Spotters Sig 3K vs 6K vs Fury AB’s

[Gwood88]

I posted this on another forum but I didn’t get much feedback.

I’m looking for set of range finding 10x42 bino’s that can connect with a kestrel.

The Sig Kilo 3k’s are discontinued but still for sale for around $750 a lot of places.

The Vortex Fury 5000 AB look really cool since they don’t necessarily need a kestrel for ballistic data. But they are more expensive and I’ve read they have to be constantly resync’d with the kestrel when ever they go to sleep.

Sig 6k 10x42 model, these are the replacements for the 3K’s but there are only like 1 or 2 reviews out there on these, and they didn’t give me much info to sell me on them over the other options.

Anyone have experience with these options that can chime in? Or even better experience with all 3?

 

[Gingerbeardman]

I bought the kilo 3000 right before the 6k became available. Primary difference from what I can gather is ranging distance and the 6k can mark a location on Basemap. That seems like a pretty cool feature. Also, the 3000 will give AB corrections out to 800 without the kestrel. Honestly unless you really need the other features of the 6k or you really want to spend extra money on the Vortex, $750 for the 3000 seems like a pretty sweet deal. This past October I was able to get consistent ranges out to 3800 yards in relatively hazy conditions on rocks.

 

[Birddog6424]

The Sigs are the worst damn bino I have looked through short of some sort of $100 Chineseum POS. And that includes the new 10k.

I'm appalled at the complete lack of glass quality. It's like looking through binos while wearing blue tinted sunglasses.

When I think of all the big game I've spotted just because a patch of something in timber didn't look quite right, and turned out to be a game animal, I don't think I would use those things for anything but a firing solution.

Buy nice binos, and a rangefinder. Or get Leica's.

 

[Curahee19]

Swaro binos and get a range finder on the side

 

[Curahee19]

Sig should be ashamed of the quality glass they put in their 10k.

 

[Jumper]

The Sig 10ks blue haze is because of the coating they have to use to make their nice AMOLED display show up. Apparently the 6ks don't use the same display and the image is better. I just ordered a set from Liberty Optics 2 days ago after looking through a set at a local Cabela's. The image looked pretty good to me.

 

[gr8fuldoug]

The optical quality is vastly improved in the 6K. That blue tint/haze is gone.

 

[kswaterfowl]

My 6k has no blue tint to them.

 

[Todc]

The vortex are worth the $. There is no reason to connect them to a kestrel imo. Been running them in field matches and they are great.

 

[DuneShoot]

I looked through the 6K 10x32. The blue was for sure there, worse than the 3K.
Didn't have 6k 10x42 for me to try.
Anyone compared 6k 10x32 to 10x42's?

 

[verdugo60]

I was just at Scheels and they let me take them outside, had the Vortex Fury AB’s, the Sig 6K 10x42 and the Swaro EL Ranges side by side. Obviously, Swaro glass is better, even in a parking lot. The Sigs were NOT nearly as blue-tinted as the 10k’s. Makes sense, the 10k’s tint is due to the advanced display.

Until you’re ranging in a field environment it’s hard to compare but the 6K’s and Fury’s both had very fast returns on the lasers, which was cool. Glass is fairly close between the two with the edge going to the Vortex Fury’s. I think 6k will have the edge for laser but I didn’t have the setup or conditions to test that properly.

For the money both offerings are actually pretty good, this stuff is really advancing quickly. I hope Vortex does a Fury “10,000” or something similar, with their Razor UHD glass.

 

[Gwood88]

Thanks guys. That’s a lot of good info.

The 6k sounds like it would be the best for my needs.

I want to like the Fury’s but I’ve heard multiple reports of them having to be manually reconnected to the kestrel every time you want to use them and that would annoy me. I would like having the AB on board as a back up to the kestrel if I ever forgot it or it stopped working for some reason.

 

[verdugo60]

Thanks guys. That’s a lot of good info.

The 6k sounds like it would be the best for my needs.

I want to like the Fury’s but I’ve heard multiple reports of them having to be manually reconnected to the kestrel every time you want to use them and that would annoy me. I would like having the AB on board as a back up to the kestrel if I ever forgot it or it stopped working for some reason.

Why are you worried about connecting to the kestrel with the Fury’s? They have the full AB Elite ballistics so as long as the sensors update fairly quickly you have your drops. Of course wind is a factor that no binos can sense without a wind meter of some kind. I have found in field matches in NRL Hunter style matches you don’t have time to mess with connecting a kestrel to binos. You do with some hunting scenarios but sometimes not.

This is why having good ballistics on board is an upgrade over systems that needed to BT to a kestrel previously.

 

[HOOFER]

Love my 3ks. Total Game changer.

I still run an old school dope card. As in AK I did have them not update or something before I lost service and not connect or something. And not give me dope.

100 percent a user error. No fault of the system.

I however didn’t have my dope backed up. Manually. And shot over one of the largest caribou I have ever seen.

Never will not have a redundancy again….. I know better Anyway.

 

[Carl_Ross]

I have a pair of 6k 10x42's, just did a NRL hunter match with them, which was what I got them for.

They have better glass than the 3k's or 10k's I've looked through, with no noticeable tint. Not alpha glass either, for sure.

They easily connect with my Kestrel. If the Kestrel times out and shuts off, I usually have to range once before it starts giving corrections, not bad.

The data IS slower to get than on a 10k, as you have to wait 2s+ for it to cycle to an elevation screen, and more if you want windage (which I haven't been using). And, you HAVE to be connected to a Kestrel to get full functionality, not the case for 10k's, or I presume the Fury AB's I've never used.

On my unit the laser/reticle alignment is pretty decent, the laser is at 9:00 on the reticle circle, not too bad and easy to get right. Pretty impressed with the ranging overall.

 

[Birddog6424]

Going the opposite direction of this thread, but kinda funny, I simplified all the tech I was becoming dependant on. No Bluetooth to Kestrels, no AB firing solutions for every scenario, etc. I dumbed it down to the least amount of dependency I could manage in the field. I never even took my Kestrel out of my pack all season long.

I use an LRF and a write on turret.

I wrote in approximate elevation and temp for my dope, and it was pretty much money for the entire month of October for hunting. I dropped the temp a bit and re-wrote it for November/December. Covered it with scotch tape. Confirmed my dope several times to 900 yards throughout the season, it was always money.

It's an incredibly simple process that works for hunting. If I shot NRL Hunter this is absolutely what I would do. I just run my Steiners with an LRF. I don't sacrifice glass quality, they are an alpha glass bino. That's something I don't believe you should give up.

Range it, dial it, send it. Easy peasy.

I know Leupy is working on their version of the Race Dial. And you can buy the turret tape for a LOT less than binos with AB. I'm kinda surprised more people don't do it this way.

 

[wpeach1912]

Why are you worried about connecting to the kestrel with the Fury’s? They have the full AB Elite ballistics so as long as the sensors update fairly quickly you have your drops. Of course wind is a factor that no binos can sense without a wind meter of some kind. I have found in field matches in NRL Hunter style matches you don’t have time to mess with connecting a kestrel to binos. You do with some hunting scenarios but sometimes not.

This is why having good ballistics on board is an upgrade over systems that needed to BT to a kestrel previously.

The fury’s take at least 1-2 seconds longer to give a firing solution than the 3ks bluetoothed to a kestrel

 

[Gwood88]

Why are you worried about connecting to the kestrel with the Fury’s? They have the full AB Elite ballistics so as long as the sensors update fairly quickly you have your drops. Of course wind is a factor that no binos can sense without a wind meter of some kind. I have found in field matches in NRL Hunter style matches you don’t have time to mess with connecting a kestrel to binos. You do with some hunting scenarios but sometimes not.

This is why having good ballistics on board is an upgrade over systems that needed to BT to a kestrel previously.

I’ve heard other reports of stuff like this happening. Just sort of annoying.

But what you’re saying is exactly why I want to like the Fury’s.

Help please: Vortex Fury HD 5000 AB doesn't update data from Kestrel Elite when Fury wakes up

I have brand new Vortex Fury HD 5000 AB and I paired it with my Kestrel Elite Ballistics 5700. I wanted Kestrel to provide all the data so I set 'Kestrel Solution in Fury' to ON. Fury ranges everything fine the first time but after it goes to sleep (say after the set 30 seconds) and I try to...

www.snipershide.com

 

[verdugo60]

That’s

The fury’s take at least 1-2 seconds longer to give a firing solution than the 3ks bluetoothed to a kestrel

Good to know, they sound similar to the Leica’s s Far as display. One advantage of the Sigs.

Too bad Sig shit the bed on glass with the 10k’s.

 

[wpeach1912]

That’s

Good to know, they sound similar to the Leica’s s Far as display. One advantage of the Sigs.

Too bad Sig shit the bed on glass with the 10k’s.

The glass on the 3ks, at least, mine aren’t very blue and is pretty decent. Didn’t make me not find any targets at the Vernal Hunter match, and many other could not find targets. The sigs to take a few seconds to re-connect to the kestrel after going to sleep though

 

[verdugo60]

@wpeach1912 I had the 3K’s, they weren’t bad. The 10k’s are more blue but the laser is awesome. 3k laser was pretty good too actually, how’d it do with all the snow in Vernal? I heard it was a tough match, didn’t know if it was hard to range targets.

 

[wpeach1912]

@wpeach1912 I had the 3K’s, they weren’t bad. The 10k’s are more blue but the laser is awesome. 3k laser was pretty good too actually, how’d it do with all the snow in Vernal? I heard it was a tough match, didn’t know if it was hard to range targets.

No issues there, just the usual difficulty with the 3ks massive laser divergence trying to hit skylined targets

 

[DuneShoot]

Ordered the SIg 6K 10x42.
I read the manual hoping to shed some light on the different target modes and range modes but it didn't have much detail on each.
Anywhere else I can read up on these?

 

[4O6shootist]

They easily connect with my Kestrel. If the Kestrel times out and shuts off, I usually have to range once before it starts giving corrections, not bad.

I was under the impression that the 6k will give instant firing solutions out to 800y without connection to a kestrel? It either uses internal sensors or last known kestrel dope. Am I incorrect in this understanding?

 

[Carl_Ross]

I was under the impression that the 6k will give instant firing solutions out to 800y without connection to a kestrel? It either uses internal sensors or last known kestrel dope. Am I incorrect in this understanding?

It will, if it is set to AB Ultralight mode. If it's set to ABX, then it needs to talk to the Kestrel. I wanted the additional range the ABX would give me as I knew we were expecting some 900+ yd targets.

And...it still takes a couple seconds to scroll to the screen with the elevation correction, it displayed with the range like in the 8k & 10k.

 

[verdugo60]

No issues there, just the usual difficulty with the 3ks massive laser divergence trying to hit skylined targets

@SXS00 , what @wpeach1912 mentioned is the biggest test of a rangefinder. SIG has been doing good lately with lasers, I’m curious how good the 6K’s really are at this. The 10k’s are supposedly really good as far as laser. I have to think 10k 2.0 is being worked on with better glass, just hard to say timeline.

 

[4O6shootist]

@SXS00 , what @wpeach1912 mentioned is the biggest test of a rangefinder. SIG has been doing good lately with lasers, I’m curious how good the 6K’s really are at this. The 10k’s are supposedly really good as far as laser. I have to think 10k 2.0 is being worked on with better glass, just hard to say timeline.

Sig rep at Colorado hunter match said to expect 10k 2.0 with better glass in 2024.

 

[verdugo60]

Sig rep at Colorado hunter match said to expect 10k 2.0 with better glass in 2024.

Good to know, thanks man. I had to miss Dorgan’s match this year.

 

[4O6shootist]

Good to know, thanks man. I had to miss Dorgan’s match this year.

I was not there, but a good friend purchased a set of 10ks from the sig rep since his zeiss victory rf would not range well in the snow. Pynch did same since his Swaros were having same problem. The sig rep informed them of the next gen coming. Who knows when that'll come to fruition.

 

[st1650]

It’s either garbage software in a very good optical package (Leica) or very good software in a garbage optical package (kilo 10k)
I guess I’ll stick around with my Kilo 3K for another couple of years.

 

[eno00wen]

The Sig 10ks blue haze is because of the coating they have to use to make their nice AMOLED display show up. Apparently the 6ks don't use the same display and the image is better. I just ordered a set from Liberty Optics 2 days ago after looking through a set at a local Cabela's. The image looked pretty good to me.

I am pretty sure it has to do with the coating they use to filter the NIR of the 905 nm laser. Because you are shooting the laser out through one side and collecting it on the other for time of flight, there is a chance that laser is collected and focused on either eye and so they have a optical notch filter and it is too wide and blocking part of the spectrum your eye see as red. I am not an expert of optical filter costs but my guess is that a coating or material to make is super narrow and bring back the color would drive the cost through the roof. There is always a bespoke product for some nich application these days

Color, and color intensity is not as important to your sight, "phase" relation is more important for pattern detection.
A good place to learn about this is through modern video compression algorithms, or really the whole history of them.
Maybe someone can teach us more?

 

[eno00wen]

The Sigs are the worst damn bino I have looked through short of some sort of $100 Chineseum POS. And that includes the new 10k.

I'm appalled at the complete lack of glass quality. It's like looking through binos while wearing blue tinted sunglasses.

When I think of all the big game I've spotted just because a patch of something in timber didn't look quite right, and turned out to be a game animal, I don't think I would use those things for anything but a firing solution.

Buy nice binos, and a rangefinder. Or get Leica's.

I agree and am looking for more of a technical expansion. I think all of sig's stuff is heavily rebranded

The Sigs are the worst damn bino I have looked through short of some sort of $100 Chineseum POS. And that includes the new 10k.

I'm appalled at the complete lack of glass quality. It's like looking through binos while wearing blue tinted sunglasses.

When I think of all the big game I've spotted just because a patch of something in timber didn't look quite right, and turned out to be a game animal, I don't think I would use those things for anything but a firing solution.

Buy nice binos, and a rangefinder. Or get Leica's.

i think all of sig's stuff is heavly rebranded from asian optics, see attched tear down and data sheets from the fcc submittals, then look at that companies website, maybe we can ask them more specific design decisions?

 

[Jumper]

So I got a set of Kilo 6k's from Scott @LibertyOptics a couple weeks ago (Highly recommend Liberty optics). 10x42s. They are an excellent set of Bino Rangefinders. They range just about everything non reflective out to about 2000 yds. I was getting effortless returns on reflective targets 1500 yds further (that's 3500yds for any Marines who might put down the crayons and read this).

I didn't try the extended range mode. And this represents some pretty informal testing. And the laser is aligned perfectly with the aiming circle as far as I can tell. Which is something I was worried about since there's no calibration function like on the 10k's.

And, there's no blue tint! They link easily to my Kestrel. And that's all I wanted a set of bino rangefinders to do: have a good laser that links to my Kestrel with decent glass. The other features are just nice to have stuff. I don't plan on using them but maybe I will later on. With those requirements the SIGs were a better value than the Leicas or the 10k's for me.

 

[Scopeye]

Hi new to the forum and just can't take it no more after years of just lurking and only reading I'm here posting to offer a little education and some important noteworthy facts many probably don't even know or realize.

I can't seem to understand why so much interest in disposable throw away laser rangefinder binoculars since their limited 5 year electronics warranty starts ticking the moment they are manufactured which started from their dates of manufacture and not from their actual date of purchase and SIG has no desire nor intension to repair out of warranty electronics. The cheap discontinued models likely are already expired regarding electronics warranty or very close to expiration nobody knows until it's way too late after the fact trust me on this don't find out the hard way just don't buy SIG or Trijicon with any electronics in them even illuminated reticles have less than 5 years warranty not lifetime as people may think. Bushnell is the worst only one year only with original dated proof of purchase receipt and you actually thought Bushnell scopes with illuminated reticles have a real lifetime warranty think again you got duped seriously and they don't seem to even want to honor their own written lifetime warranty see BBB gave Bushnell an F rating for exactly that screwing over way too many of their own longtime customers over not honoring their own warranty still ongoing well over the past decade. They should be like Nikon and quit the scope business IMHO since they intend tojeep on screwing over their own customers over greed and keeping their own profits the highest which seems totally opposite of what Vortex is doing.

I just can't sit idle and read all of this SIG recommendations and know you all must really think they have a real lifetime warranty they're just like Bushnell using words such as lifetime warranty which they don't intend to actually honor but SIG was really smart about it and posted this 5 year electronics warranty from date of manufacture fact like Trijicon did to avoid legal issues from disgruntled customers after the fact.

Don't be ignorant but it's ok to be stupid since stupidity is a choice and ignorance isn't bliss in this case but now you know the facts you probably didn't befire this post. Choose stupidity and go ahead and buy it at least you are comfortably rich enough and perfectly willing to knowingly buy disposable throw away electronics when Leica has 15 years warranty less of a yearly hit cost divided by 15 years and they'll likely repair it after that 15 years is up too unlike SIG who isn't an actual manufacture unlike Leica or just buy the top of the line Vortex or Burris model which will never become obsolete because after it fails and all electronics will and do fail you get the newest latest and greatest replacement free of charge. Other lifetime warranty brands on their electronics still too new to determine longevity of their electronics warranty free swap outs for their latest and greatest but I'm personally waiting for Maven for their rangefinder binoculars since their rangefinder has insanely crazy clear glass and lifetime warranty even on their electronics straight from their horse's mouth via email reply I've saved.