Ross Mk3 1910 action build- Who wants to help me spend some money!

[Blueoval56]

So I came across a unicorn yesterday. A Ross 1910 action, just the action, that looks like it has never had a barrel on it. The seller said he's had it in a box for 25 years and he got it from a friend when he passed away. He guesses that it's never been built into a rifle either. For an action around a 100 years old it looks like it's in incredible shape. The original colour case hardening is quite visible. The action has everything but the rear bridge and rear sight but the seller said he may have those as well, he just needs to search a bit.

I thought about just keeping it as a collector piece but I don't collect things that don't function so it's going to be built!

How would you build up an action like this?

I was thinking to build it kind of like an a pre-64 model 70 match rifle. Pick up an un-inletted Richards microfit marksmen stock in nice walnut, throw on a varmin-ish profile barrel, and add a Unertl type scope. I would also add a Lyman/ redfield front sight as the original rear peep sights are very accurate and adjustable.

Last would be to pick a chambering. I could go with the standard 303 British but I was thinking a special build deserves something a bit more exciting like maybe 303 Epps improved or a 30-303 Improved wildcat to take advantage of all the 30cal bullet choices over .311.

Pictures attached because photobucket is being garbage today.

 

[NukeMMC]

Please do yourself a favor and watch this video:
https://youtu.be/EaSui_UqDX8

The MkIII Ross (1910) while a very accurate and enjoyable rifle to shoot (my dad had one and a 1905 MkII) it has a design flaw that allows firing out of battery if the bolt is incorrectly assembled.

Get yourself very familiar with the rifle before shooting it and you'll be just fine.

Other than that ... nice score!!

 

[sirhrmechanic]

They were great rifles, but, yes, if the bolt was assembled wrong, it could become a rear-moving projectile. A few Canadians lost cheeks due to the fact that it was not private-proof.

By way of full disclosure, this was the invention of my crazy uncle Ross.... technically great-uncle Ross. Of the Westmount Rosses. Yes, due to the marriage of a crazy auntie, I am a somewhat indirect descendant of the clan... I have a couple of Ross Rifles, including one that came down through the family. And lots of Ross cousins.

Read McBride. He sings the praises of the Ross. They were the choice of British and Canadian snipers in WW1. But don't assemble it wrong! Crazy Uncle Ross designed a great rifle, but he never made it simple enough for every Snuffy Smith.

I REALLY look forward to seeing this build. The action was pretty darn good. And very strong. As I currently have a .416 Taylor, I have been a fan of the .416 Strauss. It's a wildcat based on the .303. Easily strong enough for the Ross action, which is best suited for rimmed cartridges. Also very suitable to build into a .45/70. My Ohio deer rifle is a .45/70 on a Lee Enfield and it is smooth as butter and a great, accurate rifle. A .45/70 on a Ross would be a sweet shooter.

Sooner or later, I'll have a nice Ross Sporter.... but ammo is a PITA.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

And if you do something like a varmint rifle, there is a .303/22 which is a pretty hot little cartridge, ballistically.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[Blueoval56]

I definitely appreciate the concerns gentleman, I should have mentioned that I already own 2 Ross 1910 rifles, one with a pinned bolt and one without. I am very aware about how to install the bolt correctly and incorrectly. That's why I was so excited to find this action for sale. I was going to rebuild one of my other ones but neither are in as good as shape as this one is.

i hadn't thought about a varmint rig, that could be fun!

It'll take a while to complete because I'm up in Canada and it takes forever to get stuff up here. I'm also very excited.

That's incredible that you have lineage to Ross himself, would love to see pics of your Ross rifles!

 

[Hairy Biker]

Fantastic find. Truly fantastic.

There are a few Ross rifles floating around Australia. Many from a South American Navy who got them after the Great War from Canada. Having shot alongside these, it is a fine competition rifle, but the 5 shot magazine hinders the rapid fire.

I also find the military one built for a shorter stature than we are today.

The 280 Ross case is fairly quote/unquote easily to covert a 6.5 x 68s to. A Bisley winner in its day - but I would not wish to have one in Flanders.

 

[sandwarrior]

Regarding the assembly issue,.Does anyone else know if this might also be an issue of the M95? As O understand from sirhr that the Ross is a near direct copy of the M95.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

I don't think it's a direct copy (or even a near direct copy...) but is certainly derived from it. Lots of differences as I understand it. But I've never taken the two apart side-by-side. It would be an interesting exercise to dismantle a Ross and a Mannlicher on the same bench. And compare the internals. I'll as my friend Martin Pegler about it. He might know as well.

If I remember the assembly right, you can put in a pin/detente/pall backwards in the bolt and the straight pull will not lock up. So the bolt will got with Newtons Law... in an equal and opposite reaction to the bullet.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[Hairy Biker]

Not the same. Like comparing the Ross to the Austrian straight pull.

 

[Just Macca]

My vote would be 7mm Rem Mag. Same bolt face, but the feed rails would require work. It would be like a hotter, more common and more affordable 280 ross.

 

[sandwarrior]

Not the same. Like comparing the Ross to the Austrian straight pull.

The M95 is the Austrian straight pull. Rudy Mannlicher designed it. I have one of those, obviously. I am not familiar with the Ross. Only that I heard it was a near direct copy. Which is why I asked the question. But, if they are different and the M95 doesn't have the same issue, that is good.

Added: To the OP: If you could find a bunch of British .303 Mk.VIII then I'd go with the .303. Otherwise consider some other options like a wildcat off the .303 or even 7.62x54R. Preferably in 7mm. Even 6.5 if you had a hankering. Great ballistics without proving how tough you are. And, not beating a rifle to death that may not be up to a hot-hot cartridge.

Save​

 

[Blueoval56]

My vote would be 7mm Rem Mag. Same bolt face, but the feed rails would require work. It would be like a hotter, more common and more affordable 280 ross.

I would love to build a magnumn out of it but I would have to go to a different bottom metal as the mag box is too short. The factory sporters had a different bottom metal that could accommodatethe longer 280 Ross.

 

[Blueoval56]

The M95 is the Austrian straight pull. Rudy Mannlicher designed it. I have one of those, obviously. I am not familiar with the Ross. Only that I heard it was a near direct copy. Which is why I asked the question. But, if they are different and the M95 doesn't have the same issue, that is good.

Added: To the OP: If you could find a bunch of British .303 Mk.VIII then I'd go with the .303. Otherwise consider some other options like a wildcat off the .303 or even 7.62x54R. Preferably in 7mm. Even 6.5 if you had a hankering. Great ballistics without proving how tough you are. And, not beating a rifle to death that may not be up to a hot-hot cartridge.

Save​

I keep coming back to 6.5 Epps as the chambering which is basically a 6.5-303 Improved with the shoulder moved forward and steepened to 35 degrees. A 7mm would be really neat but there is already reamers and dies available for 6.5 Epps which would keep costs down a small amount. I hadn't thought about using 7.62x54R brass, I'll look into that more.

I also have a Steyr M95, I'll have to look at it a bit closer to see how close they are. I've never taken it apart before as I don't shoot it. It hangs on the wall at my parents place.

 

[Foul Mike]

I think I would go with 6.5 whatever. Nice bullets.

 

[Forgetful Coyote]

Sweet! Keep us posted sir. 6.5 or .30-303 Improved sound cool. According to Mcbride these were the most accurate rifles on the line at Camp Perry during that time... though could that maybe been cause they were running the .280 with its hotter ballistics? Not sure what the rules were like back then..

 

[Blueoval56]

Sweet! Keep us posted sir. 6.5 or .30-303 Improved sound cool. According to Mcbride these were the most accurate rifles on the line at Camp Perry during that time... though could that maybe been cause they were running the .280 with its hotter ballistics? Not sure what the rules were like back then..

They were definitely written about being very accurate at the time. I have also read that the MkIII was the strongest action made until the weatherby Mark 5 was made. Can't recall the name right now, but there was a guy who filled a 280 Ross case with pistol powder in an attempt to blow up the action and he couldn't get it to blow.

I think the Ross actions are fascinating pieces of engineering considering when they were made.

 

[Hairy Biker]

Page 81 of my McBride says he was issued a Ross rifle - one of the lot made for and used by the members of the Canadian Palma Team at Camp Perry in 1913. .... They were accurate and dependable with the Mark VII ammunition. (Ch 6)

So 303 not 280 Ross.

 

[Hairy Biker]

Also, from a 2001 article in Guns Australia, the British Commandant of the Small Arms School at Hythe summed up the military opinion in his 1910 report on the MkII**: "It seems clear that this rifle is designed as a target rifle pure and simple, without regard to the requirements of active service or the training of large bodies of men of average attainment."

The 280 Ross performed very well at Bisley in the special 280 Match Target rifle. It won in 1908 (prize handed back because the barrel was overweight), 1911 and 1913 Kings Prizes. It placed solidly in 1912. Perhaps the most accurate military style rifle ever made.

 

[ZG47A]

I have a friend who has built a .303 Epps on an unissued Mk 4 action. He has set it up as single shot target rifle and also had a couple of hunting rifles converted to that chambering. If you decide to go that way, send me a PM and I may be able to get you some pointers.

 

[sandwarrior]

I keep coming back to 6.5 Epps as the chambering which is basically a 6.5-303 Improved with the shoulder moved forward and steepened to 35 degrees. A 7mm would be really neat but there is already reamers and dies available for 6.5 Epps which would keep costs down a small amount. I hadn't thought about using 7.62x54R brass, I'll look into that more.

I also have a Steyr M95, I'll have to look at it a bit closer to see how close they are. I've never taken it apart before as I don't shoot it. It hangs on the wall at my parents place.

I shot my M95 a fair amount until it went into storage in N. Idaho with the rest of my stuff moving down to take the job in St. George. For Accuracy, it was terrible. A good group was 8" with mil ball. With Hornady 205's that improved to 5". But, it was fun.

 

[RFKITCH29]

Great minds must think alike. I'm going to do something similar. Going to use a Ross action, but thinking 7 wsm (due to bolt face di.) on a fiberglass stock. Will have to do something creative with the magazine/bottom metal. I measured one of my Ross's and my Remington Long action and the action screw spacing looks pretty close, so might be able to modify an old take off stock. I'm also in Canada (Edmonton area). We'll have to compare notes.

 

[Blueoval56]

I have a friend who has built a .303 Epps on an unissued Mk 4 action. He has set it up as single shot target rifle and also had a couple of hunting rifles converted to that chambering. If you decide to go that way, send me a PM and I may be able to get you some pointers.

I definitely will! Any information is always helpful

 

[Blueoval56]

Great minds must think alike. I'm going to do something similar. Going to use a Ross action, but thinking 7 wsm (due to bolt face di.) on a fiberglass stock. Will have to do something creative with the magazine/bottom metal. I measured one of my Ross's and my Remington Long action and the action screw spacing looks pretty close, so might be able to modify an old take off stock. I'm also in Canada (Edmonton area). We'll have to compare notes.

Excellent! That sounds like a great build, something a little more modern. I would love to hear if a Remington take-off stock would kind of work. I'm just south of Calgary, so pretty close!

 

[TorF]

1952 Olympic gold medal winner, 100m running deer event, John H Larsen with his custom Ross rifle in 6.5X55.

Video: "Running Deer Doubles" that clearly show why many used straight pull rifles in the old days. Rifle in video is the slickest bolt ever: Husqvarna 1900 Sporter cal. 222 rem.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

BTW, for any of you Canuckians... who want stuff with minimal paperwork... I go to Canada every few weeks. I'm only 40 miles from the border. We go up there to see movies that don't show up here in the sticks.

So if you ever want stuff shipped to the U.S. and remailed from Canuckianland just north of me to somewhere right to near you.... let me know. Glad to help. Can't help with weapons. But barrels, rings, stocks, metal... anything I can carry North with a straight face and say "No Weapons".... glad to help you out with. It's legal... and simple. Just 'sayin.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[buffalowinter]

My Ross 10E sporting rifle, in .303

 

[sirhrmechanic]

As always, Rick....

Gorgeous!

I do want a Ross Sporter at some point. Right now, I have two. One from family. One ex-US military with lots of cool stock stamps. Ex Ord rifle, tested and let go, from what I can figure.

The sporters were incredible rifles. To put in modern terms... like Weatherby in the day.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[Blueoval56]

My Ross 10E sporting rifle, in .303

That's magnificent! I let one like that, minus scope, slip though my fingers a couple weeks ago.
I plan on building similar to this but with a heavier barrel and more of a target stock.

 

[TorF]

Necro thread but:
There is a Ross mk3 in 303 British cheap for sale in my area, where they are rare.
The rifle has been bubbad so;
What do you think of converting it to 6.5PRC? Is the action strong enough?
If I survive, literally, a visit to the hospital in April, this could be a fun project.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Action is plenty strong. The weakness was that if assembled wrong, the bolt would not lock and would take out your face… oops.

Crazy uncle Ross was one of my ancestors. I love his rifles. If they were used right they were amazing. See “A Rifleman Went To War”

Actions are amazingly rugged!

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

And hope your hospital visit is not as serious as that! You are in the .001 percent of great folks here! Get well!!!

Sirhr

 

[ArmedGinger]

I've owned a couple Ross rifles, both military an civilian with one even being chambered in 300 win mag. Great rifles.

As for the bolt problem, it's only if you don't know what you're doing and disassemble the bolt and reassemble it incorrectly. Just pay attention and don't reassemble your bolt while you're distracted.

 

[Blueoval56]

Interesting that this thread got revived! I still have the the action but the build got put on hold for a while. I have a 6.5 barrel, just trying to find an importer for Richard’s microfit stocks and a smith who will inlet it. I don’t think I’m talented enough to take on that project. Then it will get topped with an external mount type scope on target blocks.
Might actually see this project come alive this year.