• Win a RIX Storm S3 Thermal Imaging Scope!

    To enter, all you need to do is add an image of yourself at the range below!

    Join the contest

The Bar is racist

Lots of people just like to pay lip service to freedom. When it comes down to it though, those people just want big brother to give them a nice warm hug and say they’ll be kept safe
Lot's of people who like to be anti-government spend a lot of time looking for uncle government. I am not sure the thought process that leads people to think that, without a licensed barber they are going to be so stupid as to run out to the butcher shop for a shave, rather than to ask their friends and contacts who cuts a nice head of hair. Same goes, of course, for every single service available. The use of peer networks is now enhanced by imperfect tools like Yelp, making a government license increasingly obsolete.

Quite honestly, libertarianism is dead. We did it to ourselves in the shift from something thoughtful toward fuck the police and pass the bong. Not that those are untenable beliefs, but they can't ever be the foundation for a system of belief. And this new group of conservatives are practically the Taliban in my mind. It's all toss the nonbelievers in jail, string 'em up.
 
Lot's of people who like to be anti-government spend a lot of time looking for uncle government. I am not sure the thought process that leads people to think that, without a licensed barber they are going to be so stupid as to run out to the butcher shop for a shave, rather than to ask their friends and contacts who cuts a nice head of hair. Same goes, of course, for every single service available. The use of peer networks is now enhanced by imperfect tools like Yelp, making a government license increasingly obsolete.

Quite honestly, libertarianism is dead. We did it to ourselves in the shift from something thoughtful toward fuck the police and pass the bong. Not that those are untenable beliefs, but they can't ever be the foundation for a system of belief. And this new group of conservatives are practically the Taliban in my mind. It's all toss the nonbelievers in jail, string 'em up.
One problem is thinking the solution is going to come from the top and trickle down.
 
Lot's of people who like to be anti-government spend a lot of time looking for uncle government. I am not sure the thought process that leads people to think that, without a licensed barber they are going to be so stupid as to run out to the butcher shop for a shave, rather than to ask their friends and contacts who cuts a nice head of hair. Same goes, of course, for every single service available. The use of peer networks is now enhanced by imperfect tools like Yelp, making a government license increasingly obsolete.

Quite honestly, libertarianism is dead. We did it to ourselves in the shift from something thoughtful toward fuck the police and pass the bong. Not that those are untenable beliefs, but they can't ever be the foundation for a system of belief. And this new group of conservatives are practically the Taliban in my mind. It's all toss the nonbelievers in jail, string 'em up.
Off topic, but libertarian party take on borders is the reason I can't support them at national level. The R's at least pay lip service to secured borders.
 
  • Like
Reactions: UKDslayer
Off topic, but libertarian party take on borders is the reason I can't support them at national level. The R's at least pay lip service to secured borders.
I think there is a lot wrong with the Libertarian Party. Mostly that it tends to default to simple solutions for complex problems, and immigration is one of them. But there is also a lot of good, and there is room for discussion and disagreement that doesn't always exist in parties that actually have a chance to win elections, lol. But more importantly, libertarians consistently ask better questions about the issues at hand, and don't find them is such odd positions as "fuck the government, but don't take the vaccine because it isn't fully FDA approved." Sure, they might have other reasons not to, but at least they tend to be internally consistent.

I wouldn't even consider myself a good libertarian at this point, but better than I am anything else. I've shared this with a few people recently, since it has been sticking in my mind. From Pericles' Funeral Oration from the Thucydides. It represents probably close to what I see as ideal, and I'd consider it a moderate form of Libertarianism. Forgive words like Democracy, knowing that not all of our forms of government existed in ancient Greece. I think it is a spirit that died soon after his speech, was dead for 2000 years, and once again we are doing our damndest to kill it forever.

Our form of government does not enter into rivalry with the institutions of others. Our government does not copy our neighbors', but is an example to them. It is true that we are called a democracy, for the administration is in the hands of the many and not of the few. But while there exists equal justice to all and alike in their private disputes, the claim of excellence is also recognized; and when a citizen is in any way distinguished, he is preferred to the public service, not as a matter of privilege, but as the reward of merit. Neither is poverty an obstacle, but a man may benefit his country whatever the obscurity of his condition. There is no exclusiveness in our public life, and in our private business we are not suspicious of one another, nor angry with our neighbor if he does what he likes; we do not put on sour looks at him which, though harmless, are not pleasant. While we are thus unconstrained in our private business, a spirit of reverence pervades our public acts; we are prevented from doing wrong by respect for the authorities and for the laws, having a particular regard to those which are ordained for the protection of the injured as well as those unwritten laws which bring upon the transgressor of them the reprobation of the general sentiment.
 
Lol... You're part of the "here's my link" crowd That proves nothing other than you found somebody else's opinion that agrees with yours.
Do you have anything but an opinion to support your statements? Or are your precious feelings the only thing you’re relying on in this argument?
 
Relying on experience in several different fields...no feelings involved.
This is not an argument for the necessity or legitimacy of occupational licensure laws

Let’s try another question. Do you care if your mechanic has all of the ase certifications imaginable? Or do you just care if they know what they’re doing?
 
This is not an argument for the necessity or legitimacy of occupational licensure laws

Let’s try another question. Do you care if your mechanic has all of the ase certifications imaginable? Or do you just care if they know what they’re doing?
That is exactly the argument.
All the mechanics I trusted to work on my car or ASC certified, and knew what the fuck they were doing. The person like replacing the engine in my car right now doesn't hold a current certification but, I do know that he knows what the fuck he is doing.

I do get what you are implying common I believe. A certification doesn't guarantee that you know squat.

I can't tell you how many title opinions or title certifications I've checked that were filled with errors. And just because you have a degree doesn't mean you know shit either. Too many times I've run across landmen, with a degree that couldn't run title on her own dam property. Which is pretty fucken scary because everything you need to know to be a land man worn by 2nd grade...lol.

That said, I'd rather trust somebody certified then some schmuck that just says he knows how to twist a wrench
 
  • Like
Reactions: RGStory and The D
That is exactly the argument.
All the mechanics I trusted to work on my car or ASC certified, and knew what the fuck they were doing. The person like replacing the engine in my car right now doesn't hold a current certification but, I do know that he knows what the fuck he is doing.

I do get what you are implying common I believe. A certification doesn't guarantee that you know squat.

I can't tell you how many title opinions or title certifications I've checked that were filled with errors. And just because you have a degree doesn't mean you know shit either. Too many times I've run across landmen, with a degree that couldn't run title on her own dam property. Which is pretty fucken scary because everything you need to know to be a land man worn by 2nd grade...lol.

That said, I'd rather trust somebody certified then some schmuck that just says he knows how to twist a wrench
This is still not the most crucial part of the argument though. Requiring a laundry list of licenses, completely ignoring business licenses & building inspections, is hurting economies and keeping people from making their own livings. It shouldn’t matter at all if someone can’t pass even the most basic ase certifications. If someone can successfully run a business but only perform the most basic of maintenance they are still providing value to the community.
 
Three illegal immigrants changed out my daughter's AC system. End of the day, the "licensed" a/c tech came by and gave us the licensed priced bill.
Sadly, that has been going on for at least a decade. The trades are full of it. Licensed contractor subs the work out to illegals or those who can barely speak English. They do this so they don't have to pay workman's comp.
 
This is still not the most crucial part of the argument though. Requiring a laundry list of licenses, completely ignoring business licenses & building inspections, is hurting economies and keeping people from making their own livings. It shouldn’t matter at all if someone can’t pass even the most basic ase certifications. If someone can successfully run a business but only perform the most basic of maintenance they are still providing value to the community.
Typically the person that runs the business isn't the mechanic. It's completely different skill sets to own com operate, manage versus doing the actual work. But I think I get where you're coming from, at least in regards to Permitting, licensing, inspections... Some of that is complete BS.

We're gonna just have to disagree on licensing as it relates to the actual worker such as lawyers, plumbers, electricians, mechanics. And they can't pass even a basic test I surely don't want them representing me in court, working on my house, car or building.

We all know somebody that does good work in quite a few different fields. Lawyer for example. I knew a guy, dead now and rightfully so he was a complete piece of shit as a person but had decided to finish law school and passed the bar he would have been an awesome attorney. Before law school he knew more than most attorneys I've met and would trust him more then most board certified attorneys. But any schmuck that just says he knows law … absolutely not
 
The same thing has been going on in medical schools for DECADES, you still have to pass NMBE's - but I wouldn't be surprised if standard are lowered there as well.. I've never mentioned this before...I went to medical school in the late 1980s. There were 4 dark skinned individuals in my class @ state school. One Indian was treated as though he was white. One Iranian (I will never forget his sparkling blue eyes contrasting almost black hair) got recalled back to their army second year. The remaining two black students got full ride scholarship, despite one being from a very successful professional family that went to a private boarding school, an expensive liberal arts college, and the only student who wore "real" designer clothes; the other being upper middle class - somewhat above my background. Both of the latter failed miserably over and over, requiring private tutoring and hand-holding in every single subject. I was informed by a classmate with "an in" to the dean that they were actually getting exam questions in advance and were allowed to retake exams they still failed. I received ZERO financial support from my parents. Yet, despite being in the top three of my class each year of medical school, I only received financial merit scholarship of $500/yr and had to bankroll the rest of my 250K total bill with 13% HEAL loan, in contrast to the affirmative action students ("skin color scholarships) got FULL ride room, board, books, tuition purely on skin color. This is still how it goes in state schools, and probably even worse in private schools. The rich designer kid became a psychiatrist to the the LGBTQ community and the other, also at the very bottom of the class, provided family practice care in relatively underserved area and did quite well because of her skin color.

So does lowering standards and "affirmative action" really help darker skinned individuals and their communities? Highly doubt it. I would much, much rather see school choice for all youth as early as possible so that at least one variable of the equation could be removed (I do understand social issues at home persist). I was a short-bus kid starting in the fourth grade. All kids with promise should likewise have the right to be nurtured early regardless of skin color. Controlling the family situation and social issues at some point needs to be up to the family. But certain political factions, if they can't commit genocide via abortion clinics, want to keep that group oppressed by piss-poor education and the "oppressed" don't even seem to care. We know throwing money at disadvantaged school districts doesn't improve quality of education, just leads to graft.
Step-One test for 2nd going into 3rd year Medical Students will be Pass/Fail next year, PA's with only 600 hours are being used to replace MD's with 5,000 hours of experience, what could go wrong?
 
Typically the person that runs the business isn't the mechanic. It's completely different skill sets to own com operate, manage versus doing the actual work. But I think I get where you're coming from, at least in regards to Permitting, licensing, inspections... Some of that is complete BS.

We're gonna just have to disagree on licensing as it relates to the actual worker such as lawyers, plumbers, electricians, mechanics. And they can't pass even a basic test I surely don't want them representing me in court, working on my house, car or building.

We all know somebody that does good work in quite a few different fields. Lawyer for example. I knew a guy, dead now and rightfully so he was a complete piece of shit as a person but had decided to finish law school and passed the bar he would have been an awesome attorney. Before law school he knew more than most attorneys I've met and would trust him more then most board certified attorneys. But any schmuck that just says he knows law … absolutely not
I was talking mostly about a small business, maybe even run from home. I know the business side is usually separate.


Why we disagree is you trying to hold every other consumer to your standards. Somebody who isn’t the best in their field or maybe just venturing out on their own can still be able to provide a valuable service to the community. Just because you don’t trust them doesn’t mean anybody else can’t have the opportunity. Also where I think you’re confusing the issue is consumer cost. Somebody running a shoestring budget, with no reputation, no voluntarily acquired credentials, and who can’t offer many added amenities will definitely not be able to charge premium prices for their product/service. Just because you wouldn’t give this place a second glance doesn’t mean some other people wouldn’t

Another area of this issue that gets confused is the issue of customers being defrauded. That’s something I see all the time. “We’ll, if you let anyone do whatever they want opening a business won’t customers get ripped off?” Yes, they might. It’s their responsibility to do their diligence, caveat emptor and all that. But that is a reflection on the current state of affairs as well. That shit happens now too. And there is less and less that customers can expect their gov to do for them to be compensated.
 
Typically the person that runs the business isn't the mechanic. It's completely different skill sets to own com operate, manage versus doing the actual work. But I think I get where you're coming from, at least in regards to Permitting, licensing, inspections... Some of that is complete BS.

We're gonna just have to disagree on licensing as it relates to the actual worker such as lawyers, plumbers, electricians, mechanics. And they can't pass even a basic test I surely don't want them representing me in court, working on my house, car or building.

We all know somebody that does good work in quite a few different fields. Lawyer for example. I knew a guy, dead now and rightfully so he was a complete piece of shit as a person but had decided to finish law school and passed the bar he would have been an awesome attorney. Before law school he knew more than most attorneys I've met and would trust him more then most board certified attorneys. But any schmuck that just says he knows law … absolutely not

And a CPL? Do you believe that this should be licensed also?

It is a strange position for you to hold when Landmen themselves are often the target of accusations of unlicensed practitioners of law.
 
Why can't I just challenge the MD/DO test
I guarantee that I could pass it with zero effort. I have been doing the same thing as doctors for the past 25 years.

I'll put money on it that I have done many more things then most doctors.

Doc