Thunder Valley precision

[BCX]

I have to be the dissenting voice. I don’t think there is a lot to be gained from shooting a match like that when you can’t see splash from misses. Half the shots were “no call.” When more than half the shooters had one impact on steel out of twenty shots, I think you’re well past the capability of the weapon system.

The 338,375,416 cals are more than capable at that distance.

 

[BCX]

I was only running 20.9 mils at the farthest target. The one splash I seen was just off the left edge of target.

 

[b2lee]

I have to be the dissenting voice. I don’t think there is a lot to be gained from shooting a match like that when you can’t see splash from misses. Half the shots were “no call.” When more than half the shooters had one impact on steel out of twenty shots, I think you’re well past the capability of the weapon system.

I do understand where you are coming from. I do understand your frustration. I on the other hand remember when we were doing the same thing at 1k and at 1 mile....it wasn't that long ago. Yes, currently we are operating outside of anything we would consider 'practical'. We have to push the boundaries and strive for that next level. Can we push the practical line to 2k yards in the next 5-10 years? Will we be having 2k benchrest and talking how easy it is?....like we do at 1k benchrest?

I remember my first impact at 1k....my first impact at 1 mile....and my first impact at 2500...I think they all were equal at that time...in that moment. That initial rush of "Did I just do that?" The first impact at 1k was a lot of jumping up and down...fist pumping....a lot of excitement. Now when we miss at 1k we stop...take a deep breath...and say, "What did I do wrong?". One mile is getting there too....it won't be long before we re-visit our notes and try to figure out how in the hell we missed that 1MOA target at 1 mile...or lord forbid if the target is 2 or 3 MOA.

We need to keep pushing these boundaries. We need a different set of eyes on the problems we face so we can have new ideas....new insights into how we can tear down these obstacles. How we can invent something...design something...build something to improve the sport. The ground work...the hard work...the sleepless nights we spend now trying to over come a problem...will benefit the masses in the future.

I for one, will stay the course...and try to push my rifle system as far as I can...to the point of where it is no longer having a lucky day...but an expected day.

Good shooting and talking with you this weekend. Hope to see you soon at other events.

 

[phlegethon]

The thick grass around the target didn’t help spotting misses!

Yeah I think that’s the biggest problem. If you have sand or loose dirt then you can see where your shots are landing and at least learn something. Shooting into grass gives no feedback.

 

[phlegethon]

The 338,375,416 cals are more than capable at that distance.

There were plenty of those at the match, with one or zero impacts on steel.

 

[BCX]

Yeah I figured the 375/416 guys would of dominated that match.

 

[b2lee]

Yeah I figured the 375/416 guys would of dominated that match.

Me too....and there were many of those guys that were getting good spots...if their dope was close they were getting corrections....but everyone took WAY too long to do their corrections. TVP isn't like shooting anywhere else. You never have the same wind call for more than 5-10 seconds....even on what seems to be a no wind day. It defies explanation. I've shot other places that had a heavy...but steady wind...and it was easy to ballistic app your data and either make a first round hit or be very close.

While I expected my tiny bullet not to kick up much...I could see most of my misses...except at 2444...but I mean come on....300PRC at that distance...that is the bullet......not the fault of what we are trying to do. Any other venue...and without the rifle going south on me quickly due to a cleaning issue like at Black Bear....I think I can hang out to 2300yds. Does TVP need some manicured sand pits around those targets...sure...but that was about the most realistic test of the platforms at that distance we have seen.

 

[Sandow the Heretic]

Definitely need cameras. I had one spotter to my left say impact and one to my right say no impact. It was fun either way! Need to change a thing or 2 up before the next match.

So cameras a great for judging impacts but they can be remarkably bad for calling correction. If you have shooters that you are reasonably confident of getting in the pocket, you can set cameras right along line of sight and at least with my system, 100 feet back or more and then zoom in for a reasonably close view. This gives you a good feel for windage calls and depending on the angle of fire you can still have the camera relatively out of the way. Judging elevation can still be very misleading though because you are usually looking up at the targets and depending on the terrain, that angle makes calls of over vs under the target hard. For a match setting, I put camera 75 to 100' back and 40 feet off to the side so the view makes both windage and elevation calls mostly useless. Don't get me wrong, you can still see trends in where people are missing and you can reconcile what you see in a spotting scope with what you see on a display to really understand the perspective, but you have to be very aware of the parallax. I can't see giving a shooter a camera feed for the first time in a match setting and have it do much other that add confusion to their calls.

Cameras certainly don't make up for poor target placement or lack of impact feedback. It is up to the match director to ensure that sighting misses is possible. Unless a lack of feedback is deliberate like we do for the Cold Bore target...

-Alex

 

[Red1993sol]

Well we are one week out from thunder valleys next ELR shoot! Who’s going ? Me and Tommy will be attending .

 

[b2lee]

I believe the match has been canceled...check the Schedule on their webpage.

 

[BCX]

I have to sit this one out… heading on vacation the following week.

 

[b2lee]

I'll be at The Grand Masters 25 tomorrow....just a low round count/monthly style match. It should be fun.

 

[BCX]

Good luck