The Modern Scout Rifle

[Abbotm2]

I’ve noticed a trend and all of my rifles and in the industry of having shorter barrels to accommodate suppressors, while also being able to do more than you would think with lower magnification optics.

The original scout rifle imagined by Jeff Cooper in the 1980s was a short Barrel bolt action with a wide field of view optic.

After listening to a vortex podcast I realized some of my favorite rifles are indeed modern scout rifles. I can’t reach Mr. Cooper’s weight limit of 7.5 pounds with steel suppressors and have no use for a .308 but between 300blk, 223, and 45-70 I think have the bases covered.

Would love to get your thoughts on a modern scout rifle, I bet you have one and didn’t even know it. 5x Prism with an offset red dot @10oz? Cooper would love that shit if he had the tech.

 

[stanley_white]

If you truly want to understand Jeff Cooper, and the evolution of his concept of a Scout Rifle, buy and read all the Gunsite Gossip books.

-Stan

 

[Abbotm2]

Thank I will definitely look into that.

I am really interested in what the scout rifle would be if it was conceived In 2023, hopefully more interesting then a recce AR.

 

[Mrpike71]

If Cooper was still around I suspect he’d have a quality lpvo (1-6/10) mounted above the action, not forward.

 

[Daddyusmaximus]

I always thought the scout rifle was a cool concept. The forwards mounted scope was what caught my attention mostly. I really liked having both eyes open, and having the extra awareness without a big scope right up in front of my face. However, like everything else, concepts can evolve over time. I think that had the Col lived longer, he may have changed some of his parameters as newer tools came into use like the red dot sights, and LPVO scopes we have today. I have two rifles that I consider "all purpose" or "general purpose" which is what I think a Scout would have evolved into. One, however, is more scout like in the traditional sense due to it's forward optic. Both of those optics are of the newer types I just mentioned. One, an LPVO, the other a red dot. I did not stick with the caliber choice of the late Col for either rifle. Both calibers are well suitable for the job, they just aren't as easy to find should I have to replenish while traveling. Lucky for me, I'm not a professional guide.


First is a Remington 700 Classic chambered in 7mm Mauser. Nice, smooth, modern rifle, in one of my favorite calibers. No heavy recoil, yet enough pop to put down anything I'll ever need to. For this one, I put a PA 1-8. Though it doesn't match up directly with the 7mm Mauser, the ACSS reticule is wonderful. I love the illumination, and the power range. Close shots are quick and easy at 1X (I leave it there) and should I need it, I can zoom out to 8 power. That's almost as good as a typical 3x9 hunting scope. I added the Magpul Hunter bottom metal (plastic) so it now sports DBM capability. Surefire FS allows the use of a can.

The second one I've had longer, and is more scout like. Built on an old surplus weapon, it can feed from stripper clips as intended. The barrel was shortened to 16.25" and it sports a forward mounted red dot. Zero power magnification is even faster than low power, so snap shots are as close to instant as can be. Take it off if it goes tits up, and I still have the irons. Ten rounds in the mag is handy, and it's based on the fastest bolt action ever fielded by a major Army. One with a long, and storied history. The Lee Enfield No4 MkI. I fell in love with this set up so much, I did my son's Mosin up like it, then 2 lever guns. No... it doesn't make weight. I did put a SF Warcomp on it so I can use my can, but have yet to try it out on there. Haven't had the can long (Surefire SOCOM mini 30) and I'm not gonna try it unless I'm dead sure the .311 bullets from the .303 British won't destroy my .30 cal can. I will say it sure does shoot smooth....

 

[memilanuk]

I'd love to see / hear more about that Mosin conversion, specifically how you mounted the red dot. I've got a Mosin carbine in an old B&C stock that is kind of a fun 'truck gun' as is... but a red dot like that would be pretty cool!

 

[Daddyusmaximus]

I'd love to see / hear more about that Mosin conversion, specifically how you mounted the red dot. I've got a Mosin carbine in an old B&C stock that is kind of a fun 'truck gun' as is... but a red dot like that would be pretty cool!

Took the rear sight off, then had my gunsmith mill it flat, cut some grooves in the sides of the sight base for the clamps to fit in. (Sig Romeo 5)
Then he cut a groove for the crossbolt to fit it...
I also gutted 550 cord to fix ammo pouches to the stock in a similar fashion to how the M1 Carbines looked back in WWII.
Sight sits real low, and the sight picture is easy, and natural.

 

[memilanuk]

Took the rear sight off, then had my gunsmith mill it flat, cut some grooves in the sides of the sight base for the clamps to fit in. (Sig Romeo 5)
Then he cut a groove for the crossbolt to fit it...

Sweet. After I asked I'd found a few rails designed to replace the rear sight, but it sounds like your approach is a little more direct

 

[Guns&WhiteWater]

Here is my scout rifle in its current configuration. I tried the scout scope concept with a fixed power EER Leupold but hated the extremely narrow field of view and poor low light performance when hunting.

The 2 MOA red dot is ideal for this rifle because that’s about equal to its practical accuracy, and the speed of acquiring moving targets can’t be beat. However after two seasons of deep woods hunting with it, I’ve found it can be difficult to spot pesky branches with the optic. Probably going to move the Romeo 5 over to my 35 Remington lever gun and install a 1-6 LPVO on it for ethical reasons.

 

[memilanuk]

Probably going to move the Romeo 5 over to my 35 Remington lever gun and install a 1-6 LPVO on it for ethical reasons.

Ethical reasons? What makes a LPVO more 'ethical' than a red dot? Honestly curious...

 

[Guns&WhiteWater]

I had trouble seeing branches that could deflect my bullet when I was viewing deer with the red dot in the woods at distances starting around 75 yards. I had to use my bino to find shooting lanes in certain situations. I wasn’t aware of this at first. I’m thinking that 4-6x magnification would allow better situational awareness of obstructions that are hard to spot with the non-magnified sight.

This would not apply in open woods or fields, of course.

 

[simpletoms]

I always thought the scout rifle was a cool concept. The forwards mounted scope was what caught my attention mostly. I really liked having both eyes open, and having the extra awareness without a big scope right up in front of my face. However, like everything else, concepts can evolve over time. I think that had the Col lived longer, he may have changed some of his parameters as newer tools came into use like the red dot sights, and LPVO scopes we have today. I have two rifles that I consider "all purpose" or "general purpose" which is what I think a Scout would have evolved into. One, however, is more scout like in the traditional sense due to it's forward optic. Both of those optics are of the newer types I just mentioned. One, an LPVO, the other a red dot. I did not stick with the caliber choice of the late Col for either rifle. Both calibers are well suitable for the job, they just aren't as easy to find should I have to replenish while traveling. Lucky for me, I'm not a professional guide.


First is a Remington 700 Classic chambered in 7mm Mauser. Nice, smooth, modern rifle, in one of my favorite calibers. No heavy recoil, yet enough pop to put down anything I'll ever need to. For this one, I put a PA 1-8. Though it doesn't match up directly with the 7mm Mauser, the ACSS reticule is wonderful. I love the illumination, and the power range. Close shots are quick and easy at 1X (I leave it there) and should I need it, I can zoom out to 8 power. That's almost as good as a typical 3x9 hunting scope. I added the Magpul Hunter bottom metal (plastic) so it now sports DBM capability. Surefire FS allows the use of a can.


View attachment 8061673

The second one I've had longer, and is more scout like. Built on an old surplus weapon, it can feed from stripper clips as intended. The barrel was shortened to 16.25" and it sports a forward mounted red dot. Zero power magnification is even faster than low power, so snap shots are as close to instant as can be. Take it off if it goes tits up, and I still have the irons. Ten rounds in the mag is handy, and it's based on the fastest bolt action ever fielded by a major Army. One with a long, and storied history. The Lee Enfield No4 MkI. I fell in love with this set up so much, I did my son's Mosin up like it, then 2 lever guns. No... it doesn't make weight. I did put a SF Warcomp on it so I can use my can, but have yet to try it out on there. Haven't had the can long (Surefire SOCOM mini 30) and I'm not gonna try it unless I'm dead sure the .311 bullets from the .303 British won't destroy my .30 cal can. I will say it sure does shoot smooth....

View attachment 8061679

That’s pretty slick. But that thing has got to go BOOOMMMMM!

 

[Potsy]

I think Col. Cooper (in 2023) would mandate A.I. pattern bottom metal. He was also a fan of BUIS on a Scout. I do think he’d prefer a rail mounted LPVO over the forward mounted scopes he preached 30 years ago.

In terms of caliber, he was a proponent of a .308 as a .308 would handle any situation the Scout was designed for and, being a military round, was commonly available. I do think he had a Scout built in a wildcat caliber (.360 Fireplug?) strictly for hunting game where he wanted something larger.

I remember reading him say that the Scout Rifle was a “generalist” in concept. It wasn’t designed to do anything perfectly, it was designed to do everything well.

 

[Daddyusmaximus]

That’s pretty slick. But that thing has got to go BOOOMMMMM!

Even with the short barrel (I'll guess you're talking about the Lee Enfield) and the muzzle brake, it's really not bad at all. I think that with surplus ammo being harder to find, and modern ammo using different (better) powders, it all burns within that 16.25 inches. They probably load it down a bit for use in 75+ year old rifles too.

50 yds with the red dot... PPU SP ammo, old gun, old man, old eyes... but it still works.
Heavy though. Wouldn't want to hump it when I got ARs... lol.