Planning a build for bench shooting (not competition) and possibly hunting bolt action. With todays options of prefit shouldered barrels and swapable bolt faces, one capability I want is to try many diferent cartridges per barrel and bolt face swaps. The controlled round feed of these actions is advantagious because of some of the cartridges I would like to try. Obviously some long actions but also some short action mags like the saum and wsm's. What action should I go with? Can be other than listed in the title, but what action and why. Will probabily be housed in an MDT chassis. Thanks for any advice.
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TL3 or ARC?
- Thread starter Raptor77
- Start date
Well, your TL3 prefit options will be broader, unless you're willing to run the PVA shim, in which case you can put a TL3 prefit on an ARC action (my plan for my new Archimedes). Don't have other suggestions beyond that, just an FYI on prefits.
I would go with the TL3. the design is much simpler and easier to switch out the bolt.
But I only have 1st gen ARC Nukes. I think Nuke 2.0 is bayonet, toolless disassembly. Archimedes is very complex to disassemble the bolt compared to Zermatt actions.
Also, it seems BigHorn Zermatt has slightly better tolerance for pre-fits.
But I only have 1st gen ARC Nukes. I think Nuke 2.0 is bayonet, toolless disassembly. Archimedes is very complex to disassemble the bolt compared to Zermatt actions.
Also, it seems BigHorn Zermatt has slightly better tolerance for pre-fits.
I have a TL3 and an Archimedes. Barrel selection is better and bolt disassembly is easier for the TL3. I'd take the Archimedes over the TL3 every single day despite some of it's quirks.
You mind further explanating why?
I had a tl3 and a m5 but I'm back in the market and was really leaning just doing another tl3 but the Archimedes is interesting
i'd pick an origin because i much prefer the swept bolt handle. and it's cheaper. and barrel selection
i wouldn't overlook the new medium length actions if you're going to hunt with a 6.5PRC/SAUM/Sherman length case and just single feed a 300PRC from the bench/target shooting. but idk what your plans are there
that being said. i really liked my ARC M5 mausingfields
i wouldn't overlook the new medium length actions if you're going to hunt with a 6.5PRC/SAUM/Sherman length case and just single feed a 300PRC from the bench/target shooting. but idk what your plans are there
that being said. i really liked my ARC M5 mausingfields
explanating?
I dont have a tl3, just the origins, but something about my black friday arch just feels sweet. With both sitting next to each other the origin has a lighter bolt lift but just barely (though several thousand more rounds). The arc feels like the bolt close is smoother.
The arc just feels, idk, slicker? More stream lined? And the only thing I can think of is it doesnt have the primary extraction ramp it runs into so you only have the bolt closing and opening on one axis, straight down vs sliding down and forward a smidge at the top at the same time.
I really have zero complaints about either. I lack the vocabulary to describe what Im trying to. Its just different.
Not sure I could say I prefer one over the other, both are awesome. (and much better than any push feed ever)
edit: I do prefer my origin to the nucleus 1.2 my cousin has though. The archimedes is enough different from the nuc to me to stand separately.
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For me, with a Nucleus 2.0 vs. TL-3 it's as simple as bolt body diameter clearance, and hardness/surface interaction. The Nucleus bolt runs slicker and feels faster-- whether or not it really is or if it even really matters for anything is beside the point.. LOL
The other thing that mildly bothers me is the TL-3/origin extractor setup. I'm just not a fan of T-slot extractors, and all of the American Rifle Co. extractors are retarded strong/durable.
One thing I will say is that the Nucleus will see a DRAMATIC improvement in feel if you immediately throw away the firing pin spring they come with (25#) and replace it with a 19# spring.
The other thing that mildly bothers me is the TL-3/origin extractor setup. I'm just not a fan of T-slot extractors, and all of the American Rifle Co. extractors are retarded strong/durable.
One thing I will say is that the Nucleus will see a DRAMATIC improvement in feel if you immediately throw away the firing pin spring they come with (25#) and replace it with a 19# spring.
I considered a medium action but nobody makes poly mags and don’t want to limit other options
explanating?
I dont have a tl3, just the origins, but something about my black friday arch just feels sweet. With both sitting next to each other the origin has a lighter bolt lift but just barely (though several thousand more rounds). The arc feels like the bolt close is smoother.
The arc just feels, idk, slicker? More stream lined? And the only thing I can think of is it doesnt have the primary extraction ramp it runs into so you only have the bolt closing and opening on one axis, straight down vs sliding down and forward a smidge at the top at the same time.
I really have zero complaints about either. I lack the vocabulary to describe what Im trying to. Its just different.
Not sure I could say I prefer one over the other, both are awesome. (and much better than any push feed ever)
edit: I do prefer my origin to the nucleus 1.2 my cousin has though. The archimedes is enough different from the nuc to me to stand separately.
Look guy...I was posting while on a call and I'm a child of the public education system of clark county.... Lol.
Good info I appreciate it maybe I will try an arch instead of an m7
PVA Shim? I haven't heard of this... People are running bighorn prefits on a ARC?
Same flush face savage thread pattern 1 1/16x20 for all of em, difference is the tennon length.
TL3 tenon length is .790
Origin tennon is .890
Arc is .825 (edit: .825-.150 case exposure=.675 barrel tenon length and so a .790 tl3 barrel tenon - .1 of spacer ring -.675 of arc action=.015 case exposure which is less than the .150 case head exposure from the arc print calls for but can work alright as per Leds explanation below)
The origin tennon is longer than the tl3 so you use the .1" spacer to fill the empty space and keep the origin barrel from screwing in too far on a tl3 action.
I cant find a copy for the zermatt bighorn stuff (they will email it to you though) but the arc is here, used for all arc actions even though it specifies mausingfield.
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Also depends what cartridges you want to try. ARC Mausingfield has Lapua sized bolt head available. This opens up 338 lapua(obviously) but also the Norma magnums, Tubb XC, and some other big boys
Feeds, extracts, and cycles better. I also prefer ARC's extractor because it is more like an M70 than Savage 10. Both work fine, I'd take the Archimedes to the field every single day over the TL3.
I have a Bughole Bugnut barrel cut for an ARC mounted in the TL3. Greg said I got lucky that it headspaces but it does screw onto a Go gage.
@spife7980 has most of it, yep. Here's a thread where @Ledzep is doing this with ARC actions and TL3 barrels, no modification to the shim ring required:
Bighorn Origin barrel to a TL3
I have a shouldered Origin barrel. Will it screw on a TL3 action?
www.snipershide.com
Yessir, I've still got my old M5 that I've been carving a chunk of walnut... for the last year... I need to just kick it in the ass and finish that project up. Haven't done an M7, though.
Same flush face savage thread pattern 1 1/16x20 for all of em, difference is the tennon length.
TL3 tenon length is .790
Origin tennon is .890
Arc is .825
The origin tennon is longer than the tl3 so you use the .1" spacer to fill the empty space and keep the origin barrel from screwing in too far on a tl3 action.
I guess you would file it down to fit the arc unless they make one thats not listed on the site that I can find.
I cant find a copy for the zermatt bighorn stuff (they will email it to you though) but the arc is here, used for all arc actions even though it specifies mausingfield.
View attachment 7848921
The ARC tennon is .825 minus .150 case exposure, so .675.
However, if you run .015 slim on the case exposure (.135"), it works out to a .690" tennon. So if you take .100 off a TL-3 (.100" spacer ring), you're at the right spot for an ARC action. The caveat here is that you don't have very much bolt nose clearance. IME this hasn't proven to be a problem, but just be aware, and test bolt closing BEFORE you check with go/nogo gauges to make sure there's not interference.
If you're going to be shooting SAUM or WSMs, you might want to lean towards an ARC open top Mausingfield. I'm currently shooting a 7 SAUM in a TL2 and occasionally have casings get hung up in the ejection port on the way out requiring me to manually extract them by hand. I think the TL3 has a larger ejection port, perhaps to address this TL2 shortcoming, but with the open top Mausingfield action, you'll probably never run into this. My next 7 SAUM build that's presently with the gunsmith is exactly this, an open top Mausingfield M7.
I can see clearly now that I look at all of the print!
Thanks for pointing it out, I know I had seen your stuff before and it made sense then but I wasnt wrapping my head around it until you pointed out the obvious for me.
