cost increase due to material prices. I haven't finalized the drawing of the Arca-Swiss version to send to them, but that's next on my list to do so I can get an idea of cost of that vs. the picatinny version.

I will post a link in this forum topic when I create a new group buy thread. I will need to get an idea of how many want the original picatinny version vs. the Arca-Swiss version.

 

[samb300]

I’m new to this arca-swiss rail concept. Where can I learn more about it and how would an Atlas bipod attach to it?

FWIW, I think your new design above looks great compared to the older version. I would like this more especially since it would bring the bipod up closer to the center of the bore. As long as I can mount my Atlas bi-pod.

The best place to see what the Arca-Swiss accessories are would be to check out the Really Right Stuff (RRS) SOAR accessories. http://soar.reallyrightstuff.com/soar-more/bipod-accessories

The Atlas bipod will definitely work with the Arca setup, and based on the numbers I received from another member, the Atlas-CAL should work as well. Only issue would be a Harris bipod with the Pod-Loc, that will only work with the original picatinny version of the mount.

 

[samb300]

But his is no longer a spigot right? Rather an extended pic rail. I am in no way discounting the accessory, just trying to gain an understanding as to why this is better. What environment are we con texting this. Range work or field work/

Correct. This replaces the entire "bipod block" that is inside of the square-tube forend of the AI chassis. On the AT, it is held in with two large roll-pins and two threaded flush cups. The mount I designed has zero wiggle, wobble, or movement when a bipod is attached. The B&T spigot adapter that goes into the factory bipod block is almost impossible to get the wiggle out of, which I why I went down the path of designing this part a few years ago.

The Arca-Swiss variant is more in keeping with the times for the accessories that people are running for competition. Using the Arca-Swiss adapter plate on a bipod allows you to quickly slide it forward and backward as the individual shooting scenario presents itself (assuming you have an MPA chassis or the bolt-on Arca-Swiss rail for the AT and AX systems).

More and more rifles, stocks, and chassis systems are integrating the Arca-Swiss rails into the forend. Whether or not this mounting system is here to stay and/or will replace picatinny completely is yet to be seen.

 

[Fig]

MPA makes a bunch of different adaptors to add pic rails, or Harris adaptors to their spigot/RAT system. If those are compatible you could mount just about anything you wanted. Not sure if it is with Acra-swiss.

They're not cheap though:
MPA Accessories

 

[samb300]

I dig the design of the pic model, but I will say the Big Dog Steel spigot system is sound, no play and locks up like a vault to a total of ~4" forward of the stock. It is a pig though, but some might see that as a more stable platform through more mass in a ELR scenario.

I don't know how much the Big Dog Steel mount weighs, but I do know that the BT19 spigot mount alone weighs 5.1oz, which I'm sure is a heck of a lot less than the Big Dog. My mount weighs 3oz less than the factory bipod block AND BT19 spigot combined, so I would bet it's a good 5-8oz less than the Big Dog setup.

 

[samb300]

MPA makes a bunch of different adaptors to add pic rails, or Harris adaptors to their spigot/RAT system. If those are compatible you could mount just about anything you wanted. Not sure if it is with Acra-swiss.

They're not cheap though:
MPA Accessories

Yes, MPA's "RAT" system is essentially a spec Arca-Swiss rail that runs the length of their chassis forend.

 

[carnageasada]

I don't know how much the Big Dog Steel mount weighs, but I do know that the BT19 spigot mount alone weighs 5.1oz, which I'm sure is a heck of a lot less than the Big Dog. My mount weighs 3oz less than the factory bipod block AND BT19 spigot combined, so I would bet it's a good 5-8oz less than the Big Dog setup.

View attachment 6888075

Oh it's substantial and you may be undershooting the delta, I'll bring it into work and weigh it, perhaps tomorrow... I'm interested in the pic model actually, but would need to know the cost prior.

 

[samb300]

Oh it's substantial and you may be undershooting the delta, I'll bring it into work and weigh it, perhaps tomorrow... I'm interested in the pic model actually, but would need to know the cost prior.

Cost of AE/AT picatinny mounts were $160 shipped (US only due to ITAR). With cost of material/machining going up slightly, price may go up $5-$10.

I'd definitely be interested in how much that Big Dog spigot weighs compared to the 5oz of the Atlas BT19/20 !

 

[carnageasada]

Cost of AE/AT picatinny mounts were $160 shipped (US only due to ITAR). With cost of material/machining going up slightly, price may go up $5-$10.

I'd definitely be interested in how much that Big Dog spigot weighs compared to the 5oz of the Atlas BT19/20 !

I'm happy to get that data for you and thanks for the costing info. Exactly how far does the pic rail extend forward?

 

[samb300]

I'm happy to get that data for you and thanks for the costing info. Exactly how far does the pic rail extend forward?

It is a 5-slot picatinny rail that extends approximately 2.9" from the front of the chassis.

The current design of the Arca-Swiss version extends approximately 3.8" from the front of the chassis.

 

[ballisticdaddy]

I'd definitely be interested in how much that Big Dog spigot weighs compared to the 5oz of the Atlas BT19/20 !

Just pulled mine off to weigh and coming in at 9.57 oz

 

[samb300]

Just pulled mine off to weigh and coming in at 9.57 oz

View attachment 6888299

That’s pretty chunky! Thanks for weighing it. Do you happen to know how long it sticks out when mounted in the spigot? And do you actually mount the bipod all the way at the end of it?

 

[ballisticdaddy]

That’s pretty chunky! Thanks for weighing it. Do you happen to know how long it sticks out when mounted in the spigot? And do you actually mount the bipod all the way at the end of it?

It extends 4.5" from the edge of the chassis and yes I mount my Seb Joypod bipod all the way at the end to help minimize muzzle jump and maintain site picture when shooting in LR matches