What primers do you use and why? Does it really make a diffrence to which ones you use? If you have tried more than one please tell me the pros and cons...just trying to learn the most i can! Thanks yall
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Take on Primers?
- Thread starter adm09_003
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Re: Take on Primers?
I have always used federal 215's in my mag. loads but last week I loaded 2 identical loads of 3 each one with Fed. 215's the other with cci 250's and I did this with 3 different powders. One powder grouped better with 215s the next would group better with the 250's. I didn't check velocity yet.
Ken
I have always used federal 215's in my mag. loads but last week I loaded 2 identical loads of 3 each one with Fed. 215's the other with cci 250's and I did this with 3 different powders. One powder grouped better with 215s the next would group better with the 250's. I didn't check velocity yet.
Ken
Re: Take on Primers?
Unless we're competing in the Interplantary Benchrest of the Universe match, or we are of that mentality, one primer or the other does not matter enough to lose sleep over though there are distinctions like cup hardness for example. In 6 RAT we like Wolf small rifle magnum primers due to their apparent low sd and consistency. Certainly we will stay with the primer used to develop the load.
Also, I just do what the scientific type shooters say to do. Dan Newberry convinces me to use the OCW method which holds that THE optimal charge weight is not susceptible to variations in primer brands. Glenn Zediker convinces me Remington 7 1/5 small rifle primers are good at this time. So that's what I use. Large rifle would be CCI BR2. In a rifle prone to blow primers I use CCI #41.
Unless we're competing in the Interplantary Benchrest of the Universe match, or we are of that mentality, one primer or the other does not matter enough to lose sleep over though there are distinctions like cup hardness for example. In 6 RAT we like Wolf small rifle magnum primers due to their apparent low sd and consistency. Certainly we will stay with the primer used to develop the load.
Also, I just do what the scientific type shooters say to do. Dan Newberry convinces me to use the OCW method which holds that THE optimal charge weight is not susceptible to variations in primer brands. Glenn Zediker convinces me Remington 7 1/5 small rifle primers are good at this time. So that's what I use. Large rifle would be CCI BR2. In a rifle prone to blow primers I use CCI #41.
Re: Take on Primers?
All I use now is CCI250s. I have tried and still have a lot of Wolf LRM, FGMM 210Ms and Winchester 9.5 primers. The CCI would give me the best overall accuracy in both my 7WSM and .308.
I just finished load developing for my .308 and found out that the Wolf LRM primers would start stringing up and down the hotter I went with the load. I thought it was just it could have been me, but I repeated it a couple of times and shot a known load and everything went back to normal. On my 7WSM, I would get hanf fires with the Wolfs. Federal 210Ms are OK on my .308. The CCI 250s just shoot more consistent for me and it reflects when I shoot it over a chrono.
Every gun is going to be different. Just that I found it easier to get the load down on my rifles with CCI. I am sure if I changed some things around, it will shoot with other primers too.
All I use now is CCI250s. I have tried and still have a lot of Wolf LRM, FGMM 210Ms and Winchester 9.5 primers. The CCI would give me the best overall accuracy in both my 7WSM and .308.
I just finished load developing for my .308 and found out that the Wolf LRM primers would start stringing up and down the hotter I went with the load. I thought it was just it could have been me, but I repeated it a couple of times and shot a known load and everything went back to normal. On my 7WSM, I would get hanf fires with the Wolfs. Federal 210Ms are OK on my .308. The CCI 250s just shoot more consistent for me and it reflects when I shoot it over a chrono.
Every gun is going to be different. Just that I found it easier to get the load down on my rifles with CCI. I am sure if I changed some things around, it will shoot with other primers too.
Re: Take on Primers?
Saw a chart once that showed actual pictures of the flash length, width of each of many primers tested. There was to me, a big difference from one primer to the next in many instances. Large, long flash with one and short flash with another. Seems to me that it could make a difference in burn rate during powder ignition. And that one primer may group a given load better than another.
Saw a chart once that showed actual pictures of the flash length, width of each of many primers tested. There was to me, a big difference from one primer to the next in many instances. Large, long flash with one and short flash with another. Seems to me that it could make a difference in burn rate during powder ignition. And that one primer may group a given load better than another.
Re: Take on Primers?
Thanks for the insight. So for a .308 load out of winchester brass and Varget powder pushing 168gr Sierra MK what would the better primer be? CCI BR2? others?
Thanks for the insight. So for a .308 load out of winchester brass and Varget powder pushing 168gr Sierra MK what would the better primer be? CCI BR2? others?
Re: Take on Primers?
Link to an interesting and fairly scientific analysis on primers. This one is about small rifle primers, but at the bottom, there is a link to his other study of large rifle primers.
http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2009/06/primers-small-rifle-primer-study.html
CAUTION 1: Reading this will probably cost you money and headaches, because you'll *need* to buy a bunch of components and try to find the "best" primer...
CAUTION 2: Don't consider all primers interchangeable. They ARE different, and when using new/different primers, you MUST back off and work up the load again.
Link to an interesting and fairly scientific analysis on primers. This one is about small rifle primers, but at the bottom, there is a link to his other study of large rifle primers.
http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/2009/06/primers-small-rifle-primer-study.html
CAUTION 1: Reading this will probably cost you money and headaches, because you'll *need* to buy a bunch of components and try to find the "best" primer...
CAUTION 2: Don't consider all primers interchangeable. They ARE different, and when using new/different primers, you MUST back off and work up the load again.
Re: Take on Primers?
"If you have tried more than one please tell me the pros and cons...just trying to learn the most i can!"
Ah, if only everything - hell, ANYTHING! - about reloading was as simple as new guys hope.
There are differences between primer brands and types but there are no automatic 'pros and cons' about them. Sometimes a change helps, sometimes a change hurts and sometimes a change won't make a bit of difference. But anytime someone tells you he knows what a change will do for YOU, put him on your ignore list because he's fully loaded with BS.
"If you have tried more than one please tell me the pros and cons...just trying to learn the most i can!"
Ah, if only everything - hell, ANYTHING! - about reloading was as simple as new guys hope.
There are differences between primer brands and types but there are no automatic 'pros and cons' about them. Sometimes a change helps, sometimes a change hurts and sometimes a change won't make a bit of difference. But anytime someone tells you he knows what a change will do for YOU, put him on your ignore list because he's fully loaded with BS.
Re: Take on Primers?
I use CCI #250 Magnum in my 338 LM rounds. The accuracy is awesome and every single one has gone bang so far. With that said I think I'm going to try some CCI BR2's when I run out next. Just to compare.
I use CCI #250 Magnum in my 338 LM rounds. The accuracy is awesome and every single one has gone bang so far. With that said I think I'm going to try some CCI BR2's when I run out next. Just to compare.
Re: Take on Primers?
I develop my loads with Standard, vs Match, primers. Once all development is done, I work up a batch that's half standard, half match, and see if there's a real justification, <span style="font-style: italic">according to the target</span>, to switch to match primers. If I did my development job right, there shouldn't be.
Greg
I develop my loads with Standard, vs Match, primers. Once all development is done, I work up a batch that's half standard, half match, and see if there's a real justification, <span style="font-style: italic">according to the target</span>, to switch to match primers. If I did my development job right, there shouldn't be.
Greg
Re: Take on Primers?
I've been using Wolf consistently for the past two years. However, with the new batch that I acquired a couple of months ago, I have had 5 failures to fire out of 200 rounds. Good strike, compound present in the cup...no fire. I may have to switch if this continues.
I've been using Wolf consistently for the past two years. However, with the new batch that I acquired a couple of months ago, I have had 5 failures to fire out of 200 rounds. Good strike, compound present in the cup...no fire. I may have to switch if this continues.
Re: Take on Primers?
Here is one non-scientific target that I shot to do a primer test. The load was worked up using an OCW test, then OAL testing. Here are three different primers using that OCW charge. Left group Fed 210M, Middle Fed 215M, right BR2. Retumbo powder in .25-06 shot round robin.
ES and group better with 215M. One example does not make it so, but I thought it was interesting. I did choose the 215M for this load.
Here is one non-scientific target that I shot to do a primer test. The load was worked up using an OCW test, then OAL testing. Here are three different primers using that OCW charge. Left group Fed 210M, Middle Fed 215M, right BR2. Retumbo powder in .25-06 shot round robin.
ES and group better with 215M. One example does not make it so, but I thought it was interesting. I did choose the 215M for this load.
Re: Take on Primers?
"Left group Fed 210M, Middle Fed 215M, right BR2."
Perhaps it's worth asking, "What primer did you use for the original load work-up?" And, did you attempt any load work up with those different primers or just swap them around in your already established load?
"Left group Fed 210M, Middle Fed 215M, right BR2."
Perhaps it's worth asking, "What primer did you use for the original load work-up?" And, did you attempt any load work up with those different primers or just swap them around in your already established load?
Re: Take on Primers?
I'm with CKA. I always use BR2's. That little "B" on the primer is important. Instead of saying "send it", I now say "send it bitch". It makes a difference.
I'm with CKA. I always use BR2's. That little "B" on the primer is important. Instead of saying "send it", I now say "send it bitch". It makes a difference.
Re: Take on Primers?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AnthonyL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use CCI #250 Magnum in my 338 LM rounds. The accuracy is awesome and every single one has gone bang so far. With that said I think I'm going to try some CCI BR2's when I run out next. Just to compare. </div></div>
That seem like a very large cartridge to set off with a standard primer. It really depends on what powder you use, but I would be leery of switching. You may see hang fires, if you switch, especially in colder weather.
Good luck
Jerry
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AnthonyL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use CCI #250 Magnum in my 338 LM rounds. The accuracy is awesome and every single one has gone bang so far. With that said I think I'm going to try some CCI BR2's when I run out next. Just to compare. </div></div>
That seem like a very large cartridge to set off with a standard primer. It really depends on what powder you use, but I would be leery of switching. You may see hang fires, if you switch, especially in colder weather.
Good luck
Jerry
Re: Take on Primers?
Have used Win., Rem., Wolf, CCI, and Fed. I've seen significant SD improvement when testing different primers, but it varies from one caliber to another.
Fed. 210M works best in my .308, while Rem. 71/2 SR Bench work best in a .223 bolt rifle. As Casey said Wolf SRMag is what the 6 RAT likes, along with a couple of 6 Dashers.
Just have to invest some time and money to find what works in your rifle.
Have used Win., Rem., Wolf, CCI, and Fed. I've seen significant SD improvement when testing different primers, but it varies from one caliber to another.
Fed. 210M works best in my .308, while Rem. 71/2 SR Bench work best in a .223 bolt rifle. As Casey said Wolf SRMag is what the 6 RAT likes, along with a couple of 6 Dashers.
Just have to invest some time and money to find what works in your rifle.
Re: Take on Primers?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Left group Fed 210M, Middle Fed 215M, right BR2."
Perhaps it's worth asking, "What primer did you use for the original load work-up?" And, did you attempt any load work up with those different primers or just swap them around in your already established load? </div></div>
I did the load workup with the Fed 210M, where I found a large OCW node centered at the load listed on the target. I then changed out the primers to see if a hotter primer(Fed215M) would improve the groups due to the slowness of Retumbo. I was looking more for an improvement in ES, but the change in group size was also nice. This is a hunting rifle, so I am more concerned in a stable node than pure precison.
After this target, I did reshoot OCW tests with both the Fed 215M and the BR2 and found the node centered at the same powder charge with each primer; just the Fed215M shot tighter. FWIW.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"Left group Fed 210M, Middle Fed 215M, right BR2."
Perhaps it's worth asking, "What primer did you use for the original load work-up?" And, did you attempt any load work up with those different primers or just swap them around in your already established load? </div></div>
I did the load workup with the Fed 210M, where I found a large OCW node centered at the load listed on the target. I then changed out the primers to see if a hotter primer(Fed215M) would improve the groups due to the slowness of Retumbo. I was looking more for an improvement in ES, but the change in group size was also nice. This is a hunting rifle, so I am more concerned in a stable node than pure precison.
After this target, I did reshoot OCW tests with both the Fed 215M and the BR2 and found the node centered at the same powder charge with each primer; just the Fed215M shot tighter. FWIW.
Re: Take on Primers?
For my .308 Varget load, I started with CCI, tried Winchester and am now using Tula large rifle primers as they give me the best ES and SD's. They also have a hard shell and are just as hard to seat as the CCI's. YMMV
SScott
For my .308 Varget load, I started with CCI, tried Winchester and am now using Tula large rifle primers as they give me the best ES and SD's. They also have a hard shell and are just as hard to seat as the CCI's. YMMV
SScott
Re: Take on Primers?
FWIW. I just did a little test with cci,winchester,cci benchrest, cci magnum, win mag., wolf mag. primers
They were all loaded using 168gr smk and 46.4 gr of varget. Fired from an 18in sps in .308. There was a consistant 30FPS increase with the magnum primers. The win and cci standard primers showed the most consistant velocitys shot to shot. I fired 3 rounds of each. I wanted to see the diffrence between standard and mag primers.
FWIW. I just did a little test with cci,winchester,cci benchrest, cci magnum, win mag., wolf mag. primers
They were all loaded using 168gr smk and 46.4 gr of varget. Fired from an 18in sps in .308. There was a consistant 30FPS increase with the magnum primers. The win and cci standard primers showed the most consistant velocitys shot to shot. I fired 3 rounds of each. I wanted to see the diffrence between standard and mag primers.
Re: Take on Primers?
I used only BR2s until recently. I had a batch of BR2s that were bad, with 1 in 7 failing to discharge and pretty much ruining an all to rare long range steel day.
I'm working up a similar load with F210s.
I have about 15,000 BR2s left on the bench, but I just don't have the confidence to use them right now.
I used only BR2s until recently. I had a batch of BR2s that were bad, with 1 in 7 failing to discharge and pretty much ruining an all to rare long range steel day.
I'm working up a similar load with F210s.
I have about 15,000 BR2s left on the bench, but I just don't have the confidence to use them right now.
Re: Take on Primers?
During the primer shortage of the 80's I was able to score two thousand Federal 210M. There were defective, piercing the cup in about 1 in 20 primers. It took me too long to realize what was the cause of the problem. I through out about 800 primers. Shit happens.
If you know your primers are defective contact CCI.
Good luck
Jerry
During the primer shortage of the 80's I was able to score two thousand Federal 210M. There were defective, piercing the cup in about 1 in 20 primers. It took me too long to realize what was the cause of the problem. I through out about 800 primers. Shit happens.
If you know your primers are defective contact CCI.
Good luck
Jerry
