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Ok Tim. What is the right question?Why would I get annoyed ?
nothing on a forum annoys me, it’s kind of like yelling at the puppy for wizzing on the rug, ultimately, they grow up.
For Justin, it is very simple, fairly bad methodology.
when you take pictures before and after, BUT, you improperly clean your barrel, precisely what you learning ? Any valid testing should incorporate some discipline about your testing procedures as much as your tests, why I deleted my posts, these likely to follow soon.
Trying for answers....very worthy exercise. Not asking the right questions to begin with.....not so much.
As I said before.....not really my opinions. Don’t kill the messenger.
Still waiting for your “right question”.Justin, that there kind of illustrates a point.
Did you really do ONE search on RF barrel break in ?? Could prove useful if that was actually a thing.
How about RF barrel wear, RF barrel life, RF barrel erosion, and on and on ?
How about searches on the appropriate forums?
It took me about 10 minutes to find a pantload of stuff.
Less time on snarky posts, more time learning how to measure groups(0 for 6).Justin the ignore button is an awesome feature.
The Free floated barrel and find the brand your rifle likes... I'm listening!! Well ok I dont care on the free floated barrel thing because i have seen rifles that shoot better with some pressure at the forend and some that dont.@AGrizz...that's my problem, couldn't find any documentation of rimfire barrel wear during the first 1000 shots.
Plenty of opinions as to what is occurring and claims of improved accuracy after 2 bricks of 22lr sent.
However, no actual documentation of change over time. That's what Tim pointed out in a previous thread.
I was basing my comments on unsubstantiated information. A search of the internet showed he was correct.
Opinions and anecdotal evidence aplenty, hard data/images none with rimfire. When ya' can't trust y'er information
ya' have to try it for y'erself. I've been doing that with rimfire for about 9 years .
Determining if those internet rimfire truisms are based on fact or wishful thinking.
Things like free floated barrels, find the brand y'er rifle likes, sub-moa all day long,
precision shooting with 17hmr and 22wmr, consistent accuracy at 200 yards, supersonic transition.
Try 'em, document 'em, figure out what works and what are incorrect conclusions based on minimal data.
Everyone needs a hobby, rimfire keeps me occupied.
I think Tim might be a bit annoyed that I don't agree with his opinions/experiences.
It's possible I might have pissed him off-fa-fa.
I do affect some folks that way.
Likely because I question everything.
Tim I like your making sure JM keeps it on the straight and narrow lol!
Sorry my bad! I was thinking JA in my head but....If that is a reference to me, I'd like to know the cause. Can't recall making any controversial comments.
If I understand what you are saying finding a ”good” lot is about the quality of the lot and very, very little about your particular rifle’s preference.Have you ever noticed that some lot numbers disappear overnight,
and others linger for weeks being sold off in dribs and drabs?
Those batches that produce great results get noticed and word gets out fast.
When you find cartridges with minimal ES and correctly assembled well made components
they shoot well in all rifles. Get y'er hands on some of that ammo
the results on target will astound you.
If your bored... and you have a way to measure base to ogive length? Is the wolf and team the same? What does the stuff measure that doesnt shoot?I bought a brick of eley team none of my rifles liked it , I bought a brick of eley wolf match extra none of my rifles liked I bought a 40xb and it dosent shoot very well with any of the ordered brands ,,,,, but ,,,,, it loves this brick of team and wolf and will shoot with or even out shoot the other rifles with ammo they like
I don’t know how this throws in your mix but it was something I noticed in one case
It will have zero to do with OAL, UNLESS you have and extremely short or long chamber.If your bored... and you have a way to measure base to ogive length? Is the wolf and team the same? What does the stuff measure that doesnt shoot?
I dont care about consistency I'm just wondering average length.
My chamber shouldn't be any extreme. I didnt measure is so could be its long. In theory its 0.6 I ordered a Calfee 4. (I dont have a 22lr reamer)It will have zero to do with OAL, UNLESS you have and extremely short or long chamber.
The only accurate way to measure it is to have a small piece of barrel with a partial chamber cut to make a die and can then yield accurate OAL measurements.
It is only important with certain MI match barrels cut for a particular OAL lot, lots can vary at least .010” .
doesn't the affinity of a given rifle for different ammo types have more to do with headspace and the different rim thicknesses ?It will have zero to do with OAL, UNLESS you have and extremely short or long chamber.
The only accurate way to measure it is to have a small piece of barrel with a partial chamber cut to make a die and can then yield accurate OAL measurements.
It is only important with certain MI match barrels cut for a particular OAL lot, lots can vary at least .010” .
As for air rifles. You Sir, evidently have absolutely zero experience with them. Please gain some information prior to your answers. Pyramid air would be a great place to start.Pellets aren't a good comparison, the lead in pellets is dead soft and velocity is low, probably around 400 fps. As mentioned already I doubt the quality of a Crosman barrel is very high.
Well Sir, please enlighten me where my error is.As for air rifles. You Sir, evidently have absolutely zero experience with them. Please gain some information prior to your answers. Pyramid air would be a great place to start.
For higher grade ammo, not for 20 years. Almost all BR rifles are set @ .043”doesn't the affinity of a given rifle for different ammo types have more to do with headspace and the different rim thicknesses ?
At least that appears to be my experience. It may be self delusion but i think i can bias a gun towards a particular ammo type by tuning the headspace to ammo type... Note this doesn't mean that i can get bulk ammo to shoot well - just that given two 'match grade' ammos one or the other will shoot better depending on how the headspace is adjusted.
Are you sure it’s .050”, that seems huge. Unless you have an aggressive MI barrel, probably a non-issue.My chamber shouldn't be any extreme. I didnt measure is so could be its long. In theory its 0.6 I ordered a Calfee 4. (I dont have a 22lr reamer)
Now with the Rim X I have a 0.050 head space this gives enough clearance with the fixed extractor to avoid issues with dirt at a match. So longer then I typically would do. Maybe that plays a part?
My results agree with what you. My best shooting ammo at 200 has the biggest variation in length.
What I'm wondering is. Do rifles prefer a length in broad strokes. I have found that long lots of a ammo shoot better then short lots of the same. Also ammo that is all long I can shoot multiple lots with simular results even if the velocity are the different lot to lot. At 200 that is at 50 some of the short ammo is best. Center X, Eley match.
At 200
0.76s dont shoot. Low 0.77s is hit or miss. 0.776- 0.781 shoots great. I have some 0.75 to try. I have nothing over 0.78 to try.
Justin....do you realize the bore is probably not rough, you cannot tell, that’s a badly leaded bore.Question came up...How do you know it's not just the lead causing the smoothing?
Had to think about it to maybe provide an answer.
Air rifles use lead pellets at a decent fps.
Do pellet rifles show smoothing of the rifling?
No burn residue involved.
I've never seen the inside of my Crosman 1322 air pistol barrel before...it ain't pretty.
This ones had about 3 tins of 14 grain 22 pellets through it. 1500 shots
I don't see any signs of smoothing...yikes.
Good thing it's only used at less than 10 yards.
Not exactly what I would call polished...would you?
Captured multiple locations.
That be some rough rifling.
And yes, that's after passing a bronze brush through the bore.
Link to the rest of the images https://photos.app.goo.gl/ZBBV82v6WindM7Ef6
Your first sentence says it all.Everyone has a different cleaning routine. I NEVER put a brush in my rimfire barrels. Patches only with Rimfire Blend down the bore and the tuner. Carbon remover on a patch soaked in the chamber for 15 minutes.
I'm sure on the 0.05 it surprised me as well. It is a prefit I left as is. The gauge sent with the action is 0.051 so I'm at the max. I could set a little tighter but the bolt face would get tight on the barrel because of the rimx fixed extractor.Are you sure it’s .050”, that seems huge. Unless you have an aggressive MI barrel, probably a non-issue.
With those, some chambers are cut looking for a narrow OAL range, which is why I’d assume in the recent past, somebody like Calfee was droning on endlessly about having ELEY post OAL on lot labels. The rifling on those is super shallow almost non existent, and type and depth of chamber super critical as well.
Those barrels can be extremely intolerant about what they like.
Actually it’s the 2nd sentence and, let ‘s maybe remember you’ve been doing this about 15 minutes.Your first sentence says it all.
That ‘s odd. Somewhere down the line measure how much recess is in the bolt nose.I'm sure on the 0.05 it surprised me as well. It is a prefit I left as is. The gauge sent with the action is 0.051 so I'm at the max. I could set a little tighter but the bolt face would get tight on the barrel because of the rimx fixed extractor.
I'll have to admit i'm lost on the MI barrels....
My bad the gauge is 0.050". I can "force" the bold closed but barely... has to spotless clean and any tighter it wouldn't go so I'm under the 50 with no tension.That ‘s odd. Somewhere down the line measure how much recess is in the bolt nose.
have you ever set it where the extractor is barely touching breech face? 6-7 thou is not very much. just thinking out loud.
ever think of reaching out to them to see if that is where they set all of them ?
According to @Zermatt Arms "Minimum [headspace] for the RimX will be .0455" with a maximum of .0500"."That ‘s odd. Somewhere down the line measure how much recess is in the bolt nose.
have you ever set it where the extractor is barely touching breech face? 6-7 thou is not very much. just thinking out loud.
ever think of reaching out to them to see if that is where they set all of them ?
Does barrel polishing occur shooting rimfire ammunition,
does it improve accuracy over time, if polishing does occur
how many shots does it take to show that improvement?
Since when does bad rifling have deposits ON TOP of the underlying metal ? Any crap barrel fish yields tool marks, inclusions, rough finish INTO the steel, not on top of the steel and since it's probably lead, you can brush it until your freaking arm falls off without much improvement when it gets bad. That's why they make specific lead remover like No Lead. Different approaches for different issues.Tim, I knew you were going to point out my cleaning technique.
That's why I added the note regarding how it was cleaned.
That's not leading of the rifling. It was cleaned with solvent and a bronze brush.
That is the actual steel finish of the barrel...that's some seriously poor rifling.
I do know how to clean a barrel. Not a totally ignorant amateur on this side of the keyboard.