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Rifle Scopes Torque wrench really necessary?

3

30cal_Fun

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 16, 2011
69
0
35
Netherlands
#1
Probably everyone knows the videos of Larry Potterfield, Brownells and others.
When torquing the base, rings or the action to the stock they use an adjustable torque wrench to torque it all down to a specific number of inch/pounds.
Still, countless people do it simply by feel and there are few shooters that actually own a torque wrench.

So, my question is: Do I really "need" an adjustable torque wrench, or will a good screwdriver do the job too?

The reason I ask is because I have been taking off the stock and scope a lot lately (refinishing). I know shouldn't over tighten the rings to a point it could damage the scope, and that the action screws should be tightened well but I don't really have a solid feel for how tight it all should be.

Louis
 
#3
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 30cal Fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...and there are few shooters that actually own a torque wrench. </div></div>

That is just a totally inaccurate assumption for most of the folks who are engaged in precision, long-range shooting.

I mean, you are obviously intelligent enough to realize that you shouldn't "overtighten rings" and that your "action screws should be tightened well." How do you expect to accurately gauge the torque you are exerting on your rings/mounts/action screws/etc. without the proper tools? Get yourself a good adjustable torque wrench (or driver) and start using it on all jobs like those you described. You will realize what a difference it can make in the long run and how much more consistency it affords you (which leads to accuracy/repeatability in a long-range rifle).
 
#5
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I didn't have a torque wrench until I spent some time on this site., I recently re-mounted two Lupie Matk IV's with it. Knowing that I had even torque specs on expensive glass was reassuring. I know I am exactly torqueing 15 ft lbs when that is required. I wouldn't be without one now. I use the Borka that was talked about here awhile back. It is in my range bag..... I don't leave home without it.
 
#6
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

LL said it, consistency is key, especially in the torque on action screws, for the $50 it costs for an adjustable torque wrench it's cheap insurance. You can spend more, but I don't think you need to. An adjustable $50 model might not be 1% accurate, but it should be repeatable. Having one also keeps you from ham fisting a screw, and one day spent trying to drill out a screw on a expensive gun without hurting it, or paying a gunsmith to and it will be worth the $50.

The other thing is most people are amazed at how little torque 15-25 in/lbs is for things like scope ring screws so most people really have no idea how much torque they should be using, much less the ability to get 8 screws even close to the same.

The difference between 15-18lbs might not matter on a scope mount or action screw, but the fact you get all the screws to the same torque, and that the action screws are adjusted as close as possible to the same torque every time the action is taken out of the stock is key. It also helps keep from damaging things like floor plates, scope tubes, etc.
 
#7
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

If you have expensive scope, or shoot expensive ammo, or do not have an option of re-zeroing your rifle every time you take it apart or change scope setups, spending money on torque tool is simply a matter of actually saving the money, and possibly, lots of time too.

I can hardly understand people who spend 2-3 grand on the scope
and mount it by the "feel". May end up as a very expensive disappointment.
 
#8
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I found out the hard way that having a torque wrench is very wise. I have badger ordance rings that have six screws per mount. Well as I tighten one screw the other beside it would loosen. Before I knew it all of them were so tight that I ended up collasping the tube. After that i bought the torque wrench. I was use to the traditional 2-4 screw scope mounts, were feel could get it close. I had no idea that you could over torque the Tactical 6 Screw mounts. Live and learn!
 
#10
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: chain</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I didn't have a torque wrench until I spent some time on this site., I recently re-mounted two Lupie Matk IV's with it. Knowing that I had even torque specs on expensive glass was reassuring. I know I am exactly torqueing <span style="font-weight: bold">15 ft lbs</span> when that is required. I wouldn't be without one now. I use the Borka that was talked about here awhile back. It is in my range bag..... I don't leave home without it. </div></div>I just wanted to point that this is suppose to say 15 inch/lbs, I know it was just a typo, but I can promise you people get these confused( we have plenty of proof
grin.gif
)

Back on the subject, Yes it is very important to use a torque wrench when mounting scopes and such for a number reasons, most of which have been mentioned already.



Scott
 
#11
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I have never used a torque wrench to mount my optics. Tight is tight.

However, the action screws must be tightened evenly and consistently as the action will move in the bedding and has to settle back consistently from shot to shot. You <span style="text-decoration: underline">need</span> a torque wrench for this.

I modified a standard no-hub plumbers torque wrench. They are pre-set to approximately 15 in.lb. I pinned and epoxied an allen hex socket on the end of the wrench and it works fine. No real need for a $50+ adjustable.
 
#12
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vkc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just get a Borka tool torque wrench. For as much as you'll spend for good equipment, why risk ruining it over $100 or less.</div></div>

+1

There is a good reason why manufacturers give torque settings.

Why bugger up kit by guesstimating what is "tight enough"??
 
#13
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 10Xview</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have never used a torque wrench to mount my optics. Tight is tight.

However, the action screws must be tightened evenly and consistently as the action will move in the bedding and has to settle back consistently from shot to shot. You <span style="text-decoration: underline">need</span> a torque wrench for this.

I modified a standard no-hub plumbers torque wrench. They are pre-set to approximately 15 in.lb. I pinned and epoxied an allen hex socket on the end of the wrench and it works fine. No real need for a $50+ adjustable. </div></div>

This doesn't seem right to me. I always thought I wanted no movement between action and stock. Can anyone else comment?
 
#14
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

Theoretically there should be no movement, but practically the action does move and as long as "it settles back consistently from shot to shot" in same place everything should be OK.
In the machining industry it is called "fish tailing".
 
#15
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

It's an interesting question. It feels like it would be correct to say that action vibrates, rather than moves, but on the other hand, vibration is also a form of movement. Seems like it's a matter of using the correct terminology.
 
#17
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

Get a Borka. $75 on the Group buys section is a bargain!

Most serious shooters do use a torque wrench when installing scopes. Sure, there are a lot of fudds out there that don't and a lot of plinkers that don't either but most of these folks are securing $75 simmons onto their ADL. Then they wonder why their ADl won't hold zero.

-David
 
#18
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I use a wheeler fat wrench, works very well. You should always use a tourque wrench especially when working on expensive gear and optics. Trust me a few bucks verse over torquing a pricey scope, you do the math.
 
#19
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

Thanks for all the good advice everyone!!!
Some really good arguments as to the how and why.

I have on old Redfield accurange I will be installing in some months, not something I would like to over tighten. I will see if I can find a good wrench here, if not, I will probably go with the wheeler engineering fat wrench, seems like a good one.

Kind regards, Louis
 
#21
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I own 4. One in Foot pounds for the vehicles and 3 in inch pounds for my guns. With all the money that is spent on precision weapons and optics not to mention the reloading. It just makes good sense to bring everything to the right spec's.
 
#23
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I stripped out a rear threaded hole tightening a base screw on a SS Win M70 action when I didn't think I needed a torque wrench. Do I have one now?
Yup.
 
#24
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I'm just getting into long range/ precision shooting but have been in industrial/ electrical maintenance for over 10 years. It has always amazed me that people who make a living in precision, or who's lives may depend on the difference in a few volts use cheap tools, incorrect tools, or no tools at all. Precision is the name of the game here, after spending the kind of money we do on our equipment not using a torque wrench makes no sense to me.
 
#26
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

I bought a pound torque wrench for my truck years ago, I decided that my rifles are just as important to me.
I have an S&K inch torque wrench that works quite well.
 
#27
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

Considering (shot-to-shot) consistency is accuracy,
Would it also be a good idea to lap the rings?

I was thinking of buying the whole kit from wheeler engineering.
 
#28
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 30cal Fun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Considering (shot-to-shot) consistency is accuracy,
Would it also be a good idea to lap the rings?

I was thinking of buying the whole kit from wheeler engineering.
</div></div> Depends. Are your rings out of alignment? Most quality rings do not need lapping, especially when used with a quality base that is bedded when necessary.

Torque wrench: Borka rocks.
 
#29
Re: Torque wrench really necessary?

Thanks for the tip for Borka.

The base is a Redfield Jr and the rings old Redfield 4-screws, I haven't mounted them yet, but the are not exactly $300 Badgers.
 
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