ok im wanting your guys opinion on this i can only build one rifle and looking to shoot accuratly from 400-1200 yards would you build a 308 or a 300 win mag heavy barrel with a night force scope? appriciate all replys, im wanting a DEAD ON rifle with punch for these ranges cant deside on which i like better and with 3 kids all in sports can only have one
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thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
- Thread starter donniedee
- Start date
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
With finances being an issue I'd get a .308 out of those choices due to cost of ammo unless you reload. The .300 will be much easier to deliver rounds on target at those ranges though, so if you reload I'd get that. Not that the .308 can't do it depending on your skill level.
Are these the only rounds you are considering? You might consider 6.5 CM as it's a reasonable costing round for match ammo and has better ballistics then the .308
With finances being an issue I'd get a .308 out of those choices due to cost of ammo unless you reload. The .300 will be much easier to deliver rounds on target at those ranges though, so if you reload I'd get that. Not that the .308 can't do it depending on your skill level.
Are these the only rounds you are considering? You might consider 6.5 CM as it's a reasonable costing round for match ammo and has better ballistics then the .308
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
If most of your shooting is going to be past 1k, I would have to say 300 WM. i have to ask, are you just paper punching? If so, then a magnum in 30 cal is not what I would use. Nothing wrong with it, just feel you might have better choices like the 6.5 family. While the 308 will reach the 1000 yard mark, the 300 WM does it more consistency. Not everyone can shoot 308 at 1 K consistently. Get ready for a lot of different opinions. My LR shooting experience is very limited, but what I say is from what I have seen and done in person. I hope this helps.
If most of your shooting is going to be past 1k, I would have to say 300 WM. i have to ask, are you just paper punching? If so, then a magnum in 30 cal is not what I would use. Nothing wrong with it, just feel you might have better choices like the 6.5 family. While the 308 will reach the 1000 yard mark, the 300 WM does it more consistency. Not everyone can shoot 308 at 1 K consistently. Get ready for a lot of different opinions. My LR shooting experience is very limited, but what I say is from what I have seen and done in person. I hope this helps.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
Unless confirming a zero or tweaking a load I will not put a round through my Win Mag at less than 800.
Start looking at the cost to run each vs what you're doing. A quality .308 barrel is good for 8 - 10k rounds and a Win Mag is more like 2 - 3k, (barrel swaps are what @ $500), 155 or 175 vs 210 or 220 projectile cost, brass, @ 30 more grns of powder per round. Run all that against 10k or so rounds and ask yourself how you are actually shooting and see if it is worth it to you.
Good luck
Unless confirming a zero or tweaking a load I will not put a round through my Win Mag at less than 800.
Start looking at the cost to run each vs what you're doing. A quality .308 barrel is good for 8 - 10k rounds and a Win Mag is more like 2 - 3k, (barrel swaps are what @ $500), 155 or 175 vs 210 or 220 projectile cost, brass, @ 30 more grns of powder per round. Run all that against 10k or so rounds and ask yourself how you are actually shooting and see if it is worth it to you.
Good luck
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
i was leaning towards the 308 as most shots will be under 1000yrds, but i did want to be able to get there for a loong deer shot and be able to ring a gong at 1000 308 seems alot more reasonable due to all factory bthp rounds out there and tons of data on it who makes a "box mag" conversion for a rem 700p?
i was leaning towards the 308 as most shots will be under 1000yrds, but i did want to be able to get there for a loong deer shot and be able to ring a gong at 1000 308 seems alot more reasonable due to all factory bthp rounds out there and tons of data on it who makes a "box mag" conversion for a rem 700p?
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
i was leaning towards the 308 as most shots will be under 1000yrds, but i did want to be able to get there for a loong deer shot and be able to ring a gong at 1000 308 seems alot more reasonable due to all factory bthp rounds out there and tons of data on it who makes a "box mag" conversion for a rem 700p?
i was leaning towards the 308 as most shots will be under 1000yrds, but i did want to be able to get there for a loong deer shot and be able to ring a gong at 1000 308 seems alot more reasonable due to all factory bthp rounds out there and tons of data on it who makes a "box mag" conversion for a rem 700p?
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
1. At what ranges will most of your shooting be done?
2. How many shots are you planning to shoot in a session, or a day, or during a course or a match?
3. Do you intend to hunt with it? If so, what animals at what ranges?
1. At what ranges will most of your shooting be done?
2. How many shots are you planning to shoot in a session, or a day, or during a course or a match?
3. Do you intend to hunt with it? If so, what animals at what ranges?
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
most shooting from 400-1000yrds 40-50 per session and yes some long range south texas deer hunting
most shooting from 400-1000yrds 40-50 per session and yes some long range south texas deer hunting
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
Split the difference between the two with a 30-06.
Split the difference between the two with a 30-06.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
How are your fundamentals? If they are good, then stepping up to a .300 won't encourage bad habits and a magnum rifle won't frustrate you. If you will be shooting mostly from 800-1200 you will notice the .300 begin to take over. And in a 20lb-plus rifle with a brake it won't be hard to control or too exhausting to shoot all day.
But if you shoot mostly to 600 you won't notice much difference in elevation dope. Sure, the .300 will hit harder, but you don't need to hit a deer hard. For hunting, shot placement is key.
Bottom line: a .308 is a more versatile all-around rifle, cheaper, easier, and more fun to shoot.
Agreed that a 10-twist 30-06 would be a better all-around rifle though.
How are your fundamentals? If they are good, then stepping up to a .300 won't encourage bad habits and a magnum rifle won't frustrate you. If you will be shooting mostly from 800-1200 you will notice the .300 begin to take over. And in a 20lb-plus rifle with a brake it won't be hard to control or too exhausting to shoot all day.
But if you shoot mostly to 600 you won't notice much difference in elevation dope. Sure, the .300 will hit harder, but you don't need to hit a deer hard. For hunting, shot placement is key.
Bottom line: a .308 is a more versatile all-around rifle, cheaper, easier, and more fun to shoot.
Agreed that a 10-twist 30-06 would be a better all-around rifle though.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
boiler, thought of that as well but i like the look and feel of a rem heavy barrel, dose anyone incl rem make a hb 06?
boiler, thought of that as well but i like the look and feel of a rem heavy barrel, dose anyone incl rem make a hb 06?
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: donniedee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">boiler, thought of that as well but i like the look and feel of a rem heavy barrel, dose anyone incl rem make a hb 06? </div></div>That makes it easier: If it's a factory rifle you are considering, don't get a belted magnum.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: donniedee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">boiler, thought of that as well but i like the look and feel of a rem heavy barrel, dose anyone incl rem make a hb 06? </div></div>That makes it easier: If it's a factory rifle you are considering, don't get a belted magnum.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
2-3k on a .300 mag barrel is pushing it. If your shooting 50-60 rds a sitting, your going to be spending a ton on powder and changing your barrel out every year if your doing a lot of shooting. You'll get good performance out of a .308 1-10 and run the 155-175VLD's and its proven out to a mile if you do your part (refer to the magpul videos, Art of The Precision Rifle) Im not sure if you said it but is there a reason why you want to stick to a 30 cal?
2-3k on a .300 mag barrel is pushing it. If your shooting 50-60 rds a sitting, your going to be spending a ton on powder and changing your barrel out every year if your doing a lot of shooting. You'll get good performance out of a .308 1-10 and run the 155-175VLD's and its proven out to a mile if you do your part (refer to the magpul videos, Art of The Precision Rifle) Im not sure if you said it but is there a reason why you want to stick to a 30 cal?
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I based my decision on being able to grab match ammo at a reasonable price if I "happen to run out" while out on the road. 300 win has some available, as do other chamberings, but 308 has the most (in 30 caliber).
Is this going to be a factory gun? Or semi-custom? Heart set on a 30 cal?
I do agree that 30-06 sounds like the best all-round choice. But if you are set on a factory heavy barrel, then you choices (from Remington, Savage, Tikka) are non-existent. At least without having to rebarrel it.
I based my decision on being able to grab match ammo at a reasonable price if I "happen to run out" while out on the road. 300 win has some available, as do other chamberings, but 308 has the most (in 30 caliber).
Is this going to be a factory gun? Or semi-custom? Heart set on a 30 cal?
I do agree that 30-06 sounds like the best all-round choice. But if you are set on a factory heavy barrel, then you choices (from Remington, Savage, Tikka) are non-existent. At least without having to rebarrel it.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
If majority of your shooting is/will be under 1000 just go 24-26" custom barrel and shoot something like the 208 A-max.
Or you could shoot the 185 Bergers. That would be a great mix of velocity/bullet BC/weight retention at longer ranges.
If majority of your shooting is/will be under 1000 just go 24-26" custom barrel and shoot something like the 208 A-max.
Or you could shoot the 185 Bergers. That would be a great mix of velocity/bullet BC/weight retention at longer ranges.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
OP could rebarrel any old Savage 110 found in a pawn shop with a high-quality Criterion prefit in 30-06 in about 20 minutes.
OP could rebarrel any old Savage 110 found in a pawn shop with a high-quality Criterion prefit in 30-06 in about 20 minutes.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
Installing a new barrel a Savage with still leave you with a Savage
OP, what is your budget for a rifle less scope? Do you plan to reload? If not, you might want to look into a 260 or 6.5CM. Both offer factory ammo, light recoil and 3000WM ballistics.
Personally, if you can swing it reach out to GA and have them chamber you up a 6.5CM.
Installing a new barrel a Savage with still leave you with a Savage
OP, what is your budget for a rifle less scope? Do you plan to reload? If not, you might want to look into a 260 or 6.5CM. Both offer factory ammo, light recoil and 3000WM ballistics.
Personally, if you can swing it reach out to GA and have them chamber you up a 6.5CM.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I had a 300 because I thought it'd be better for long range. I sold it because it beat up my wallet and my shoulder. Now I have a 308 AAC-SD in AICS and I couldn't be happier!
I had a 300 because I thought it'd be better for long range. I sold it because it beat up my wallet and my shoulder. Now I have a 308 AAC-SD in AICS and I couldn't be happier!
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I think you're going to be able to get a lot more out of the .308 in terms of rounds, $$$, and straight up shooting. And worst comes to worst, you sell the .308 and get a .300.
I think you're going to be able to get a lot more out of the .308 in terms of rounds, $$$, and straight up shooting. And worst comes to worst, you sell the .308 and get a .300.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
It really comes down to three factors-recoil, energy on target, and cost. The .308 wins two out of three easy, and Texas whitetails aren't that big to need a magnum out to 6-700 yards. I bought a 300 last summer for deer hunting and if I could do it over again I would get a 308.
It really comes down to three factors-recoil, energy on target, and cost. The .308 wins two out of three easy, and Texas whitetails aren't that big to need a magnum out to 6-700 yards. I bought a 300 last summer for deer hunting and if I could do it over again I would get a 308.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I'd say if you are relatively new to long range and you do not reload for yourself (and do it well) then get the 308 since there are a lot of very good, relatively cheap factory loads for it and good of information about factory rounds. Not to mention plenty of vendors here selling quality loaded ammo for 308.
Adaptive, who are members here makes the FDAC slide: density altitude solver for the 308 also. You should check that out especially if you don't already have a PDA with ballistic solver.
260 might be a third option for you. Federal announced they will be making FGMM in 260 now which means good 260 ammo should be available in bulk for quite some time. Not sure on pricing.
If money is not an object in the long run (308 being cheaper to shoot) then go for the 300WM. I also agree with just about everything I have read before my post.
I'd say if you are relatively new to long range and you do not reload for yourself (and do it well) then get the 308 since there are a lot of very good, relatively cheap factory loads for it and good of information about factory rounds. Not to mention plenty of vendors here selling quality loaded ammo for 308.
Adaptive, who are members here makes the FDAC slide: density altitude solver for the 308 also. You should check that out especially if you don't already have a PDA with ballistic solver.
260 might be a third option for you. Federal announced they will be making FGMM in 260 now which means good 260 ammo should be available in bulk for quite some time. Not sure on pricing.
If money is not an object in the long run (308 being cheaper to shoot) then go for the 300WM. I also agree with just about everything I have read before my post.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
donniedee,
I think you asked who makes a box magazine conversion for a 700P. Either way with a L/A (.300 WM) or S/A (.308) there are a lot of choices. CDI, Badger, Atlasworxs, HS precision, Hooper, Wyatts, and many more. Most of these provide for both S/A and L/A.
Just my opinion, but three kids and sports can get expensive, The .308 would be cheaper and still very capable.
BC
donniedee,
I think you asked who makes a box magazine conversion for a 700P. Either way with a L/A (.300 WM) or S/A (.308) there are a lot of choices. CDI, Badger, Atlasworxs, HS precision, Hooper, Wyatts, and many more. Most of these provide for both S/A and L/A.
Just my opinion, but three kids and sports can get expensive, The .308 would be cheaper and still very capable.
BC
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
308 works well out to 800yds with no problems. Almost no one here will be fighting zombies, alien invaders or insurgents past that distance and most rifle ranges are not that far. It goes subsonic at around 1200yds, well below a mile.
300 Win Mag with have more punch out past 1000yds, hard shooting 190's or heavier bullets might make it supersonic to a mile if they are lucky. It will cost far more to shoot with less barrel life.
Both of them are dropping like rocks at extreme distances.
I know everyone has big dreams of fighting battles of the end of the world and whatnot, but mostly they are used for competition , pounding gongs or paper.
How's your budget these days?
308 works well out to 800yds with no problems. Almost no one here will be fighting zombies, alien invaders or insurgents past that distance and most rifle ranges are not that far. It goes subsonic at around 1200yds, well below a mile.
300 Win Mag with have more punch out past 1000yds, hard shooting 190's or heavier bullets might make it supersonic to a mile if they are lucky. It will cost far more to shoot with less barrel life.
Both of them are dropping like rocks at extreme distances.
I know everyone has big dreams of fighting battles of the end of the world and whatnot, but mostly they are used for competition , pounding gongs or paper.
How's your budget these days?
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bruno86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... performance out of a .308 1-10 and run the 155-175VLD's and its proven out to a mile if you do your part (refer to the magpul videos, Art of The Precision Rifle)</div></div>You see, that's exactly why I criticized those darn videos.
The .308 isn't a one-mile cartridge, whether you 'do your part' or not.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bruno86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... performance out of a .308 1-10 and run the 155-175VLD's and its proven out to a mile if you do your part (refer to the magpul videos, Art of The Precision Rifle)</div></div>You see, that's exactly why I criticized those darn videos.
The .308 isn't a one-mile cartridge, whether you 'do your part' or not.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I actually have 1200 yds on my property and with no neighbors for miles I can shoot as far as most people dream they can shoot.
308 is a good rifle at reasonable distances. The mile shot is hard and pointless for all but youtube entertainment.
At 700 yds the 308 barely chips the paint off the gong, it is good for coyotes or varmits beyond that distance.
I actually have 1200 yds on my property and with no neighbors for miles I can shoot as far as most people dream they can shoot.
308 is a good rifle at reasonable distances. The mile shot is hard and pointless for all but youtube entertainment.
At 700 yds the 308 barely chips the paint off the gong, it is good for coyotes or varmits beyond that distance.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: donniedee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ok im wanting your guys opinion on this i can only build one rifle and looking to shoot accuratly from 400-1200 yards would you build a 308 or a 300 win mag heavy barrel with a night force scope? appriciate all replys, im wanting a DEAD ON rifle with punch for these ranges cant deside on which i like better and with 3 kids all in sports can only have one</div></div>
I assume you are shooting on your own dirt as the longest range around here is in liberty hill (Best of the West) and is 1K. Have you shot either cal.? As others asked, how are your fundamentals? If you are like me then getting to 1K is going to take some time. If you are on a budget have you considered SWFA? They do have pretty nice glass for the price. Are you dead set on a Rem 700? I have my 700P and it shoots ok but the trigger and the out of the box awesome of my TRG and a comparable cost to a custom (actually I got mine new for 2200 for a TRG-42) makes it a great option.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: donniedee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ok im wanting your guys opinion on this i can only build one rifle and looking to shoot accuratly from 400-1200 yards would you build a 308 or a 300 win mag heavy barrel with a night force scope? appriciate all replys, im wanting a DEAD ON rifle with punch for these ranges cant deside on which i like better and with 3 kids all in sports can only have one</div></div>
I assume you are shooting on your own dirt as the longest range around here is in liberty hill (Best of the West) and is 1K. Have you shot either cal.? As others asked, how are your fundamentals? If you are like me then getting to 1K is going to take some time. If you are on a budget have you considered SWFA? They do have pretty nice glass for the price. Are you dead set on a Rem 700? I have my 700P and it shoots ok but the trigger and the out of the box awesome of my TRG and a comparable cost to a custom (actually I got mine new for 2200 for a TRG-42) makes it a great option.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I think the OP should be looking more at a 308. It's got enough range at a good price plus it doesn't have much recoil relative to larger cartridges.
I just got a 308 to start out on (somewhat similar scenario). I don't plan to shoot past 800 yards, but it can be used to 1000 on a deer. Taking 3/4 mile shots starts to get into a bit more advanced shooting, which also starts coming with a larger price tag.
I think the OP should be looking more at a 308. It's got enough range at a good price plus it doesn't have much recoil relative to larger cartridges.
I just got a 308 to start out on (somewhat similar scenario). I don't plan to shoot past 800 yards, but it can be used to 1000 on a deer. Taking 3/4 mile shots starts to get into a bit more advanced shooting, which also starts coming with a larger price tag.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
so
1) Is this a custom build?
3) are you reloading?
4)why are you only looking at the 308 and 300 win mag?
I can help with a few of these haha...the 308 will have NO punch after 800yds putting it well outside of the 300 win mag category! and for people telling you recoil is an issue with a 300 win mag, unless you are not putting a break on it...than yes I agree, but with the breaks out there today recoil is not an issue anymore regardless of the caliber and if it is I feel for you haha. Hell if the 50 cal can be tammed to where kids are shooting them, then is recoil with the 300 win mag a concern with a break? Thats nonsense. Plenty of competition shooters use the 300 win mag with no issue for 1,2 and 3 day events.
Here's where I would challenge you...why a 308 or a 300 win mag? why not a 7mm which has better BCs and ballistics than both and 1200 yds is nothing for that caliber with less recoil, or why not a 7-08 which is standard cal (instead of the 7mm's that are magnum cals like, SUAM, WSM and Remmington Mag) where you have decent ballistics, 7mm BCs and punch at 1,200 yds? just some different ideas for you to look into.
But if the decision is either the 308 or 300...I would hands down take the 300 win mag as my all around rifle over the 308. 308 can not shoot the 30 cal bullets with the best BC like the 190s, 208, 210+ at the velocities necessary to take advantage of the BCs, so you are stuck with lesser bullets moving slower with no knock power past 800yds. Also because the 300 can handle the heavier as well as the lighter bullets, you have a wider range to shoot from...you can load a 300 down to 155s and lessen the recoil and still smoke the 308. The only way in hell I would take a 308 over a 300 win mag is if ammo cost is an absolute make or break for you, or you had a concern for barrel life. If neither of those are an issue...then 300 win mag over a 308 all day every day.
so
1) Is this a custom build?
3) are you reloading?
4)why are you only looking at the 308 and 300 win mag?
I can help with a few of these haha...the 308 will have NO punch after 800yds putting it well outside of the 300 win mag category! and for people telling you recoil is an issue with a 300 win mag, unless you are not putting a break on it...than yes I agree, but with the breaks out there today recoil is not an issue anymore regardless of the caliber and if it is I feel for you haha. Hell if the 50 cal can be tammed to where kids are shooting them, then is recoil with the 300 win mag a concern with a break? Thats nonsense. Plenty of competition shooters use the 300 win mag with no issue for 1,2 and 3 day events.
Here's where I would challenge you...why a 308 or a 300 win mag? why not a 7mm which has better BCs and ballistics than both and 1200 yds is nothing for that caliber with less recoil, or why not a 7-08 which is standard cal (instead of the 7mm's that are magnum cals like, SUAM, WSM and Remmington Mag) where you have decent ballistics, 7mm BCs and punch at 1,200 yds? just some different ideas for you to look into.
But if the decision is either the 308 or 300...I would hands down take the 300 win mag as my all around rifle over the 308. 308 can not shoot the 30 cal bullets with the best BC like the 190s, 208, 210+ at the velocities necessary to take advantage of the BCs, so you are stuck with lesser bullets moving slower with no knock power past 800yds. Also because the 300 can handle the heavier as well as the lighter bullets, you have a wider range to shoot from...you can load a 300 down to 155s and lessen the recoil and still smoke the 308. The only way in hell I would take a 308 over a 300 win mag is if ammo cost is an absolute make or break for you, or you had a concern for barrel life. If neither of those are an issue...then 300 win mag over a 308 all day every day.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
If you gotta ask, go with the 308. When you want to stretch its legs, load up some 208s/210s.
I load 208s to 2600 fps in a 20", and 2700 fps in a 26".
The slower 2600 fps load is still doing over 1400 fps at 1200 yards in local atmo, with over 900 ft-lbs retained. Even at sea-level it will be doing around 1300 fps at 1200 yards.
If you gotta ask, go with the 308. When you want to stretch its legs, load up some 208s/210s.
I load 208s to 2600 fps in a 20", and 2700 fps in a 26".
The slower 2600 fps load is still doing over 1400 fps at 1200 yards in local atmo, with over 900 ft-lbs retained. Even at sea-level it will be doing around 1300 fps at 1200 yards.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
Would like to see somebody be accurate enough with a .308 to humanely hunt deer at 1000, no offense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think the OP should be looking more at a 308. It's got enough range at a good price plus it doesn't have much recoil relative to larger cartridges.
I just got a 308 to start out on (somewhat similar scenario). I don't plan to shoot past 800 yards, but it can be used to 1000 on a deer. Taking 3/4 mile shots starts to get into a bit more advanced shooting, which also starts coming with a larger price tag.</div></div>
Would like to see somebody be accurate enough with a .308 to humanely hunt deer at 1000, no offense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think the OP should be looking more at a 308. It's got enough range at a good price plus it doesn't have much recoil relative to larger cartridges.
I just got a 308 to start out on (somewhat similar scenario). I don't plan to shoot past 800 yards, but it can be used to 1000 on a deer. Taking 3/4 mile shots starts to get into a bit more advanced shooting, which also starts coming with a larger price tag.</div></div>
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mstang1988</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would like to see somebody be accurate enough with a .308 to humanely hunt deer at 1000, no offense.</div></div>
I don't think it matters what caliber you are using, shooting animals at 1000 is ethically questionable at best. I have no doubt that it is possible but the risk of botching a shot at that range is exponentially higher, even for a world class shooter, and well above the level of acceptable risk IMHO. The amount of air time on the bullet is too long at that range to be sure of anything. Even a .338 Lapua magnum takes about 2.25 sec to get out there which is plenty of time for the animal to do something unpredictable. Just my 2 cents.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mstang1988</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would like to see somebody be accurate enough with a .308 to humanely hunt deer at 1000, no offense.</div></div>
I don't think it matters what caliber you are using, shooting animals at 1000 is ethically questionable at best. I have no doubt that it is possible but the risk of botching a shot at that range is exponentially higher, even for a world class shooter, and well above the level of acceptable risk IMHO. The amount of air time on the bullet is too long at that range to be sure of anything. Even a .338 Lapua magnum takes about 2.25 sec to get out there which is plenty of time for the animal to do something unpredictable. Just my 2 cents.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
Agreed but I wasn't going to fight that argument here. Did want to correct the flight time for lapua. For me the calculated flight time is around 1.371 seconds. With .308 it's 1.733. @1200 it's 2.276 for .308 and 1.742 for .338 Lapua.
TRG-42 .338 Lapua Ballistics Chart
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Boss334OP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mstang1988</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would like to see somebody be accurate enough with a .308 to humanely hunt deer at 1000, no offense.</div></div>
I don't think it matters what caliber you are using, shooting animals at 1000 is ethically questionable at best. I have no doubt that it is possible but the risk of botching a shot at that range is exponentially higher, even for a world class shooter, and well above the level of acceptable risk IMHO. The amount of air time on the bullet is too long at that range to be sure of anything. Even a .338 Lapua magnum takes about 2.25 sec to get out there which is plenty of time for the animal to do something unpredictable. Just my 2 cents.</div></div>
Agreed but I wasn't going to fight that argument here. Did want to correct the flight time for lapua. For me the calculated flight time is around 1.371 seconds. With .308 it's 1.733. @1200 it's 2.276 for .308 and 1.742 for .338 Lapua.
TRG-42 .338 Lapua Ballistics Chart
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Boss334OP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mstang1988</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would like to see somebody be accurate enough with a .308 to humanely hunt deer at 1000, no offense.</div></div>
I don't think it matters what caliber you are using, shooting animals at 1000 is ethically questionable at best. I have no doubt that it is possible but the risk of botching a shot at that range is exponentially higher, even for a world class shooter, and well above the level of acceptable risk IMHO. The amount of air time on the bullet is too long at that range to be sure of anything. Even a .338 Lapua magnum takes about 2.25 sec to get out there which is plenty of time for the animal to do something unpredictable. Just my 2 cents.</div></div>
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I have a 300WM now and love it. But I only use it for long range (slow fire) precision work. It is too hard on it to pound rounds through it and run it hot. For that a .308 would probably be the better choice. Easier and less expensive to shoot and won't have to stop shooting so often to let it cool down.
That said, the 300WM is pretty impressive hitting steel even at 1000 yards with a 208 A-Max : )
Good luck and hope it helps,
JamieD
______________________________
Jamie Dodson
814-262-7994
Wolf Precision
AI Stocks and Accessories
I have a 300WM now and love it. But I only use it for long range (slow fire) precision work. It is too hard on it to pound rounds through it and run it hot. For that a .308 would probably be the better choice. Easier and less expensive to shoot and won't have to stop shooting so often to let it cool down.
That said, the 300WM is pretty impressive hitting steel even at 1000 yards with a 208 A-Max : )
Good luck and hope it helps,
JamieD
______________________________
Jamie Dodson
814-262-7994
Wolf Precision
AI Stocks and Accessories
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
I love my .308 would never sell it, I loved my 6.5x55 but just sold it Saturday to buy a 300wm. 6.5 has great ballistics/super light recoil. But i wanted something with a bit more knock down power for when i hunt large game. I will eventually build up a .260 to replace my 6.5x55(just going with a more modern version that's why I am going with .260).
I love my .308 would never sell it, I loved my 6.5x55 but just sold it Saturday to buy a 300wm. 6.5 has great ballistics/super light recoil. But i wanted something with a bit more knock down power for when i hunt large game. I will eventually build up a .260 to replace my 6.5x55(just going with a more modern version that's why I am going with .260).
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bruno86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... performance out of a .308 1-10 and run the 155-175VLD's and its proven out to a mile if you do your part (refer to the magpul videos, Art of The Precision Rifle)</div></div>You see, that's exactly why I criticized those darn videos.
The .308 isn't a one-mile cartridge, whether you 'do your part' or not. </div></div>
I was only stating what has been done with a 308. Yes you are correct, I believe it is only a 1k cartridge. I like the 308 over the 300 for what he is going to be doing. It will save him in the pocket book and on the shoulder.
Ps: the videos are a bit of a stretch for the average working man with a limited income but you can learn alot when you open up your mind.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bruno86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... performance out of a .308 1-10 and run the 155-175VLD's and its proven out to a mile if you do your part (refer to the magpul videos, Art of The Precision Rifle)</div></div>You see, that's exactly why I criticized those darn videos.
The .308 isn't a one-mile cartridge, whether you 'do your part' or not. </div></div>
I was only stating what has been done with a 308. Yes you are correct, I believe it is only a 1k cartridge. I like the 308 over the 300 for what he is going to be doing. It will save him in the pocket book and on the shoulder.
Ps: the videos are a bit of a stretch for the average working man with a limited income but you can learn alot when you open up your mind.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bruno86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ps: the videos are a bit of a stretch for the average working man with a limited income but you can learn alot when you open up your mind. </div></div>My issue with the videos was with the bad information contained within.
If you haven't already, have a look at this Thread:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...489#Post2829489
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bruno86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ps: the videos are a bit of a stretch for the average working man with a limited income but you can learn alot when you open up your mind. </div></div>My issue with the videos was with the bad information contained within.
If you haven't already, have a look at this Thread:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...489#Post2829489
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
The .308 would be my choice if I was in your possition. I've got one and shoot it out to 1000yds in matches and for fun and I can't complain about the results of the cailber. I just feel the .308 is more versitle when your shooting on a budget, because you can get the best components (brass, bullets, ect.) for half or less the cost of a .300 win mag. Which equals to more time pulling the trigger. Just my 2 cents hope it helps.
The .308 would be my choice if I was in your possition. I've got one and shoot it out to 1000yds in matches and for fun and I can't complain about the results of the cailber. I just feel the .308 is more versitle when your shooting on a budget, because you can get the best components (brass, bullets, ect.) for half or less the cost of a .300 win mag. Which equals to more time pulling the trigger. Just my 2 cents hope it helps.
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tlg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The .308 would be my choice if I was in your possition. I've got one and shoot it out to 1000yds in matches and for fun and I can't complain about the results of the cailber. I just feel the .308 is more versitle when your shooting on a budget, because you can get the best components (brass, bullets, ect.) for half or less the cost of a .300 win mag. Which equals to more time pulling the trigger. Just my 2 cents hope it helps. </div></div>
reloading cost difference may not be that much, it is the additional cost of the barrels that adds up
cost estimate from another thread:
Load data is a rough average of loads I've seen from members here.
.223REM
Bullet: 69gr SMK - $93/500
Brass: Lapua - $53/100
Primer: Federal 205M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~25gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $0.82 once loaded. $0.55 twice loaded. $0.47 thrice loaded.
.308WIN - match quality
Bullet: 175gr SMK - $145/500
Brass: Lapua - $64/100
Primer: Federal 210M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~44gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.08 once loaded. $0.76 twice loaded. $0.65 thrice loaded.
.300WM - standard quality
Bullet: 208gr AMAX - $28/100
Brass: Winchester - $309/500
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~77gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.14 once loaded. $0.83 twice loaded. $0.72 thrice loaded
.338LM
Bullet: 300gr SMK - $268/500
Brass: Lapua - $244/100
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~95gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $3.25 once loaded. $2.03 twice loaded. $1.63 thrice loaded
for various chamberings here are
calculations on the cost of a rifle, barrels needed and loading supplies for 10,000 rds
with a conservative accuracy estimate over the 10,000 rds
223 --------------------- Not match ------------------ 2400-----------------------------------------------------------1.5moa
6.5 creed (also 6.5 lapua ?) ---- Match --------------------7000-----------------------------------------------------------5/8moa
308 (1 barrel)---------------Not match ------------------5000-----------------------------------------------------------1.25moa
for 308 match, a rifle proportional to the ammo (2000), and 1 re-barrel
308----------------------Match----------------------8000-----------------------------------------------------------.75moa
300win (4 barrels)------------not match------------------11,000---------------------------------------------------------1.5moa
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tlg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The .308 would be my choice if I was in your possition. I've got one and shoot it out to 1000yds in matches and for fun and I can't complain about the results of the cailber. I just feel the .308 is more versitle when your shooting on a budget, because you can get the best components (brass, bullets, ect.) for half or less the cost of a .300 win mag. Which equals to more time pulling the trigger. Just my 2 cents hope it helps. </div></div>
reloading cost difference may not be that much, it is the additional cost of the barrels that adds up
cost estimate from another thread:
Load data is a rough average of loads I've seen from members here.
.223REM
Bullet: 69gr SMK - $93/500
Brass: Lapua - $53/100
Primer: Federal 205M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~25gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $0.82 once loaded. $0.55 twice loaded. $0.47 thrice loaded.
.308WIN - match quality
Bullet: 175gr SMK - $145/500
Brass: Lapua - $64/100
Primer: Federal 210M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~44gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.08 once loaded. $0.76 twice loaded. $0.65 thrice loaded.
.300WM - standard quality
Bullet: 208gr AMAX - $28/100
Brass: Winchester - $309/500
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~77gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.14 once loaded. $0.83 twice loaded. $0.72 thrice loaded
.338LM
Bullet: 300gr SMK - $268/500
Brass: Lapua - $244/100
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~95gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $3.25 once loaded. $2.03 twice loaded. $1.63 thrice loaded
for various chamberings here are
calculations on the cost of a rifle, barrels needed and loading supplies for 10,000 rds
with a conservative accuracy estimate over the 10,000 rds
223 --------------------- Not match ------------------ 2400-----------------------------------------------------------1.5moa
6.5 creed (also 6.5 lapua ?) ---- Match --------------------7000-----------------------------------------------------------5/8moa
308 (1 barrel)---------------Not match ------------------5000-----------------------------------------------------------1.25moa
for 308 match, a rifle proportional to the ammo (2000), and 1 re-barrel
308----------------------Match----------------------8000-----------------------------------------------------------.75moa
300win (4 barrels)------------not match------------------11,000---------------------------------------------------------1.5moa
Re: thoughts between a 308 and a 300 win mag build?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: George63</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tlg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The .308 would be my choice if I was in your possition. I've got one and shoot it out to 1000yds in matches and for fun and I can't complain about the results of the cailber. I just feel the .308 is more versitle when your shooting on a budget, because you can get the best components (brass, bullets, ect.) for half or less the cost of a .300 win mag. Which equals to more time pulling the trigger. Just my 2 cents hope it helps. </div></div>
reloading cost difference may not be that much, it is the additional cost of the barrels that adds up
cost estimate from another thread:
Load data is a rough average of loads I've seen from members here.
.223REM
Bullet: 69gr SMK - $93/500
Brass: Lapua - $53/100
Primer: Federal 205M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~25gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $0.82 once loaded. $0.55 twice loaded. $0.47 thrice loaded.
.308WIN - match quality
Bullet: 175gr SMK - $145/500
Brass: Lapua - $64/100
Primer: Federal 210M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~44gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.08 once loaded. $0.76 twice loaded. $0.65 thrice loaded.
.300WM - standard quality
Bullet: 208gr AMAX - $28/100
Brass: Winchester - $309/500
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~77gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.14 once loaded. $0.83 twice loaded. $0.72 thrice loaded
.338LM
Bullet: 300gr SMK - $268/500
Brass: Lapua - $244/100
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~95gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $3.25 once loaded. $2.03 twice loaded. $1.63 thrice loaded
for various chamberings here are
calculations on the cost of a rifle, barrels needed and loading supplies for 10,000 rds
with a conservative accuracy estimate over the 10,000 rds
223 --------------------- Not match ------------------ 2400-----------------------------------------------------------1.5moa
6.5 creed (also 6.5 lapua ?) ---- Match --------------------7000-----------------------------------------------------------5/8moa
308 (1 barrel)---------------Not match ------------------5000-----------------------------------------------------------1.25moa
for 308 match, a rifle proportional to the ammo (2000), and 1 re-barrel
308----------------------Match----------------------8000-----------------------------------------------------------.75moa
300win (4 barrels)------------not match------------------11,000---------------------------------------------------------1.5moa</div></div> Wow that's some cool information! I had no idea that a 300 win mag eats barrels like that. Thanks for educating.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: George63</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tlg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The .308 would be my choice if I was in your possition. I've got one and shoot it out to 1000yds in matches and for fun and I can't complain about the results of the cailber. I just feel the .308 is more versitle when your shooting on a budget, because you can get the best components (brass, bullets, ect.) for half or less the cost of a .300 win mag. Which equals to more time pulling the trigger. Just my 2 cents hope it helps. </div></div>
reloading cost difference may not be that much, it is the additional cost of the barrels that adds up
cost estimate from another thread:
Load data is a rough average of loads I've seen from members here.
.223REM
Bullet: 69gr SMK - $93/500
Brass: Lapua - $53/100
Primer: Federal 205M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~25gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $0.82 once loaded. $0.55 twice loaded. $0.47 thrice loaded.
.308WIN - match quality
Bullet: 175gr SMK - $145/500
Brass: Lapua - $64/100
Primer: Federal 210M - $37/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Varget (~44gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.08 once loaded. $0.76 twice loaded. $0.65 thrice loaded.
.300WM - standard quality
Bullet: 208gr AMAX - $28/100
Brass: Winchester - $309/500
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~77gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $1.14 once loaded. $0.83 twice loaded. $0.72 thrice loaded
.338LM
Bullet: 300gr SMK - $268/500
Brass: Lapua - $244/100
Primer: Federal 215M - $38/1000
Powder: Hodgdon Retumbo (~95gr load) - $140/8lbs
TOTAL: $3.25 once loaded. $2.03 twice loaded. $1.63 thrice loaded
for various chamberings here are
calculations on the cost of a rifle, barrels needed and loading supplies for 10,000 rds
with a conservative accuracy estimate over the 10,000 rds
223 --------------------- Not match ------------------ 2400-----------------------------------------------------------1.5moa
6.5 creed (also 6.5 lapua ?) ---- Match --------------------7000-----------------------------------------------------------5/8moa
308 (1 barrel)---------------Not match ------------------5000-----------------------------------------------------------1.25moa
for 308 match, a rifle proportional to the ammo (2000), and 1 re-barrel
308----------------------Match----------------------8000-----------------------------------------------------------.75moa
300win (4 barrels)------------not match------------------11,000---------------------------------------------------------1.5moa</div></div> Wow that's some cool information! I had no idea that a 300 win mag eats barrels like that. Thanks for educating.
