Sidearms & Scatterguns Talk me into selling my M&P 9 and getting a Sig 226

3

.30Nate

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Full Member
Minuteman
Sep 14, 2013
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Lima ohio
#1
I got the Smith a couple years ago and haven't shot it enough to say I love it or hate it but I'm not very accurate with it. I got a Sig 1911 last year and to me it is light years ahead of my Smith when it comes to accuracy and trigger pull. The 1911 is my everyday carry and go to gun when shooting. I feel that I should have a 9mm and a .45 so that during an ammo shortage I at least have some options. I'm not sure what to do here guys. Should I sell my M&P and pick up a Sig? If I do it will most likely be a scorpion to match the 1911 :D
 
#2
Keep it and buy the Sig. You're not accurate with the M&P because you haven't shot it enough, you just said so. M&P's are very good guns and the ergonomics are somewhat like the 1911. If you love your 1911 then practice with the M&P more. If you don't like it after that then sell it.
 
#4
M&P shoots fine factory its not the gun its like everyone else said you have not spent enough time with it. I would go with what lawofsavage said. Sigs are good guns but if you can't shoot the M&P right the sig won't change that.
 
#7
I bought two M&Ps, and put Apex parts in both. The triggers were still mediocre at best. The ergonomics were great, but I did not enjoy shooting them. I also did not like having to use a tool to depress the sear disconnect before removing the slide. So, I sold both for a loss.

I then bought a 226 X5 Allround, sort of the opposite of the M&P. Much heavier, and DA/SA. The X5 is a joy to shoot, no recoil, super accurate, but is heavier on a draw stroke.

For a polymer gun, I would go with the CZ P-09, or perhaps the new Sig P320. The P-09 is very accurate, holds 19 rounds, and is reported to be very soft shooting. I have handled one, but not shot one. The P320, from what I hear, has a great trigger. I look forward to hearing range reports, or trying one out.
 
#8
.30Nate said:
You guys are right, I just need to spend some more time with it. The one thing I don't like is the trigger and that APEX kit will fix that. Thanks for the input guys.
Click to expand...

The two Apex kits I installed fixed about 70% of the trigger issues. However it is still a poor to mediocre trigger, do not expect miracles.
 
#9
agree with you. sell the SW and get the matching sig to your 45 in 9mm.

OR get yourself a glock 30 or 21 in 45.

Then get a G29 or 20 slide and be able to shoot 10mm, 40sw, 357sig 9x25 dillion, 38 super, and 9mm
 
#10
I agree with you on the ergonomics, it fits my hand great. The trigger is bad, I can't hit much with it therefore it stays at home most of the time. I would like to stay away from polymer guns. That was part of the reason I was looking at the 226.

Not sure what to do now with the mixed reviews on the trigger kit.
 
#11
I love sigs but prefer my polymer guns hands down. CZ are nice but still I like striker fired pistols. Comparing a polymer handgun to a 1911 is apples to oranges. Get the apex trigger. The M&P is a great gun.
 
#13
I put the full Apex kit in my M&P and it made a huge difference. Also, if you have one of the older ones with the slow twist barrels, getting any accuracy past 15 or 20 yards can be tough. A KKM barrel will fix that though. I love my M&P now.
 
#14
c1steve said:
I bought two M&Ps, and put Apex parts in both. The triggers were still mediocre at best. The ergonomics were great, but I did not enjoy shooting them. I also did not like having to use a tool to depress the sear disconnect before removing the slide. So, I sold both for a loss.

I then bought a 226 X5 Allround, sort of the opposite of the M&P. Much heavier, and DA/SA. The X5 is a joy to shoot, no recoil, super accurate, but is heavier on a draw stroke.

For a polymer gun, I would go with the CZ P-09, or perhaps the new Sig P320. The P-09 is very accurate, holds 19 rounds, and is reported to be very soft shooting. I have handled one, but not shot one. The P320, from what I hear, has a great trigger. I look forward to hearing range reports, or trying one out.
Click to expand...

still mediocre? What did you not like about the apex trigger? I am quite happy with my apex trigger in my M&P 9mm.
 
#15
You want us to convince you to sell a modern, striker fired pistol so you can buy an obsolete, DA/SA one?

DA/SA is a solution to a non-existent problem. That's why you love your faux 1911. A P226 is a step backward.
 
#16
c1steve said:
I bought two M&Ps, and put Apex parts in both. The triggers were still mediocre at best. The ergonomics were great, but I did not enjoy shooting them. I also did not like having to use a tool to depress the sear disconnect before removing the slide. So, I sold both for a loss.

I then bought a 226 X5 Allround, sort of the opposite of the M&P. Much heavier, and DA/SA. The X5 is a joy to shoot, no recoil, super accurate, but is heavier on a draw stroke.

For a polymer gun, I would go with the CZ P-09, or perhaps the new Sig P320. The P-09 is very accurate, holds 19 rounds, and is reported to be very soft shooting. I have handled one, but not shot one. The P320, from what I hear, has a great trigger. I look forward to hearing range reports, or trying one out.
Click to expand...

You dont have to use the tool to take the gun down, the take down is very similar to a Glock. Yes you need to pull the trigger but thats not a problem as long as the gun has been cleared. And to the OPs question I would keep the M&P. I have had very few jams, its accurate, reliable, and ergonomic. I have put thousands of rounds through it. I agree the trigger could use some work and have done some research on the Apex. Eventually I will probably get the Apex kit. It seems it would fix the issues I have with the trigger. Mainly the pull and reset.
 
#17
i am a 1911 fan but all things considered sig's make the "new" poly pistols feel a little toyish. maybe it s the overall weight or just because the materials do feel different but sig's have been winning the battle of the gun safe. i am also in NY so i have a 10 rd mag max which does come into the equation.
 
#18
I do like the M&P over other polymer guns, but still shoot a P226 way better. I suspect part of it is the reduced recoil felt from a heftier handgun, but it may also just fit my hands better. Makes sense to shoot them both side by side if you can, and then decide what works for you.

John
 
#19
doctordoctor said:
I love sigs but prefer my polymer guns hands down. CZ are nice but still I like striker fired pistols. Comparing a polymer handgun to a 1911 is apples to oranges. Get the apex trigger. The M&P is a great gun.
Click to expand...

The new CZ is really something. It is DA/SA but a very light DA pull. Accuracy should be better than a Glock, and it holds 19 rounds in 9mm. This is going to be a great selling gun. I usually prefer Sigs because of the low recoil, but reports on the CZ P-09 are that it is VERY soft shooting. I have handled one, and was impressed. I am guessing/estimating that the recoil is close to a Sig, which is about half the recoil of a 20 oz. polymer pistol.

Also the new Sig 320 looks very good. It is polymer, striker fire, and has a great trigger from what I have read. I look forward to trying one. Sig had problems with the P250. Apparently they learned from their mistakes and produced an excellent polymer pistol.

s
 
#21
Let me see. You want to sell your M&P and get a P226 because(and only because) you really like your Sig 1911?
What kind of logic are you using here? The three guns you are talking about could not be more different from each other if you tried to pick three guns more different from each other.
Get a grip man. Don't get rid of the M&P until you shoot it. I went from Glock to M&P 7 1/2 years ago and never looked back. That said, neither an M&P or a Glock is remotely comparable to a 1911.
And the SA/DA trigger pull on that 226 is probably going to drive you crazy. SA/DA will never equal a 1911 single action trigger.
Also, if you guys saying the M&P trigger is no good haven't tried the latest gen of the M&P trigger you could be surprised. Too me, now that it has the audible and tactile reset, it is just as shootable as the Glock and has far superior ergos.
 
#22
I'm sure not surprised that this thread immediately brought out the glockfanboys, as any pistol thread seems to do that, but I've re-read the OP and nowhere did I see him asking about plastic bricks... :p JK guys, don't get your panties all in a wad.

Anyway, with the one exception posted above regarding the Apex kits, you'll not likely see many people bad-mouthing them. They are a surefire engineered solution and if you're not sure of your DIY ability, Apex will do the install for you. I highly recommend it if you decide to keep your M&P. If you just really want the SIG, then by all means get it and sell that piece of junk M&P to me for a huge loss. I'm always ready to help out a fellow forum member. :)

But seriously, different folks like different strokes and that's a good thing. I just highly suggest you get your hands on the SIG you're considering first and put some rounds through it. That way maybe you won't find yourself back on here in a year asking what else you should get. If there's any way to shoot what you want first, it'll give you more solid feedback than a hundred posts from us nimrods will do.
 
#23
The Apex kits are an excellent upgrade, but the trigger will still be a bit gritty. My Sigs came with decent triggers, better than the M&Ps were after the Apex kits. I have 5 Sigs at Gray Guns right now, all having trigger/action work done. I do not mind a heavy trigger, but will not settle for a gritty one.

I still think the CZ Duty P-09 is much better than the M&P. NICE trigger, and very accurate. On the two M&Ps I had, one had to depress the sear disconnect before removing the slide. I could not fit a finger tip down inside the injection port far enough to do this, so needed some sort of tool to do this. A key would work, even a toothpick. This to me was not acceptable, but I believe the sear discount would be easy to remove.
 
#24
valkyries said:
You dont have to use the tool to take the gun down, the take down is very similar to a Glock. Yes you need to pull the trigger but thats not a problem as long as the gun has been cleared. And to the OPs question I would keep the M&P. I have had very few jams, its accurate, reliable, and ergonomic. I have put thousands of rounds through it. I agree the trigger could use some work and have done some research on the Apex. Eventually I will probably get the Apex kit. It seems it would fix the issues I have with the trigger. Mainly the pull and reset.
Click to expand...

He said he sold the gun's because of this. Interesting enough it makes one wonder if he ever owned one with a response like that. Tools to take a M&P slide off is 100% user error.
 
#25
I have to agree. I find there to be no issue getting the slide off. There's even a video out there showing how to do a complete field strip and reassemble using only one hand. I tried it and could accomplish it with some effort. With practice, I see how it could be used in a dire scenario of the loss of use of one arm.

Edit: found the vid. Strip and reassembly with no tools in about 1 minute.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=j0ljypy3BOg
 
Last edited:
#26
Strangedays said:
He said he sold the gun's because of this. Interesting enough it makes one wonder if he ever owned one with a response like that. Tools to take a M&P slide off is 100% user error.
Click to expand...

I watched the video, and he put his finger in the ejection port at about :028. I cannot do that and reach the sear disconnect, with any finger. I do have fairly large hands, but am not fat in any way. I just cannot reach the sear disconnect. So for me, or someone with largish hands, it is a drawback.

I find the stock grips on a Sig 226 to be comfortable, but slightly small. Most persons do not have hands that size.
 
#27
c1steve said:
I watched the video, and he put his finger in the ejection port at about :028. I cannot do that and reach the sear disconnect, with any finger. I do have fairly large hands, but am not fat in any way. I just cannot reach the sear disconnect. So for me, or someone with largish hands, it is a drawback.

I find the stock grips on a Sig 226 to be comfortable, but slightly small. Most persons do not have hands that size.
Click to expand...
Maybe it was not explained well enough. There is no need to put anything in the ejection port at all or push the sear down ever. S&W recommends you do for safety so you dont have to pull the trigger. When I take mine down Ill pull the slide back about 3/4 line up the take down lever with the notch in the slide, release slide, pull trigger, done takes about five seconds. Almost identical to Glock. I hope everyone that has an M&P knows this.
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/sDi3jHM271I?feature=player_detailpage" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
#29
.30Nate said:
...I got a Sig 1911 last year and to me it is light years ahead of my Smith when it comes to accuracy and trigger pull....
Click to expand...

Accuracy in what sense? Do you mean standing still slow fire? Or USPSA type shooting? If you don't already shoot some kind of USPSA or IPSC style shooting, I would suggest giving it a try before buying or selling anything, especially if this is gun you carry for self defense.
 
#30
cfulback32 said:
Accuracy in what sense? Do you mean standing still slow fire? Or USPSA type shooting? If you don't already shoot some kind of USPSA or IPSC style shooting, I would suggest giving it a try before buying or selling anything, especially if this is gun you carry for self defense.
Click to expand...

Or IDPA. In any case, if you've only ever shot target style, you may not know how your weapon will perform if the SHTF.
 
#32
sakobob said:
i had to read this thread to find out it was difficult to field strip a m&p! i've done it like a glock sense day one,
as valkyries has said.
Click to expand...

It seems like EVERYONE who finds a problem with how to disassemble the M&P figured out the wrong way to do it.

"I hate needing a tool to disassemble the M&P line, I wish you could just pull the trigger and take it down like the Glock"

or

"I don't like pulling the trigger to disassemble a M&P, they should probably include a tool in the firearm to disassemble it."


I think if these two people would just TRADE their M&Ps, both would walk away happy with their firearm.

I do it either way.


@OP, Like what was said, you are comparing apples vs oranges vs grape soda. Both Sig and Smith make great guns but neither of them are going to be universally accepted as the best. The ergonomics and trigger on a 1911 are usually very good. Don't try to compare all firearms to them.

The M&P has a similar grip angle to the 1911 and is easy to point shoot. Yes the trigger is poor, but the grit will smooth out if you shoot it enough. If you don't want to, then the APEX is a good option. Just remember, if you are ever in a shootout, you likely won't care about trigger pull.

The 226 is also a great gun and feels great in the hand, but DA/SA is usually a handicap in shooting. It takes many rounds down range (usually) to be effective with this type of set-up. Also, for the price difference, you are not gaining much.

You need to choose the firearm that is best for you. So until you have a reasonable amount of trigger time behind either of these firearms, you cannot make an educated decision. With anything to do with firearms, I think that you should carefully weigh the circumstances before you act.
 
#33
Thanks for all the advice guys. I think the best thing for me to do is keep the Smith and get more comfortable with it. I have an uncle that shoots a lot of IDPA and I'm going see if he wants to help me improve my pistol skills. I'll revaluate the situation and a 1000 rounds or so.
 
#34
valkyries said:
Maybe it was not explained well enough. There is no need to put anything in the ejection port at all or push the sear down ever. S&W recommends you do for safety so you dont have to pull the trigger. When I take mine down Ill pull the slide back about 3/4 line up the take down lever with the notch in the slide, release slide, pull trigger, done takes about five seconds. Almost identical to Glock. I hope everyone that has an M&P knows this.
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/sDi3jHM271I?feature=player_detailpage" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Click to expand...
I didn't think there would be someone who owned a M&P who wouldn't have already known this but as usual I am surprised.
 
#36
Ultraman550 said:
Keep it and buy the Sig. You're not accurate with the M&P because you haven't shot it enough, you just said so. M&P's are very good guns and the ergonomics are somewhat like the 1911. If you love your 1911 then practice with the M&P more. If you don't like it after that then sell it.
Click to expand...

Exactly what he said, don't sell it you will regret it, if moneys an issue be patient and wait and save the $$$. If you sell it in 6 months you will be posting on here bitching that you shouldn't have.
 
#37
Valkyries, now I see that there are two methods. No one explained that to me before, I had only gone by the M&P manual. The gun has super ergonomics, and I now see that it is easy to field strip. Is there anything that can be done to improve the gritty trigger beyond what the DCAEK kit does? If the trigger can be improved more, I might buy another M&P.

However the CZ P-07 and P-09 may be better yet. I have handled the P-09, but not shot it. After shooting a heavy Sig with low recoil, it is hard to get excited about 500 rounds downrange with the lightweight M&P.
 
#38
THIS!! Never understood the people hanging onto a DA/SA style gun. Yes they may be accurate but you will never be as confident on your first shot, under stress especially when the next one is way lighter. I love the last 14 on my Berretta 92, but the first one takes a second longer to make a first round hit. Same with HK traditional and Sigs.

To OP, put an APEX in and shoot the thing! The Glock is nice too, but if you like 1911 ergo's the M&P is going to be an easier crossover, glock has a totally different grip angle.

Downzero said:
You want us to convince you to sell a modern, striker fired pistol so you can buy an obsolete, DA/SA one?

DA/SA is a solution to a non-existent problem. That's why you love your faux 1911. A P226 is a step backward.
Click to expand...
 
#39
I have owned a few Sigs over the years. Never really liked them. I still have a 220 in 9x19 / 38 Super but rarely shoot it. The high bore axis makes it recoil more than it should. I dont mind the DA trigger part as I shoot a lot of revolvers.

I have been shooting my M&P Pro for a couple years and really like it. I can shoot it just as fast and accurate as a Glock 17/34.

If you want a DA in 9x19, get a Smith 929 or 986.
 
#40
To the people who wonder about the M&P trigger pull, shoot the shit out of. The trigger will get better, not a world of difference, but some.

If you feel confident with your skills: drift the rear sight off, and the drop safety plunger will come out (don't loose the spring, plate or plunger). Polishing the plunger will help. It doesn't take much. The APEX design has a slight chamfer to this part.

If you are looking at getting a newer M&P, people have said that the triggers have been improved. I don't know, I haven't shot any newer M&Ps.


The way I see it though, if you ever need to use a firearm for self defense, you won't worry too much about the grittiness of the trigger. As long as you can trust the firearm.
 
#42
For all of you experts that talk down the S&W, take a look at the equipment stats from the 2012 IDPA nationals. Glock and S&W together account for more than 65% of all pistols used. Glock 33.5% and S&W 31.7%. My experience locally has been somewhat similar, so the argument regarding sponsorship is a weak one in my opinion.

DOWN ZERO BLOG | All posts tagged 'Equipment Survey'

And yes, for all you Glockenfans, Glock was again #1, for a reason; they just work (as do the S&W M&P series).

Ruger and Sig Sauer bring up the rear at 3.9% each.

For those not familiar with IDPA, it's a competition designed so that any Joe can bring what he carries for self defense and shoot it in a timed stress environment to improve his/her skills and still do really well with factory stock equipment. This is in contrast to some other pistol competition formats that encourage equipment races and wherein one cannot place well unless one is running a minimum $3500 race gun.
 
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