Solid copper bullets

[WhiteOak]

Anyone with good hunting experiences with Barnes TTSX
.30 Cal for whitetails ?

 

[dddoo7]

I use Barnes solid copper in my muzzle loader and really like them.

 

[Aaros143]

Ive used Barnes 30 cal 150grn TTSX bullets for the past three years. Nothing but awesomeness.

 

[WhiteOak]

Good to hear ! What about accuracy and terminal performance at close and long range ?

 

[Aaros143]

I can group 1/2 MOA or under. This is using a Rem 700 AAC-SD with a 16.5 inch Barrel.
Terminal performance has always been great. From hogs at 20 meters to deer at 300.

 

[WhiteOak]

Impressive ! Do you take the high shoulder shot ?
Does it anchor em' ?

 

[quietmike]

I've loaded hundreds of the 168 tttx in 3006 for my son and my friends. Probably 80 deer dropped with them. Most drop like they've been pole axed. The farthest one has ran is 40 yards. Exit holes are between golf ball and baseball size.

Farthest shot is a bit over 300 yards.

 

[Aaros143]

High shoulder or at the base of the head. Where I hunt can vary between open fields and thick brush.
Always dropped immediately.

 

[WhiteOak]

Last year I bought a 3006, I touched one off on a bucks lower/ muscle part of his shoulder with a 150 gr. Power shok , he ran 15 or 20 yards and gave up.

Small exit , it did it's job, glad for it , but definitely wanting the same results you folks are having.

 

[AKONA]

Any TSX in any caliber will do a number. the key is speed. The more speed you get the better they work.
for the 308w a 130tsx works a lot better than the 150gr for that reason. the heavier ones should only be used in magnums.
Again, speed kills.

 

[Wicked Weapons]

I'm thinking like AKONA. Been working on loads with the 130gr TTSX for my 308 Tikka. Took it on a black bear hunt (as a back-up) but didn't use it, so haven't shot anything but paper yet.

 

[ptaylortx]

I use 168 ttsx in my 308 and they're great for whitetail. The 180 ttsx out of my 300wm [MENTION=89035]300[/MENTION]0 fps are like the hammer of Thor.

 

[WhiteOak]

I don't hand load, it'll be factory for me.
Doesn't sectional density play a part ?

 

[madarcher427]

What about barrel wear ? I was told they are hard on the barrel. Ive seen a lot of deer killed by them . They drop like the were hit by a hammer.

 

[WhiteOak]

I would think it would be like any other, the grooves cut into the bullet would be less bearing surface though.
The all copper is softer than copper alloy , unless they are talking about throat erosion.

I only shoot just before and during deer season.
I let my barrel cool down for each and every shot, I want that poi right there from a cold barrel , it's worked so far. Poi rises as my barrel heats up, but windage stays the same.

 

[FlashGordon]

Solid copper bullets

Not a TTSX but I took a doe last season with a 140gr Lapua Naturalis out of a 6.5 Creedmoor. Headshot, blew all the bone in its skull to bits. Sounded like a sack full of wet rocks when I picked it's head up.

 

[T J]

I don't hand load, it'll be factory for me.
Doesn't sectional density play a part ?

Sectional density is of far more importance with the "conventional" type of bullets as they tend to shed weight as the bullet penetrates. Solids don't shed nearly as much weight as the cup & core types. From the animals I've killed & those I've seen killed, I've witnessed Mono's stack a literal truck load of critters. Dozens of Barnes kills from 400yds & in & i've used the Cutting Edge projectiles out to just under 700 in a 6.5.

No bullet has the magic to save your ass from a poor shot; put it where it counts & you will have a dead mammal. I personally believe (you know what opinions are worth) that hunting bullets should make 2 holes. One in & one out. Barnes has never failed to do just that, ever.



t

 

[WhiteOak]

I did not know there was difference in lead and mono sectional density, this makes sense.

Looking for no magic ! Just solid results and something to stay with. Thanks for the info.

 

[AKONA]

I don't hand load, it'll be factory for me.
Doesn't sectional density play a part ?

No. In general sectional density is a factor in penetration but with these bullet's design work best with speed.
Let me explain....

Speed is achieved with lighter bullets and it helps the bullet behave to the maximum of its potential according to its intended terminal design that is to leave
as much energy as possible on the target. If you increase the grain you increase penetration but is it really needed? Because if, by increasing grain, you loose
speed then the bullet might not expand to the full size and leave as much energy on the target and even if the speed drops below the ideal speeds you might end
up with pin hole wounding. I had people loose game due to this condition. Lets take the popular 308 winchester for example.

In the smaller cases, lighter 308w solid bullets work much better than the heavier ones. The reason is, the heavy bullets are too long and steal too much case space making
the bullets starting slow already. And with slow I mean not slow for other designs but slow for barnes and other solid designs. If you look a the manufactures specs they give you a
nice threshold but you will find the bullets work better with more speed. so the heavy 308 bullets are really intended for larger calibers and magnums.

Of course things can be tuned with max COAL of chamber, magazine used, barrel length and distance to targets but lets say for the average out of the box
hunting rifle for the average ranges most folks hunt withing 300 yards and w/o getting into specialty stuff. The 150gr might be ideal for 30.06 but not really needed
unless one is going after the largest animals. Again the speed on impact is what matters the most.

Then if you try their 130gr TSX or TTSX in the 308w can put some brutal speed on those so at the average ranges and with animals like deer, mule deer, black bear
pigs, etc... where there is no so much mass as moose or brown bears to start with, the bullet expands better and leaves more energy before it passes through.
The 130gr hits the targets with more energy and on average 300fps higher than the 168gr TSX. They also have less recoil and shoot flatter adding to the benefits
for the average use.

Barnes uses the 130 ttsx to show case fast expansion. Like in many shooting situations less ends up being more in the end. All these facts are available on their website.
Just follow the manufacture's advice and test this and you will be all set.
http://www.barnesbullets.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/02/308WinWeb.pdf

These below would be the 130 ttsx at 100 to 150 yards for maximum effect. A 168gr TSX willl never achieve those speeds not even at the muzzle and will be +/- 600fps slower
at those distances (around 2,300fps) penetrating well but failing to transfer energy and wounding so efficiently. This is from barnes knowledge base / website.

http://www.barnesbullets.com/videos/308 130 TTSX 2906fps 3Gel_WMV9_640x480.wmv

http://www.barnesbullets.com/videos/308 130 TTSX 2912fps 16Gel_WMV9_640x480.wmv

The barrel life reduced with barnes is a myth. One of those online fantasies.

 

[madarcher427]

Thank you ! Which would use for larger game like in elk? With a .308.

No. In general sectional density is a factor in penetration but with these bullet's design work best with speed.
Let me explain....

Speed is achieved with lighter bullets and it helps the bullet behave to the maximum of its potential according to its intended terminal design that is to leave
as much energy as possible on the target. If you increase the grain you increase penetration but is it really needed? Because if, by increasing grain, you loose
speed then the bullet might not expand to the full size and leave as much energy on the target and even if the speed drops below the ideal speeds you might end
up with pin hole wounding. I had people loose game due to this condition. Lets take the popular 308 winchester for example.

In the smaller cases, lighter 308w solid bullets work much better than the heavier ones. The reason is, the heavy bullets are too long and steal too much case space making
the bullets starting slow already. And with slow I mean not slow for other designs but slow for barnes and other solid designs. If you look a the manufactures specs they give you a
nice threshold but you will find the bullets work better with more speed. so the heavy 308 bullets are really intended for larger calibers and magnums.

Of course things can be tuned with max COAL of chamber, magazine used, barrel length and distance to targets but lets say for the average out of the box
hunting rifle for the average ranges most folks hunt withing 300 yards and w/o getting into specialty stuff. The 150gr might be ideal for 30.06 but not really needed
unless one is going after the largest animals. Again the speed on impact is what matters the most.

Then if you try their 130gr TSX or TTSX in the 308w can put some brutal speed on those so at the average ranges and with animals like deer, mule deer, black bear
pigs, etc... where there is no so much mass as moose or brown bears to start with, the bullet expands better and leaves more energy before it passes through.
The 130gr hits the targets with more energy and on average 300fps higher than the 168gr TSX. They also have less recoil and shoot flatter adding to the benefits
for the average use.

Barnes uses the 130 ttsx to show case fast expansion. Like in many shooting situations less ends up being more in the end. All these facts are available on their website.
Just follow the manufacture's advice and test this and you will be all set.
http://www.barnesbullets.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/02/308WinWeb.pdf

These below would be the 130 ttsx at 100 to 150 yards for maximum effect. A 168gr TSX willl never achieve those speeds not even at the muzzle and will be +/- 600fps slower
at those distances (around 2,300fps) penetrating well but failing to transfer energy and wounding so efficiently. This is from barnes knowledge base / website.

http://www.barnesbullets.com/videos/308 130 TTSX 2906fps 3Gel_WMV9_640x480.wmv

http://www.barnesbullets.com/videos/308 130 TTSX 2912fps 16Gel_WMV9_640x480.wmv

The barrel life reduced with barnes is a myth. One of those online fantasies.

 

[WhiteOak]

I couldn't find 130 gr. Ttsx for factory 3006 loaded ammunition.
I do have the 150 gr. 3006 Ttsx and they say it's around 2970 muzzle velocity. Is that too slow ?
My farthest shot will be @ 200 yards

I have heard it takes speed.

 

[AKONA]

150 should be fine. The TTSX seems to start expansion a bit faster but then this changes
from model to model. The TSX is lethal medicine even in the little 223 62g and 70gr tsx all the way to the largests 458 calibers.
I don't like to say use this or this other one but what one has to do is to do the homework and be realistic with expectations and ranges one is harvesting animals.
Most complaints I hear from folks is because they are using the wrong bullets for the right calibers. So if you have an adversion towards lighter bullets look into
soft points jacketed and other choices.
the 168gr has been hardened and although they say min. threshold is 2000fps we know from experience they like the 2500fps to fully deploy the parachute. So
this might be perfect for a hot 30.06 or then the WSM or larger magnums that is even better. The 180 should be for the largest magnums and largest animals
like the largest bears. The 180gr bullets are very long. they have to be, they are made of solid copper. if you do not have a large case then you do not have enough
space for the fuel. Always check the twist rates as these get also tighter with length.
The 150 and 140 grains even the 130gr for deer/ mule and other animals will work better as I described.
you see once you get into the heavy game everyone likes to talk larger calibers and then the threshold goes down to 1800 and even 1600 due to the bullet wider channel and
overall section. In other words, they start to behave more like pistol hollow points but then this is rarely needed unless you go to africa. Also they are bad flyers (low bc) and
really ideal for close engagements.
Perhaps one of the most simple yet brutal would be the 358 winchester offspring of the 308w and for inexplicable reasons not that popular in America.
But very few things walking on this continent that with a single a 150gr bullet with those 2500/2600 fps on the target and good placement is not going to
come down.
Once again, with those 308s try to put speed on the targets. Then the solids will not disappoint.

 

[AKONA]

Here at midway...

Barnes Tipped Triple-Shock X Bullets 30 Cal (308 Diameter) 130 Grain


Barnes Tipped Triple-Shock X Bullets 30 Cal (308 Diameter) 150 Grain

For larger cases at closer distances or magnums at even at longer distances. Check twist and velocity on impact..

Barnes Tipped Triple-Shock X Bullets 30 Cal (308 Diameter) 180 Grain

 

[WhiteOak]

Thank you everyone for the enlightenment !