Savage 338 Issue - Need some help

[CShooter92]

My buddy gave me his Savage 110-BA 338 Lapua to do some load development for. I've never loaded for 338 before but figured I'd give it a shot.

I followed the Nosler load manual and did a bunch of reading on here and went with this load to start. It is listed as a mid-range load in the Nosler book.

89.0 gr of H1000
Lapua and Nosler Brass
Federal 215 LR magnum primers
Berger 300gr Hybrids

I loaded up a bunch of these and took them to the range this weekend. It was a 40 degree day. Get all set up, load a round and pull the trigger. It goes click... I let it sit a bit, pulled it out, and the firing pin hit the primer but didn't set it off. The primer was just ever so slightly recessed into the case but I've never had that be an issue before.

Chamber another round, it goes off fine. However, the bolt is extremely hard to get back and the primer is completely flattened... Definitely over pressure so I start wondering if it was a bad charge. At this point I figured I'd try a round that had Nosler brass. Put the round in... Click. Same primer strike but no detonation. I know these primers aren't bad because I just loaded my 7mm Rem Mag with them and they shot fine.

Grab another Nosler brass load... pull the trigger and it goes off. Now I can't even get the bolt back without pounding on it with a block of wood. At this point I figured I'll pack up and go home.

So I think I have 2 issues... One being the light primer strikes. My friend said that he has never had an issue with this before and I'm using his once fired brass that has been FL sized. Any ideas on how to fix this?

The other is that the load is definitely hot, even though every where I read, it shouldn't even be close.

I just need some opinions on where to go from here. I'm gonna pull all the bullets and start over but what charge weight should I go with?

 

[John Glidewell]

not enough info to say for sure. Did you get a measurement to the lands? Pressure could be caused by jamming bullets into the lands. Did you measure the firing pin for protrusion? If not what Cartridge overall length did you use and where did you get the data from? (Nosler data for Berger bullet?) Did you actually pop primers before sizing and measure before and after with a headspace comparator to ensure you were only bumping the shoulder .002-.003"? Over sizing can create/mimic pressure.

I do not like H1000 with 300 grainers either, I use Retumbo or RL33, I find H1000 is a bit fast for the heavier bullets.

 

[CShooter92]

I will get some more info when I'm home. I know I am not at the lands with the bullet. I used a marker and colored the bullet, then seated further until I was not contacting anymore. When I did this, the rounds would not fit in the mag so I needed to seat down to mag length. I pulled all the measurements from the Nosler manual.

While I do not have a headspace comparator for a 338, I ran with the RCBS die instructions when FL sizing. Primers were all popped during the sizing process. My friend had sized a few cases before he gave them to me, but I ran them through the FL die again.

Haven't measured firing pin protrusion yet.

 

[XLR308]

I will get some more info when I'm home. I know I am not at the lands with the bullet. I used a marker and colored the bullet, then seated further until I was not contacting anymore. When I did this, the rounds would not fit in the mag so I needed to seat down to mag length. I pulled all the measurements from the Nosler manual.

While I do not have a headspace comparator for a 338, I ran with the RCBS die instructions when FL sizing. Primers were all popped during the sizing process. My friend had sized a few cases before he gave them to me, but I ran them through the FL die again.

Haven't measured firing pin protrusion yet.

Not saying it is definitely your problem but if you followed the die instructions for sizing I would be willing to bet you are setting the shoulder back more than is needed.
That could also be part of your problem with light primer strikes.

 

[Steel head]

Start at a reasonable place and work up with powder.
just because lots of people use a certain loading doesn’t mean you can.

The mis fire is probably soft seated primers and/or too much headspace

 

[Eddystone]

Check out the previously shared tips above. I would then make dang sure the chamber is squeaky (brake clean and a 12 gauge brush works for me) clean. Any sizing wax or lube from any source will cause a big issue with this cartridge. Lots of bolt thrust. I have one of these, First-hand mistake sharing, not hearsay.

 

[Mark Coffey]

I have owned a Savage 110 FCP/HS in 338LM. I have 3 other people I shoot with that shoot the BA version.

1-I would make sure the barrel is clean. I like Bore Tech Eliminator.
2- The Savage chambers tend to be tight! Factory 338 ammunition tend be OK. I still have a RCBS full length re-sizing Die that has been shortened, so I could bump the shoulder back enough.... PM me if you need it. I have since figured out that it is easier to mill the case holder.
3-We all had issues with cases sticking in the chamber with any thing other then Lapua. One of the shooters polished his chamber and it helped.
4-All of the rifles except mine loved 90.5 gr H1000 and 300 OTM’s. Mine didn’t like anything.... Total POS. Even after it was re-barreled from Savage it was a 2 MOA gun at best.

I hope this helps.

 

[CShooter92]

I cleaned the chamber and barrel when I got the gun from him, however I will give it another clean to make sure nothing is remaining. I don't think it's a soft seated primer issue. I initially seated the primers and they didn't even want to seat below the case head with normal force, I needed to give them a little extra force just to seat them flush or slightly recessed.

@Mark Coffey I will send you a PM.

 

[CShooter92]

Ok so here's an update. The shoulder stretched maybe 0.004" from unfired to fired. The OD of the neck increased approx. 0.005". The overall case length is 2.724" in the book and both the fired and unfired measure 2.722".

I took the bolt all apart and the all the internals were very oily. I cleaned them all up and also cleaned the chamber again. From there, I put the brass in that had the light primer strikes. Pulled the trigger on it and the primer went off without issue on both.

The one thing I noticed is that the primer backed out on both of these cases so it is not protruding from the case head. So... I'm thinking this may have happened when I fired the two rounds and that is why the primers were so flat on those two rounds.

 

[Long Range 338]

Definitely sounds like you are oversizing the brass if your shell holder is touching the bottom of the die. You need to start from scratch and setup your dies again for your rifle. Make sure you are not into the lands with your bullet seating and back off the charge and work your way back up. Also you mention using Nosler and Lapua brass, guaranteed the case capacity is different between the two brands.

 

[CShooter92]

Definitely sounds like you are oversizing the brass if your shell holder is touching the bottom of the die. You need to start from scratch and setup your dies again for your rifle. Make sure you are not into the lands with your bullet seating and back off the charge and work your way back up. Also you mention using Nosler and Lapua brass, guaranteed the case capacity is different between the two brands.

Thanks, I will give this a try on the two rounds that did go off. Just curious why RCBS would put in their instructions to screw the die down to the shell holder, and then say to turn it further down another 1/8 turn if it would cause over sizing? I have used this method on my 22-250 RCBS dies without issue. Of course I realize there are much greater forces at play with the 338.

I realize case capacity is different between the two brass brands. My buddy has zero experience reloading so I figured I'd help him out with what he had. I didn't expect it to give me this many issues.

 

[John Glidewell]

why you should be using a comparator to check the headspace/shoulder bump on the brass......otherwise you are guessing, which can lead to bad things with 338s. It's a $40 tool

 

[spife7980]

Just curious why RCBS would put in their instructions to screw the die down to the shell holder, and then say to turn it further down another 1/8 turn if it would cause over sizing?

Because it guarantees that it got sized (albeit oversized) and keeps RCBS from answering the phones explaining people how to actually load. The bolt closes every time with their instructions, you just only get to use that case for less than half its potential life.

 

[Long Range 338]

Because it guarantees that it got sized (albeit oversized) and keeps RCBS from answering the phones explaining people how to actually load. The bolt closes every time with their instructions, you just only get to use that case for less than half its potential life.

^^^ This. I've never had a factory chamber that required sizing all the way to touching the die to the shell holder. You can establish your headspace by sizing your brass until it just fits in your chamber without difficulty closing the bolt.

 

[John Glidewell]

you can establish your headspace by sizing your brass until it just fits in your chamber without difficulty closing the bolt.

This works too. He would need to back off his die quite a bit though and slowly work the die down to get this.

 

[spife7980]

 

[CShooter92]

All makes sense for sure. I don't really want to buy a Headspace comparator for this gun because it's not mine and I have zero urge to run a 338 Lapua in the future.

So... knowing what I know now, my best course of action would be to pull all the bullets, and reload with a lighter charge at this point? I'm not going to be able to run the brass through the die again since they've already been oversized.

 

[spife7980]

In the interm you could get a 45 case and use that maybe? Trim it to be flush on the end so youre not measuring with a wonky tool.

 

[CShooter92]

Took the rifle to my gunsmith the other day just to check it out. We borescoped it and there wasn't anything stuck in the chamber. We noticed some interesting markings on the brass so it looked as if the chamber wasn't concentric to the bore. Then we ran a set of GO, NO-GO gauges into the rifle. The NO-GO, was a No go. However, the GO gauge was very stiff on bolt close. I guess it's just a really tight chamber and the loads that should be good for a regular chamber are reaching pressure a lot sooner than they generally would in another chamber.

 

[John Glidewell]

Unthread the barrel and reset the headspace.