Rifle Scopes Scope Alternatives for Vortex Razor Gen II

[DocRDS]

The AI is coming: it needs something to sit atop it

I have a 4.5-27x56 EBR-7C Vortex Gen II Razor currently that I really like (Sits on my Howa), but rather than buy another--what are comprable models in price and performance I looked at the 'High End' ZCO, S&B (Kahles and Tangent are big in my area too) and kinda got lost in what they provide. Was thinking maybe a Nightforce of some sort as a next step.

Initially it'll be 6.5 Creed, PRS primarily and shots to 1200 max. Mostly daylight, doubt it will go hunting.

Edit: FFP, Mil/Mil, Zero Stop should all be implied as required.

 

[ShaKr524]

I think an Athlon Cronus might be a good option and similar in price to the Razer. Just my .02.

 

[Zuul]

Lol, I was in the same boat. Had a new Razor in my safe for the next rifle purchase, ended up buying a AI. Couldn’t do it, bought a S&B for it and couldn’t be happier. If a local shop had a ZCO I could have finger banged I’d probably gone that route, I’ll save that for the next rifle.

 

[Saltyag15]

In the same price range, you'd probably be looking at the Leupold Mark 5, Athlon Cronus, Burris XTR3.
Next step up in price would be the Nightforce ATACR.
All of these are great scopes. Good luck with whatever you decide!

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I sure do like the kahles 525i. I'm looking for another one now actually. I have almost jumped on a few Razor's because I like them a lot too and I have an AMG that I just love. That said, the 525i just gives a little better "pop" and the paralax adjustment being at the top is just so much easier to adjust while you are down on the gun. Once. I got familiar with the kahles, I knew I'd found my preferred scope. SKMR reticle is very similar to the EBR-7 (which I also love) as well, so it works out very good if you are used to that one. Jmo

 

[CSTactical]

The AI is coming: it needs something to sit atop it

I have a 4.5-27x56 EBR-7C Vortex Gen II Razor currently that I really like (Sits on my Howa), but rather than buy another--what are comprable models in price and performance I looked at the 'High End' ZCO, S&B (Kahles and Tangent are big in my area too) and kinda got lost in what they provide. Was thinking maybe a Nightforce of some sort as a next step.

Initially it'll be 6.5 Creed, PRS primarily and shots to 1200 max. Mostly daylight, doubt it will go hunting.

Edit: FFP, Mil/Mil, Zero Stop should all be implied as required.

In that price ~$2K price range you should also give the Leupold MK5 with the PR2 reticle a look. Feel free to call us at 916-670-1103 with any questions you have as well.

 

[gebhardt02]

@DocRDS If you ever want to discuss our scopes, just let me know. No obligation, just very happy to answer any questions you have regarding ZCO. Best of luck with your research.

 

[346ci]

Burris XTR3

 

[VargmatII]

I had a Razor G2 a few years ago. While I really liked the turrets, I was never really impressed with the glass. It bleeds a lot of color and when you go above 22-23x it gets a bit "milky" for lack of better words to describe it.
So, when I got a new job I figured that I was able to award myself with a PM2 5-25x56. Which turned out to be a great choice, I really like that scope and used it at shooting ranges, competitions and a few hunts for 2 years. Then like a dummy I sold it with the rifle it was on. Now 1,5 years down the road, I have tried a Delta Stryker for a while, but ended up buying a Kahles k624i and another 5-25x56 PM2. And while the Kahles is a great scope, the Schmidt is even better. And I cant see myself without a Schmidt again.

So moral of the story is. Get a Schmidt, you wont be sorry.

 

[Birddog6424]

The XTR3 is a rock solid optic at that price point. You'll like it better than the Razor.

 

[Bigrederic]

The XTR3 is a rock solid optic at that price point. You'll like it better than the Razor.

I really want to get a look through one... They have me really intrigued.

 

[steve123]

I almost think spending the extra $ on anything besides a Cronus "Gen2" to be a "not worth it" situation. I absolutely love mine. I had S&B's, still have one, have two March, had USO, and NF NXS, I have to say that I'm not planning on buying anymore expensive scopes because the G2 is that good.

I only had four 6.5 Saum cartridges left in my bin to try the 19"x21" steel at 1990Y earlier this week. Darned if I didn't cold bore it as witnessed by two friends! Then hit it with the last shot! There's nothing I don't like about the G2 and for $1450 or whatever you can snag one for they are a huge bargain.

I'd go straight to Tangent Theta if I were going to buy anything else though.

 

[fancygunz]

I almost think spending the extra $ on anything besides a Cronus "Gen2" to be a "not worth it" situation. I absolutely love mine. I had S&B's, still have one, have two March, had USO, and NF NXS, I have to say that I'm not planning on buying anymore expensive scopes because the G2 is that good.

I only had four 6.5 Saum cartridges left in my bin to try the 19"x21" steel at 1990Y earlier this week. Darned if I didn't cold bore it as witnessed by two friends! Then hit it with the last shot! There's nothing I don't like about the G2 and for $1450 or whatever you can snag one for they are a huge bargain.

I'd go straight to Tangent Theta if I were going to buy anything else though.

I keep reading positive anecdotes like yours about the Cronus Gen 2. People praising it all over the place. Then you get a group of guys saying don't bother with the budget Cronus, go with something like a Nightforce ATACR or something like that.

Since you have used S&B's, March, etc., what's the real deal? Optically and reliability-wise, are you getting anything tangible? Wish physical stores still existed and carried this stuff!

 

[Jgunner]

Cannot go wrong with an atacr, but there are a ton of great scopes mentioned above, not sure you could go wrong with any of them.

 

[Thorbeast]

I'd get a 7-35 ATACR... Scopes seem to be personal preferences, but I never see anyone complain about the 7-35 ATACR, about anything.

 

[beetroot]

I keep reading positive anecdotes like yours about the Cronus Gen 2. People praising it all over the place. Then you get a group of guys saying don't bother with the budget Cronus, go with something like a Nightforce ATACR or something like that.

Since you have used S&B's, March, etc., what's the real deal? Optically and reliability-wise, are you getting anything tangible? Wish physical stores still existed and carried this stuff!

The Cronus was the go to scope when they were being sold for $1200 to make way for the Gen 2 version.
The Cronus isn't anything special otherwise other than it sits in the scope "sweet spot" of $1500-$2000 where they are notably better than cheaper scopes but more expensive scopes get into diminishing returns.

The Cronus is very similar to the Delta Stryker, Tract Toric, and a few other models that are based on the same LOW design.
The Gen 2 Cronus only improved the turrets over the Gen 1, so any claims that the Cronus is some god tier scope are disingenuous.
It's like the Arken scopes but in a different price bracket, they both offer good value for money in their respective price bracket but some folk go over the top and claim they are the best scope in the world bar none.

Sort of like those that claim the only scope in the world that will never break is a Night Force, or anything made in China is complete rubbish, you can effectively ignore those kind of people.

 

[avastcosmicarena]

A lot of people seem to like the Tract Toric UHD 4.5-30 as an alternative to the Razor.

 

[Birddog6424]

A lot of people seem to like the Tract Toric UHD 4.5-30 as an alternative to the Razor.

The Tract is my least favorite LOW design. Its essentially owned by LOW and branded by them for Tract. Tract had nothing to do with the design of this scope. It's identical to the Delta Stryker at 41ozs and ridiculously tall turrets.

And for some reason, the ones I have looked through had a very unappealing sight picture and eyebox.

And I guess it rubs me wrong that they contact an OEM and say, hey, I like that scope, can you put our name on it? You don't even need to be a real scope company at that point. You just need some money and some warehouse employees.

 

[M77]

If you can find a used S&B PM2 5-25 I think that would be best bang for buck and is still a relevant scope today, in that price range I think you're sitting in the Leupold MK5 / Atacr 5-25 / Steiner t5xi 5-25 / Athlon Cronus range. Perhaps even checkout the new Minox 5-25 LR

 

[carbonbased]

If you don’t want to pay TT/ZCO money, people seem to really like the Minox ZP5.

But really, you need to buy a reticle you like, as that will probably be more of a differentiator at the top end, more than glass or anything else.

Just please don’t buy anything with a Horus! lol yeesh

 

[steve123]

I keep reading positive anecdotes like yours about the Cronus Gen 2. People praising it all over the place. Then you get a group of guys saying don't bother with the budget Cronus, go with something like a Nightforce ATACR or something like that.

Since you have used S&B's, March, etc., what's the real deal? Optically and reliability-wise, are you getting anything tangible? Wish physical stores still existed and carried this stuff!

It's the diminishing returns aspect for the most part. Basically paying double or more than the G2 Cronus for small nuances. Yes, my March HM 5-42 and my S&B are nicer scopes and they better be for the price but for me it's not worth the money anymore to get those nuances.
However I do need scopes with 10Y and 10M focus for FT air rifle comps so I will be keeping the nice scopes.

Too me the G2 Cronus with the APRS6 and superior turrets over previous gens has set it apart whereas the previous gens I sold because I didn't like the reticle or the turrets.

 

[koshkin]

The Tract is my least favorite LOW design. Its essentially owned by LOW and branded by them for Tract. Tract had nothing to do with the design of this scope. It's identical to the Delta Stryker at 41ozs and ridiculously tall turrets.

And for some reason, the ones I have looked through had a very unappealing sight picture and eyebox.

And I guess it rubs me wrong that they contact an OEM and say, hey, I like that scope, can you put our name on it? You don't even need to be a real scope company at that point. You just need some money and some warehouse employees.

Have you been in a meeting with an OEM? That is really not how talking to the OEM works. Besides, if using your logic, then the only 4.5-20x56 scope from LOW that you like should be the Stryker, right? To the best of my knowledge, all the other variants came to market afterwards. If you really want to get picky, I am moderately certain LOW came up with that design after their experience of working with Vortex on the Razor Gen2. They could not just re-brand the Gen2 (there is only one truly similar Gen2 variant out there I know of) and the turrets are proprietary to Vortex, so they needed to have a competing variant for other clients.

They are all related designs, but they are not identical. Tract does get a couple of things on the inside built differently. So does Delta. I do not have enough insight into Athlon and Trijicon versions to know what their negotiations with the LOW were like.

They also all QC things differently.

As far as the core optomechancial design of that scope, none of the companies selling it had anything to do with it. It was an internally developed design. The optomechanical variations between different brands are comparatively small and do not change the core design. There are differences though.

There is a reason why people look at them and have a preference (for example, you did not like the Toric you have seen) and it is not all sample variation.

ILya

 

[acudaowner]

I'll throw it in again 5x50x56 delta stryker

Edgun West | Delta Stryker HD 5-50x56 SFP

EDgun West Store - Leshiy 2 Edgun Fenix Epic Airguns Steyr Airguns Airmaks Airms Airgun Technology

www.edgunwest.com

add an adjustable rail and you get more elevation that any of the for-mentioned scopes have and still at least 500 dollars in your pocket cheaper price but your going to love the extra mag if you choose it it's double what any 5x25 is offering and as good glass as the nf I could not tell any differences except all the money saved yea they don't have a lot of choices as far as reticls go only 2 choices moa and I believe on mrad like I said not many choices best of luck with what ever you decide to get or go with may it serve you well .

 

[Birddog6424]

Have you been in a meeting with an OEM? That is really not how talking to the OEM works. Besides, if using your logic, then the only 4.5-20x56 scope from LOW that you like should be the Stryker, right? To the best of my knowledge, all the other variants came to market afterwards. If you really want to get picky, I am moderately certain LOW came up with that design after their experience of working with Vortex on the Razor Gen2. They could not just re-brand the Gen2 (there is only one truly similar Gen2 variant out there I know of) and the turrets are proprietary to Vortex, so they needed to have a competing variant for other clients.

They are all related designs, but they are not identical. Tract does get a couple of things on the inside built differently. So does Delta. I do not have enough insight into Athlon and Trijicon versions to know what their negotiations with the LOW were like.

They also all QC things differently.

As far as the core optomechancial design of that scope, none of the companies selling it had anything to do with it. It was an internally developed design. The optomechanical variations between different brands are comparatively small and do not change the core design. There are differences though.

There is a reason why people look at them and have a preference (for example, you did not like the Toric you have seen) and it is not all sample variation.

ILya

No, I wasn't in on the OEM meeting. My example of the conversation was clearly satire...

And I'm aware that there are variations. I'm aware that some approach the OEMs with their own designs, some use the OEM's design or modify that existing design to meet their needs. The differences between the strengths and weaknesses of various designs are there to see. I've actually always liked the Gen II Razor, but its also a pretty unique design. I also really like the Eotech Vudu, I think that's a very nice outside of the usual box Japanese made scope. And I like the XRSII. Its boringly reliable and easy to use.

I dont think LOW does a "bad" scope. But I do have my favorites.

 

[Hollywood 6mm]

I'd say Bushnell DMR3 or wait just a little longer and snag an XRS3 when those start shipping. I am a bit biased, though.

 

[HousePlant]

It's Jan 2022... still no XRS3 available. Still no reviews except one, which was basically a commercial.

 

[Hollywood 6mm]

It's Jan 2022... still no XRS3 available. Still no reviews except one, which was basically a commercial.

The first batch was on the website and has since sold out. Last I checked, GA Precision has them in stock.