Scar17 for medium/long range?

[wilderness medic]

Well right before committing to the AXMC I got laid off for the winter.

So I’m thinking about getting into long range shooting and firing solutions with my SCAR17 and ACOG TA11E. Is it possible? I know it’s not idea and a 4x optic is going to really limit me.

Any recommendations on ammunition to get or at least try? It sounds like once you start the range cards and chronographing you are firmly committed to the round you chose. .308 or 7.62?

What other gear should I have for makin a range card and confirming zeros?

Chronograph?
Range finder?
Barometer/thermometer?

As far as I know the SCAR is good for about 700/800m. I just got my Gisselle super scar trigger and Harris bipod and I’m excited to hopefully at least get partially acquainted with this long range stuff until I can get my AXMC next year.

 

[wilderness medic]

Bump

 

[Shadow_Warrior]

I have two Scar17's
One with 7.62 Elcan 1-4x
One with a Leupold 1-8x
My Scar17 shoots solid 1 MOA with Horandy Match (White Box) and 1.25 MOA Fed GMM 175gr.
With the Elcan 4x I can consistently hit (80% hits) a 20"x20" plate at 650 yards which is fairly impressive for a 4x. The main drawback is spotting your impacts at that distance as I find it very difficult on the light weight Scar platform.
With the 1-8x I can consistently hit a 16"x16" plate out to 650 yards.
If you are a newer precision shooter I would recommend ditching the Scar17 as its a bitch to control the recoil pulse. However if you find yourself being very consistent 1MOA @ 100y then yea feel free to stretch it out and get to know your platform.

Have you considered starting with a precision AR15 upper in order to get your fundamentals established?
My favorite go to rifle is my RECCE 16" AR-15 shooting out to 800y!

 

[wilderness medic]

Good lord I will never ditch my scar for an AR. Don’t most .223 rounds go transonic at like 600m?

Doesn’t the forward recoil pulse only matter for follow up shots??

I’m not looking to buy anything except a high end bolt rifle and it won’t be for a while. I might get the elcan specter 1/3/9 for the scar though.

I’m really confused why you would recommend something with a lower BC to get started...? Unless I don’t understand forward impulse and that’s a huge problem for this. But it doesn’t sound like it is for others shooting the scar at 800m

 

[BCP]

I would get some AR500 plates and make swinging targets if you have your own range. Biggest ones you can afford. 4x ACOG on a SCAR isn't going to be a "Precision" rifle but at least then you'll have fun.

You could always put a larger scope on your SCAR and try some federal match 168s. Who knows maybe you will get lucky and it'll shoot an inch at 100. Then you can go to a 300/600 range on F class day and dick around.

 

[wilderness medic]

There are plates at 400/500 locally. No issue hitting them with the ACOG holding over. But I would like to practice doing turret adjustments etc.

 

[hypno02]

The scar 17 is not a good LR platform. And it never will be.

I tried making my scar 17 into a mid range rig and I had inconsistent zeroes, very inconsistent groups with a warm barrel, and overall shitty ergonomics compared to an ar10/15.(super scar, kdg handguard, etc) I sold it for a LMT MWS and although it’s a heavier rifle, it fits the role 10x better than any scar 17.

IMHO no scar17 should wear an optic higher than 8x.

 

[wilderness medic]

Cool. So I wasted $6k and 4 years building this thing up the way I wanted it.

 

[Shadow_Warrior]

I'll say it again......As a new Precision shooter you are better served Ditching the Scar17 and going with something else to start out with so that you can master your fundamentals of marksmanship.
I have seen very seasoned LR shooters not be able to shoot a large frame gas gun as its a completely different animal.

Here is just ONE example of many I could give you here but you could buy a used/new Ruger PRP in 5.56
(new $800) using the Horandy Match black box 75 gr ammo which generally cost around $.60 a round.
This is a cost effective way to go out and shoot 100-200 rounds in one range trip and never worry about heating up your barrel and burning it out as the .223 barrels can last 10K rounds.
Set the rifle up to fit you with the adjustable LOP and proper check weld height. This is a crucial part of your NPA.
Learn the fundamentals of NPA (Natural Point of Aim) and practice at 100 yards until you are shooting 1/2-3/4 MOA consistent groups on paper.
Once that's mastered move out to 200-600y and start to understand wind and the effects of wind at different ranges.
IMO There is not a much better wind tool than shooting a .224 bullet into a dirt berm at 600y in a 10 mph wind and being able to instantly see your impacts and call your own corrections. This will ultimately help fast track you a larger caliber.
When you are ready to buy a larger caliber precision rifle sell the RPR for $700 and buy a 6mm or 6.5mm rifle of your choice.
Ruger RPR 5.556

 

[Shadow_Warrior]

Cool. So I wasted $6k and 4 years building this thing up the way I wanted it.

So think of the Scar17 as a tool in the tool chest. It has its place but LR "precision" is not it.
I own two Scar17's and love them but I don't value them as Precision rifles.

 

[wilderness medic]

So think of the Scar17 as a tool in the tool chest. It has its place but LR "precision" is not it.
I own two Scar17's and love them but I don't value them as Precision rifles.

Maybe precision is the wrong word and I should have used it.

If it’ll shoot 1 MOA how is an 8” group at 800 not achievable? I’d be pretty stoked to be able to adjust my optic for all the variable and even hit paper at that distance.



I have shot literally thousands of 5.56 prone out to 400m out of an M4. If you’re talking about learning to hold over etc for adjustment I’ve already done that. However I’ve never actually made any turret adjustments for anything minus a zero.

 

[deersniper]

Get a rem700 223 and a vortex or SS scope if the budget is an issue. You will learn something about shooting/long range with that

 

[ScarlettRed]

If you have a scar and it shoots well, go with it. I started my long range adventure with my scar as I could barely afford to feed my 338LM. Its only real limitation is the fact that it has a pencil barrel. I've shot neck and neck with my prs shooting buddies until about 500y. By then the barrel heats up like all thin barrels and opens up the groups. If I started my day at 500y I'm sure I could go further no problem until it heats up again. It is also limited by a 16" barrel shooting factory at 2500fps with a .475g1BC. The configuration is it's handicap, not the platform. The scar teaches you how to shoot, if you can shoot it well you can pretty much shoot anything.

 

[Potss]

There is zero reason to use a Scar for your stated purposes. A quality AR10 will be better in literally every way. Get MSTN, Craddock, or CLE to build you one, or buy one from JP, KAC, Seekins or LMT and you'll have a far more accurate, lighter (if you build) lower recoil, less harsh on optics platform. Plus you can easily swap to calibers beyond .308 like 6.5CM if you desire.

 

[308pirate]

Cool. So I wasted $6k and 4 years building this thing up the way I wanted it.

Ignorance is bliss.

Your ignorance extends to the capability of the 223 Remington cartridge loaded with 75+ grain match bullets and how they compare to 308 Win match loads.

I recommend selling your SCAR to someone who has to have what the military cool kids have and start over with a quality, mid priced bolt gun.

I have a Howa 1500 that cost me less than a third of your SCAR and will run rings around it in accuracy and ease of shooting. And I'm not unique.

 

[Dirty8404]

I don’t believe in selling guns. Keep the scar and enjoy it. All the moving mass in the 17 makes them very difficult to shoot well, but they don’t need to shoot better than 1.5 moa to fill the role they were meant to.

You don’t use a sledgehammer for putting screws in.

Get an inexpensive .223 bolt gun, (Tikka or Howa) put some decent budget glass on it, and go for it. $1500 would be more than enough, and you won’t outgrow it for a long time.

 

[MK20]

The scar 17 is very accurate. It will do most things you ask of it. The recoil impulse is weird but you can learn it. If it’s what you got, run it.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

Why are you bumping your own thread(s) that were only posted for a few hours?
If you think that will get more and better replies, you are mistaken. It will actually get less productive replies and more "treat you as a troll" replies.
Take some time to read the other SCAR threads (Shit for that matter, read ALL the sticky threads)..as there are plenty. After you read those you will be able to gather some more direct and pertinent questions that relate directly to your desires and not such generalized and broad questions.
You will notice here..from reading...that the more direct and singular question(s) you ask; the better the replies you get to those questions.

As for as your question of:
"If it’ll shoot 1 MOA how is an 8” group at 800 not achievable? "

Mainly because group sizes do not follow a linear progression as if everything is exactly equal. There a numerous "inducers" that can be the cause of that 1MOA @100 shooting 3MOA @800.

As for me personally...I just cannot recommend a firearm that the day Crane NSWC signed the procurement contracts for it they put out a solicitation for a new designed magazine because of the failures from FN magazines lolol....That is called a clue in regards to: Did they pick the BEST rifle or did they pick the best "kickback" rifle

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[wilderness medic]

I’m not looking to buy anything except a high end bolt rifle and it won’t be for a while. I might get the elcan specter 1/3/9 for the scar though.

I guess this thread needs to go no further. As I said I'm not looking to buy anything other than my high end bolt rifle once I get the money together. If the SCAR isnt up to this kind of shooting then oh well, I'll keep using it for its intended purpose until I get the bolt gun I want.

I especially have no desire for a .223. Even if they have made better rounds that apparently can achieve a good BC and can stretch it out further than what I thought I don't want it.


I bumped my thread because it had already become buried several pages back with zero replies. With all the threads I read it seems like it wouldn't be hard to take long to throw a couple easy answers my way. For instance I asked a question in another thread that would probably take 20 whole seconds to answer yet a day later only one person said "Huh doesn't sound like a normal thing." Guess I'm better off sticking to spending hours on Youtube and reading like I have been.

 

[Strykervet]

Why not get the Mk20 and call it a day? That's the precision version of the SCAR. They're selling 'em now I guess. Personally I'd go for a KAC SR25, and did, in part because FN told me they'd be ready by Christmas --of 2014 or 15. But they're taking money this time.

I'd go that route, a Badger mount or rings and a tough as fuck quality scope, maybe a USO. Although an ACOG wouldn't be bad either, try to get one that's setup using the ammo or bullet weight (or close to it) that you plan on using. Some of the reticles are calibrated for different trajectories with no rhyme or reason why. The Mk20 comes with a slow twist so an ACOG and lighter bullets may be just it's thing.

But I'd certainly get the Mk20 over the SCAR for sure. IMO, it's just an SDM version of the SCAR. Perks and upgrades I'd wanna have anyway.

Good luck either way!

 

[Rudy Gonsior]

I guess this thread needs to go no further. As I said I'm not looking to buy anything other than my high end bolt rifle once I get the money together. If the SCAR isnt up to this kind of shooting then oh well, I'll keep using it for its intended purpose until I get the bolt gun I want.

I especially have no desire for a .223. Even if they have made better rounds that apparently can achieve a good BC and can stretch it out further than what I thought I don't want it.


I bumped my thread because it had already become buried several pages back with zero replies. With all the threads I read it seems like it wouldn't be hard to take long to throw a couple easy answers my way. For instance I asked a question in another thread that would probably take 20 whole seconds to answer yet a day later only one person said "Huh doesn't sound like a normal thing." Guess I'm better off sticking to spending hours on Youtube and reading like I have been.

Look man, this is the internet and nobody is coming to the pitty party. Patients is a virtue when you're learning, especial when your asking question for $Free.99. Typically the answers you get tend to correlate with the questions you asked. So I'd take a hard look at what your asking questions about. Honestly a bit of reading through some of the treads here probably could have narrowed down the knowledge gaps.

I'm not trying to be a dick but looking at your post you seem to have come into this forum with some preconceived notions that are simply odd and most likely won't work out well. The fact is a lot of guys have been down the road your on or similar path and are just trying to point you in the right direction, because a using a SCAR17 and trying dialing turrets on an ACOG simply isnt a good launch point into learning Precision Rifle, that just not how the game works.

If you're truly interested in learning something then stick around and be curious, observe, take a look at what others are doing. If you have a question, see if anyone else has already asked (chances are someone has). Floating around on Youtube probably isn't going to do you any better than it already has. Lastly seek out SMEs and ask some questions, narrow down what it is that want to learn then take a class that fits your needs. There are a number of great instructors sprinkled about and while you'll pay for it, formal professional instruction is going to put you on a hyper speed track to where you want to be.

 

[Dirty8404]

I especially have no desire for a .223. Even if they have made better rounds that apparently can achieve a good BC and can stretch it out further than what I thought I don't want it.

The benefit of a 223 is that it gives you the opportunity to learn inexpensively, given your financial constrains. If you want to practice expensively once that changes then go for it.

If you asked a question that didn’t get answered, then someone with a good answer didn’t read it. SH is growing very quickly and the knowledge base to answer questions isn’t growing at the same rate.

People with knowledge don’t exist solely to answer your questions. You aren’t entitled to shit, and your post sure comes across that way but I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Research is absolutely the best option, because you get the opportunity to learn WHY the answer is what it is, not simply the answer itself. That’s useful because you can apply that info to other scenarios using your own judgement. There’s tons of info on SH about the issues involved with large-frame semi-autos, you basically asked a variant of that question.

I tried to do precision stuff with a shorty M1A, didn’t work out very well so I switched to a precision 5.56 AR build and did much better. That’s the reason I recommend a 223. I’m not parroting what I read somewhere, it’s because I learned the hard way and I’m attempting to pass it on.

 

[wilderness medic]

Hahaha pity party?? Okaaaay.

Never said I was entitled to shit, nor did I demand immediate answers. Sorry if you take a bump as that.

Answer or don’t answer, whatever. Just sayin it’s funny that all some people have had to add is criticism and shit talking and calling me ignorant (no shit I am that’s why I’m trying to learn). Also funny if you look at your second paragraph that would have been a simple beautiful answer to my original questions instead of this circus of drama lmao.

The internet is funny. As are a lot of forum people. The Sole purpose of a forum is to exchange questions answers and experience but somehow mine aren’t ok. People seem to read and interpret shit in their individual preconceived notion. The joys of faceless text without face to face interaction.

Excuse me if I don’t waste anymore time on this clown show. Apparently my questions are somehow offensive, entitled, and seeking pitty haha... Im so so sorry. I apologize. Have a good one.


To those of you that actually tried to help, thanks

 

[THEIS]

 

[hypno02]

The scar 17 is very accurate. It will do most things you ask of it. The recoil impulse is weird but you can learn it. If it’s what you got, run it.

Please show me a legit 5x5 less than 1.5moa.

 

[deersniper]

you're going to be another poser with a high end bolt rifle with 0 appreciation for it or the skill to use it.

 

[deersniper]

And if you want to learn you will pay for and study the online training here.

Edit and lol at that attitude.

 

[bikeracer]

Ugh - this doesn’t have to be so painful. The OP is simply asking how to get the most accuracy out of his SCAR - jeez - not a tough question.

OP - you can shoot anything you want at distance - I have an AXMC and a SCAR and while the two aren’t in any way comparable the SCAR will make you a better shooter if you can get decent groups at distance. As mentioned the recoil impulse in the SCAR takes some getting used to and a 168 pill makes for some pretty good recoil out of a light rifle. I think it’d be more fun with a higher power optic - but again the more challenging it is shooting at distance the better you’ll be with your bolt gun.

I mostly shoot my gas guns at the 100 yd. range because shooting a good bolt gun for groups at 100 is boring and a waste of good ammo.

 

[BCP]

LOL now this is the Sniper's Hide I remember

There's no reason OP can't put a scope on his SCAR and go "learn to shoot" at some 600yard F class meet or whatever

Everyone has to start somewhere

 

[TKO]

Well right before committing to the AXMC I got laid off for the winter.

So I’m thinking about getting into long range shooting and firing solutions with my SCAR17 and ACOG TA11E. Is it possible? I know it’s not idea and a 4x optic is going to really limit me.

Any recommendations on ammunition to get or at least try? It sounds like once you start the range cards and chronographing you are firmly committed to the round you chose. .308 or 7.62?

What other gear should I have for makin a range card and confirming zeros?

Chronograph?
Range finder?
Barometer/thermometer?

As far as I know the SCAR is good for about 700/800m. I just got my Gisselle super scar trigger and Harris bipod and I’m excited to hopefully at least get partially acquainted with this long range stuff until I can get my AXMC next year.

Let me see if I can help. Ive owned two SCARS and done a lot of shooting with them, out to 1K yards with 168 SMK 's and 175 TMK's is marginally doable but not practical. I would focus any precision shooting with a SCAR to under 800 yards, I use the term precision lightly. To get the most out of your SCAR, ditch the ACOG idea. My first SCAR started with an ACOG (TA11J) and found it very annoying for multiple reasons. Its an optic designed with combat in mind, not precision. If you want the best repeat accuracy out of your SCAR, you want an optic with turrets, zero-stop or equivalent, reticle you are comfortable with, and durable, as SCAR is hard on scopes. I ended up with a SHV NF, nothing fancy but durable and repeatable. I have long given up on precision shooting with my SCAR but by no means would ever discourage anyone from wanting to push the limits, I learned a lot. Once I went to a bolt, my SCAR has sat in the safe, rarely seeing the light of day.
If you want to develop a range card, yes, you certainly need a chronograph. A range finder is not necessary to develop a card but can be very fun testing your DOAP at random targets at unknown distances. For beginners (not that im an expert) do your homework on a ballistics app, find one these guys recommend, plenty to choose from. I use Strelok Pro and G7 Ballistics.

Anyway, if you hand load, P.M. me and I will give you some of my load data to get you started. Good luck and have fun!!

 

[mgrs]

Good post by TKO above. If all you want to do is learn a bit and make some noise with steel plates you might as well. I find that my 17 shoots well for what it is until it is too warm... you can only ask so much of a light barrel. It is hard to shoot well, however, and takes more concentration than a heavier large frame AR10, and much more than a bolt action. You may also have a hard time self spotting with it.

Anything in a 16" barrel is going to be slow.... probably near 2450 or lower. 168s should be fine to 600y but 800y gets frustrating. 175s hold up better and I found that my 17 barrel stabilizes them OK, but you may want to confirm in yours. I have not shot it any farther; it just is not made for that.

Probably wise also to get a N to 14 or 18x scope with a good "no questions asked" warranty.

 

[TheGerman]

NOM NOM NOM