Advanced Marksmanship Rucksack as a rifle rest

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CoryT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A properly used loop sling will certainly produce nice groups. However, for the most part, groups do not matter to a sniper. Sniping is much more about shooting one shot ten times than shooting ten shots once. Once uses the group to zero the rifle and as a test of the rifle/shooters general performance. The consistency I want is the abiity to get behind the rifle and place one shot within 1/2 moa of the POI, NO MATTER WHAT that position might look like.

While shooting a small group is gratifying, the difference between shooting a 1 MOA group at 800 and a 1/2 MOA group at 800 only means the one bullet I shoot at the bad guy will potentially be 2 inches closer to the POA. That might cause a miss 1 in 100 shots. Would I rather shoot a 1/2 MOA group? Sure. But if that's what I need then I need to do it from whatever crappy made-up position in which I find myself on the battlefield, not slung up on an NRA square range.

I do not mean to disparage the accomplishments of you or any other High Power match shooters. It's just a different game, which requires different tools. While much of the skill set transfers, and I encourage my sniper students to shoot matches, it's just not the same thing.</div></div>

Well, in fact, all shooting is the same-the bullet will always go in the direction the gun is pointed. The proper use of the sling, over other field expedient supports, better assures, whether shooting one round, or many, that the shooter's aim, and where the gun is pointed at bullet exit, is more consistent. Obviously, if a shooter does not have the opportunity to use a loop sling, within the constraints of an appliction, makes the discussion about using it moot. In other words, ya shoot what ya brung with what support is handy.

 

[Arcangel8654]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Cory...you just constanty run you mouth spouting bullshit that you have no real knowledge or experience about to people you have no idea who they are or what they do..You should just shut the fuck up out of respect for the good name of the Col. and stuff more twinkies in your mouth.
"my sniper students" please

 

[teknikallysekure]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

N/M I figured it out.

 

[Tactical]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

I wont get into the name contest here but no doubt a properly hooked up tight sling holds shots tight as hell, but never saw a man lay with tight sling for three or four hours before a command fire shot on bag guy. Just too hard to do.

I make slings but have a bipod on my rifle for good reason. It works very well. I have a sling on my rifle for very good reasons. It works very well when I cant do the bipod thing. Speed and terrain dictates what I use.

I believe the thing to remember here is everything has its place.

Learn to use it all and apply as needed.

Now I see two good guys arguing over the color of the walls, so to speak.

F It go shoot.

 

[Arch]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

I just added a bipod to my rucksack, which already had a good TIS sling on it.

 

[CoryT]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Archangle, since you only seem to complain about what others say with noting to add yourself, I'd sugguest you stuff your own twinkies.

I had three Marine Scout/Snipers from the schoohouse at Pendelton in my last class just two weeks ago, should I let them know you don't consider them snipers since they were in one of my classes?

I knew Jeff quite well, I have an E ticket in riflecraft from him. He choose to invite me to the Provost class and signed my instructor card.

Having now gotten well off-topic, I shall now ignore you for the rest of my life, I've wasted too much time on you as it is.

 

[CoryT]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

OK, back on topic.

SS said >>The proper use of the sling, over other field expedient supports, better assures, whether shooting one round, or many, that the shooter's aim, and where the gun is pointed at bullet exit, is more consistent.

I would question that assertion based on a couple of points.

1. Were that so, why would any other support other that the sling be banned from use in many rifle competitions, such as High Power Match?

2. Why would competitors in formats where they are not banned choose to use a bipod rather than the 'superior' sling?

A last thought occurs, how did Benchrest even get started?

I don't deny that a skilled shooter in a slung position can shoot better that a less skilled shooter does off a bipod. It's the skill, not the sling, that makes the difference.

I still maintain that snipers, in general, have little practical use for a shooting sling. Big game hunters, on the other hand, are better served with a good sling than any other single item, including a telescopic sight.

 

[Arch]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Paraphrasing from the good book, “To everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose under heaven"

a time to shoot sling
a time for steel ring
a time to shoot ruck
a time for minute of duck
a time for the bipod
a time to head nod
a time to stand up
a time sit down

a...time...not...to...waste arguing apples are oranges.

 

[Tactical]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

"I still maintain that snipers, in general, have little practical use for a shooting sling." CoryT said

Cory, arch said "a time for" but he left out a time to admit you are wrong or dont have enough experience to see through the trees. I thought far higher of you before that less than brilliant statement.

Come on out and I will teach you when a sniper needs a sling. Get off that square range and be prepared to build FFPs and also shoot right the hell now with what ever you can to keep from suffering small hole disease. Arch has spent more than a few minutes hoping he gave small hole disease before someone infected him so he understands the use.

I am done with this. My offer stands. You want to learn come on out. You want to spew that crap and many will keep shaking head and wonder how much thought you placed into this?.

 

[Arcangel8654]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CoryT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Archangle, since you only seem to complain about what others say with noting to add yourself, I'd sugguest you stuff your own twinkies.

I had three Marine Scout/Snipers from the schoohouse at Pendelton in my last class just two weeks ago, should I let them know you don't consider them snipers since they were in one of my classes?

I knew Jeff quite well, I have an E ticket in riflecraft from him. He choose to invite me to the Provost class and signed my instructor card.

Having now gotten well off-topic, I shall now ignore you for the rest of my life, I've wasted too much time on you as it is. </div></div>



Listen dickbrain they aint "your" sniper students..thay are snipers who are attending your class like many other classses around the globe...some exceptional classes and some are down right gay..for example a Marine from MARSOC 2ndSOB and a SOTIC instructor among a couple other soldiers attended a class on the east coast a few weeks ago and the class was considered a fucking joke and a waste of govt money..get it? probly not.
Col. Cooper was a great man but he did spend a lot of time on the bottle..even more than me I believe..So obviously he must have been drunk when he signed off for a fucking retard. And ive fucked some ugly pigs that i regret from being drunk.
Lastly as far as stuffing a twinkie..I could stuff your fucking twinkie and there wouldnt be a god damn thing you could do about it you fucking poser bitch..

 

[Force_Multiplier]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Can't we all just get along?

 

[skirmishline]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Preferences for the prone:

1) Rucksack support if time and situation permits setting up (for SWAT it often does);

2) Hawkins (fist) rest when the terrain is right for it;

3) Olympic prone (slung up) when I can't use the Hawkins.

In reference to some of the interservice rivalry here:

The truth is, this former Army paratrooper learned to use a shooting sling and Olympic prone by reading Jeff Cooper and Jim Owens, both former Marines; the Army taught me a lot of good things in four years, they just didn't teach me that.

The USMC prides itself on every Marine a rifleman. The Army has some truly exeptional riflemen - as good as any Marine anywhere - but it's more of a closed society, at least from what I could tell, and the skills and mindset certainly don't extend to every soldier.

The average soldier (and for that matter, the instructors on the ranges at Army basic training posts) aren't anywhere near the skill level of the Army Marksmanship Unit at Ft. Benning. And I didn't see an Army-wide rifle culture that inspired them to be.

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

If you guys want to discuss the use of shooting slings, then this topic might be more benefical...

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...5681#Post755681

 

[j-huskey]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Sling, Ruck, Shooting Sticks, Rope, Rock, Tree, Partner, dead body, who gives a shit, use what helps make the shot when it counts. Don't paint yourself into a corner with "my ruck; sling; (fill in the blank); is better than your dick" bullshit.

There is no one size fits all in the real world.

Its the top section of the loose nut between the seat and steering wheel that matters most in all this.

 

[Tactical]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

The thing that kepes me wondering is why anyone would limit themself by not learning a very useful skill set?

Its the only ""Hey I only fight from this position" crap

You end up being a boxer in the Ultimate Fighting Championship. Very pretty style but dead as a door nail

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skirmishline</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The average soldier (and for that matter, the instructors on the ranges at Army basic training posts) aren't anywhere near the skill level of the Army Marksmanship Unit at Ft. Benning. And I didn't see an Army-wide rifle culture that inspired them to be. </div></div>

Yeah, I wish that was the opposite.

You'd be surprised how many anti-gun nuts are in the Army, that and the lack of love for rifle marksmanship makes me want to join the Marine Corps sometimes.

 

[ubet]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tactical</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The thing that kepes me wondering is why anyone would limit themself by not learning a very useful skill set?

Its the only ""Hey I only fight from this position" crap

You end up being a boxer in the Ultimate Fighting Championship. Very pretty style but dead as a door nail </div></div>

Not to hijack this thread, but for me personally, no one to teach me, and i dont want to form bad habits just to have to unlearn them. Cant say for sure but i bet it is a lot the same for a lot of guys. Would love to be taught to sling up and use it properly just no one to learn from.
Ubet

 

[Tactical]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Ubet, its simple to learn how. Just pay some money and go to school at Rifles Only or come out here and I will teach you. Or the simplest way is to drag yourself down to any High Power Across the course or Palma Club. Just ask them to let you shoot and teach you.

 

[NaHa]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Um, how about books and DVDs? Jim Owens is one author/teacher who comes to mind. You can find a lot of this sort of stuff from Champion's Choice, out of Lavergne, TN if I recall. They have a catalogue with tons of neat products. Google for them. A little initiative to learn goes a long way, friend.

 

[LSandBinc]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

SS, How tight do you sling up with a bolt gun? When I sling up for shooting NM I sling up tight enough that I get black and blue marks on my shoulder even through my creedmore coat, is it nessesary to be that tight with the bolt gun? I've also used both sling and ruck resting my left hand and forearm on the ruck after slinging up, but it takes some getting used to, my personel opionion is it helps for the split second that it takes for the bullett to leave the barrel.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Shooting a bolt gun in the prone loop sling supported position, I want to get the sling adjusted to allow for both comfort and steadiness.
Comfort is an important concept. When my sling, stock, and hand-stop are adjusted properly, my position is vise-like; plus, I can rebuild it to perfection for every shot. I did not develop this sort of skill overnight. In fact, even learning how to use the sling from experts, I didn't know a properly adjusted sling from one not correctly adjusted until I had explored all of the possibilities with it, within the constraints of the position.

Today, I've found that teaching the use of the sling can be very frustrating, not only for me, but for the student too. I don't know what the student is feeling, and the student doesn't know what things are supposed to feel like.

 

[ubet]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tactical</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ubet, its simple to learn how. Just pay some money and go to school at Rifles Only or come out here and I will teach you. Or the simplest way is to drag yourself down to any High Power Across the course or Palma Club. Just ask them to let you shoot and teach you. </div></div>

would the nor cal range in sac be a good place to go to learn and ask for help?

Nate haler, i will look into that. It is tough for me to learn from reading and dvds but i will look into it.

Thanks
ubet

 

[Tactical]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Sac Range has some of best sling shooters in the world.

Get enough guys together and I will do half day demo up there with my slings, no cost unless you purchase a sling. Or just meet me there and I will teach you how no charge

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Tell ya what, I'll be at the Knob Creek Range out of Louisville on Wednesday October 01. Any who want, PM me if you're gonna be in the area; and, I'll show you how to do it.

 

[wksinatl]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<span style="font-weight: bold">T. said:
Get enough guys together and I will do half day demo up there with my slings, no cost unless you purchase a sling. Or just meet me there and I will teach you how no charge

SS said:
Tell ya what, I'll be at the Knob Creek Range out of Louisville on Wednesday October 01. Any who want, PM me if you're gonna be in the area; and, I'll show you how to do it.</span>

How could you get a better offer than that???

Keith

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tell ya what, I'll be at the Knob Creek Range out of Louisville on Wednesday October 01. Any who want, PM me if you're gonna be in the area; and, I'll show you how to do it. </div></div>

Free Training!!! LOL!

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

I wouldn't describe it as free training, just a helping hand for any trying to learn proper use of the loop sling. I don't understand, however, why such an offer would bring about a LOL response. What's funny about it?

 

[ArmaHeavy]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

It was as a differnt way of saying "Dog Pile."

 

[Daniel Barham]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Shooting at ASC and in all the different positions and on all the different terrain, I shot sling, bipod, and rucksack styles.
Whatever gave me the best shooting platform for that place for that shot. I need to learn more about slung up shooting, but the practice I did prior with the sling helped. And having a good sling (thanks Tactical). I found a few positons I couldn't get a steady comfortable postion with using the bipod, I used the ruck.
Same with the sling. Learn to use em all.

 

[19818119]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

The importance or need for a sling is related to how steady one can hold a rifle with or without said sling. In other words the weaker you are or the heavier your rifle the more important a sling becomes. Accurate shooting requires problem solving abilities and tools. A sling is one such tool. A good sling properly utilized is just one more sting to your bow... so to speak. The rest is semantics and bullshit.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rath</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Accurate shooting requires problem solving abilities and tools. A sling is one such tool. A good sling properly utilized is just one more sting to your bow... so to speak. The rest is semantics and bullshit.

</div></div>

I agree, a shooter's quest for marksmanship excellence comes down to shooter/target analysis.

 

[rijndael]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Slug</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooting at ASC and in all the different positions and on all the different terrain, I shot sling, bipod, and rucksack styles.</div></div>

And a few times, I used both a bipod and rucksack!

 

[mdmp5]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ratbert</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Every time I see pics of someone shooting off a ruck they always have a nice, full, puffy pack. Whenever I load up a pack for shooting it's full of ammo boxes, spotting scope, tripod, water bottles, etc. This does not produce a nice plump pack off of which to shoot. If I actually need to USE (which IS actually why you pack it, right?) any of this stuff then it's even worse. Maybe I'll toss a rain jacket in there but that's hardly enough to fill out even a small ruck.

So do you guys stuff your packs with extra socks just so it will be nice and plump or what? </div></div>

I stuff a pillow in my Eagle pack.

 

[PopSmoke]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

FYI, Blackhawk makes a bag-rest that has a molle-style mount. Called S.T.R.I.K.E. sniper rest. Here's one on opticsplanet.
http://www.opticsplanet.net/blackhawk-s-t-r-i-k-e-sniper-rest-38cl89.html

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stickboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does anyone have pics of how to use a rucksack as a proper rifle rest? I would like to try something other than a bipod.

Thanks </div></div>

 

[300snipe]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Well said LowCrawl. While I'm new to LR shooting I've got many years of racing and sport bike riding under my belt - it just kills me to see kids at the dealership buying new 600/1000R bikes and walking away with the cheapest helmet they can get, the same tennis shoes they walked in with, and a t-shirt - not caring about anything other than thinking they look badass now that they have a crotch rocket. You want to go over and slap them and buy them a leather jacket and some other armor but they'll learn one way or another.

Similarly with going to the range you see people doing all kinds of nonsense and I'm probably guilty of some mistakes as well but I'm here to read and learn as much as possible about the sport. I think the OP is too.

I think with most sports and hobbies it comes down to respect and expectation: you need to expect that learning and advancing your skills takes time and the only way to do that is to respect the knowledge of people that know more than you do and be open to advice and constructive criticism.

In addition, it would be nice to see people that are skilled and experienced not always look down on newbies (although I've definitely been guilty of this at one time or another in different sports) - we've all been there at one time so asking questions about shooting from a bag isn't a bad thing and doesn't necessarily mean the OP doesn't want to be a good shooter. I'd imagine he's asking for advice and the response that slings are better is definitely a good response. Personally I don't know because I've only used slings for carrying my hunting rifle around in the woods, but now I know better thanks to some of these posts.

Anyone have have a good link to how to use a sling and what sling is best?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LowCrawl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I only see the 50 cal as needing a bipod. Using a bipod I see one definite arrangement that needs to done. If it is spring hinged the bipod needs to be having the springs be part of the rifle recoil which in other words is the bipod needs to be collapsing to the front when the legs are stowed. If it isn't then during recoil you'l get uneven jump. You'll still get uneven jump when it collapses forward but not as bad.

Shooting off the ruck you have wrestling to be done with the bag till things are right and getting the same lay for repetitiveness in a real word encounter is wild odds. Last I knew the guys hired to grow opium, refine it into heroin, and transport are patient as heck so that's a plus for using a ruck in Afgahnistan. Of course its a different story in Iraq. Those boys are interested in quick and violent payback is a bitch.

But back to why not use a sling. Below are a couple of just read a book style of links. We all know it isn't just reading and takes years to get there...(where Tubbs and many others are). For some using a scope compaired to iron sights is scoped guys blowing off iron site guys as kids. Competition iron site guys are hitting 1000 all the time using a sling. Some how we can all figure starting at the top fguring a scope is going to get you there is a wrong assumption I'd hope. You aint going to ride a killer GSX-R1000 and split cars going 180 with out spending year after year riding. I kind of see shooting the same. Get the basics right, have a real feel for the different rifles and know how they are going to torque out when hitting max power curve. The rifle and bike have to be layed in right. A heavy barrel is a plus for guys with some slop in their shooting and gives some the idea that the heavy barrel is going to take care of everything and just lay that rifle on top of something. I see that concept as totally wrong. You can get a lot better performance from any rifle slinging up the right way. One of these days I'll quit being a little helpful and skip comments like many other times or just make simple comments for corective actions which is like telling a bank robber he dropped some cash exiting the bank. Some gus don't even realise there are days they can go out shooting and its just the wrong day for their body to be shooting. I'm going to say this for the last time online. If you are going to be wanting to be shooting good YOU have got to not just think about shooing but practice your position at home or where ever before going out shooting. This means 2 weeks or more of getting into position practicing hold for being on taget when relaxed and not coming off target and a whole slew of things. Not just slam away. Your bones and muscle memory have to be there and practiced to not screw the shots up. Shoot right. Shooting isn't simple. I remember a few years back Sterling talking about countless hours he had spent in his back yard laying there practicing for his improvement and upcoming competitions. He probably still does from time to time to keep from loosing his edge. You have to. Slinging lead alone doesn't get a guy results. A sling is going to get a rifle so locked in on a target it is sickening. It's not the sling that makes him an ace shot, its his practice too. Having the glass or iron on a target isn't going to make a long shot if the weapon and shooter aren't set up right. blahblah blah. Good luck.

Basic shooting
Tubbs

PS don't pay attention to me. I volunteered for the last afghanistan deployment. It's way better to lay behind a ruck in america.

I think I have PTSD (post thread stress distarctions) now. </div></div>

 

[keithtb1]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

And this is why I love this site! Someone asks for a suggestions, which turns into a war of words, beatings, and ends up with some of the Top people giving great advice and free lessons! Just to add my 2 cents; most of us train from the prone on a bipod at all kinds of distances and then a call goes out and probably 70% of the time you never end up in that position due to obstructions not allowing us to shoot that way. A ruck will help give a little more height but not by much. Started training with a primos trigger stick tripod and have been very impressed with how well it works. I would be very comfortable taking a head shot with one of these at the distances we are set up for, and they are not very expensive.
A few years back we had one of our snipers have to take a shot from one balcony of a building to an adjoining building and he had to drag over a TV stand and prop up on that. Needless to say not the most steady of shots. Luckily he had that available, all the while this nutcase was firing down at everybody and ended up firing about 450 rounds before he was put down. Having these adjustable tripods makes a nice addition to anyones bag of tricks, and they fit right in the dragbag. I'm sure many a hunter here has used them as well.

 

[300snipe]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

I haven't used the primos trigger stick tripod but I have a Harris 26" one that works pretty well for higher shots - definitely not as stable as a 9" or 13" one but good for getting the gun up when you're lacking a tv stand

 

[sniperdude]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

OK there is a lot of good posts on this one. I have recently switched from a bipod as a primary rest to my pack. For me I have noticed more consistant groups. For me a bipod even with rubber feet on concrete can still cause poi shift (not too much but enough for me to get angry at the accuracy gods).

Now for the pack, I have an eagle becker patrol pack (blackhawk makes a similar called "patrol pack"). Its pretty much a square (rectangular) bodied pack, on the exterior there are 6 different pouches. They are on the pack in a way that you can rest the rifle horizontally or vertically (as relates to the pack). I have a small section about 6"long a piece of 4" diameter pvc pipe cut in half longways and some foam glued in the inner part where the forend of the stock will rest. I sized it so it will fit in the larger pouches. I have slid some kydex type plastic in the sides of the pack, which keeps it rigid and doesnt take up space or weight.

This gives me a rest off my pack while still able to use the contents inside if needed. I seem to like it better than an ad on sniper rifle rest. But everybody is different and might find another method more comfy for them.

whew!

 

[deltaghost]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

pics? I am thinking of doing something similar as a bipod is not really suited for my type of shooting.

 

[sniperdude]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

as soon as i can figure how to get some pics on here i am.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deltaghost</div><div class="ubbcode-body">pics? I am thinking of doing something similar as a bipod is not really suited for my type of shooting. </div></div>

 

[SFC Carpentier jr]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Here is a rest I picked up from Voodo Tactical. I have it attached to my Camelbak pack.

 

[Chiller]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

Nice...just dont like ACU...

 

[deltaghost]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

look forward to it! Hope to order mine soon!

 

[hideanywhere]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

As I am new here, I am glad the OP asked the question, as this now gives me something else to think about. Me being me, I will now end up trying shooting off a ruck/pack of some sorts. Not because I want to prove anybody right or wrong, but because I want the experience for myself. I don't want to be that guy who may get asked this question in the future who comes back with, "well, so and so, said this". I want to be that guy who says, "in my experience, this is what has happened". Then encourage them to try it on their own. If done in practice/training all that is lost is a few extra $$$ spent on ammo and a couple hours of valuable experience. Better than finding out in competition/combat where more is obviously at stake.

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

i prefer the bipod in front, with the ruck and rifle guides attached for rear support.

if your already in an ambush position, you've already spent the time waiting. why not spend that time setting up the bipod, which is a more stable platform, properly to where the target is anticipated.

if taking a quick shot, the sling adds some support, however deploying a bipod, again a more stable platform, only takes a few seconds, and usually much less than setting up a ruck.

even if setting up the ruck, the amount of time and movement getting the rifle stable after the pack decompresses the air and anything that may be collapsible / moveable in it is clearly overpowered by the use of a bipod.

a ruck is better than nothing, but IMHO doesn't beat the practical use of a bipod. all methods - sling, bipod, and ruck, should be practiced anyway, singularly and in concert with each other.

 

[Quickoz]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

I have used Bipods, slings and packs. I have a TIS sling on my rifle which is awesome, nearly as good as my single point Fullbore sling but they are built for different purposes. I used to shoot of a bipod as I thought it was better, but after attending a long range shooting class where we engaged targets out to 1200m, I switched to a pack for my front/primary support.

Why? first, I find this far easier to use and more consistant then a bipod as I shoot of amny different surfaces and while on this course, I was taught that a bipod will have POI shift for every different surface you shoot off, being grass, concrete, gravel, sand, etc. I do agree with Cory T with feeling like you ahve to constantly adjust when shooting of a bipod, I can relate as I used to have to do it a whole lot and my accuracy suffered. A pack to me is a more consistant rest in this respect and I do shoot much better and I get far more comfy behgind my rifle and shoot better. Now I dont have a 400 dollar Atlas bipod to use as much as I would like one due cost and other reasons. It is easier to load up then the Harris non-swivel I used to use and I can see where it would be useful. But, a pack suits me much better.

This works for me but may not work for everyone, That I will admit. I dont have endless amounts of cash for new and improved kit so I make do. I try to juggle flying and riding aswell as my shooting. To decide weather to get a new piece of kit compared to doing the 100hrly on my plane is a toss up at times.

My opinion may not carry much weight but im a relative newbie to this shooting and this works for me and where I shoot.

 

[shaggs]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

great discussion although i think the only people that answered his question as posted were Triad and SFC Carpentier Jr. lol

 

[j-huskey]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOP PREDATOR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i prefer the bipod in front, with the ruck and rifle guides attached for rear support.

if your already in an ambush position, you've already spent the time waiting. why not spend that time setting up the bipod, which is a more stable platform, properly to where the target is anticipated.

if taking a quick shot, the sling adds some support, however deploying a bipod, again a more stable platform, only takes a few seconds, and usually much less than setting up a ruck.

even if setting up the ruck, the amount of time and movement getting the rifle stable after the pack decompresses the air and anything that may be collapsible / moveable in it is clearly overpowered by the use of a bipod.

a ruck is better than nothing, but IMHO doesn't beat the practical use of a bipod. all methods - sling, bipod, and ruck, should be practiced anyway, singularly and in concert with each other. </div></div>

I recently shot a 375 Cheytac and a little before that, a 50 cal off a mountain side.
Where we shot, and we had plenty of time to set up, the bipod sucked. In this case, it definitely was NOT the most stable option. Big rocks and really loose dirt are not bipod friendly.
The ruck (Eagle Becker pack with several outside pockets that DO hold the rifle in place) would have been much better. (sorry, no pictures for the OP)
And I screwed up that shoot. If I had had my head out of my ass, I would have done what I knew to do. Which is to carry several sand bags (empty), and when you have the time, fill them, and build a position that beats both the bipod and ruck.
When done, empty the sand bags, roll them up, pack them up, and move out.
Or if really desperate, dump the ruck, fill it with dirt, and make it a big sand bag (Yes I have), then later, dump the dirt, jam everything back in a real mess and move out.

Another option for me there would have been to put the ruck on the ground, let the folded up bipod legs anchor the front of the rifle to the ruck, and have used the tripod on the back of the stock to get the angle. Again, my error.

"all methods - sling, bipod, and ruck, should be practiced anyway, singularly and in concert with each other." 100% agree with this.

 

[kraigWY]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rucksack as a rifle rest</div></div>

And take the chance of a bandit shooting my "peaches or pound cake"????? No Way in Hell.

 

[mgd45]

Re: Rucksack as a rifle rest

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CoryT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I can't agree that the sling is in any way "superior" to any other type of artificial support. It can perhaps deliver equal results, but it's not "superior" if equal skill in employing other support is used.

The loop sling provides good support in any position where the support side elbow can be rested under the gun. The hasty sling provides little, if any, actual support, but it does keep the sling from swayin</div></div>

The loop sling is superior to other artifical supports, for a mulitude of reasons. If you don't understand this then you don't know how to use one. </div></div>

When I attended my LE Sniper school, I was the only guy who showed up with a sling on my rifle. I used an old 1907 leather sling & I actually had a few guys laugh at me because it looked so funny......it was an old tan colored sling attached to my black colored rifle.....

Needless to say, after several days of shooting in different positions where a bi-pod wasn't working for them & they saw how effective my sling was helping me, half the class showed up by the 4th day with cheap Walmart slings......LOL!