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Movie Theater The Conjuring
- Thread starter roggom
- Start date
95% of all oceans have not been explored, so there is still a chance of finding intelligence on earth...
How much of the ocean have we explored?
How much of the ocean have we explored?
Ancient fish surprising scientists isn't a big deal - science thrives on surprises. Palaeontologists were surprised to discover that ancient fish, but it wasn't impossible that it existed. Nothing about it broke the laws of physics nor did it completely upend everything known about the evolution of fish. In the taxonomy of species there are often surprises and they tend to just fill in gaps in our knowledge or add new branches. Now if researchers were to find the fossil of a modern rabbit and radiometric dating were to confirm it being pre-Cambrian - that would throw everything into question. Is that possible some day? Of course, but so unlikely that it's not considered a viable option.
The thing about ghosts and spirits is that for us to see and interact with them, they have to be made of matter. And matter is something we understand very well, so much so that the Standard Model of Particle Physics is one of the most successful scientific theories of our time, accurate to incredible precision. And nowhere within that framework can supernatural behaviors fit, so they would have to be made of some kind of exotic matter. Sure, that's possible and only recently have we come to discover that ordinary baryonic matter (ie atoms) makes up a very small portion of the energy density of the universe. But here's the catch: by definition there's no way for it to interact with us except gravitationally. You can't see it, touch it, smell it, etc because it's not ordinary matter. And that gravitational interaction is so incredibly week at the scales we're talking about that it would be imperceptible let alone undetectable. Our understanding of particle physics is like a giant puzzle with gaps in it that get smaller and smaller the more we experiment and learn. A hundred years ago those gaps were huge and concepts like Ether and spirits had big areas to hide in, but that's no longer the case. In fact, it's getting harder and harder to stuff ancient concepts like ghosts and spirits into those tiny gaps, so much so that they are being treated the same as other ancient concepts born out of our scientific ignorance: not taken seriously. So again, could their be ghosts and spirits? Sure, but it's highly unlikely.
The thing about ghosts and spirits is that for us to see and interact with them, they have to be made of matter. And matter is something we understand very well, so much so that the Standard Model of Particle Physics is one of the most successful scientific theories of our time, accurate to incredible precision. And nowhere within that framework can supernatural behaviors fit, so they would have to be made of some kind of exotic matter. Sure, that's possible and only recently have we come to discover that ordinary baryonic matter (ie atoms) makes up a very small portion of the energy density of the universe. But here's the catch: by definition there's no way for it to interact with us except gravitationally. You can't see it, touch it, smell it, etc because it's not ordinary matter. And that gravitational interaction is so incredibly week at the scales we're talking about that it would be imperceptible let alone undetectable. Our understanding of particle physics is like a giant puzzle with gaps in it that get smaller and smaller the more we experiment and learn. A hundred years ago those gaps were huge and concepts like Ether and spirits had big areas to hide in, but that's no longer the case. In fact, it's getting harder and harder to stuff ancient concepts like ghosts and spirits into those tiny gaps, so much so that they are being treated the same as other ancient concepts born out of our scientific ignorance: not taken seriously. So again, could their be ghosts and spirits? Sure, but it's highly unlikely.
Very true, but that possibility is not equal to the possibility that it doesn't exist. When multiple lines of independent evidence point towards the same conclusion, the probability of that being correct is MUCH higher than the one none of the evidence points to. And there are varying levels of merit to evidence too, so an eye witness account that goes against a mountain of well established scientific evidence doesn't make it a 50/50 possibility.
It's ok if you are scared, you can just say, that you try to deny it in order to hide your fear. Like a small child hiding under a blanket, if you can't see them, they can't see you... I get it.
Friend of mine is a Vicar (Priest)
He's been asked to perform a couple of excorcisms. he told us (my parents & I about it)
Scares the living fucking crap out of me. YES I am VERY frightened by shit like that.
I come from a scientific background, and I CANNOT explain stuff like that in any rational manner, but I believe it is real.
Since I cannot explain it, yet it really does exist, if frightens the fuck out of me.
I have a really good mate, tactical firearms instructor for a UK police force, smart, rational guy. There is an area near his house they call the 3 Kings, it's 3 standing stones. He won't go anywhere near it after dark. There is an atmosphere at that place. His dog, police K9, it wont even go there!
Can I see anything? NO. Can I prove anything? NO. Does it frighten the shit out of me? YES!!
Fear is healthy. It stops you getting killed.
N
i much enjoy reading this debate. I also find it interesting how we all think and believe so differently, it makes us human. I believe it's "feeble minded" to write off something as false or make believe if it cant be explained scientifically. If you went back in time and explained the atomic bomb to say a european knight, think he would believe you? Take the great pyramids for example, all our steller scientists that are so smart can't explain how they were built to this day, they have theories, but none proven and problems with each, yet they exist. Same goes for stonehendge, they even now can't explain how they were done, yet here they are. The Roanoke colony? How about the Mayans, all theories but unproven. Point is there are a whole shit ton of things in this world yet to be discovered or explained "scientifically". I for one am not writing off the idea of any of them because i havent seen with my own eyes "evidence".
and since they've been mentioned a few times as this discussion evolved, Im not saying I believe in UFO's but in my mind for as mind boggling large as we KNOW the galaxy and universe to be, I think it's pretty damn arrogant to believe we are the only beings out there. do I believe in roswell, no, do I believe pretty much any of the claims of UFO sightings, hell no, but to think they arent out there is silly. just my opinion
and since they've been mentioned a few times as this discussion evolved, Im not saying I believe in UFO's but in my mind for as mind boggling large as we KNOW the galaxy and universe to be, I think it's pretty damn arrogant to believe we are the only beings out there. do I believe in roswell, no, do I believe pretty much any of the claims of UFO sightings, hell no, but to think they arent out there is silly. just my opinion
Just because delusional people believe in it does not make it real either. The burden of proof is always on the people making the claim not the other way around.
Throughout the history of mankind unexplainable things have been called supernatural instead of looking for a rational answer. Why? Fear and an acceptance of ignorance plays a major role here. Grown men shaking in their boots like little children, pissing their pants and crapping their panties.
I don't look at unexplained anomalies with fear but rather curiosity. I have seen some strange things in my life that I absolutely cannot explain but I can tell you that it wasn't a ghost or demon.
There's nothing magical to Stonehenge, the Pyramids and Mayan civilization. Yes, it's amazing what primitive humans were able to accomplish when they had lots of time and lots of slaves, but there's nothing about any of that stuff that's impossible. The controversy you're pointing to has more to do with figuring out the mechanics of how they built those structures, but no one seriously denies that it's impossible.
No arrogance here on us being the only people - I think statistically it's very likely that there are other intelligent civilizations in the universe, especially considering how much we've learned about exoplanets in the last 20 years. But the chance that we've been visited by any of them I find highly unlikely for two main reasons. First, the distances involved are quite literally astronomical and I think even an advanced race would be hard pressed to travel them. Second, and more importantly, there could literally be billions of civilizations, but probably not at the same time. Since we only have our own experience as a metric, civilizations probably come and go over periods of thousands of years, which is the blink of an eye on geological and astronomical time scales. I'm of the opinion that this is the primary reason for the Fermi Paradox, but that's just me. If we are being visited by alien craft, there should be physical evidence at some point, but until then it seems we're left with a steady stream of claims that don't hold up to scrutiny. And sometimes people get pissed off that they're being dismissed, so then they devolve into conspiracy theories and the like. And for the record, I think alien beings are far more likely than ghosts, spirits and the supernatural (and Bigfoot or Leprechauns).
No arrogance here on us being the only people - I think statistically it's very likely that there are other intelligent civilizations in the universe, especially considering how much we've learned about exoplanets in the last 20 years. But the chance that we've been visited by any of them I find highly unlikely for two main reasons. First, the distances involved are quite literally astronomical and I think even an advanced race would be hard pressed to travel them. Second, and more importantly, there could literally be billions of civilizations, but probably not at the same time. Since we only have our own experience as a metric, civilizations probably come and go over periods of thousands of years, which is the blink of an eye on geological and astronomical time scales. I'm of the opinion that this is the primary reason for the Fermi Paradox, but that's just me. If we are being visited by alien craft, there should be physical evidence at some point, but until then it seems we're left with a steady stream of claims that don't hold up to scrutiny. And sometimes people get pissed off that they're being dismissed, so then they devolve into conspiracy theories and the like. And for the record, I think alien beings are far more likely than ghosts, spirits and the supernatural (and Bigfoot or Leprechauns).
Dude, the only one talking about fear or people pissing in their pants is you. I never said I was scared or shaking in my pants at anything. Makes me think that perhaps it's you that's afraid. Simply said I had an experience that defied logical explanation and made me a believer.
Using your logic, I can sit here and call you ignorant for dismising things you have zero knowledge of simply because you've never experienced it or can't explain it. That's about as closed and simple minded as it gets. But I'll let you contiune to do the name calling and insulting. That seems about all you're able to bring to the table.
Did it ever occur to you that you're simply applying what you know, our laws of physics to something that we know NOTHING about. Something that might not necessarily operate within those laws that you're so fond of?
the point i was making is that science hasnt been able to prove how those monuments were built and they are solid items in front of us, so to me it's not a stretch of the imagination that science cant explain ghosts/spirits, but because one is in front of us it is acceptable to not understand, but the other is not.
speaking of the pyramids I watched a documentary that said they dont believe even with our modern building know how that we could do the pyramids as accurate and as large, thats fascinating to me.
speaking of the pyramids I watched a documentary that said they dont believe even with our modern building know how that we could do the pyramids as accurate and as large, thats fascinating to me.
The problem here is that you're paying attention to a documentary and not the Anthropology community who actually do the research and study that stuff for a living. Why don't you email the Anthropology department of your local university and ask them about those structures?
And SlapChop, I hear where you're coming from but if we applied that logic to every investigation we'd get nowhere. "Yeah, he said something drove past here, but we can't find any tracks, no disturbed terrain, no physical evidence that anything moved along this surface...but it's possible it was a vehicle that doesn't interact with normal matter and just passes right through it." Imagine how murder investigations would turn out if the lack of physical evidence could be trumped by the assailant not being required to abide by the laws of physics? We'd never be able to draw a reasonable conclusion by a majority of evidence because quite literally anything would be a possible alternative. The thing about physics and math, for example, is that it's not subjective and up to opinion or variation depending on where you are. It's not as if Einstein's matter/energy equation is only viable on Earth or like polarity charges repel each other here but not on Mars.
thats a good Idea, may have to do that. Though the response I will get is a scientist's theory, not a fact, unless they have broken the code and i'm fairly sure we all would have heard about it by now, correct me if I'm wrong.
oh and I never said I take a documentary as the gospel, as they say, I just said I found it fascinating
Scientific theories are made of facts. A lot of people confuse the colloquial use of the word theory, which is basically an idea, with scientific theory, which is a predictive model that explains the data (ie facts) and can be tested. If you ask an Anthropologist, he should be able to give you the best evidence to explain that understanding, in other words the reasons why they think this or that about the Pyramids, etc.
Did anyone read the link I posted? Look into his work? That was a scientific experiment, that concluded something with mass leaves the body at the exact time of death. That is science. It was proven. Proving WHAT left the body is a question, sure, but it would seem to prove, there is proof of things we can't explain.
Oh yeah, I forgot about that one. It's a classic, even Snopes has a page on it:
snopes.com: Weight of the Soul
"His postulations on this topic are a curiosity, but nothing more"
The bottom line on that is that his methodology was flawed and his results were inconclusive. That's probably why we don't hear much about it anymore.
snopes.com: Weight of the Soul
"His postulations on this topic are a curiosity, but nothing more"
The bottom line on that is that his methodology was flawed and his results were inconclusive. That's probably why we don't hear much about it anymore.
Just got back a bit ago, me and my GF went and saw this movie. It was definitely freaky as "hell", to know that it is based off of true events is truly disturbing. I would love to know how much Hollywood embellished the story though.
[video=youtube;VdjwNnPp-n8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdjwNnPp-n8&t=32m1s[/video]
This portion (32:00) of a panel with Mythbusters' Adam Savage reminded me of this thread, namely the 21 grams claim.
This portion (32:00) of a panel with Mythbusters' Adam Savage reminded me of this thread, namely the 21 grams claim.
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Watched it tonight,
you know how I know it's a true story, cop in the room and the real Lorraine Warren in the picture.
you know how I know it's a true story, cop in the room and the real Lorraine Warren in the picture.
My wife and I are all about the horror move thing. I don't think there are many we haven't seen.
The unexplained is always written off by the scientific community and by the hard core religious its god or the devil. I fall in the middle ground where I have no conclusive proof ether way so UFO'S ghosts all exist until conclusively proven otherwise. However I would also say that the majority of the claims have reasonable explanations.
list of some of my top "Main Stream" horror movies! no particular order..
-Exorcism of Emily rose
-The grudge original in subtitles
-frontier French
-high tension
-irreversible French
-livide French
The unexplained is always written off by the scientific community and by the hard core religious its god or the devil. I fall in the middle ground where I have no conclusive proof ether way so UFO'S ghosts all exist until conclusively proven otherwise. However I would also say that the majority of the claims have reasonable explanations.
list of some of my top "Main Stream" horror movies! no particular order..
-Exorcism of Emily rose
-The grudge original in subtitles
-frontier French
-high tension
-irreversible French
-livide French
Finally got around to watching this. Was waiting for a bootleg copy to come my way. Was good but not great. They over hyped the film and typical Hollywood they exaggerate the details. The real life Annabelle doll looks nothing like the one that was used in the movie. Oh well!
By the way, I don't think Irreversible was a "horror" flick but it sure as shit is one of the most disturbing movies I've ever seen. Then again, perhaps that's what makes it horrific.
By the way, I don't think Irreversible was a "horror" flick but it sure as shit is one of the most disturbing movies I've ever seen. Then again, perhaps that's what makes it horrific.
Giant apes were very real. Google Gigantopithecus. Scientists believe they may have disappeared as recently as a hundred thousand years ago, which would mean they may have interacted with modern humans to some degree. I'm of the opinion that they are now extinct.
I'm not going to share my fucked up experiences with the unexplained on an internet forum, but I will say that if the Ghost Hunters actually believed, I don't think they would go out looking for the shit.
Science is the way forward, but I like to keep an open mind. The universe is billions of years old. Modern science is a couple hundred years old at best. Hell, do we even know what reality is?
I'm not going to share my fucked up experiences with the unexplained on an internet forum, but I will say that if the Ghost Hunters actually believed, I don't think they would go out looking for the shit.
Science is the way forward, but I like to keep an open mind. The universe is billions of years old. Modern science is a couple hundred years old at best. Hell, do we even know what reality is?
I just saw this last night finally. IMO it was boring and not scary...overall disappointing. I mean, c'mon....it had Peter Gibbons in it!
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