Silver solder sight base?

freereload

freereload

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Minuteman
Sep 22, 2011
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Washington
#1
I'm working on a 700 build right now and I've thought that a surgeon action would be nice because the rail is milled as part of the receiver, not just screwed on. Then I thought, "Well, hey! I could just weld the rail onto my receiver for maximum durability and not worrying about those screws!" But then I remembered that welding warps stuff.
So then I thought, "Well, if it's good enough for the military, I'll let my OCD go."

Then I came up with silver-soldering the sight base to the receiver.
I have no idea what I'm talking about with this stuff, but if you could silver solder the rear portion of the sight rail, could you essentially bed your sight base while increasing durability and taking stress off those screws?
 
#2
Re: Silver solder sight base?

First....to get a good solder joint, both surfaces have to be clean - no paint or coatings, nothing other than the metal. so if you do decide to go for it, make sure it's all clean before you break out the torch.

Second, have you ever seen a base screw fail? Some of the commercially available bases have a recoil lug built into the bottom of the mount to reduce the shear stress on the base screws. I don't recall having ever seen a base screw fail, though I have seen a couple of instances in which the scope rings themselves have failed.

Bottom line -- don't let anybody tell you to not do it. But to me, it seems you're trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist.
 
#4
Re: Silver solder sight base?

My question is why? Even if one screw fails on a base you should have at least 3 more holding it on. And truthfully having the screw be the week point is a good thing. It allows for cheap easily replaceable parts to break before stressing the receiver. Just get a quality base, bed it, torque it down correctly and be done with it. Anything more and you creating a problem just solve it.
 
#5
Re: Silver solder sight base?

Fine. I'll use JB weld like a good boy.

And to answer someone's question...
I've seen one scope base break off after someone bumped their rifle off a tree while hunting(or so the story goes). I've also broken the base off my 10/22 while it was in a rifle case. I know the 10/22 has an aluminum receiver and all, but that stuff just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
I'm nit-picky about stuff like that. Don't mind me.
 
#6
Re: Silver solder sight base?

i always thought if a guy took and laid a good wide tig bead inside the 10/22 (or any AL receiver) you would have more beef than stock to drill and tap. but most receivers i have heard of pulling the threads out were an aluminum one
 
#7
Re: Silver solder sight base?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hink</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Second, have you ever seen a base screw fail? Some of the commercially available bases have a recoil lug built into the bottom of the mount to reduce the shear stress on the base screws. I don't recall having ever seen a base screw fail, though I have seen a couple of instances in which the scope rings themselves have failed.
</div></div>

Somewhat new here, been lirking mostly for a while.

I have recently seen base screws fail.

My son has a Remington 700 in 30.06. He was target shooting recently when all four base screws sheared off! The scope (mount and all) flew back and whacked him on the forehead.

After checking to make sure that he was alright, we all had a good laugh about it.

I have drilled out the screws, but trying to chase the threads has been a major chore. Just can't seem to get the tap to bite. I guess that I will wind up having to take it to a gunsmith. Although, the JB Weld does sound interesting.
 
#8
Re: Silver solder sight base?

I've had good luck with epoxy on scope bases and such. Generally, the more suitable epoxies have the longest full cure time. Five minute epoxy is not your friend here. For the best bond, both surfaces must be rough (non-polished) and absolutely clean and degreased. Buy the freshest epoxy available and mix it THOROUGHLY before applying it to both surfaces. All of the above assumes everything is at room temp. YMMV etc.
 
#9
Re: Silver solder sight base?

What scope base/screws was it that failed? If we're talking Leupold or similar I wouldn't be too surprised, but if it was Badger/Seekins I would be very surprised.
 
#10
Re: Silver solder sight base?

I have seen scopebases fail, even pinned bases.
So personally I prefer bases machined in one piece with the reciver.

Remenber the Rem 700 came in the 40th as a hunting action, and the majority of hunters just used open sights.
Why use an action made for open sights in 2011?
When everything else in perfected in absurdum, why keep something less than best?


Håkan
 
#11
Re: Silver solder sight base?

I have never seen a scope base screw fail yet , and I have a habit of carrying my rifle's by the scope I know I shouldn't I just always have .

I have seen iron sights silver soldered on .

I think you may be over thinking it a bit .
 
#12
Re: Silver solder sight base?

Just one base failure. On a 10-22. I've had a couple bases come loose and at the worst possible time of course.

Learnt my lesson and now use blue Loctite on the base and even on the ring screws.

One of the top reasons why I bought a Surgeon is it'll never break or come loose.
 
#14
Re: Silver solder sight base?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spuhr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When everything else in perfected in absurdum, why keep something less than best?


Håkan </div></div>
That's what I figured. Guess the Surgeon is the only way to achieve this on a 700 action.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Luke</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What scope base/screws was it that failed? If we're talking Leupold or similar I wouldn't be too surprised, but if it was Badger/Seekins I would be very surprised. </div></div>
I don't recall. I saw the 700 base break off before I knew anything about bolt guns, so I couldnt tell you. I don't think the owner is one likely to use a Badger base. Probably a cheaper Leupold deal.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dbateman™</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you may be over thinking it a bit . </div></div>
I'm known for that.
 
#15
Re: Silver solder sight base?

if a scope base has a lug that mates into the loading port of the action it takes all of the shear (recoil) stress off of the screws. Now all the screw has to do is hold down and thats what they are designed to do and they do that well. Im not sure how many scope bases we have sold (a bunch), but i have never got one back or had anyone complain about screws shearing off.

If you have a lugged base and you do break off the screws that hold it you have bigger problems. Like the land mine you stepped on, helicopter that crash landed on you...Its kind of like buying a mac truck to haul your bicycle, its going to work..
 
#16
Re: Silver solder sight base?

Glen

I agree that it shouldent shear off.
What I have seen more than once is screws that comes loose, despite beeing loctited.
That is why I not would spend 3000+ dollar on a long range system unless it has an integrated rail.

It's not a big deal, but when perfecting everything else, why leave this.

Håkan
 
#17
Re: Silver solder sight base?

I'm thinking that I may give the epoxy a try. If that fails, then the silver solder. The scope base that was on my son's rifle appeared to be a Leupold.

Thanks for the advise!
 
#19
Re: Silver solder sight base?

I suspect that if the screws sheared off they were likely over torqued, corroded, or had been battered by being loose a while and right on the verge of breaking anyway. A base with a lug should prevent that force from reaching the screws. Bedding the base should give 100% contact allowing maximum friction reducing shear forces. Adhering the base to the receiver takes that even further, the screws shouldn't really be neccesary, I left mine in anyway, it is also supposed to add some measure of rigidity. Silver solder would probably not be ideal, it seems it would be rather hard to get it to wick under the mount fully, the temps involved in soldering should not effect the temper of the receiver. If you do attempt it, be sure to tell us how it works.
 
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