Thoughts on TL3 barrel change out options.

[Dthomas3523]

My TL3 is only a few weeks out or less. So I’m debating on how to have the barrels set up for it. I’m going for a “fear the man with one gun” setup where except for the barrel and the recoil that goes along with it, everything will stay the same.

I have decided to have the barrels shouldered to make things slightly quicker(except a carbon proof pre fit for hunting).

So, the options I’m looking at:

I could just have them shouldered normally and have a barrel vice set up to mount in trailer hitch. Drop the stock, use vice, put back in stock.

Or

Have the barrels shouldered but have the extra .588 added to allow the barloc to fit. Hand tighten until it stops (I’d make an index mark probably) with go gauge, then torque the hex bolt to 90 in/lbs and check with no go.

The way I understand it, this would negate the need for the vice as well as no need in dropping the stock.

Am I understanding the barloc shouldered system correctly? Seems almost like a no brainer for quick changes, or at least changes only requiring a single tool + gauges.

Thanks!

 

[flyer]

I wouldn't do that without some kind of witness mark at least.

The Barloc tensioner might nominally be 0.588" but it could spread out and act narrower over time.

 

[Dthomas3523]

After reading things better, they do recommend using go/no go gauges with it. This should alleviate that issue.

 

[PistoleroJesse]

As I understand it, barloc still requires a go/nogo gauge. But then the only extra tool you need is the hex because you get plenty of mechanical advantage to preload the barrel threads from the bevel on the barlock.

 

[ForgeValley]

I use the barrel nut version with Savage prefits, and the whole process is really simple. With the barrel nut version you do need the included spanner wrench to tighten down the nut. I find it easier to keep track of the spanner wrench than I would a vise, torque wrench, and action wrench.

And as for using gauges or not, I change a barrel, I'm checking it, recommended or not. Guess that philosophy comes from being responsible for the headspace and timing on an M2.

Any reason you want to use shouldered prefits as opposed to prefits with the barrel nut version? Guess that would be another $150 for the barrel nut Barloc version though.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I use the barrel nut version with Savage prefits, and the whole process is really simple. With the barrel nut version you do need the included spanner wrench to tighten down the nut. I find it easier to keep track of the spanner wrench than I would a vise, torque wrench, and action wrench.

And as for using gauges or not, I change a barrel, I'm checking it, recommended or not. Guess that philosophy comes from being responsible for the headspace and timing on an M2.

Any reason you want to use shouldered prefits as opposed to prefits with the barrel nut version? Guess that would be another $150 for the barrel nut Barloc version though.

My theory was, with a shouldered barrel, one less tool to keep track of. No spanner wrench. Just screw in barrel with go gauge, tighten hex screw, check with no go, done.

I’m also not too concerned about saving money with non shouldered pre fits. In theory, I’ll be having smith spin them up with shoulders and spacing for the Project is basically for convenience and having one platform for 3-5 barrels.

I’m open to other suggestions.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I have 6 barrels for 2 TL-3's that I swap out on the fly. No barrel vices, go/ no go gauges, witness marks. Perfect return to zero and consistent headspace of brass. Below is a link to a post I wrote last year when I was putting it together. It is simple and reliable.

https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...ystem-tl3-xlr-evo-6-dasher-223-wylde.6667070/

Love the set up. You and/or the Smith wasn’t worried about applying torque so far away from the action? Obviously your results sleek for itself. Just seems like repeated torquing at the muzzle vs near action could lead to issues.

 

[Dthomas3523]

No issues. Since that post, I've tested and shot anything from handtight, 20ft/lbs, random torque using a crescent wrench, up to 40 ft/lbs. The barrel doesn't know the difference; it shoots the same POI and precision. No need for witness marks or gauges. The barrel stops on the shoulder. When you torque it, it doesn't continue to thread or turn. It has stopped; it's just torque on the threads. There are now 6 of us using this same setup. All TL-3's.

Here's a 10rd group handtight on an extremely clean bore after cleaning with CLR.

Badass.

After see this, I'm thinking just shouldered barrels hand tight. And have smith mill flats near the chamber/action in the off chance that I need some torque to get a hand tight barrel off.

 

[Sheldon N]

I'm running dual TL3's with a bunch of different shouldered barrels. I have the trailer hitch barrel vise setup and will sometimes swap barrels at the range. It does add a bit of time since you need to take the action out of the chassis and use a torque wrench with an action wrench. I run at 60 ft/lb for barrel torque. Since I have dual actions my need to swap barrels is greatly reduced. One is usually the 223 trainer and the other is my match gun.

I don't use go or no-go gauges, the shouldered barrel does all that for me. The whole setup is very repeatable and predictable. You can pull a gun apart, swap barrels around, dial the known scope offset between calibers/barrels, then fire a round to check zero. It's almost always bang on perfect, sometimes just a click is needed. Having a bedded chassis that fits the action like a glove helps a good deal.

However, if I were going to do this on a single rifle rather than a dual setup I'd be using Reubenski's approach with 20lb torque and the rifle held between the knees while tightening or loosening the barrel. Action stays in the chassis, no need for go or no-go gauges, barrel swaps are much quicker. I might be more nervous about hand tight, since you definitely don't want the barrel loosening up on you. If I did that I'd be double checking all the time that it hadn't unscrewed any.

 

[morganlamprecht]

ive run hunting rifles similar to Reub for the past couple years...have flats cut near the muzzle, thread them on, bump tight with a wrench...no issues with accuracy...only thing to consider is if running a suppressor, you need enough torque to not thread the barrel off if the can gets tight...i had my 6x45 barrel screw off once after installing/removing a can about 50 times...no issues just screwing the barrel back on, but something to be mindful of

 

[flyer]

I'm going to be using a Barloc on my upcoming ARC Nucleus action build.

I don't expect barrel changes to be a frequent thing but I'm going to use Savage pre-fit (and take off) barrels with the Barloc barrel nut.

I am thinking I may apply a little thread locker on the barrel nut so it doesn't move unintentionally when off the rifle. I'll add a witness mark across the bottom of the recoil lug, tensioner and barrel nut so that I can ensure it is screwing in to a consistent depth.

This way I don't have to have a gunsmith turn a precise shoulder, I don't need any type of vise, just a small torque wrench or makbe one of those fix it stick sets.

I'll use headspace gauges when I can but I'll have the witness marks just in case I want to swap and don't have them on hand.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Does anyone know if machining flats into the barrel after its all put together is possible? Or would it disturb the accuracy at all?

 

[Dthomas3523]

I wouldn't make handtight a habit. I just did once bc I forgot my wrench. The suppressor could present an issue. I usually go 40ft/lbs and haven't had a tight suppressor unscrew a barrel. I have pulled a hot barrel with the suppressor on, and once it cooled, put the wrench on the flats to keep the barrel from rotating while I unscrew the sticky suppressor with my hands(with the loose barrel free of the action and chassis)

One of the really cool things about being able to pull a barrel without consequence or hassle is cleaning and measuring the throat directly at the chamber using a split neck case and a bullet.

I switched over to MPA chassis bc XLR is too slow in innovating and love them. First chassis I've had that doesn't need bedding. All the others induced action flexing. I mention it bc bedding can capture the recoil lug which I think is important when torquing on a bolted in action. The cool thing about the new MPAs is the recoil lug clamp. It really locks the action down and I like to think it's more conducive to barrel swaps.

I have the opposite problem as Sheldon. I bought a second, identical TL-3/ MPA so my barrels are interchangeable between my two match rifles but bc it's so convenient to switch barrels, the second rifle is still unfired! I have a scope mounted, action in chassis, all set up and ready to go and haven't even shot it. It's more of a PITA to drag two gun boxes to the range than it is to throw a second or third barrel in the gunbox or back seat of the truck, ha ha! One of these days, I'll get it to the range....

Well shit,

I’m debating now.

Barloc and only tool is hex bit with in/lb torque wrench. Need to install with go/no go

Or

Ft/lb torque wrench with crow’s foot no gauge needed.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Well shit,

I’m debating now.

Barloc and only tool is hex bit with in/lb torque wrench. Need to install with go/no go

Or

Ft/lb torque wrench with crow’s foot no gauge needed.

I’m definitely going flats and shoulder. Not to big of a deal to throw the wrench in my range bag. Still very minimal tools required.

 

[Dogsniper]

I have 6 barrels for 2 TL-3's that I swap out on the fly. No barrel vices, go/ no go gauges, witness marks. Perfect return to zero and consistent headspace of brass. Below is a link to a post I wrote last year when I was putting it together. It is simple and reliable.

https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...ystem-tl3-xlr-evo-6-dasher-223-wylde.6667070/

I did this same set up after his post. Works great and hassle free!!!

 

[Dthomas3523]

I’m definitely going flats and shoulder. Not to big of a deal to throw the wrench in my range bag. Still very minimal tools required.

Pretty sure this is what I will be doing as well.

I’ll have flats near muzzle and I’ll also have a hitch mounted barrel vice just in case something decides to seize up.

 

[Colt1776]

I wouldn't make handtight a habit. I just did once bc I forgot my wrench. The suppressor could present an issue. I usually go 40ft/lbs and haven't had a tight suppressor unscrew a barrel. I have pulled a hot barrel with the suppressor on, and once it cooled, put the wrench on the flats to keep the barrel from rotating while I unscrew the sticky suppressor with my hands(with the loose barrel free of the action and chassis)

One of the really cool things about being able to pull a barrel without consequence or hassle is cleaning and measuring the throat directly at the chamber using a split neck case and a bullet.

I switched over to MPA chassis bc XLR is too slow in innovating and love them. First chassis I've had that doesn't need bedding. All the others induced action flexing. I mention it bc bedding can capture the recoil lug which I think is important when torquing on a bolted in action. The cool thing about the new MPAs is the recoil lug clamp. It really locks the action down and I like to think it's more conducive to barrel swaps.

I have the opposite problem as Sheldon. I bought a second, identical TL-3/ MPA so my barrels are interchangeable between my two match rifles but bc it's so convenient to switch barrels, the second rifle is still unfired! I have a scope mounted, action in chassis, all set up and ready to go and haven't even shot it. It's more of a PITA to drag two gun boxes to the range than it is to throw a second or third barrel in the gunbox or back seat of the truck, ha ha! One of these days, I'll get it to the range....

I have an Impact action and am thinking of having 2-3 barrels to switch out as well. How do you achieve the 40 ft-lbs? I like the idea of having a slot machined at the end of the barrel so you don’t have to have a barrel vise or an action wrench if you leave it in the chassis.

 

[Sheldon N]

I have an Impact action and am thinking of having 2-3 barrels to switch out as well. How do you achieve the 40 ft-lbs? I like the idea of having a slot machined at the end of the barrel so you don’t have to have a barrel vise or an action wrench if you leave it in the chassis.

If you're running an MPA chassis an alternate option is a Ross vise and using a piece of oak board in the base of the stock to hold the gun in place while you torque on/off the barrel. No action wrench needed, barreled action stays in the chassis. That's the approach I'm using these days, not quite as fast as just having a torque wrench with flats, but close. Check out the video on the Ross vise website to see what I'm talking about with the oak board. Carl uses a piece of metal bar but I've been using a 1/4 oak plank and torquing to around 35-40 ft/lb.

The upside is that you don't need flats machined on every barrel so you can just order pre-fits off the shelf.

 

[Colt1776]

If you're running an MPA chassis an alternate option is a Ross vise and using a piece of oak board in the base of the stock to hold the gun in place while you torque on/off the barrel. No action wrench needed, barreled action stays in the chassis. That's the approach I'm using these days, not quite as fast as just having a torque wrench with flats, but close. Check out the video on the Ross vise website to see what I'm talking about with the oak board. Carl uses a piece of metal bar but I've been using a 1/4 oak plank and torquing to around 35-40 ft/lb.

The upside is that you don't need flats machined on every barrel so you can just order pre-fits off the shelf.

I am actually running a KRG Bravo right now and it doesn't have any holes in it like the MPA does. I do like that option not having to have the barrels machined.