Rifle Scopes The parallax killer

[Long Range Pellet]

Hi everyone,

i wanted to share and take some advice for some nightmare i’m having for last couple week,

i decided to get a budget scope as the athlon argos btr 6-24x50 ffp but the seller encourage me to get the vector optics marksman 6-24x50ffp. I got that and mounted without bedding and noticed that my parallax knob got stuck and the clarity died after 15x mag. Then i took it back to the dealer and i said i don’t trust vector optics anymore so i paid little bit more and changed with vortex diamondback tactical 6-24x50ffp. I was happy but i spent twice as my budget. Anyways i mounted it about 18 inch pounds and the exact same problem occured. Mailed to vortex and they forwarded the situation to distributor. Changed the optic immediately with the same.
Mounted again and torqued with about 15 inches pound and try to feel how parallax knob was free. Heard a ting! Inside of the scope! Stopped and untightened the screws and check the knob was ok.
Went shooting and parallax started to focus at higher ranges (like target @100m knob focuses at apprx. 300) then checked the 200m target with 24x guess what? Bloody blurry vision!
called the seller guy and replied like “ what the hell? Its been about 30 years in the sector and never heard a problem something like you are having?” Noticed that im all alone now. Tried to mail the distributor about the problem but no return yet i m pretty sure that my scope mount ruined 3 scopes in 2 weeks but i have to solve the problem. Sorry for the long story but i need some help because i m about to cry and that scope costed me about 1,5 times of my salary. And i feel pretty shy to talk with the dealer and the distributor. Im from Turkey btw. It will not so easy to send it to the vortex to be serviced.

 

[thehun]

Well...what mount are you using...is it cheapo chicom crap?

 

[Baron23]

Hi everyone,

i wanted to share and take some advice for some nightmare i’m having for last couple week,

i decided to get a budget scope as the athlon argos btr 6-24x50 ffp but the seller encourage me to get the vector optics marksman 6-24x50ffp. I got that and mounted without bedding and noticed that my parallax knob got stuck and the clarity died after 15x mag. Then i took it back to the dealer and i said i don’t trust vector optics anymore so i paid little bit more and changed with vortex diamondback tactical 6-24x50ffp. I was happy but i spent twice as my budget. Anyways i mounted it about 18 inch pounds and the exact same problem occured. Mailed to vortex and they forwarded the situation to distributor. Changed the optic immediately with the same.
Mounted again and torqued with about 15 inches pound and try to feel how parallax knob was free. Heard a ting! Inside of the scope! Stopped and untightened the screws and check the knob was ok.
Went shooting and parallax started to focus at higher ranges (like target @100m knob focuses at apprx. 300) then checked the 200m target with 24x guess what? Bloody blurry vision!
called the seller guy and replied like “ what the hell? Its been about 30 years in the sector and never heard a problem something like you are having?” Noticed that im all alone now. Tried to mail the distributor about the problem but no return yet i m pretty sure that my scope mount ruined 3 scopes in 2 weeks but i have to solve the problem. Sorry for the long story but i need some help because i m about to cry and that scope costed me about 1,5 times of my salary. And i feel pretty shy to talk with the dealer and the distributor. Im from Turkey btw. It will not so easy to send it to the vortex to be serviced.View attachment 7455127

so, the million dollar question is what rings are you using that hosed up three scopes in quick sequence?

 

[Long Range Pellet]

Thanks for replies, yeah it can be said that the mount crappy. the vector optics one piece ar type one. six screws per ring.
But in Turkey these mounts are classified as “standard” or “useable”

 

[Baron23]

Thanks for replies, yeah it can be said that the mount crappy. the vector optics one piece ar type one. six screws per ring.
But in Turkey these mounts are classified as “standard” or “useable”

Brother, I’m no expert but the only constant is the mount, really probably the ring part of the one piece.

sounds like you managed to screw up the tube/erector in three different scope. Has to be the mount as Vortex’s torque spec is indeed 18 in/lbs. inch/pounds, not foot/lbs...right?

send it back to Vortex. They cover anything under warranty.

an idiot friend of mine (well, no more of an idiot than I and the rest of my friends) fell out of a rusted tree stand and mangled his leg and the Viper onhis rifle. He was honest and told them exactly what happened and asked if they could repair it and he would pay. They sent him a new scope under warranty.

AND DO NOT PUT ANOTHER SCOPE IN THAT MOUNT. Haha

take a hammer to that mount and beat it into junk.

my suggestion is to look at a good quality mount. Since you like one piece, Spuhr comes to mind. Lots of decent ones out there to include Leupold, Vortex, Badger, really tight stuff, etc. but these are not inexpensive.

others here who know more will most likely have more and better suggestions.

 

[thehun]

I bet you money you are torqueing it ft/lbs instead of in/lbs...or if you are in metric...I bet your values are off...

Get a fat wrench....stay away from junk Chicom stuff unless it comes from a reputable company like Vortex or Primary Arms...

 

[Long Range Pellet]

Brother, I’m no expert but the only constant is the mount, really probably the ring part of the one piece.

sounds like you managed to screw up the tube/erector in three different scope. Has to be the mount as Vortex’s torque spec is indeed 18 in/lbs. inch/pounds, not foot/lbs...right?

send it back to Vortex. They cover anything under warranty.

an idiot friend of mine (well, no more of an idiot than I and the rest of my friends) fell out of a rusted tree stand and mangled his leg and the Viper onhis rifle. He was honest and told them exactly what happened and asked if they could repair it and he would pay. They sent him a new scope under warranty.

AND DO NOT PUT ANOTHER SCOPE IN THAT MOUNT. Haha

take a hammer to that mount and beat it into junk.

my suggestion is to look at a good quality mount. Since you like one piece, Spuhr comes to mind. Lots of decent ones out there to include Leupold, Vortex, Badger, really tight stuff, etc. but these are not inexpensive.

others here who know more will most likely have more and better suggestions.

LOL thanks Baron for the experiences you shared Felt much better. You can be sure about that i will melt the mount, shoot it hundreds of rounds. But although i still wonder, while i am having these troubles, some shimming the scope and shoot flawlessly, if my shitty mount lead that nightmare ( maybe ring tension problem with misaligned rings) how do they don’t

 

[Long Range Pellet]

I bet you money you are torqueing it ft/lbs instead of in/lbs...or if you are in metric...I bet your values are off...

Get a fat wrench....stay away from junk Chicom stuff unless it comes from a reputable company like Vortex or Primary Arms...

Sounds crazy but im sure that im working with inches because i used an “L” allen key to double check the tension. holding the shorter side with two fingers. With a little pressure it turns slightly

 

[ormandj]

Sounds crazy but im sure that im working with inches because i used an “L” allen key to double check the tension. holding the shorter side with two fingers. With a little pressure it turns slightly

If it's that loose (short end of an Allen wrench with a few fingers can loosen it), I find it hard to believe it's causing the binding you're describing, even if the rings are trash. I agree with the others, however, use the Vortex warranty, and get another mount. I'd suggest finding someone with a really nice torque wrench in in/lb to use, too, just in case.

Also - just to check - are you using a thread locking compound on the scope mount ring screws? If so you need to significantly reduce torque. I think when Vortex calls for 18in/lb normally, if you use thread locker, they require no more than 11in/lb.

 

[Long Range Pellet]

It’s crazy right? Maybe the rings were misaligned and bit scope with the sharp edges. ( the contact area decreases, the pressure force increases as a phys101 formula) nope didn’t use locktite. just put it on and “screw” it up. Btw good news The distributor replied as “send me the scope, i will inform you after I investigate the scope” crossed my fingers I don’t want to be gotten as a “warranty violator”
Yeah looks like a torque wrench became a “need” rather than “want”.
but i wonder for years, why the manufacturers don’t produce these scopes tougher? To be fitted on a cheaper mounts or tightening the screws with more confidence? The weight? Who cares? I don’t want to be scared when I’m tightening the screws or don’t want to use a torque wrench or locktite etc
If i were a manufacturer I would fit a 30mm erector to a 35 mm tube with much more thicker walls

 

[ormandj]

It’s crazy right? Maybe the rings were misaligned and bit scope with the sharp edges. ( the contact area decreases, the pressure force increases as a phys101 formula) nope didn’t use locktite. just put it on and “screw” it up. Btw good news The distributor replied as “send me the scope, i will inform you after I investigate the scope” crossed my fingers I don’t want to be gotten as a “warranty violator”
Yeah looks like a torque wrench became a “need” rather than “want”.
but i wonder for years, why the manufacturers don’t produce these scopes tougher? To be fitted on a cheaper mounts or tightening the screws with more confidence? The weight? Who cares? I don’t want to be scared when I’m tightening the screws or don’t want to use a torque wrench or locktite etc
If i were a manufacturer I would fit a 30mm erector to a 35 mm tube with much more thicker walls

Many of these scopes now can be used as hammers, they are already durable and heavy enough! Clamping forces are entirely different, so your point concerning physics is relevant. You don’t want a scope strong enough to prevent internal deflection from incorrectly machined mounts at higher clamping values, it would weigh far too much. I don’t know about you but I think many scopes already weigh too much; another half kilo to kilo would be silly.

The manufacturers fixed this problem by not covering claims due to user error. Your distributor and dealer are unbelievably kind to you to continue assisting; most would have told you to buy another scope by now with that number of scopes damaged in the same exact way.

Please do us all a favor and as the other poster said, destroy that scope mount and stop destroying scopes. Someone is eating thousands of dollars of losses on your experimentation with something that is clearly breaking expensive scopes, either the mount or the clamping force you are applying via incorrect torque if the tool is wrong.

 

[Long Range Pellet]

Many of these scopes now can be used as hammers, they are already durable and heavy enough! Clamping forces are entirely different, so your point concerning physics is relevant. You don’t want a scope strong enough to prevent internal deflection from incorrectly machined mounts at higher clamping values, it would weigh far too much. I don’t know about you but I think many scopes already weigh too much; another half kilo to kilo would be silly.

The manufacturers fixed this problem by not covering claims due to user error. Your distributor and dealer are unbelievably kind to you to continue assisting; most would have told you to buy another scope by now with that number of scopes damaged in the same exact way.

Please do us all a favor and as the other poster said, destroy that scope mount and stop destroying scopes. Someone is eating thousands of dollars of losses on your experimentation with something that is clearly breaking expensive scopes, either the mount or the clamping force you are applying via incorrect torque if the tool is wrong.

Actually after I experienced these, not only mounting the scope i also feeling really nervous and paranoid even if i’m holding in my hands can’t help thinking like “what if i break this one too?” And I swear my hands shaking too So a 5 kg extra heavy heavy duty scope won’t disturb me by weighting way too much after all LOL

yeah your definitely right about the distributor, shipped it an hour agothats why i was about to cry what if they say that “there’s nothing to do with it” and to be honest, that would not be a wrong attitude for a seller

you’r right but I didn’t know that the mount is way too crappy this much

i hope this did not cost the distributor, dealer even the Vortex high as much as i/we calculated.
I won’t share the mount’s photos in order not you guys to have the same issue because apperantly you all guys experienced way too much not to choose a shitty mount
Btw i’m new here and iy was my first post and i did not expect to get this much replies thank you all guys thats why this forum is the best of the globe

 

[Vodoun daVinci]

It's the scope mount in my opinion. it's tweaking the alignment of the tube and when you tighten it down (even a little) it's bending the tube and binding the mechanics up. At this stage I'd be all over another mount.

VooDoo

 

[Long Range Pellet]

It's the scope mount in my opinion. it's tweaking the alignment of the tube and when you tighten it down (even a little) it's bending the tube and binding the mechanics up. At this stage I'd be all over another mount.

VooDoo

I think so Vortex’s mount will help i guess. But im too scared to mount a scope now

 

[thehun]

Quality rings anymore do not cost that much...

This is way one learns that cheap Chicom stuff isn't great...and you end up more frustrated...not sure what brands are available in Turkey...or what they allow to import...but Spuhr, Leupold, Geissele, ARC, Seekins, Scalarworks, Badger, NF all make good rings/mounts...

 

[Long Range Pellet]

Quality rings anymore do not cost that much...

This is way one learns that cheap Chicom stuff isn't great...and you end up more frustrated...not sure what brands are available in Turkey...or what they allow to import...but Spuhr, Leupold, Geissele, ARC, Seekins, Scalarworks, Badger, NF all make good rings/mounts...

Your definitely right But we only have here; vortex, athlon, hawke, vector optics, utg, barska, truglo, busnell as a summary there’s not much high end brands here and i will go for vortex

 

[thehun]

Your definitely right But we only have here; vortex, athlon, hawke, vector optics, utg, barska, truglo, busnell as a summary there’s not much high end brands here and i will go for vortex

Yeah Vortex and Athlon are the best options from those brands...stay away from the others...Bushnell is good too...but unsure how they work overseas and all...I know they have different optics.

 

[koshkin]

As everyone has correctly pointed out, the problem is likely the mount with the rings being misaligned with respect to each other.

ILya

 

[Magnumdood]

... thank you all guys thats why this forum is the best of the globe

Very true.

 

[Long Range Pellet]

If you have the means lap your rings, I agree with the others, sounds like bad ring alignment and or over torquing. I know its frustrating but look at it as a learning experience, Anybody who has been shooting for any length of time has had some of the same things happen.

Its been about 10 years about scopes rifles etc i been in to i though that I experienced enough but someone can learn things in no time thats true i used to crack a scope ring upper half and split in two pieces about 8 years ago it was an AO scope and it was a cheap scope but i still use it flawlessly i quess side focus scopes are much more fragile

 

[Long Range Pellet]

I still have the eye piece from the very first scope I paid for 40 plus years ago, I cranked on the eyepiece so hard trying to adjust diopter that I twisted it off, I started being more gentle with scopes after that.lol That being said the scopes manufactured today are far superior in strength to those made in the 70's and 80's, but we learn they still have mechanical limitations..lol

Oh twisted off a diopter the nipple twisteerr! LOL yeah i have bad habit about tightening the screws. If I don’t say “yeah that is not going anywhere”, i never used to stop tighten harder and harder! LOL for example the T15 was a “3mm allen screw remover”, it was never a torx for me

 

[ballen421]

I bet you money you are torqueing it ft/lbs instead of in/lbs...or if you are in metric...I bet your values are off...

Get a fat wrench....stay away from junk Chicom stuff unless it comes from a reputable company like Vortex or Primary Arms...

This

Suggest making sure you’re using the right torque metric (in/lbs). Also might want to be sure your torque driver isn’t way off spec.