Rifle Scopes Steinter T5Xi > Burris XTR2?

MWM-5150

MWM-5150

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Full Member
Minuteman
Nov 5, 2010
204
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Springfield, MO
#1
So Im trying to make a final decision on an optic and I could use some insight from some people that may have actually worked with both of the scopes I have in mind.
Im torn between several optics, but the two scopes of interest today (it changes every day...) are...

Steiner T5xi 3-15
Burris XTRii 3-15

Rifle: Tikka CTR 308
Use: 85% Steel/Target - 15% Hunting (Dawn & Dusk)
Budget: Trying to keep it under $1500. For my purposes I really cant justify more than this.

Mechanically, the Burris has been a very solid performer, however the criticism that always seems to come up with these scopes is the glass. I'm not a glass snob by any means, but since the rifle will be my primary hunting rig I want to be sure the scope will not let me down at dawn&dusk. So my questions is, do you feel the glass in the T5Xi is really $500 better than the glass in the XTRii? If I have an animal at a tree line say 4-500yds away at dusk, is the Steiner going to provide me with that much extra clarity and brightness? I fully realize there are several other features provided by the T5xi beyond potentially "better glass", but to be completely honest the mechanical features provided by the XTR are really all I need. Are there other considerations I need to be aware of that may make the T5Xi worth the extra coin?

To complicate things further, another potential step up the ladder might be the DMR2. The only apprehension I have with this optic is the low end FOV. Both the T5Xi and XTR provide a 3x FOV of around 36'@100yds, while the Bushnell at 3.5x only has 25'@100yds. For target use this isn't as critical, but while hunting this makes a huge difference if you have an animal walk up on you inside of 50yds.

As a bit of history, the optic I have on my other rifle is a 4-16 PST. While I don't have any complaints with this one during the day, the brightness and clarity leave a lot to be desired at dawn & dusk.

Any insight you folks could offer would be appreciated.
 
#3
I've got a couple of the Burris and one of the Steiners. While both would work, if you have the extra coin I would go with the Steiner. The turrets on the Burris are good and dependable but I love the turrets on the Steiner and the glass is definitely better.
 
#5
I dont like the SCR for a hunting reticle. It is too hard for me to pick up quickly at low power. Off course when we want a do all, we have to make compromises. The glass in the DMRii and Steiner is considerably better than either of the xtrii I owned. I doubt you would have trouble finding an animal at 4-500yards with any of them.
 
#6
supercorndogs said:
I dont like the SCR for a hunting reticle. It is too hard for me to pick up quickly at low power. Off course when we want a do all, we have to make compromises. The glass in the DMRii and Steiner is considerably better than either of the xtrii I owned. I doubt you would have trouble finding an animal at 4-500yards with any of them.
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You make a valid point regarding the SCR, and this was another concern I had in mind. Would you argue that the G3 reticle in the DMR (or LRTS) scopes would be more visible in low-light, low-mag conditions? I suppose the illumination helps with all of them.
 
#7
MWM-5150 said:
You make a valid point regarding the SCR, and this was another concern I had in mind. Would you argue that the G3 reticle in the DMR (or LRTS) scopes would be more visible in low-light, low-mag conditions? I suppose the illumination helps with all of them.
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Yes the G3 and G2H are easier to pick up at low power. The SCR is easier for me on small targets. I mounted my DMRII last week and ran it a little beside my TX5i 3-15. I have been hunting with a 3-12 LRHS for a couple years now. I have been very impressed.
 
#8
supercorndogs said:
Yes the G3 and G2H are easier to pick up at low power. The SCR is easier for me on small targets. I mounted my DMRII last week and ran it a little beside my TX5i 3-15. I have been hunting with a 3-12 LRHS for a couple years now. I have been very impressed.
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How does the Steiner compare optically to the DMRII?

I compared mine to an ERS and LRHS(the one I got from you) and I'd say the Steiner beat them both out in terms of resolution. The LRHS controls CA a little better though.

I understand the DMRII has considerably better glass than the ERS did.
 
#9
lennyo3034 said:
How does the Steiner compare optically to the DMRII?

I compared mine to an ERS and LRHS(the one I got from you) and I'd say the Steiner beat them both out in terms of resolution. The LRHS controls CA a little better though.

I understand the DMRII has considerably better glass than the ERS did.
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I thought the LRHS had the best glass out of that group. The DMRII looks like the same glass as the DMR to me. It even still has that blueish tint.

Did you get one of the new LRHS, or the used one I had? Or did you get one of my used ones in late 2015? I swear the first two 4.5-18s I had were way out of their league optically. Then last year I found a deal and picked up three more. The one I used did not seem as good as the first two I used to own. The other two I sold without opening before I ever mounted the third.
 
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#10
The one I got from you was a 3-12. Don't remember if it was new or used. Do remember being very impressed with it's glass. I lent it to a friend that compared it to a USO ST-10 and said it beat out the USO handily.
 
#11
T5xi will have better glass than the XTR2 but $500 worth? I would think so.

lennyo3034 I heard DMR and DMRII are pretty similar glass wise. I've heard the T5xi is slight better than the DMRII, but I don't think the DMRII is considerably better than the ERS. My ERS suited me well for a while, but when I looked through my buddies DMRII, it felt almost similar. The ERS did have a more sensitive eye box though.
 
#13
I have two XTRs and am happy with them. I can't compare to the others you ask so I won't make stuff up, but I will say, any place I've hunted has had legal hunting hours of 30 minutes before sunup to 30 minutes after sunset. If you can't find your target and engage easily with XTR glass at the ranges you quote, I suggest you check your watch prior to pulling the trigger.
 
#14
supercorndogs said:
The DMRII looks like the same glass as the DMR to me. It even still has that blueish tint.
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That is so strange, the DMR II-i that I have does not have the blueish tint that my old DMR had. My old DMR had issues during low light, not bad by any means, but because of the blueish tint it caused some issues with clarity/contrast that the new DMR II has resolved. In lieu of your comments on the LRHS it almost sounds like the variance in quality between scopes appears to be quite large, this makes me wonder if I have an exceptional version of the DMR II??

To the OP, I've had both the Steiner T5Xi and the Burris XTR II (albeit different models) and I'd say the glass is better in the T5Xi in regard to clarity/resolution; however, both models exhibit really bad CA which bothered me for the price of the T5Xi but was acceptable at the price point of the XTR II. The DMR II also doesn't have the greatest control over CA but is acceptable for its price point, I would say it performs a little better than the original DMR in that regard.

As others have mentioned, I too would not recommend the SCR as a hunting reticle, it is too thin and would get lost in many contrasty hunting situations. The G3 reticle is definitely much better for contrasty situations. The DMR II-i has the best daylight illumination I have seen in a long range scope. Another factor is weight, the DMR II-i comes in at just over 35oz which is pretty heavy for a hunting scope, while the Burris XTR II 3-15x50 is just shy of 31oz.

Something else to consider is this, look at the classifieds for a used Premier LT 3-15x50 illuminated. You should be able to find them for under $1700 and at that price there is no other scope that can beat them optically. They only weigh 27oz which is great for a hunting/tactical rig. The only complaint is in the reticle selection, some complain the Gen II XR reticle is too thin (and some would say it works for them) and the only other option is the mildot reticle which is a bit thicker, but is not as usable as the Gen II XR.

In regard to the FOV of the DMR II at 25' at 100 yards, this is still 12.5' at 50 yards, do you not think you'll be able to pick up the animal with 12.5' FOV at only 50 yards away. I understand it will be "easier" with a greater FOV; however, I do not think it will be as much of a hindrance as you might think. One other thing to note with the DMR II is that it's closest parallax setting is at 75 yards, so if you think you'll be doing a lot of shooting under 75 yards then it might not be the right scope.

Here is the SCR reticle compared to the G3





Here is the DMR II-i illuminated in a somewhat contrasty situation, the reticle actually looks brighter than the image shows




 
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#15
Everyone loves the XTRii but every time I've loked through one, I'm consistently let down. I don't know if it's people just not understanding clarity or what, but @ 100 yards, there are a multitude of scopes I'd put ahead of the Burris in terms of optical quality.

Would definitely recommend a TX5i, DMR, or Razor Gen I over them, that's for sure.

 
#16
I personally own an XTR II 3-15x. In my opinion, glass quality really seems to make more difference in scopes above 20x. At my 15x top end and a 50mm objective, I don't feel like I'm giving up much at all to higher priced scopes, even in low light conditions.

My wife's scope is an XTR II 8-40x F-class. I can say image quality definitely darkens up once past 25x. But for broad daylight target shooting, there's no problem at all disecting a black LR F-class target's 5" X-ring on 30-40x at 800 yards.

Hope this helps.
 
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#17
I try not to sit in front of a keyboard and speculate about what may or may not happen while hunting. Or make statements that sound good on paper (internet) in regards to what works and what doesn't.

I have however been hunting pretty much year round with several of the XTR II's since they released nearly 3 years ago, and I haven't had any issues. No issues with glass, I can see my target, see horns if they're there, and shoot it. No issues with the SCR, it illuminates bright enough to make it clear against any backdrop that may wash it out. I respect the above posters, they have lots of experience with lots of scopes. But that's been my experience with the XTR II. It's been up to the task in every scenario I've subjected it to with a lot of days spent in the field.

I've only shot steel with the T5Xi, I like the scope. I also like Bushnell, one of my favorite brands that I have had on my hunting rifles for many years. I swapped out most of my Vortex stuff for Burris, but still have a pair of Razor HD binoculars that I take hunting. Lots of good brands to choose from. I don't think you can go wrong here. Thanks for considering the Burris.
 
#18
I appreciate the comments Gentlemen. Seems there is no question the Steiner will have an edge over the Burris in image quality. Im honestly not too concerned with the thinness of the SCR. If...IF I had a low light, short range shot the illumination would mitigate the thinness of the reticle at low power. Additionally I may have embellished the rifles use for hunting since the primary use will be steel/range. I just wanted that dawn/dusk performance there when I needed it. I may wait for some more info on the LRTS variants to surface before I pull the trigger.
 
#19
wjm308 said:
That is so strange, the DMR II-i that I have does not have the blueish tint that my old DMR had. My old DMR had issues during low light, not bad by any means, but because of the blueish tint it caused some issues with clarity/contrast that the new DMR II has resolved. In lieu of your comments on the LRHS it almost sounds like the variance in quality between scopes appears to be quite large, this makes me wonder if I have an exceptional version of the DMR II??


I have started to wonder if a lot of this arguing about glass has to do with manufacturer variation and that peoples eyes are not the big difference. I had about 7 ERS scopes. I sent one in for debris on the inside, and Bushnell sent me a replacement that had glass almost as bad as any XTRII I have seen. I am pretty sure it was a replacement anyway, unless there is something in assembly that can change the image and brightness. The LRHS scopes didn't show as big of a variation across the three I used, but I sure would like to look through those other two now. I think the ones with a reputation for having better glass, will consistently have better glass, but there are portably bad examples also. As they say sources change and I bet every batch of blanks is a little different.

I have only spent a couple hour with the DMRII so far, so please take my opinions on it with a grain of salt. I also sold my DMR's 2 years ago and haven't looked through one since. I also only had 2.
Click to expand...
 
#20
MWM-5150 said:
I appreciate the comments Gentlemen. Seems there is no question the Steiner will have an edge over the Burris in image quality. Im honestly not too concerned with the thinness of the SCR. If...IF I had a low light, short range shot the illumination would mitigate the thinness of the reticle at low power. Additionally I may have embellished the rifles use for hunting since the primary use will be steel/range. I just wanted that dawn/dusk performance there when I needed it. I may wait for some more info on the LRTS variants to surface before I pull the trigger.
Click to expand...

I can't see the illumination on my Steiner Tx5i 3-15 in the day time.
 
#21
I'm not a "glass snob" either. I do happen to own both the T5xi and the XTRII. I have personally felt that both are reliable. I recently killed a good size buck in Alabama. It was half in the tree line and half out. Lots of shadows. The XTRII performed flawlessly. The deer never took another step. DRT. I have not shot either scope beyond 1000 yards in low light. I have shot both out to about 750 as light was beginning to go away. But I would also caution that a reflective metal target is going to present you a different quality image than an elk or deer in lower light at long range.
The bottom line is if you would benefit by having the extra money in your pocket, have confidence the XTRII works just fine. In fact, for what I paid for my T5xi, I could have gotten two XTRII's.
 
#22
I was recently trying to make the same decision. I hunt with the xtr ii and I'll be the first to admit it doesn't have the greatest glass but I've also had no issues with it's low light capabilities. I just can't justify coughing up the extra coin when it does everything I practically need.
 
#23
Having both, the Steiner does have better glass. But I'm happy with both. For hunting I prefer the better glass for the low light conditions

My wife thinks I only have 3 guns

 
#24
Rerun7 said:
I was recently trying to make the same decision. I hunt with the xtr ii and I'll be the first to admit it doesn't have the greatest glass but I've also had no issues with it's low light capabilities. I just can't justify coughing up the extra coin when it does everything I practically need.
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This is where I'm at right now...Without seeing the difference for myself, its hard to tell if its really worth it to me. However, if I can afford the nicer glass, I doubt that I would every regret coughing up the extra coin...
 
#25
just browsing said:
Everyone loves the XTRii but every time I've loked through one, I'm consistently let down. I don't know if it's people just not understanding clarity or what, but @ 100 yards, there are a multitude of scopes I'd put ahead of the Burris in terms of optical quality.

Would definitely recommend a TX5i, DMR, or Razor Gen I over them, that's for sure.
Click to expand...

Perhaps those people already understand that "crispness" or "clarity" doesn't help you to hit your target better.

Here on the Hide we always debate glass glass glass..... ad nauseum. The average guy out there buys a scope after a bit of research, takes it out and shoots it. Realizes it works great, and likes it. Those are all the people that love the XTR II. They don't over analyze it, they buy it and shoot it. It tracks great and is one of the most durable scopes in the industry. Every single experienced shooter on this board can find and shoot their targets just as well with an XTR II, DMR, XRS, or PST as they can with a $3000 scope. It's a magnified device with a focus knob.

Those scopes may not have a pretty blue sky or resolve ever leaf on a limb with Ansel Adams clarity, but you can find and hit your target every time. That's enough for the large majority of shooters.
 
#26
Rerun7 said:
I just can't justify coughing up the extra coin when it does everything I practically need.
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And this is truly where we find ourselves today, there are so many scopes out that are more than capable of the task. If you are spending anywhere close to $1000 from a reputable manufacturer you will most likely get a fantastic scope. Sure there are nuances that we can debate about until the cows come home, but the reality is that manufacturing has improved greatly and whether the scope was made in the Philippines, Japan, Germany or the USA makes little difference in whether or not it will track properly, it's more about the manufacturing process; labor may be cheaper in one location vs. another but that doesn't mean quality will be inferior. I have stated multiple times on the forum that if you have a scope that you are happy with and works for you, then there is no need for you to look elsewhere. If you are looking at upgrading your scope simply because you want "better glass" then you are about to engage on a journey that will cost you a lot of money but may not end up with you getting more hits on targets or taking more game than you have before. If your scope is not tracking properly and you do long range shooting where you are dialing elevation then you have an issue and I can see wanting to upgrade, but you seriously have to consider almost anything else as a reason to upgrade is really more personal preference than it is necessity and you would probably be better served investing that time and money you spend on upgrading your scope in ammo and range time. Take it from someone who's spent way too much money in my own glass obsession disorder!
 
#27
wjm308 said:
And this is truly where we find ourselves today, there are so many scopes out that are more than capable of the task. If you are spending anywhere close to $1000 from a reputable manufacturer you will most likely get a fantastic scope. Sure there are nuances that we can debate about until the cows come home, but the reality is that manufacturing has improved greatly and whether the scope was made in the Philippines, Japan, Germany or the USA makes little difference in whether or not it will track properly, it's more about the manufacturing process; labor may be cheaper in one location vs. another but that doesn't mean quality will be inferior. I have stated multiple times on the forum that if you have a scope that you are happy with and works for you, then there is no need for you to look elsewhere. If you are looking at upgrading your scope simply because you want "better glass" then you are about to engage on a journey that will cost you a lot of money but may not end up with you getting more hits on targets or taking more game than you have before. If your scope is not tracking properly and you do long range shooting where you are dialing elevation then you have an issue and I can see wanting to upgrade, but you seriously have to consider almost anything else as a reason to upgrade is really more personal preference than it is necessity and you would probably be better served investing that time and money you spend on upgrading your scope in ammo and range time. Take it from someone who's spent way too much money in my own glass obsession disorder!
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I guess I had better stay out of your heavy & midweight scope evaluation threads!
 
#28
Is it necessary to have top end glass to merely hit targets and see and engage game animals with, No.. But I can attest to spending 1,000+ and dialing the optic all the way up to only get a blurry ass view of your intended target.. That in itself is very disappointing and makes you second guess you purchase. I think it's a personal preference like Bill has stated, as long as it tracks and your fine with it then roll with it...
 
#29
wjm308 said:
And this is truly where we find ourselves today, there are so many scopes out that are more than capable of the task. If you are spending anywhere close to $1000 from a reputable manufacturer you will most likely get a fantastic scope. Sure there are nuances that we can debate about until the cows come home, but the reality is that manufacturing has improved greatly and whether the scope was made in the Philippines, Japan, Germany or the USA makes little difference in whether or not it will track properly, it's more about the manufacturing process; labor may be cheaper in one location vs. another but that doesn't mean quality will be inferior. I have stated multiple times on the forum that if you have a scope that you are happy with and works for you, then there is no need for you to look elsewhere. If you are looking at upgrading your scope simply because you want "better glass" then you are about to engage on a journey that will cost you a lot of money but may not end up with you getting more hits on targets or taking more game than you have before. If your scope is not tracking properly and you do long range shooting where you are dialing elevation then you have an issue and I can see wanting to upgrade, but you seriously have to consider almost anything else as a reason to upgrade is really more personal preference than it is necessity and you would probably be better served investing that time and money you spend on upgrading your scope in ammo and range time. Take it from someone who's spent way too much money in my own glass obsession disorder!
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An accurate and insightful post Bill...

Lord knows it's certainly nice to be able to get nice optics on 8 or 9 different rifles without having to take out a second mortgage on my home. An obvious reason to be a fan of quality mid range optics.
 
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#30
I was in a similar spot and was looking at a number, including these two, scopes in the range of $1000-1500. First off, like others mentioned it's all about preference these days because there are so many options to hit your target but there isn't a nexus out there that does it all in this range without some compromise. It really is what is most important to your preferences and functional requirements.

So, long story short I tried XTRII, DMR, Athlon Ares, Sightron S3, Primary Arms, EXRS, Razor and these will all hit targets at range. I ended up grabbing the Bushnell Elite XRS 4.5-30x with H-59 reticle because of the quality and versatility. It tracks well, glass is really good, solid click, nice reticle, 4.5-30x is nice, and they have a lifetime warranty. After I wrote down my functional requirements and compared with all the other options it met the most features although it was on the higher end of where I wanted to be but was well worth the $1500 shipped.

It's been 4 months and if I had to choose again with this range (price and functional requirements) I would do it again. I have always been a fan of Horus reticles but I am also starting to like the G2 as well for a less busy option if you don't want to pay the Horus tax or prefer a less busy reticle. It performs well for 3gun matches, and long range target matches. It is a nice all around scope where I can use for short range 50-100 meters and quickly transition to out over 1600 meters all day long with my bone stock 6.5 CM RPR.

If I had to do it in a lower price range ($500-1000) then I would go with the Sightron S3 6-24x50 which is $850 ish with current promotional discounts and coupons. To this day the Sightron glass is always a pleasure and surprises me every time I use one. But Sightron may not have all the features that other scopes have in this range. I will probably grab a Sightron SVSS 10-50x60 for a dedicated long range build once I get the CFO (aka Wife) approval in a few months (years) but if you are looking for versatility take a look at the Elite XRS. If you are looking for dedicated long range scope then Sightron is a good value for what you get.

One more thing... if you notice over the last 3-4 years there has been a drastic increase in functionality and quality in this range. Vortex seems to be the latest value vendor but it's now creeping up into a higher range due to popularity. And so another vendor will emerge and fill that lower-middle range spot soon. It could be Athlon or another company. This will likely continue and with this increased market competition and in the next 2-3 years the value you get in this price range will increase as well. Try to get what you need and save the remainder for the next big jump in features and quality and it will probably be less than what a comparable unit is priced today. This market is under a margin squeeze which will mean better value for buyers in the future.
 
#31
MWM-5150 said:
I guess I had better stay out of your heavy & midweight scope evaluation threads!
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AMEN TO THIS!!! As much as I enjoy reading his reviews and as informative/helpful as they are, his last evaluation is gonna cost me a lot if money. After a bit of research and having read his thread, I've decided to get the Minox ZP5 5-25 and the AMG. Aahhh, there is truth in "once you look through and start using top tier glass, you're pretty much ruined from then on" ...
 
#32
Wyzrd said:
AMEN TO THIS!!! As much as I enjoy reading his reviews and as informative/helpful as they are, his last evaluation is gonna cost me a lot if money. After a bit of research and having read his thread, I've decided to get the Minox ZP5 5-25 and the AMG. Aahhh, there is truth in "once you look through and start using top tier glass, you're pretty much ruined from then on" ...
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Yep, totally agree on this! I just can't justify having an optic that is a 20-25 magnification but can't resolve clearly at anything above 15x.. That's just me, I can't speak for anyone else..
 
#33
I recently purchased a bushnell LRHS and like it a lot, although a regular mildot and a cheaper retail price point would be nice. Everything about it is "good enough," you get a zero stop + low pro 10 mil turret, it's not stupid heavy like the HDMR, eyebox isn't bad etc....

Steiner T5XI 3-15 was great, regret selling it.

IMHO if you aren't happy with the PST glass quality then skip the XTR, it's not remarkably better and might even be worse depending on who is looking through it.
 
#34
I own a Burris XTR and have shot a Steiner. The Steiner does have slightly better glass, but the burris is way cheaper. I'd go with Steiner if you have the coin, otherwise, the build quality is the same. Burris owns Steiner so they share the same internal guts, just different glass.
 
#35
I owned a Burris Xtr2 5-25x50 i was impressed for the money. Never looked through the Steiner. Being that the same parent company owns them both, many speculated that the erectors were of similar design. Glass wasn't great on the Burris. All the functions were there and it helped me win my first long range competition. The Illumination crapped out immediately after buying it. If I were you, I'd check out Sig Sauers Tango 4 4-16x44 FFP all the bells and whistles. FFP, zero stop, Illumination, Bright glass( Opinion), light weight 26oz?, 70ish moa internal travel, Available with the Lev-d reticle, electronic leveling system($800ish). I bought the 3-12x42 Tango 4 for a S&W M&P 10 and am I impressed!

IanHusaberg out
 
#36
I had always heard that German Glass is the best in the business. I saved for almost a year and found a Steiner Military 5-25x56 T5Xi. I haven't been able to mount it yet because I'm still waiting on Manners. After reading these post, I feel like I made a bad mistake in my purchase. Unfortunately it's past the return date.
 
#37
TheBeard413 said:
I had always heard that German Glass is the best in the business. I saved for almost a year and found a Steiner Military 5-25x56 T5Xi. I haven't been able to mount it yet because I'm still waiting on Manners. After reading these post, I feel like I made a bad mistake in my purchase. Unfortunately it's past the return date.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't let a few comments on here discourage you on your purchase. Mount it up and try it out, you may find you love it. There are a lot of positive reviews for the T5Xi scopes with the upgraded turrets.
 
#38
TheBeard413 said:
I had always heard that German Glass is the best in the business. I saved for almost a year and found a Steiner Military 5-25x56 T5Xi. I haven't been able to mount it yet because I'm still waiting on Manners. After reading these post, I feel like I made a bad mistake in my purchase. Unfortunately it's past the return date.
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If you purchased a "Military" it would be the M5Xi, German manufacture, and it should be a great scope for you. The "T" series is a completely different platform manufactured in Colorado.
 
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#39
plong said:
If you purchased a "Military" it would be the M5Xi, German manufacture, and it should be a great scope for you. The "T" series is a completely different platform manufactured in Colorado.
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Yeah I just realized it's the model #5550 Steiner Germany M5Xi Military. Honestly I had saved quite a bit of money for a Steiner and my wife went through my iPad and found the M5Xi that I had booked marked and ordered it without my knowledge. Now I'm just looking for a Spuhr # SP-4603B to mount it. Owners manual suggests a 45moa rail. My action has 20MOA, so with this SPUHR I'll have 40MOA. My goal this year it to hit 1500yards but most of my longest shots will only go out to 1240yards.
 
#41
lennyo3034 said:
You got a good one then. That's a keeper.


Im going to leave this ambiguous referring to the wife and the scope.
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She literally passed on a new car. I mean we had planned on buying a new car this year but, she said her car is a 2011 and has 50k on the odometer. Seeing me utterly speechless was worth every penny to her. I guess next year instead of a new Subaru I should be looking at a Lexus. Maybe that's the moral of the story. She has been asking to buy one for the past 3 years and I always said no.
 
#42
Made in Germany M5Xi MSR 5-25x56. She said should could tell I was conflicted. I already own a Vortex Razor AMG. I had the AMG, NF Beast, and this Steiner all booked marked. She thought I'd be upset she went through my iPad. I honestly probably would have taken another 2 months to make the decision. No worries, she made it for me. She knew I really wanted the BEAST but when she looked online this one had better reviews. I still don't know what she actually spent on it, "it was on sale". LOL
 

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#44
Jethatsme said:
Tx5i or Bushnell Elite. Burris will likely fail on you at some point in the near future, whether it be illumination or mechanical issues.
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OK,......I'll bite...

You are basing this assessment of the Burris on what?

I'll grant you they had illumination issues on the early releases. Long since addressed. And I've heard the sales numbers of how many of these are out there. And I've heard how many they see come back for "mechanical issues". The return rate is phenomenally low. Pretty much any optics manufacturer would be proud of it. The XTR II is one of the most solid mechanical scopes on the market. Frank Galli says he sees them everywhere in his classes and owns one himself, and has never seen one that failed to perform. He mentioned it as one of his 3 favorite scopes under $1500. So I'm curious as to what data you have access to that says otherwise?
 
#46
Birddog6424 said:
OK,......I'll bite...

You are basing this assessment of the Burris on what?

I'll grant you they had illumination issues on the early releases. Long since addressed. And I've heard the sales numbers of how many of these are out there. And I've heard how many they see come back for "mechanical issues". The return rate is phenomenally low. Pretty much any optics manufacturer would be proud of it. The XTR II is one of the most solid mechanical scopes on the market. Frank Galli says he sees them everywhere in his classes and owns one himself, and has never seen one that failed to perform. He mentioned it as one of his 3 favorite scopes under $1500. So I'm curious as to what data you have access to that says otherwise?
Click to expand...

Simply owning a Burris XTR whose turret became damaged and being at the range with a friend running a burris XTR 1-5 whose illumination failed. Safe to say I have owned the brand, sold the brand and been in the company of another when the brand failed. Best data points I can live by. Sorry. If you own one or rep the brand and are simply offended by the comment, I can't really help you there. My two cents and end of my response for this chain.
 
#47
Ok I'm getting pretty well versed in this value area lately so I'll play

I'll try to put them in order of prices, or at least lump them close together in that area. And I won't speak about the scopes I don't own yet like the PST 2. But they seem like another good option

So the requirements seem to be...

illumination
Good value for your money
Effective resolution level
Mechanically sound, and tracks
seem to be sticking to the more tactically oriented style scope in the convo so I'll go in that direction as well

On the low priced end right now, but just as effective I think

Weaver 3-15X50 EMDR no zero stop, but has locking turrets and works great as a hunting scope. Natchez is selling for $600 right now

XTR2 3-15 they will work, and I think glass quality is a wash until you start spending some money. For what it's worth... I currently have an XTR2 at Burris for illumination repair, and it came new with spots of crap on the interior lens that moves around while shooting. Is it top of my list? ... No, but I have never been able to blame my misses on it I've had the 1.5-8, 3-15, & 8-40. You get a couple interesting reticle choices in the xtr2 for the prices. I'd. Still say the lower magnification options as a viable choice even though I've had pretty much all the normal issues that seem to have come up with them.

I've got the LRTSi 4.5-18 and think that serves the hunting role better than the DMR. Depending on model worst thing noticed about the LRTSi so far is the possibility of getting a parallax knob labeled incorrectly. But they still function just fine. Don't have enough history on this yet to say, how well it holds up though...

Weaver 6-30x56 more target oriented magnification range than the last couple, but I've got a couple and no complains so far. I swear these are just a slightly bigger DMR with different reticle. I can't see the difference between them and the DMR.


I have the HDMR-2, but I will lump it and the DMR-2 in the same category. I think glass is still a wash as far as function goes, but the DMRs give some better tricked out reticle options like the G3 or the H59 compared to the Weaver.

​​​​​​
 
#48
Jethatsme said:
Simply owning a Burris XTR whose turret became damaged and being at the range with a friend running a burris XTR 1-5 whose illumination failed. Safe to say I have owned the brand, sold the brand and been in the company of another when the brand failed. Best data points I can live by. Sorry. If you own one or rep the brand and are simply offended by the comment, I can't really help you there. My two cents and end of my response for this chain.
Click to expand...

I'm not offended. I was simply asking what you were using as a basis for your statement.

Well if you managed to break a turret you are in a very extreme minority. It's probably the least likely item on the scope to have issues. It became damaged is kinda vague. You broke it, or it broke on it's own. Your "buddy" will be happy to hear they have the illumination issues worked out. My second XTR was a little buggy. I've gotten a bunch and played with a bunch more since then without issue.

No gear is bulletproof no matter how much you spend. I broke the turret on a MK8 in a 3 gun dump box (Leupold's customer service was excellent). Oddly enough, my 1.5x8 has taken a far worse beating then I ever put my Leupold through without missing a beat. I've broken two aluminum and one plastic Switchview off it. But based on the number of returns to Greeley versus how many of these are out there, it's more than safe to say this is a very durable scope line. Sorry you had trouble with yours.

I beat the hell out of this scope for two years. Finally retired it when the 1-8 came out,
vD0scyX.jpg
 
Last edited:
#49
supercorndogs said:
I thought the LRHS had the best glass out of that group. The DMRII looks like the same glass as the DMR to me. It even still has that blueish tint.

Did you get one of the new LRHS, or the used one I had? Or did you get one of my used ones in late 2015? I swear the first two 4.5-18s I had were way out of their league optically. Then last year I found a deal and picked up three more. The one I used did not seem as good as the first two I used to own. The other two I sold without opening before I ever mounted the third.
Click to expand...

I am going to have to take this back. The bluish tint was just the way my paper looked in the shadows of the early morning with the sun rising behind the back stop. The glass in the DMRII is a step up from the DMR and right on par with the TX5i.
 
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