Trench Gun Madness

[buffalowinter]

Well, after reading some history, I once again became intrigued by the Duck Bill Spreader Ithaca Model 37 used by the Navy SEAL's in Vietnam. One thing lead to another and I've spent the last month buying every cheap piece of crap shotgun off of the internet and restoring them to Trench Gun magnificence.

First, and foremost, The Ithaca Model 37 with Duckbill Spreader. Designed for and used by the Navy SEALS in Vietnam in response to their request for a shotgun that would spread shot horizontally for a bigger kill area.

I fabricated the Duckbill Spreader and Magazine extension, among other things. Finished in my proprietary Parkerized Cerakote finish.

Before and after:

Next I built a Stevens 520 trench Gun. The Stevens has the smoothest action of any shotgun I've used. Real old school craftsmanship, everything is made of either steel or wood.

Before and after:

Winchester 1897 I literally build from scrap parts I had laying around.

Remington model 11 with Cutts compensator

And just for some history, the infamous Harrington and Richardson "Special Forces Shotgun". After much investigation, and with help from SirH, we found this to be the real deal, made for Special Forces to be given to Montagnards in Vietnam.

And finally, as a counterpoint, my NFA registered SBS. Lots of effort to get this to work Zhukov folding stock. I had to manufacture a trunnion to attach the stock and get the angle right so that the stock could be folded and have the gun still function due to its' reciprocating charging handle. The right side folder also allows for the attachment of the AK side rail optic mount. The charging handle had to be fabricated also.

 

[Random Guy]

Very Impressive(!!). May I ask where you found the duck bill (real or repo?)

On edit: The original duck bill I saw off a de-milled M37 was umm, a bit past salty (see attached)

 

[buffalowinter]

Very Impressive(!!). May I ask where you found the duck bill (real or repo?)

I made it from steel tubing.

 

[roostercogburn98]

Have built two M97 clones in last few years. Both of mine were built on solid frame guns. #slidebite is real

 

[camocorvette]

That's outstanding! I always love to see your posts. Again, knocked it out of the park with those builds.

 

[Baron23]

Well, after reading some history, I once again became intrigued by the Duck Bill Spreader Ithaca Model 37 used by the Navy SEAL's in Vietnam. One thing lead to another and I've spent the last month buying every cheap piece of crap shotgun off of the internet and restoring them to Trench Gun magnificence.
View attachment 7755755

First, and foremost, The Ithaca Model 37 with Duckbill Spreader. Designed for and used by the Navy SEALS in Vietnam in response to their request for a shotgun that would spread shot horizontally for a bigger kill area.

View attachment 7755756

I fabricated the Duckbill Spreader and Magazine extension, among other things. Finished in my proprietary Parkerized Cerakote finish.

View attachment 7755757

Before and after:

View attachment 7755777



Next I built a Stevens 520 trench Gun. The Stevens has the smoothest action of any shotgun I've used. Real old school craftsmanship, everything is made of either steel or wood.

View attachment 7755758

Before and after:

View attachment 7755765

Winchester 1897 I literally build from scrap parts I had laying around.View attachment 7755759

Remington model 11 with Cutts compensatorView attachment 7755760


And just for some history, the infamous Harrington and Richardson "Special Forces Shotgun". After much investigation, and with help from SirH, we found this to be the real deal, made for Special Forces to be given to Montagnards in Vietnam.

View attachment 7755762

And finally, as a counterpoint, my NFA registered SBS. Lots of effort to get this to work Zhukov folding stock. I had to manufacture a trunnion to attach the stock and get the angle right so that the stock could be folded and have the gun still function due to its' reciprocating charging handle. The right side folder also allows for the attachment of the AK side rail optic mount. The charging handle had to be fabricated also.

View attachment 7755770

View attachment 7755771

View attachment 7755772

There's a fella on the eastern shore of Maryland that shoots skeet out of the Talbot Rod and Gun there who always shoots a Win trench gun on the first day he shoots in the spring (yeah, he's a wimp and won't shoot skeet in the freezing cold! haha).

He shoots one round with it, and it hammers him so one round is more than enough, but I'll be damned if he can't hit a 40+ mph clay target with that old, short, shotgun.

Nice stuff...thanks for posting.

 

[sam4886]

I've been lusting over a slam fire capable fuck around gun for a while now. Which do you think is the best base for a restoration/mod build? Appreciate any input from those much smarter than I.

 

[hlee]

My son has plans to shoot the pump gun event at the 2022 NSCA Nationals with my grand dad’s 1897.

 

[pmclaine]

@m1marty

A man of your interests

 

[diggler1833]

Quite impressive man, great work.

 

[pmclaine]

My "Fighting" shotgun.

Before....

After....

If I were a retired Major with mad major skills how would I go about replicating the Mk I bayonet adapter to make my shotty mo' legit?

 

[Charger442]

I've been lusting over a slam fire capable fuck around gun for a while now. Which do you think is the best base for a restoration/mod build? Appreciate any input from those much smarter than I.

ive owned everything that Rick has pictured (with the exception of the Montangard gun) , except i had a Savage 720 (license clone of the Rem 11) that had been cut down and no cutts. i currently own two M37s (no spreaders) but both have factory full length mag tubes, both from the 70s. Ive been trying to find a Stevens 520 for many years again because i really enjoy that gun.

Here's my breakdown of the pros/cons of what is above as it pertains to just a messing around gun:

1) Ithaca 37s are plentiful, extremely light, bottom eject guns that i think are the fastest pumps around. Their value has skyrocketed over the last decade as other people have discovered this. Evidenced by the fact i could find 7 round mag shotguns in the $250-300 range about a decade ago. now they go for close to a grand, if not more. shorter tube guns are available and cheaper, but the aftermarket for them is sparse and thats partly why you see Buffalowinter did all the fab himself.

2) Win 97s are the ultimate cool, if you ask me. They made them all the way up to the mid-50s. Also, they are called Winchester 97s because they have 97 moving parts in the action. Not really, but you get where this is going. You can usually find neglected specimens of these guns that need to be restored but i fear for the originality of them as so many are getting the trench gun treatment. I love the workings of these guns, and the exposed hammer is a delight. with the half cock type "safety".

3) Stevens 520. getting very rare to find. they are all either authentic trench/WWII guns ($2k+) range or they have all been converted to trench guns and usually not done very well. There is a Wards Westernfield 35 that is the same gun, and many of them have been trenched, as well. Even rarer than that is a Riverside Arms, but not particularly valuable. I would avoid messing around with the Stevens 520 guns unless you have a specific historical reason for doing so.

4) Remington 11, Savage 720, Browning A5. Not a pump. different animal all together, with long recoil and friction rings. if you want a screw around gun that goes bang always, this is it. tons of them around, easy to find parts, easy to work on. find one and do what you want to with it.


guns not listed that are also candidates for your project: Win model 12, Stevens 620. Millions made of the Winchester. grab one and do what you want to it. successor to the 97 and they overlapped in production. personally, id find an old Model 12 with a Cutts or Polychoke thats been cut down or similarly defiled and have at it. nothing of value will be lost after you mess around with it.

thats all my 2 cents worth of free advice. Number one candidate would be a Model 12, followed by a 1897, and then the Ithaca.

 

[buffalowinter]

My wife, with her 1897 which I built, winning one of her World Champion Cowboy Action Shooting titles.

 

[buffalowinter]

My "Fighting" shotgun.

Before....

After....

If I were a retired Major with mad major skills how would I go about replicating the Mk I bayonet adapter to make my shotty mo' legit?

I've pondered that same question in thinking about making one of these. here is the "kit" for the original.

Here are some pics of the unit

So it doesn't appear too difficult, and I think I'll make one. It appears it is simply a tube around the barrel, a tube around the mag extension, a rectangular tube in between and two side plates riveting it all together. You have to add a bayonet lug. So, I'm going to buy the correct size tube and plate. I'll weld the round tubes to the rectangular tube in the middle. Cut and shape as required. Rivet the two side plates to the assembly. I have an old M16a1 sight that I'll cut the bayonet lug off of and weld to the assembly. Cerakote. done.

 

[Random Guy]

My wife, with her 1897 which I built, winning one of her World Champion Cowboy Action Shooting titles.

Hard to post anything worthy after that bit of interesting info...

guns not listed that are also candidates for your project: Win model 12, Stevens 620. Millions made of the Winchester. grab one and do what you want to it. successor to the 97 and they overlapped in production. personally, id find an old Model 12 with a Cutts or Polychoke thats been cut down or similarly defiled and have at it. nothing of value will be lost after you mess around with it.

...but I will add one more candidate to the above list, the Winchester Model 1200, which came out in the late 1960s. Similar to the Model 12 (which has a steel receiver) but the M1200 had an aluminum receiver and trigger guard to reduce weight and decrease rust-related issues. A few years ago I bought a 1972 M1200 'Riot' shotgun that was a former LE shotgun, for $200. I bought it b/c I had just purchased an original military M1200 heat shield/bayonet bracket for $200, and eventually made a replica military M1200 as used in Vietnam circa late 1960s. Some were still in service in Iraq in the early to mid 200Xs. I confess I spent 3x+ on the conversion to a trenchgun, but still way cheaper than an original military version.

Winchester 1200 Shotgun

Winchester 1200 Shotgun information and photos from Olive-Drab.com

ftp.olive-drab.com

 

[pmclaine]

I've pondered that same question in thinking about making one of these. here is the "kit" for the original.

Here are some pics of the unit

So it doesn't appear too difficult, and I think I'll make one. It appears it is simply a tube around the barrel, a tube around the mag extension, a rectangular tube in between and two side plates riveting it all together. You have to add a bayonet lug. So, I'm going to buy the correct size tube and plate. I'll weld the round tubes to the rectangular tube in the middle. Cut and shape as required. Rivet the two side plates to the assembly. I have an old M16a1 sight that I'll cut the bayonet lug off of and weld to the assembly. Cerakote. done.

Its a "U" shaped stamping over another stamping to fill the void between mag tube and barrel.

The middle screw "locks" into the relief dimple on the mag tube and the other two just further tighten the metal sandwich. Unsure where the seam is on the bottom stamping.

The Ohio National Guard shotguns that were released some years ago had the bead sighted version. Some bought those shottys at $250 now the adapter itself goes for well above $500.

The USMC used the version with the rifle sights though it seems all pictures of the shottys in use have the sights removed. USMC Mk I spec called for the barrel to be longer than the other services barrels. Length matters to the USMC. If you compare the USMC shottys to the other service you see the barrel extending beyond the mag tube. USMC barrels are I believe 21 inch IIRC.

I have a 30 inch barrel with rifle sights ready to be cut to length and with the correct front sight to be mounted by drill and tap when you have my adapter made....

Approximate lead time please........

 

[buffalowinter]

Its a "U" shaped stamping over another stamping to fill the void between mag tube and barrel.

The middle screw "locks" into the relief dimple on the mag tube and the other two just further tighten the metal sandwich. Unsure where the seam is on the bottom stamping.

The Ohio National Guard shotguns that were released some years ago had the bead sighted version. Some bought those shottys at $250 now the adapter itself goes for well above $500.

The USMC used the version with the rifle sights though it seems all pictures of the shottys in use have the sights removed. USMC Mk I spec called for the barrel to be longer than the other services barrels. Length matters to the USMC. If you compare the USMC shottys to the other service you see the barrel extending beyond the mag tube. USMC barrels are I believe 21 inch IIRC.

I have a 30 inch barrel with rifle sights ready to be cut to length and with the correct front sight to be mounted by drill and tap when you have my adapter made....

Approximate lead time please........

I just bought an 870, the sights, and a mag tube in the last hour. When I get the gun I'll spec the dimensions for the steel I need to buy. I don't think you can find a mag clamp/bayonet assembly...if you can find one for $500, buy it!. I'm not sure your slug barrel has the same barrel diameter as the "Wingmaster" barrel. Let me make mine first, I think I can do it, the only question is how much it will cost. As a hobbyist, I don't buy materials in bulk so the tubing, in 2 foot lengths, cost me an arm and a leg. Maybe I'll buy some 4 foot lengths and make a couple of these to sell. Like you said, it appears to be stampings and they are screwed together, no riveted, as I first thought. Stampings are great for mass production but not really economically feasible for small production. I'll probably use tubing as I said, which will necessarily be thicker, so I can weld it. The screws are going to be basically cosmetic, and the welds won't be visible, so it will look the same.

 

[sam4886]

ive owned everything that Rick has pictured (with the exception of the Montangard gun) , except i had a Savage 720 (license clone of the Rem 11) that had been cut down and no cutts. i currently own two M37s (no spreaders) but both have factory full length mag tubes, both from the 70s. Ive been trying to find a Stevens 520 for many years again because i really enjoy that gun.

Here's my breakdown of the pros/cons of what is above as it pertains to just a messing around gun:

1) Ithaca 37s are plentiful, extremely light, bottom eject guns that i think are the fastest pumps around. Their value has skyrocketed over the last decade as other people have discovered this. Evidenced by the fact i could find 7 round mag shotguns in the $250-300 range about a decade ago. now they go for close to a grand, if not more. shorter tube guns are available and cheaper, but the aftermarket for them is sparse and thats partly why you see Buffalowinter did all the fab himself.

2) Win 97s are the ultimate cool, if you ask me. They made them all the way up to the mid-50s. Also, they are called Winchester 97s because they have 97 moving parts in the action. Not really, but you get where this is going. You can usually find neglected specimens of these guns that need to be restored but i fear for the originality of them as so many are getting the trench gun treatment. I love the workings of these guns, and the exposed hammer is a delight. with the half cock type "safety".

3) Stevens 520. getting very rare to find. they are all either authentic trench/WWII guns ($2k+) range or they have all been converted to trench guns and usually not done very well. There is a Wards Westernfield 35 that is the same gun, and many of them have been trenched, as well. Even rarer than that is a Riverside Arms, but not particularly valuable. I would avoid messing around with the Stevens 520 guns unless you have a specific historical reason for doing so.

4) Remington 11, Savage 720, Browning A5. Not a pump. different animal all together, with long recoil and friction rings. if you want a screw around gun that goes bang always, this is it. tons of them around, easy to find parts, easy to work on. find one and do what you want to with it.


guns not listed that are also candidates for your project: Win model 12, Stevens 620. Millions made of the Winchester. grab one and do what you want to it. successor to the 97 and they overlapped in production. personally, id find an old Model 12 with a Cutts or Polychoke thats been cut down or similarly defiled and have at it. nothing of value will be lost after you mess around with it.

thats all my 2 cents worth of free advice. Number one candidate would be a Model 12, followed by a 1897, and then the Ithaca.

I'm aware of the 620. Hadn't looked into the 1200. There's a few options on gun broker in the $500-700 range. Obviously not the golden unicorn factory riot gun st $200, but still not terrible. A couple decently priced 37s too, but they're hunting guns.

 

[Charger442]

I'm aware of the 620. Hadn't looked into the 1200. There's a few options on gun broker in the $500-700 range. Obviously not the golden unicorn factory riot gun st $200, but still not terrible. A couple decently priced 37s too, but they're hunting guns.

maybe that was a typo but a 1200 is not the same as the model 12, though both are winchesters.

if you want to get crazy awesome with your build, ditch the pump and go with a Winchester Super X 1, arguably one of the finest auto shotguns ever made, discontinued because it was too good and way too expensive to make.

 

[sam4886]

Yup, 1200 was a typo. My go to hunting shotgun is a super x 4. Not sure how much of the x1 heritage that still has though.

 

[m1marty]

Late to the party. Here's my Vietnam (through early GWOT) NSW 870. Included is correct ammo pouch (I also have GWOT pouches), ammo and some "action" shots.
Simple and classy, it remains a favorite.

 

[roostercogburn98]

Here is the first one I did. Traded it and then built another a few months later.

 

[roostercogburn98]

The second one that is still in the safe

 

[pmclaine]

@buffalowinter

The Merry Shotgun Fairy provided this....

Note in the final construct they used three screws and the middle one is slightly lower in line to catch in the groove of the extended magazine and locate/lock in the adaptor.

Word is that the bayonet lug is just silver soldered in place on the stamping.

I think bead sight models didnt include any sort of base just drill/tap the stamping.

The rifle sight models I assume were drilled/tapped for the front sight base/blade to be screwed on.

 

[m1marty]

Bead sight version

 

[Davo308]

Hard to post anything worthy after that bit of interesting info...

...but I will add one more candidate to the above list, the Winchester Model 1200, which came out in the late 1960s. Similar to the Model 12 (which has a steel receiver) but the M1200 had an aluminum receiver and trigger guard to reduce weight and decrease rust-related issues. A few years ago I bought a 1972 M1200 'Riot' shotgun that was a former LE shotgun, for $200. I bought it b/c I had just purchased an original military M1200 heat shield/bayonet bracket for $200, and eventually made a replica military M1200 as used in Vietnam circa late 1960s. Some were still in service in Iraq in the early to mid 200Xs. I confess I spent 3x+ on the conversion to a trenchgun, but still way cheaper than an original military version.

Winchester 1200 Shotgun

Winchester 1200 Shotgun information and photos from Olive-Drab.com

ftp.olive-drab.com

Very nice I always loved how slick the action was.

 

[pmclaine]

First round fired......00, 9 pellet, 10 yards.

9 more rounds.....holes at bottom are .308 from an earlier shoot.

Clean target 10 rounds, 90 pellet holes and some wad blow through......

 

[camocorvette]

First round fired......00, 9 pellet, 10 yards.

9 more rounds.....holes at bottom are .308 from an earlier shoot.

Clean target 10 rounds, 90 pellet holes and some wad blow through......

I need a nice wood gripped shotty. That's purdy!

 

[Baron23]

Yup, 1200 was a typo. My go to hunting shotgun is a super x 4. Not sure how much of the x1 heritage that still has though.

Pretty much none. I own 4 SX-1 incl a NIB ( that’s going up for sale soon) and a factory engraved Pigeon grade ( 48 of them made and that’s going to go up for sale soon too).

When Winchester decided to make the SX-1, the guiding philosophy was to make it like a Mod 12. Not a stamped part in it.

Milled Steel receiver (rather than aluminum like an 1100) and the drop out trigger group is also all machined steel.

Likewise, the barrels are real pieces of beautiful work.

In Talbot county in Maryland there is an older fella at the local skeet club who was at one time a VP of sales/marketing for Remington at the time the SX-1 came out. Rem bought one and had it on the conference room table. He said they all sighed in relief when they saw it as they knew that they would kick Win’s butt on price because there was no way to make it to the price point of the 1100.

Matter of fact, the SX-1 caused the death of US Repeating Arms (Winchester). They had an audit and were told that even at twice the price of the 1100, they were still losing $ on every SX-1 sold….about 80,000 of them in total.

They are wonderful shotguns.

Myth or Magic? - Clay Shooting USA

Myth or Magic? - Clay Shooting Read more about bolt, winchester, shotgun, recoil, skeet and buffer.

www.yumpu.com

 

[Charger442]

Pretty much none. I own 4 SX-1 incl a NIB ( that’s going up for sale soon) and a factory engraved Pigeon grade ( 48 of them made and that’s going to go up for sale soon too).

When Winchester decided to make the SX-1, the guiding philosophy was to make it like a Mod 12. Not a stamped part in it.

Milled Steel receiver (rather than aluminum like an 1100) and the drop out trigger group is also all machined steel.

Likewise, the barrels are real pieces of beautiful work.

In Talbot county in Maryland there is an older fella at the local skeet club who was at one time a VP of sales/marketing for Remington at the time the SX-1 came out. Rem bought one and had it on the conference room table. He said they all sighed in relief when they saw it as they knew that they would kick Win’s butt on price because there was no way to make it to the price point of the 1100.

Matter of fact, the SX-1 caused the death of US Repeating Arms (Winchester). They had an audit and were told that even at twice the price of the 1100, they were still losing $ on every SX-1 sold….about 80,000 of them in total.

They are wonderful shotguns.

Myth or Magic? - Clay Shooting USA

Myth or Magic? - Clay Shooting Read more about bolt, winchester, shotgun, recoil, skeet and buffer.

www.yumpu.com

Heard it was like a $20 million loss over the time they made them

 

[Baron23]

Heard it was like a $20 million loss over the time they made them

Yeah, and in the late 70’s that was real money! Lol

I’m sure you are right but I personally have not heard a specific amount. But that gun sure broke their back.

 

[buffalowinter]

I've pondered that same question in thinking about making one of these. here is the "kit" for the original.

Here are some pics of the unit

So it doesn't appear too difficult, and I think I'll make one. It appears it is simply a tube around the barrel, a tube around the mag extension, a rectangular tube in between and two side plates riveting it all together. You have to add a bayonet lug. So, I'm going to buy the correct size tube and plate. I'll weld the round tubes to the rectangular tube in the middle. Cut and shape as required. Rivet the two side plates to the assembly. I have an old M16a1 sight that I'll cut the bayonet lug off of and weld to the assembly. Cerakote. done.

Progress so far on the 870 bayonet lug adapter.

Metallugical analysis of the tested/inspected/certified steel I am using. if you're hit by a nuke, this is all that will be left.

 

[m1marty]

Progress so far on the 870 bayonet lug adapter.View attachment 7766976View attachment 7766977View attachment 7766978

Metallugical analysis of the tested/inspected/certified steel I am using. if you're hit by a nuke, this is all that will be left.
Amazing!

 

[buffalowinter]

I have a Czech Shepherd.

 

[m1marty]

The idiot in my profile pic is a Dutch Shepherd. Half gator, half kangaroo, half methamphetamine

 

[buffalowinter]

Finished rough shaping and will smooth it all out and put together tomorrow, then on to Cerakote, install front sight and butt sling swivel.

Moving on to my semi-auto Owen SMG. Totally one-off and just winging it off plans in my head.

Also have to work on my British WWII folding Paratrooper bicycle.

Just finished putting this cool vintage Oigee 8x scope on a short side rail for my Russian capture DOU Mauser K98

 

[m1marty]

In for an adapter if more than one is made.

 

[J Max]

Awesome thread! I built this one a couple years ago from a 50’s model riot gun. Used a dremmel and caffeine free hands to inlet the barrel for the heat shield.

Parts were collected from IMA, classic old west arms and Numrich gun parts.

 

[2c1fr]

Progress so far on the 870 bayonet lug adapter.View attachment 7766976View attachment 7766977View attachment 7766978

Metallugical analysis of the tested/inspected/certified steel I am using. if you're hit by a nuke, this is all that will be left.
View attachment 7766979

Looks great to me!

 

[pitspitr]

Buffalo and Marty in the last 2 days I have spoken with 2 different Sherriff's dept. dog handlers. (No, it was just social ) One's dog "spoke" Czech and the other's spoke German. Are your dogs retired millitary or police? If so God Bless you for doing that. Those retired dogs deserve a good home in Retirement! I'd like to adopt a retired dog, but my wife is more into small house dogs.
Buffalo, the Healer in the photo behind your bike looks like he was a good one. I had several really good Healers over the years when I still had cattle and hogs.

 

[buffalowinter]

My Czech Shepherd was a rescue. He had been thru 3 families and bit one person. I did get him from a police handler. He was going to be put down. He is a great dog and has never shown anything but love towards us. He will not leave my wife's side. When her brother came to visist he hugged her and got bit in the ass for that "attack". Actually, it was only a nip, but was pretty funny...at least I thought so. The cattle dog was also a rescue and is still with us...he is around 104 years old in people years.

 

[buffalowinter]

Metal work is all done. Waiting for the front sight. Next is cerakote.

 

[pmclaine]

Metal work is all done. Waiting for the front sight. Next is cerakote.View attachment 7767792View attachment 7767793View attachment 7767794View attachment 7767795

I am scared of what you would do if you ever got bored.

 

[buffalowinter]

I am scared of what you would do if you ever got bored.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Don’t worry about what he’d do if bored… will never happen.

Be afraid of pissing him off, however!

Sirhr

 

[camocorvette]

Don’t worry about what he’d do if bored… will never happen.

Be afraid of pissing him off, however!

Sirhr

I feel like it would be something along the lines of the movie "law abiding citizen"..

 

[buffalowinter]

Finished. Done in my proprietary "Parkerized" Cerakote.

Before:

After:

 

[pmclaine]

Holy crap Squirrel Man!

That looks fantastic!

Your PM box is going to be filling. When I get my shit together I will likely be sending request for same.

 

[buffalowinter]

Holy crap Squirrel Man!

That looks fantastic!

Your PM box is going to be filling. When I get my shit together I will likely be sending request for same.

It looks good but nowhere near good enough for me to actually market it. It was also expensive in both material (all tool steel) and expendable tool costs (mills, drill bits, cutting wheels, sanding drums etc). I really don't want to make anymore.

 

[pmclaine]

It looks good but nowhere near good enough for me to actually market it. It was also expensive in both material (all tool steel) and expendable tool costs (mills, drill bits, cutting wheels, sanding drums etc). I really don't want to make anymore.

I can fully understand.

One offs with no jigs or replication aids......ass ache and time consuming.

Thank yoû oncè again for showcasing your skills and making me know that at one time my tax payer funds actually went to an individual way more capable than what he was paid.