Ruger 10/22: Tweak or New Barrel?

[rg1911]

I was going to start participating in a monthly rimfire match, so I dusted off my rifle and tested 7 samples of .22LR ammo (ranging from Wolf Target to Federal Match to Eley Match Pistol). Under good conditions, the best 5-shot group at 50 yards off a rest was 2 inches. Since the targets go out to 200 yards, I need to get groups down to one-half inch.

I did fire fouling rounds with each different sample before firing for group.

Setup:

- Fajen laminated thumbhole stock.
- Barrel bedded at rear; action free-floated.
- Green Mountain heavy barrel (.920).

The trigger had been tweaked and, for the first time, I experienced several failures to fire, including with the Eley Match Pistol. I've ordered a replacement spring set.

The question, then, is: Can the current setup be tweaked to get the accuracy I need, or do I need to get a better barrel, such as a Kidd?

One suggestion was to bed the entire barrel. Of course, if the barrel is a major contributor to the problem, bedding the entire length probably won't cut the group size enough.

I suspect someone will say I need to buy a bolt-action target rifle, but that's not in the budget.

Thank you,
Richard

 

[russ10x]

Rich,
Something sounds loose. Sounds very basic, but this should shoot better than that....

 

[RicosRevenge]

Definitely check for anything loose...

You can try a pressure point on the barrel. I found that my 10/22 liked a piece of rubber band between the barrel and the stock about an inch from the end of the stock.

Take a peek at the crown on your muzzle as well.

 

[CMH]

How many foulers were you shooting between ammo test lots?

 

[rg1911]

How many foulers were you shooting between ammo test lots?

Two.

 

[rg1911]

Definitely check for anything loose...

You can try a pressure point on the barrel. I found that my 10/22 liked a piece of rubber band between the barrel and the stock about an inch from the end of the stock.

Take a peek at the crown on your muzzle as well.

Since I had to drop by my 'smith on the way from the range, I had him take a quick peek at it. The crown is fine and he did not detect anything loose. He did suggest putting something (a rubber band sounds good) between the barrel and stock near the tip of the stock. I'll try that this weekend.

 

[CMH]

You have to use way more foulers between ammo types. Some guns I have been able to get good results with 10. I have a 10/22 that is particularly finicky - it is in the 20-25 range to season the bore and really hit its stride.

 

[rg1911]

You have to use way more foulers between ammo types. Some guns I have been able to get good results with 10. I have a 10/22 that is particularly finicky - it is in the 20-25 range to season the bore and really hit its stride.

Wow!
I'll do more foulers this weekend. I'll also just test the two or three samples that provided the "best" results.

Thank you,
Richard

 

[ivanthesane]

Two.

Probably not near enough. Either clean well, then 5 or 10 shots, then groups, or plan on 20-25 rounds before groups.

Example of what happens after an ammo change. This was at 25 yards, Savage BTV, think I went from Wolf to Rem SS HPs.

Notice the groups keep getting smaller

 

[Tullz82]

Could check for problems at the v block and also play around with torque on the action screw. When I rebarreled mine it took some tweaking but once I got it right I didn't have to use pressure pads.

 

[rg1911]

Many thanks to all for the great suggestions. I'll test them this weekend (weather permitting).

Cheers,
Richard

 

[Larry in SD]

Setup:

- Fajen laminated thumbhole stock.
- Barrel bedded at rear; action free-floated.
- Green Mountain heavy barrel (.920).

Thank you,
Richard

Barrel bedded at rear, action free floated.

Please explain that one? I have put together a lot of custom 10/22's over the years and have never free floated the action.

A long time ago I read up on how to bed a 10/22. The author of the article said to find the balance point of the barreled action out of the stock (with the scope and mounts attached to the action) and bed from that point to the rear of the action.

While I have not bedded one myself in this method my local gunsmith has done several. Once this is done generally the only thing left to do is find the right torque spec for the take down screw for that particular Barreled Action and they will shoot.

Larry

 

[rg1911]

Barrel bedded at rear, action free floated.

Please explain that one? I have put together a lot of custom 10/22's over the years and have never free floated the action.

Larry,

The barrel simply is bedded near the rear around the attaching bolt. The rest of the barrel and the action are free-floated. This is/was a frequently done procedure back when I had the rifle assembled.

More testing this past weekend, using the recommendations from this thread, gave the same poor results. I'm pretty sure the Butler Creek barrel (I mistakenly originally provided the wrong maker) is going to have to go. When that's done, I expect I'll bed the receiver, too.

Cheers,
Richard

 

[yoteman]

One other thing to check
make sure your bolt going through the v block, is not hitting barrel.
you would shit if you knew how many I found that did, took a little off
screw an back in were it should be
YO

 

[rg1911]

make sure your bolt going through the v block, is not hitting barrel.
YO

YO,

That never even occurred to me. Thanks! Will check that asap.

Richard

 

[usmcchet9296]

I had a setup similar to yours but it wasn't bedded. Shot 1.5 to 2 inches at 100 yard fairly regularly.
Might I suggest a nice CZ bolt action <----there it was said
How did the rifle shoot years ago?
Try more ammo
barrels can be finicky
if that doesn't work you might want to try another barrel
GM's are OK but there are better barrels out there
my old gun

ultimate ruger by usmcchet92_96, on Flickr

 

[Larry in SD]

I have had a couple Butler Creek 20" Bull Barrels over the years. While they shot much better than the factory barrels they did not compare to a Green Mountain or a KIDD.

I am currently running a 20" Stainless KIDD Bull Barrel on a reworked 10/22. The barrel is totally free floated given the fact I am using a Nordic Components AR-22 Receiver Chassis Kit with AR-15 Pistol Grip, A2 Buttstock and Free Float Tube. I have had the bolt reworked, headspace set, firing pin pinned and rear face of the bolt chamfered / radiused. In addition the trigger has been sent to a guy in Modesto California for one of his precision trigger jobs.

If I am having a good day shooting this 10/22 will shot slightly under MOA groups at 100 yards from the bench with Wolf Match Target, SK Standard Plus or SK Subsonic Hollow Points.

The best I could get at 100 yards from the bench with the two Butler Creek Bull Barrel was 1 1/4" to 1 1/2" and yes one of the Butler Creek Bull Barrels was on this receiver with the Nordic Kit.

Larry

 

[rg1911]

One other thing to check
make sure your bolt going through the v block, is not hitting barrel.
YO

YO,

The bolt through the V-block isn't touching the barrel. (That would have been too easy and inexpensive to fix.)

I think I'm back to a new (Kidd?) barrel when finances permit.

Richard

 

[rg1911]

using a Nordic Components AR-22 Receiver Chassis Kit with AR-15 Pistol Grip, A2 Buttstock and Free Float Tube. I have had the bolt reworked, headspace set, firing pin pinned and rear face of the bolt chamfered / radiused. In addition the trigger has been sent to a guy in Modesto California for one of his precision trigger jobs.
Larry

Larry,

Who did your bolt and headspace work? That is, is this something any good riflesmith should be able to do, or does it require special knowledge, experience and tools?

I'm also not sure what improvement is caused by chamfering/radiusing the rear of the bolt or pinning the firing pin (which seems to be pinned in place by default).

Thank you,
Richard

 

[Larry in SD]

I have a local machinist do my bolt work for me. The chamfering the rear of the bolt face where the bottom side of the rear of the bolt interacts with the hammer during cycling does nothing for accuracy. However when shooting Target / Match ammo with lessened recoil it does offer smoother cycling as the interface between the rear of the bolt and forward edge of the hammer allow for smoother cycling.

As for pinning the firing pin, yes it can still move up and down somewhat without the pinning. However it is worse on older bolts that have seen a lot of use. My first experience was with a well used 10/22 I bought for a project. I am not sure how many rounds had been fired through it but it was rough to say the least. I had the headspace on my bolt set The recess in my bolt face was .005" deeper than it should have been thus creating headspace with the floating bolt of the 10/22) and the firing pin pinned and my misfires all but disappeared. It did not make my groups smaller per say but it did make them more symmetrical and seemed to eliminate unexplained fliers.

There are a couple guys on another forum that do the bolt work. However I obtained all the necessary dimensions and have a local machinist do mine for me. He has done several for me and friends of mine over the years. Be warned that these Ruger bolts are harder than a woodpeckers lips and my machinist has broken a couple drill bits.

How many rounds have been fired through your barrel? Is it broken in? If shot a LOT is there are carbon ring in front of the chamber?

Larry

 

[yoteman]

YO,

The bolt through the V-block isn't touching the barrel. (That would have been too easy and inexpensive to fix.)

I think I'm back to a new (Kidd?) barrel when finances permit.

Richard

cant go wrong with a new goat barrel
my little ruger charger with a KIDD barrel, outshoots my sons full size (18") green mountain
if i was to spend money on a new barrel, i have seen to many kidds that shoot, that would be what i would buy.
good luck an keep us posted
YO

 

[Larry in SD]

Absolutely correct, you just can not go wrong with a KIDD Barrel. I built my first custom 10/22 with a Green Mountain Barrel. I (and obviously a few others) were impressed with it's accuracy. So much so in fact I built 3 more identical to the one I built and ended up selling the one I had. I then set out to build another custom 10/22 but this time I used a KIDD Barrel. A buddy saw how it shot and offered me a good profit on it, so I built another one. In the end it was the same story.

I then built a custom Ruger Charger with a 10" KIDD Bull Barrel. It shot to the same standard of accuracy as did the rifles with the 20" KIDD Bull Barrels. I then built my wife a lighter weight custom 10/22 but this time used a 18" KIDD Lightweight Barrel. This one unfortunately was the worst of the lot, but still was a really good shooting barrel.

Been reading really good things about Fedderson Barrels as of late. I don't know, if it was me I'd probably just buy another KIDD Barrel if I was going to build another 10/22.

Larry

 

[rg1911]

Thank you for all the good information.

Cheers,
Richard