Okay so the dilemma not a bad one to have, but a dilemma all the same. Groundhog season will be upon us soon enough and I'm in need of a scope on my naked AE MKII. I figured I would wait after Shot Show 2011 to see what new goodies S&B had to offer and it turns out they have some good ones. The problem is when will they actually hit the shelves....? No one has a solid answer and there seems to be varying lead times. I have pretty much decided on the 5-25 whether it be PH or S&B, but was curious to see what the new S&B 3-20 was all about. I was also curious about S&B's new reticle choices ie. Klein and H2CMR. What to do....
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Rifle Scopes S&B or Premier
- Thread starter Jeeprider
- Start date
Re: S&B or Premier
I currently own both at the 5-25 magnification. I personally like the Premier more because inlike how big the turret is and that I do not get the "tunnel vision" at 5x. I also use the Gen 2 XR and P4F and I like the Gen 2 XR better because of the wind hold overs. Both have the same quality glass in my eyes though. IMHO
I currently own both at the 5-25 magnification. I personally like the Premier more because inlike how big the turret is and that I do not get the "tunnel vision" at 5x. I also use the Gen 2 XR and P4F and I like the Gen 2 XR better because of the wind hold overs. Both have the same quality glass in my eyes though. IMHO
Re: S&B or Premier
This VS that has been beat to death around here Jeep. Try searching past posts.
As for the reticles, the Klein has been around for a while and is a mildot reticle with .5 mil hash marks. The H2CMR is the newer reticle which has hollow dots and .2 mil marks on the horizontal line and between the 2nd and 3rd mildots on the vertical it has .1 mil marks. Here's a pic. Not very good and doesn't show detail too well. The reticle in person looks much better. Both the Klein and the H2CMR will be available in the 3-20x as well.
This VS that has been beat to death around here Jeep. Try searching past posts.
As for the reticles, the Klein has been around for a while and is a mildot reticle with .5 mil hash marks. The H2CMR is the newer reticle which has hollow dots and .2 mil marks on the horizontal line and between the 2nd and 3rd mildots on the vertical it has .1 mil marks. Here's a pic. Not very good and doesn't show detail too well. The reticle in person looks much better. Both the Klein and the H2CMR will be available in the 3-20x as well.
Re: S&B or Premier
I think you are in the same boat as alot of us. The 3 x 20 has alot of interest, delivery date is the problem. I was told to go with the 5x25 too. Good luck on your choice. Has anyone heard of anything but April for the release date for the 3 x 20 S&B?
I think you are in the same boat as alot of us. The 3 x 20 has alot of interest, delivery date is the problem. I was told to go with the 5x25 too. Good luck on your choice. Has anyone heard of anything but April for the release date for the 3 x 20 S&B?
Re: S&B or Premier
Ive got a S&B 4x16 and 5-25 both with P4f. You can not go wrong witht the S&B, not to take anything away from premier. The P4f would work perfect for ground hogs, the reticle is very fine and you should not have issues with the reticle covering the target. I would rather have the 5-25, I like the extra magnification. I thought about waiting for the 3-20 but I would rather be out shooting and practicing rather than sitting in front of the PC waiting for a scope that may or may not bet available any time soon and still does not have the magnification that the 5-25 has.
Ive got a S&B 4x16 and 5-25 both with P4f. You can not go wrong witht the S&B, not to take anything away from premier. The P4f would work perfect for ground hogs, the reticle is very fine and you should not have issues with the reticle covering the target. I would rather have the 5-25, I like the extra magnification. I thought about waiting for the 3-20 but I would rather be out shooting and practicing rather than sitting in front of the PC waiting for a scope that may or may not bet available any time soon and still does not have the magnification that the 5-25 has.
Re: S&B or Premier
Schmidt & Bender all the way. I think the two scope's are just as tought as the other and the glass is just as good I know for a fact if you are into ranging unknown targets the Schmidt & Bender has far better Reticles on the market I will just name two H2CMR model# 096-7702 and the new MSR Multipurpose Sniper Reticle Buy far the best of the best for ranging. The horus is just to much money. Dont get me wrong Premier Heritage would be my number one choice with the big turrets and the nice tool less 0 lever. They just need to brake there reticles down into smaller 0.1 or 0.2 tic marks for Mil/Mil Scope's so if your seriously doing a lot of accurate ranging please pick the right reticle.
Schmidt & Bender all the way. I think the two scope's are just as tought as the other and the glass is just as good I know for a fact if you are into ranging unknown targets the Schmidt & Bender has far better Reticles on the market I will just name two H2CMR model# 096-7702 and the new MSR Multipurpose Sniper Reticle Buy far the best of the best for ranging. The horus is just to much money. Dont get me wrong Premier Heritage would be my number one choice with the big turrets and the nice tool less 0 lever. They just need to brake there reticles down into smaller 0.1 or 0.2 tic marks for Mil/Mil Scope's so if your seriously doing a lot of accurate ranging please pick the right reticle.
Re: S&B or Premier
I had both as well. I just did not care for the busy XR reticle so I traded for a P4F reticle, but I missed the adjustment clicks of the PH. I think their knobs are the best on the market. Could use a slimmer prallax knob though, its a beast.
If premier had the P4F reitcle with a slimmer paralax knob, id never go back to S&B.
I had both as well. I just did not care for the busy XR reticle so I traded for a P4F reticle, but I missed the adjustment clicks of the PH. I think their knobs are the best on the market. Could use a slimmer prallax knob though, its a beast.
If premier had the P4F reitcle with a slimmer paralax knob, id never go back to S&B.
Re: S&B or Premier
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jeeprider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay so the dilemma not a bad one to have, but a dilemma all the same. Groundhog season will be upon us soon enough and I'm in need of a scope on my naked AE MKII. I figured I would wait after Shot Show 2011 to see what new goodies S&B had to offer and it turns out they have some good ones. The problem is when will they actually hit the shelves....? No one has a solid answer and there seems to be varying lead times. I have pretty much decided on the 5-25 whether it be PH or S&B, but was curious to see what the new S&B 3-20 was all about. I was also curious about S&B's new reticle choices ie. Klein and H2CMR. What to do.... </div></div>
I went through the same thing I was going back and forth between S&B, Premier, and Hensoldt.
Personally I chose the Premier for the GEN II XR as I personally found it the most useful reticle for me. The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base.
Plus the icing on the top was that Premier is an American based company and its made in the USA (I know some parts are sourced elsewhere but a majority of its made here.) For me that is really important.
I am VERY happy with my purchase.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jeeprider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay so the dilemma not a bad one to have, but a dilemma all the same. Groundhog season will be upon us soon enough and I'm in need of a scope on my naked AE MKII. I figured I would wait after Shot Show 2011 to see what new goodies S&B had to offer and it turns out they have some good ones. The problem is when will they actually hit the shelves....? No one has a solid answer and there seems to be varying lead times. I have pretty much decided on the 5-25 whether it be PH or S&B, but was curious to see what the new S&B 3-20 was all about. I was also curious about S&B's new reticle choices ie. Klein and H2CMR. What to do.... </div></div>
I went through the same thing I was going back and forth between S&B, Premier, and Hensoldt.
Personally I chose the Premier for the GEN II XR as I personally found it the most useful reticle for me. The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base.
Plus the icing on the top was that Premier is an American based company and its made in the USA (I know some parts are sourced elsewhere but a majority of its made here.) For me that is really important.
I am VERY happy with my purchase.
Re: S&B or Premier
Just an update I went with an S&B 5-25 PMII P4F and couldn't be happier. Nothing against Premier, but at the end of the day it's just not an S&B and for the money and negligible price difference I went with S&B. If I did go with Premier I know I would always be wondering what the S&B was like and having second thoughts. Both are amazing scopes I just went for what I think is the best.
Just an update I went with an S&B 5-25 PMII P4F and couldn't be happier. Nothing against Premier, but at the end of the day it's just not an S&B and for the money and negligible price difference I went with S&B. If I did go with Premier I know I would always be wondering what the S&B was like and having second thoughts. Both are amazing scopes I just went for what I think is the best.
Re: S&B or Premier
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rommel500</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base. </div></div>
Just to clarify the Premier 5-25 has 30 Mils and the S&B 5-25 has 26 Mils. Not what I would call "alot" more. Either will get a shooter with a short barreled .308 to 1000 without a problem on a flat base. A 20 or greater MOA base just allows you more usable elevation. The S&B was actually designed to be used on a 45 MOA base so you have the complete range of elevation as usuable.
Jeeprider, congrats on your new scope. You will enjoy it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rommel500</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base. </div></div>
Just to clarify the Premier 5-25 has 30 Mils and the S&B 5-25 has 26 Mils. Not what I would call "alot" more. Either will get a shooter with a short barreled .308 to 1000 without a problem on a flat base. A 20 or greater MOA base just allows you more usable elevation. The S&B was actually designed to be used on a 45 MOA base so you have the complete range of elevation as usuable.
Jeeprider, congrats on your new scope. You will enjoy it.
Re: S&B or Premier
I wonder how many people out there will even use the second turn of the scope?
I wonder how many people out there will even use the second turn of the scope?
Re: S&B or Premier
Agreed and I went with the Accuracy International 45 MOA mount specifically built for the S&B 5-25 x56, it's such a great setup! Thanks Rob, you definitely helped with the purchase!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rommel500</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base. </div></div>
Just to clarify the Premier 5-25 has 30 Mils and the S&B 5-25 has 26 Mils. Not what I would call "alot" more. Either will get a shooter with a short barreled .308 to 1000 without a problem on a flat base. A 20 or greater MOA base just allows you more usable elevation. The S&B was actually designed to be used on a 45 MOA base so you have the complete range of elevation as usuable.
Jeeprider, congrats on your new scope. You will enjoy it. </div></div>
Agreed and I went with the Accuracy International 45 MOA mount specifically built for the S&B 5-25 x56, it's such a great setup! Thanks Rob, you definitely helped with the purchase!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rommel500</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base. </div></div>
Just to clarify the Premier 5-25 has 30 Mils and the S&B 5-25 has 26 Mils. Not what I would call "alot" more. Either will get a shooter with a short barreled .308 to 1000 without a problem on a flat base. A 20 or greater MOA base just allows you more usable elevation. The S&B was actually designed to be used on a 45 MOA base so you have the complete range of elevation as usuable.
Jeeprider, congrats on your new scope. You will enjoy it. </div></div>
Re: S&B or Premier
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jeeprider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just an update I went with an S&B 5-25 PMII P4F and couldn't be happier. Nothing against Premier, but at the end of the day it's just not an S&B and for the money and negligible price difference I went with S&B. If I did go with Premier I know I would always be wondering what the S&B was like and having second thoughts. Both are amazing scopes I just went for what I think is the best. </div></div>
Congratulations on your new scope. I ordered the exact same S&B and it should be here any day now. Please post some photos and/or a range report if you can to hold me over.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jeeprider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just an update I went with an S&B 5-25 PMII P4F and couldn't be happier. Nothing against Premier, but at the end of the day it's just not an S&B and for the money and negligible price difference I went with S&B. If I did go with Premier I know I would always be wondering what the S&B was like and having second thoughts. Both are amazing scopes I just went for what I think is the best. </div></div>
Congratulations on your new scope. I ordered the exact same S&B and it should be here any day now. Please post some photos and/or a range report if you can to hold me over.
Re: S&B or Premier
I have never had a premier, so I can only speak intelligently about SB. I love it plain and simple. At first though you would think the clicks are a little stiff but the more you use it the more it grows on you (for me anyways). The glass is no duh clear and at night collects so much light its almost a NV device (not really as big of an exaggeration as you would think) I have used P4F and P3 and love them both.
Now looking at premier and reading what people say about them they sound alot like SB in glass (actually its not the glass its the coatings) and I will say those turrets are pretty sexy but the double turn turrets with the yellow windows on the SB's are sexy too and really useful. Either way you go you won't be too bad of shape but I put my vote on my two old friends, Mr Schmidt and Mr bender lol
I have never had a premier, so I can only speak intelligently about SB. I love it plain and simple. At first though you would think the clicks are a little stiff but the more you use it the more it grows on you (for me anyways). The glass is no duh clear and at night collects so much light its almost a NV device (not really as big of an exaggeration as you would think) I have used P4F and P3 and love them both.
Now looking at premier and reading what people say about them they sound alot like SB in glass (actually its not the glass its the coatings) and I will say those turrets are pretty sexy but the double turn turrets with the yellow windows on the SB's are sexy too and really useful. Either way you go you won't be too bad of shape but I put my vote on my two old friends, Mr Schmidt and Mr bender lol
Re: S&B or Premier
Jeeprider I have the same scope, reticle, and mount on my AI AWSM and am very happy with it. You will be enjoying the functionality, clarity, and ease of use of the scope long after you recover from the price.
Jeeprider I have the same scope, reticle, and mount on my AI AWSM and am very happy with it. You will be enjoying the functionality, clarity, and ease of use of the scope long after you recover from the price.
Re: S&B or Premier
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bacarrat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wonder how many people out there will even use the second turn of the scope? </div></div>
I do
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bacarrat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wonder how many people out there will even use the second turn of the scope? </div></div>
I do
Re: S&B or Premier
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rommel500</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base. </div></div>
Just to clarify the Premier 5-25 has 30 Mils and the S&B 5-25 has 26 Mils. Not what I would call "alot" more. Either will get a shooter with a short barreled .308 to 1000 without a problem on a flat base. A 20 or greater MOA base just allows you more usable elevation. The S&B was actually designed to be used on a 45 MOA base so you have the complete range of elevation as usuable.
Jeeprider, congrats on your new scope. You will enjoy it. </div></div>
Sorry I should clarify, I have a 3-15 Premier and when I was looking to purchase I was comparing to the 3-12 S&B (22mils adjustment) & the 4-16 S&B (13mils adjustment) so in that comparison to me the Premier had a fare bit more adjustment.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rommel500</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The Premier has a lot more elevation travel, although the S&B shouldn't be an issue if you have 20moa base. </div></div>
Just to clarify the Premier 5-25 has 30 Mils and the S&B 5-25 has 26 Mils. Not what I would call "alot" more. Either will get a shooter with a short barreled .308 to 1000 without a problem on a flat base. A 20 or greater MOA base just allows you more usable elevation. The S&B was actually designed to be used on a 45 MOA base so you have the complete range of elevation as usuable.
Jeeprider, congrats on your new scope. You will enjoy it. </div></div>
Sorry I should clarify, I have a 3-15 Premier and when I was looking to purchase I was comparing to the 3-12 S&B (22mils adjustment) & the 4-16 S&B (13mils adjustment) so in that comparison to me the Premier had a fare bit more adjustment.
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