Hey fellow glass lovers and beyond haha so I know this is a topic that gets asked for a lot in terms of comparisons. Is the TT worth so much more, is the glass really better, blah blah blah. Welp, this past Monday I was able to mess with a Minox ZP5 5-25 for a little bit and having owned 2 TT (the 525 and 315M) here is my humble sort of non-scientific poorly written, semi-disorganized review? Disclaimer: I'm no glass expert by any means! But I am the type of guy to call a turd a turd no matter how much I or anyone else paid for it. Sorry I'm not sorry if I offend you.
Fit and finish:
Minox: knurling on all the knobs (elevation, windage, etc.) is nice, and allows you to get a good grip. Looks wise I don't like it. But it's aggressive and that's what really matters to me at the end of the day. Power ring was smooth and had a big enough purchase to grab it without much effort if needed for quick zooming in and out. Not sure that I'd need to use a throw lever on it because it's so big. Scope caps were standard tenebraex.
TT525: the scallops on the knobs feel great and really look like they paid attention to them and cut them with great purpose and precision. I never tested turning the turrets with wet hands, but I will say in my mind there was always a thought that maybe there could be some slippage? They never did though and trust me I turned the turrets A LOT! (We'll get to those later). I'm thinking of aggressive knurling like an AMG or Razor 2 where it's sharp and it's there and might take a little skin, and I prefer that. I rather lose some skin than slip on the turrets. Personal preference though I suppose. Power ring is nice and smooth, I used a throw lever because it's a little small for me.
Both these scopes turn with the mag ring in the opposite direction so you're pulling rather than pushing to increase mag if that makes sense. Hence why I used a throw lever on the TT.
Overall: I love the look of the TT, it's a sexy looking scope. I think the Minox is ugly. Like really ugly. And maybe to some of you guys it doesn't matter, that's fine, but to some it does. Both scopes feel like quality and there's no extra gimmicks or flashiness.
Reticle:
Minox: the Minox I looked through did not have the MR4 which is what most people want to hear about so I won't spend much time on it. Other than it was very useful and seemed like it would work well in all situations.
TT525: Gen2xr, you all know it, TT lacks reticle options. For many this is the sole factor stopping them from getting this beautiful beast. And I get it. I do. I like tree reticles, Ebr-7 (my favorite ever), skmr3, mr4, etc. this one is certainly useable, but I think really only fits in the 5-25 model. In my 315M it wasn't usable at really anything below 8x even squinting real hard.
Overall: this is a total personal preference, they all work. Period.
Turrets:
Minox: ok guys, some may hate me for saying it, but damn those things suck. I mean terrible. My gen 2 razor (yes I know 10 mil per turn) was better, my NF 7-35 is night and day better. They are mushy and dialing without looking takes effort. Concentration. And I'm not sure id ever trust it without looking up to verify. If a scope ever NEEDED and MTC feature, well damn this is it. At least then you could dial by the whole mil and hold for the remainder. That's what I'd do in a speed dialing situation. The tactile feedback is something you have to pay attention too to notice. If these were to get moved inadvertently I don't think I would notice because there's no feeling really. They've got as much liveliness as a dead fish.
And I'm not going to touch on the second rev thing because apparently some scopes from a newer batch have that worked out and it's a non-issue.
TT525: so remember earlier I mentioned people always ask if a TT is worth the extra $1,500 or so? Well that's still up to you and your pockets, but if you wanted an objective point of reference to try and justify it, this is it. They are absolutely the best turrets on the planet. And maybe some alien planets.
One thing they could fix or do better though, is make the .5 mil markings bigger or maybe even label them as such similar to NF.
I hate 15 mil per turn turrets (too crammed). I really dislike the 12 per on my ATACR (still a little too crammed). I prefer 10 mil per turn like the razor or AMG. But even at 15 mil per turn I can easily count the clicks without looking while dialing quickly. And now that TT is trickling out the scopes with the CCA (MTC feature), that might be the winning ticket. I personally prefer an MTC feature but it's not for everyone. Either way you, if you've never spun TT turrets, don't because you might sell everything for one. They're that good.
I also want to cover a couple small aspects of the zero process here cause it's short. Minox is traditional set screws and TT we all know is tool-less.
Now I'm sure most of you guys are much smarter than me and have never forgotten your tool kit at home, but not having to worry about remembering to bring it to the range with the TT is pretty comforting.
I know I know, you only zero once and it's done so not a big deal.
But I pose this to you, if you shoot with facotry ammo, the TT is so easy to set the turrets you'll do it for every box, batch, etc you buy. Instead of, "well it's close enough I just want to shoot". Also, if you have a switch barrel setup (DTA, AI, kraken, sako, wto switch lug, etc.) you can zero everything so much easier and quicker that it makes it painless.
If you switch this optic on multiple rifles because you went broke buying it in the first place, no fear, you can re-zero each rifle extremely quickly. Just write down the different off-sets for each rifle and it'll take 20 seconds at most to do it.
Parallax: they're both great and extremely easy and forgiving. Neither has number marks, but you should be looking down the scope not at some numbers on the side anyway. That deer you were about to shoot just walked away because you decided to play match the numbers instead of shooting.
Overall: it's not close. And unless Minox changes something in the design I don't see how they can compare. Again, this is just about the only objective point we're going to get too where one outshines the other. TT is better than Minox in the turret department. Period. If you've felt both and disagree, you're either in denial, or are too personally invested to be objective anyway.
Glass: let's start by saying I'm no glass expert, that's Ilya and a few others on here. I have though, been lucky enough to own or mess with most every tier 1 scope, so I have some reference, but take it as my opinion.
Minox: glass is excellent. Period.
TT525: glass is excellent. Period.
See what I did there lol. Honestly neither has any CA. Both have color and pop that rivals that of an avengers movie. Damn those are some bright costumes. The shoot n c targets were extremely bright and they both have a great depth of field. In my humble opinion, you can't sit here and say that a TT is objectively worth $1,500 more based on glass alone. It's too close to call. Sample variations will be a bigger factor.
Overall: sorry guys! Those of you looking to settle the never ending glass debate need to look elsewhere. I mean honestly most tier 1 scopes won't disappoint anyone anyway. If glass is the most important thing to you, then either will do you just fine.
Warranty: so I can't speak to any experience with Minox but I will say the TT customer service is great. Yes I had to send both my TT's back for service. I had to send it to someone in CO if I remember correctly, then they send it on to our friends up North ehh. On the return trip once it made it stateside (which was actually very quickly) they overnighted it to me and it was packaged excellently. Which is more than I can say for one "top tier" scope manufacturer I've dealt with on multiple occasions.
No, TT's aren't made of adamantium (wolverine reference if you didn't see the movie). But that's not to say they are fragile.
If I have a scope I'm not sure I'm going to keep, I baby it. You can not tell the difference between a brand new one or mine. But if it's a scope I know I'm going to keep then I have no problem running it hard $4k+ or not. If you need something to get broken I'm your guy.
ITS NEVER ON PURPOSE THOUGH
! Haha ask my DTA how many bushes I've dragged it through hunting. Or how many rocks it's smacked. Keeps on ticking though!
For reference: Scope brands I've sent back for warranty include: Vortex, S&B, NF, and TT.
So that's about it. Sorry if it didn't answer all your questions or didn't have the end result of "Brand A is 10x better than the other one. Period. Brand B sucks!" I think one thing we should all do is sit back and really appreciate Premier for what they were. Yes they went out of business and I would not advise anyone to buy one at this point, but the fact that we have 2 OUTSTANDING scopes derived in some form or fashion from Premier is really a mark on the legacy they left.
Thanks for reading guys!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fit and finish:
Minox: knurling on all the knobs (elevation, windage, etc.) is nice, and allows you to get a good grip. Looks wise I don't like it. But it's aggressive and that's what really matters to me at the end of the day. Power ring was smooth and had a big enough purchase to grab it without much effort if needed for quick zooming in and out. Not sure that I'd need to use a throw lever on it because it's so big. Scope caps were standard tenebraex.
TT525: the scallops on the knobs feel great and really look like they paid attention to them and cut them with great purpose and precision. I never tested turning the turrets with wet hands, but I will say in my mind there was always a thought that maybe there could be some slippage? They never did though and trust me I turned the turrets A LOT! (We'll get to those later). I'm thinking of aggressive knurling like an AMG or Razor 2 where it's sharp and it's there and might take a little skin, and I prefer that. I rather lose some skin than slip on the turrets. Personal preference though I suppose. Power ring is nice and smooth, I used a throw lever because it's a little small for me.
Both these scopes turn with the mag ring in the opposite direction so you're pulling rather than pushing to increase mag if that makes sense. Hence why I used a throw lever on the TT.
Overall: I love the look of the TT, it's a sexy looking scope. I think the Minox is ugly. Like really ugly. And maybe to some of you guys it doesn't matter, that's fine, but to some it does. Both scopes feel like quality and there's no extra gimmicks or flashiness.
Reticle:
Minox: the Minox I looked through did not have the MR4 which is what most people want to hear about so I won't spend much time on it. Other than it was very useful and seemed like it would work well in all situations.
TT525: Gen2xr, you all know it, TT lacks reticle options. For many this is the sole factor stopping them from getting this beautiful beast. And I get it. I do. I like tree reticles, Ebr-7 (my favorite ever), skmr3, mr4, etc. this one is certainly useable, but I think really only fits in the 5-25 model. In my 315M it wasn't usable at really anything below 8x even squinting real hard.
Overall: this is a total personal preference, they all work. Period.
Turrets:
Minox: ok guys, some may hate me for saying it, but damn those things suck. I mean terrible. My gen 2 razor (yes I know 10 mil per turn) was better, my NF 7-35 is night and day better. They are mushy and dialing without looking takes effort. Concentration. And I'm not sure id ever trust it without looking up to verify. If a scope ever NEEDED and MTC feature, well damn this is it. At least then you could dial by the whole mil and hold for the remainder. That's what I'd do in a speed dialing situation. The tactile feedback is something you have to pay attention too to notice. If these were to get moved inadvertently I don't think I would notice because there's no feeling really. They've got as much liveliness as a dead fish.
And I'm not going to touch on the second rev thing because apparently some scopes from a newer batch have that worked out and it's a non-issue.
TT525: so remember earlier I mentioned people always ask if a TT is worth the extra $1,500 or so? Well that's still up to you and your pockets, but if you wanted an objective point of reference to try and justify it, this is it. They are absolutely the best turrets on the planet. And maybe some alien planets.
One thing they could fix or do better though, is make the .5 mil markings bigger or maybe even label them as such similar to NF.
I hate 15 mil per turn turrets (too crammed). I really dislike the 12 per on my ATACR (still a little too crammed). I prefer 10 mil per turn like the razor or AMG. But even at 15 mil per turn I can easily count the clicks without looking while dialing quickly. And now that TT is trickling out the scopes with the CCA (MTC feature), that might be the winning ticket. I personally prefer an MTC feature but it's not for everyone. Either way you, if you've never spun TT turrets, don't because you might sell everything for one. They're that good.
I also want to cover a couple small aspects of the zero process here cause it's short. Minox is traditional set screws and TT we all know is tool-less.
Now I'm sure most of you guys are much smarter than me and have never forgotten your tool kit at home, but not having to worry about remembering to bring it to the range with the TT is pretty comforting.
I know I know, you only zero once and it's done so not a big deal.
But I pose this to you, if you shoot with facotry ammo, the TT is so easy to set the turrets you'll do it for every box, batch, etc you buy. Instead of, "well it's close enough I just want to shoot". Also, if you have a switch barrel setup (DTA, AI, kraken, sako, wto switch lug, etc.) you can zero everything so much easier and quicker that it makes it painless.
If you switch this optic on multiple rifles because you went broke buying it in the first place, no fear, you can re-zero each rifle extremely quickly. Just write down the different off-sets for each rifle and it'll take 20 seconds at most to do it.
Parallax: they're both great and extremely easy and forgiving. Neither has number marks, but you should be looking down the scope not at some numbers on the side anyway. That deer you were about to shoot just walked away because you decided to play match the numbers instead of shooting.
Overall: it's not close. And unless Minox changes something in the design I don't see how they can compare. Again, this is just about the only objective point we're going to get too where one outshines the other. TT is better than Minox in the turret department. Period. If you've felt both and disagree, you're either in denial, or are too personally invested to be objective anyway.
Glass: let's start by saying I'm no glass expert, that's Ilya and a few others on here. I have though, been lucky enough to own or mess with most every tier 1 scope, so I have some reference, but take it as my opinion.
Minox: glass is excellent. Period.
TT525: glass is excellent. Period.
See what I did there lol. Honestly neither has any CA. Both have color and pop that rivals that of an avengers movie. Damn those are some bright costumes. The shoot n c targets were extremely bright and they both have a great depth of field. In my humble opinion, you can't sit here and say that a TT is objectively worth $1,500 more based on glass alone. It's too close to call. Sample variations will be a bigger factor.
Overall: sorry guys! Those of you looking to settle the never ending glass debate need to look elsewhere. I mean honestly most tier 1 scopes won't disappoint anyone anyway. If glass is the most important thing to you, then either will do you just fine.
Warranty: so I can't speak to any experience with Minox but I will say the TT customer service is great. Yes I had to send both my TT's back for service. I had to send it to someone in CO if I remember correctly, then they send it on to our friends up North ehh. On the return trip once it made it stateside (which was actually very quickly) they overnighted it to me and it was packaged excellently. Which is more than I can say for one "top tier" scope manufacturer I've dealt with on multiple occasions.
No, TT's aren't made of adamantium (wolverine reference if you didn't see the movie). But that's not to say they are fragile.
If I have a scope I'm not sure I'm going to keep, I baby it. You can not tell the difference between a brand new one or mine. But if it's a scope I know I'm going to keep then I have no problem running it hard $4k+ or not. If you need something to get broken I'm your guy.
ITS NEVER ON PURPOSE THOUGH
! Haha ask my DTA how many bushes I've dragged it through hunting. Or how many rocks it's smacked. Keeps on ticking though!For reference: Scope brands I've sent back for warranty include: Vortex, S&B, NF, and TT.
So that's about it. Sorry if it didn't answer all your questions or didn't have the end result of "Brand A is 10x better than the other one. Period. Brand B sucks!" I think one thing we should all do is sit back and really appreciate Premier for what they were. Yes they went out of business and I would not advise anyone to buy one at this point, but the fact that we have 2 OUTSTANDING scopes derived in some form or fashion from Premier is really a mark on the legacy they left.
Thanks for reading guys!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Last edited:
