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Rifle Scopes Shorty FFP high mag scopes?

M

man32ahan

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Feb 2, 2018
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Fairfield, Illinois
#1
What’s all out there that I’m not aware of. Has to be FFP mil based reticle. Prefer 34mm tube but not deal breaker. 4-20x,3-18x, 5-25x etc.

Ones I’m aware of:
Eotech Vudu, New NF NX8s, tangent theta.

Going on a shorty .308. So want it to Match. Not worried about weight of optic and more about length.

What you guys know of?
Thanks in advance.
 
#5
S&B PMII 3-20×50US


Tangent Theta TT315M 3-15×50


S&B PMII 5-20×50US


March F 3-24×52

ZCO 4-20×50 (w. S&B PMII 5-25×56 for comparison)
20190906_141801.jpg
 
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#21
koshkin said:
It is a nice scope, and it is less expensive than the ZCO, but I think the performance advantage of the ZCO justifies the price difference.

ILya
Click to expand...

I understand that, and greatly respect your opinion, but the OP asked "what's all out there?" So far, pretty much everything was mentioned but the Kahles. Which was my only reason for mentioning it. Perhaps I should have phrased my post differently.
 
#23
CStroud said:
I understand that, and greatly respect your opinion, but the OP asked "what's all out there?" So far, pretty much everything was mentioned but the Kahles. Which was my only reason for mentioning it. Perhaps I should have phrased my post differently.
Click to expand...

That's a fair point. K318i is definitely a scope that should be in the running.

ILya
 
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#27
Not sure what your limit is for short scopes, but the Bushnell HDMR 2 and the whole tactical line are fairly short and built solid. I've had mine for almost 2 years now with lots of rounds down range on multiple rifles and it has been great, especially for the price range it is in.
 
#28
Ill go out as far to say the S&B 5-20 ultrashort is the best ultrashort scope in this field. The best in resolution for a short scope, Military enviromental testing requirements beyond MIL-STD 810G, choices of reticles including those types that still like MOA, solid track record which includes nearly every Tier1 unit in the free western world which has three letters, 35mils on the knob of usable travel. All that and still only 11.8 inches long and still has a generous eyebox.
The 5-20 ultrashort is the king in this field and no amount of fingerfucking another expensive scope on a sunny range will prove otherwise. Theres a lot more to a top tier tactical scope that peoples lives depend on than comparing the "glass" and how the clicks feel.

My only complaint is the parallax adjustment can be a little tricky to set up compared to the longer scopes.
 
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#29
Got news for ya bud even S&Bs break. They're great optics but there isn’t an infallible man made product on earth. But just to ask have you compared it resolution wise to its competitors? Mainly referencing the ZCO 420. Also I’m not sure if the OP is deploying so reticle, knobs, glass, etc might actually be more important to him in this instance. Shit happens but for the most part in this price range these optics work regardless the brand and for intended use (hunting/comp) it makes it more difficult to choose IMHO.
 
#30
Well guess what my friend ive had personal S&B's break along with vortex razors, NFs, leupolds, steiners, USOs(a lot) ect ect., and broken quite a few during testings and trials. And I know a bit more about ZCO optics than you assume i do including the facility where they're made.
To answer your question, Yes.
And No im not a S&B fanboy nor do i think theyre good values, and my opinion is on this parameter of compact highpower optics.
 
#34
sharfshutz762 said:
Well guess what my friend ive had personal S&B's break along with vortex razors, NFs, leupolds, steiners, USOs(a lot) ect ect., and broken quite a few during testings and trials. And I know a bit more about ZCO optics than you assume i do including the facility where they're made.
To answer your question, Yes.
And No im not a S&B fanboy nor do i think theyre good values, and my opinion is on this parameter of compact highpower optics.
Click to expand...

Don't recall saying you didn't know anything about ZCO. Nor am i assuming you're an S&B fanboy. S&B has rightfully reserved a place at the top among high quality optics. I was simply asking if you had compared them to make such a blanket statement that S&B is best ultra short resolution wise and there was no disputing.. I'm not sure how knowing the facility that ZCO is made in answers my question. But assuming you compared them and liked the S&B better that's understandable we all see things differently. To each their own S&B is a great optic i wont argue that. Their reticles are useless IMHO which keeps me from buying them.
 
#35
I am not deploying, but will be using this optic in an LEO sniper capacity. It will get used a lot and in different conditions. So it does need to be durable and have a good factory warranty.

Im with @5RWill on S&B. I love the glass on their scopes and would love to own one, but they do not make a reticle I don’t hate.
 
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#36
@5RWill
Yes I have looked through the ZCO and I think the image is very nice. Did I feel the image was notably better than any of the other ultra short scopes with the exception of the Leupold MK6 . NO, Nor did I do an actual resolution test under different conditions so what my opinion of the glass of the ZCO means little.
As you said we have our opinions of what we want in a scope. My interest is in scopes that can handle extended water submersions, extreme temps of -50f to 160f, jumping out of planes at over 25k feet without fogging or seals popping, extreme rough handling in any combat enviroments, have good image and track like a swiss watch. And it matters very little what scopes I like, meeting specification for the endusers and what they like and adding value to the warfighter and taxpayer is pretty important. So far in THIS category the the 5-20 ultrashort and Nightforce 4-16 both in Tremor3 meets the specs the best and IMO the NF may be a better value.
For your needs im sure doesnt require the enviromental specifications above and the ZCO may be best for you.
YMMV

@man32ahan
Since you're wanting to use this scope as a LEO sniper capacity what reticle do you find to be an ideal close range sniper reticle since you find the Tremor3. h59. MSR. H2cmr to be inferior reticles for LEO sniping?
 
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#38
@man32ahan
Since you're wanting to use this scope as a LEO sniper capacity what reticle do you find to be an ideal close range sniper reticle since you find the Tremor3. h59. MSR. H2cmr to be inferior reticles for LEO sniping?
[/QUOTE]

I didn’t say any of them were inferior. I just don’t care for any of them. Reason being, I’m a simple reticle kind of guy. I dial wind so I don’t need Christmas tree reticles.

Tremor3 and H59 are too cluttered for me. Don’t like the msr reticle. The msr 2 reticle is not bad. Don’t like the circle dots on the h2cmr.

I just like a reticle with a floating center dot (tiny) and hash marks every .2-.5 mil.

For example, currently Nightforce Mil-C is my favorite reticle.
 
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#39
man32ahan said:
@man32ahan


I didn’t say any of them were inferior. I just don’t care for any of them. Reason being, I’m a simple reticle kind of guy. I dial wind so I don’t need Christmas tree reticles.

Tremor3 and H59 are too cluttered for me. Don’t like the msr reticle. The msr 2 reticle is not bad. Don’t like the circle dots on the h2cmr.

I just like a reticle with a floating center dot (tiny) and hash marks every .2-.5 mil.

For example, currently Nightforce Mil-C is my favorite reticle.
Click to expand...
Then you would probably also like the MD3 in the Vudu 5-25
MD3.jpg
 
#41
I’d go ZCO personally. From a market standpoint their putting out TT performance while undercutting TTs absurd price point. And at the end of the day you want the reticle you want and if that’s your favorite one i think it’s a no brainer. The only durability report I’ve heard of has been Uber positive too. Latest snipershide podcast the guy who won the team challenge for the snipershide cup intentionally tried to break his 527. He apparently has a history of scopes failing on him so he wanted to make sure. Long story short after multiple drops of the rifle he couldn’t get it to break.
 
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#44
man32ahan said:
@man32ahan
Since you're wanting to use this scope as a LEO sniper capacity what reticle do you find to be an ideal close range sniper reticle since you find the Tremor3. h59. MSR. H2cmr to be inferior reticles for LEO sniping?
Click to expand...

I didn’t say any of them were inferior. I just don’t care for any of them. Reason being, I’m a simple reticle kind of guy. I dial wind so I don’t need Christmas tree reticles.

Tremor3 and H59 are too cluttered for me. Don’t like the msr reticle. The msr 2 reticle is not bad. Don’t like the circle dots on the h2cmr.

I just like a reticle with a floating center dot (tiny) and hash marks every .2-.5 mil.

For example, currently Nightforce Mil-C is my favorite reticle.
[/QUOTE]


I know what you mean by liking a simple uncluttered reticle. I used to hunt with a NF with MIl-R reticle and I liked the simplicity of that one.
 
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#47
lancetkenyon said:
That is with a Manners PRS2 stock. Go with an EH1, and lose another pound.
Click to expand...

Very nice. TT315M on Q's Fix with 24" Proof barrel comes in under 10 lbs with folding stock and all. It is a really nice combination.

I like short scopes, so I am going to be testing EOTech's 5-25x50 on the Fix in a couple of weeks. I do not think the Vudu is going to dislodge the ZCO from its perch any time soon, but it is half the price. MD3 reticle is growing on me, but it would be nice if they offered a non-Horus tree reticle.

ILya
 
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#48
Looking forward to your Vudu review ILya
And your right, it’s not going to dethrone the ZCO. But if you shop around, you can find it for $1,300 NIB. That’s a ton of scope for the coin.
I spoke with an Eotech rep from the
Colorado Police Force that was at my range a few weeks ago and he noticed I was using Vudu 5-25’s on several rifles.
He told me it was specifically designed for the AR platform and that’s where it truly shines.
I have to agree, it’s quite a pleasure to shoot on an AR10
 
#49
Kickin45 said:
Looking forward to your Vudu review ILya
And your right, it’s not going to dethrone the ZCO. But if you shop around, you can find it for $1,300 NIB. That’s a ton of scope for the coin.
I spoke with an Eotech rep from the
Colorado Police Force that was at my range a few weeks ago and he noticed I was using Vudu 5-25’s on several rifles.
He told me it was specifically designed for the AR platform and that’s where it truly shines.
I have to agree, it’s quite a pleasure to shoot on an AR10
Click to expand...

Given the compactness, I think I can live with the CA just fine. I would have probably preferred it as a 4-20 or something similar since 4x is more important to me than 25x on a gas gun.

 
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