Trump Town Hall

[Ravenworks]

370k votes rejected in PA

370K Pennsylvania mail-in ballot applications rejected: Report

Many residents may have mistakenly sent in more than one ballot request.

www.foxnews.com

 

[SilentStalkr]

Well, here’s a database of over a thousand cases of election fraud. What would a centrist say if 3/4 of those benefited one side? Would a centrist conclude one side is a multitude more corrupt than the other? If it was 90%, would a centrist look at that differential as telling and compelling?

The Heritage Foundation's Election Fraud Map

The Heritage Foundation's Election Fraud Map is an interactive tool providing a sampling of proven instances of election fraud across the U.S. From @HeritageDataviz

www.heritage.org

2020 Election: Over One Million Ineligible Persons Registered to Vote in California

/PRNewswire/ -- A review of California's statewide voter database shows that 13 counties have more registered voters than eligible citizens-- totaling over 1...

www.prnewswire.com

One million fraudulent votes, in a state with 55 electoral votes?! I would suggest that moves the needle on a national level.

How about the Project Veritas videos released in 2016? In which a DNC leader admits to large scale busing and election fraud over the last 50 years. In fact, he thinks they’ve made such a mockery of the election process that he’s considered changing affiliation.

Or how about this analysis?

Trump Is Right — Millions Of Illegals Probably Did Vote In 2016

Media Bias: Not surprisingly, the media take seriously and support Jill Stein's and Hillary Clinton's excellent vote-recount adventure, despite there being no indication a recount is needed. Heck, even President... Read More

www.investors.com

Sadly, I think he made up his mind. Someone hinted at him voting for Biden to. Not sure if that’s true or not. I hope not. I don’t see how you can profess to be a 2A advocate and vote Biden. At any rate, he probably won’t come back to read this...

 

[BullGear]

There are no centralists in this election. You are either for Trump or against him.

That is the unmitigated truth.

 

[Leland T]

I also wanted joe to be asked if he ever took or was given money from hunters business dealings...
[/QUOTE]

IF asked he would of said " absolutely not" but IMO I think the sole purpose of Hunter Biden was to be the conduit for foregin powers to funnel money to his Dad for special considerations




..

 

[Desert Ranger Tycho]

Have to say the women behind Trump nodding after what he said made the 15 minute leftist tirade worth the watch.

 

[rustyinbend]

Sadly, I think he made up his mind. Someone hinted at him voting for Biden to. Not sure if that’s true or not. I hope not. I don’t see how you can profess to be a 2A advocate and vote Biden. At any rate, he probably won’t come back to read this...

The problem is the whole concept of being a "Single Issue Voter". Yes ... I 'm a 2A advocate. I'm also a fan of many other things that are antithetical to the current President personally and policy-wise. At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate? I vote on a preponderance of my advocacies ... not on a single consuming issue. I realize I'm in the wrong forum for that perspective to be embraced, but I'm encouraged by the fact that the glory of democracy is when people of good conscience and righteous intent, can disagree in civil discourse, remain friends, and participate fully in that democracy.

 

[MtnCreek]

The problem is the whole concept of being a "Single Issue Voter". Yes ... I 'm a 2A advocate. I'm also a fan of many other things that are antithetical to the current President personally and policy-wise. At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate? I vote on a preponderance of my advocacies ... not on a single consuming issue. I realize I'm in the wrong forum for that perspective to be embraced, but I'm encouraged by the fact that the glory of democracy is when people of good conscience and righteous intent, can disagree in civil discourse, remain friends, and participate fully in that democracy.

i.e. Sure I support the Bill of Rights, but those rich assholes getting to keep more of their money pisses me off. And Trump doesn't act presidential. Muh social security and healthcare.

 

[vh20]

At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate?

I dunno...maybe when that isolated advocacy is the single issue that is the only thing that guarantees you ever have a voice in any of the other things that are so dear to you?
Hint: If they're out to disarm you, they don't have anything good planned for you, or your pet issues.

 

[rustyinbend]

I dunno...maybe when that isolated advocacy is the single issue that is the only thing that guarantees you ever have a voice in any of the other things that are so dear to you?
Hint: If they're out to disarm you, they don't have anything good planned for you, or your pet issues.

I get that ... I really do. But that is a very personal and specific belief (albeit broadly shared in this particular forum). In another venue, that singular consuming issue would be "Abortion", or maybe "Healthcare", or a myriad of other things. As I approach retirement in 14 days, and become responsible for my own healthcare costs (I'm 62 and three years away from Medicare), and with a complex set of pre-existing conditions to account for ... I could argue that affordable healthcare should be that "isolated advocacy" that overrides all other considerations. There are many other examples of situationally urgent issues that could impact each particular voter in different and very personal ways. If my AR's get outlawed and I could only shoot my bolt guns, I'd be VERY angry and have to make tough decisions about legal compliance (or not) ... but it likely won't result in my death or financial ruin (although I'm sure I'd get that argument). BUT ... if my access to affordable healthcare is lost ... well ... I hope you get my point that any single issue is (a) situational, and (b) personal ... and those can, in any reasonable person, be expected to shape and influence a voting decision.

I'm not seeking "agreement" (this is the WRONG place for that) ... just advocating for "understanding".

And leave my pets out of this ... dammit !!!

 

[BullGear]

The problem is the whole concept of being a "Single Issue Voter". Yes ... I 'm a 2A advocate. I'm also a fan of many other things that are antithetical to the current President personally and policy-wise. At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate? I vote on a preponderance of my advocacies ... not on a single consuming issue. I realize I'm in the wrong forum for that perspective to be embraced, but I'm encouraged by the fact that the glory of democracy is when people of good conscience and righteous intent, can disagree in civil discourse, remain friends, and participate fully in that democracy.

How do you boil a frog? Keep on that course and there won't be a 2A to support and as such an America that you know and love. You must prioritize your beliefs. The 2nd is one of the most important rights we have as a society. It was put there to keep bad people AND politicians in check. However the politicians have tried to water down it's meaning to such a point, now a portion of society feels it's no longer needed. I'm afraid, they believe their government officials will protect them. In these times (with socialism being so main stream) defending the 2A is the most important aspect of the voting process. At this time, it's most important to support ANY candidate that has our same beliefs.

You may not like Donald Trump (usually on a personal note instead of political view), but he's the best option we have and that's undeniable. He's not a polished politician. He's not a politician at all. That's why some won't like him. They want that smooth talking, slicked up guy who plays the part. But that's why many like him. He's a polished turd, but a turd that gets things done for AMERICA. He's not out there to get rich. He doesn't owe anyone in the political arena.

If you don't like him (for whatever reason), hold your nose and vote for him. If not, I truly believe this election will color our country for decades to come. Socialism isn't pretty, no matter how they paint it. Peal back it's layers and it's a red communist flag under it all.

 

[rustyinbend]

How do you boil a frog? Keep on that course and there won't be a 2A to support and as such an America that you know and love. You must prioritize your beliefs. The 2nd is one of the most important rights we have as a society. It was put there to keep bad people AND politicians in check. However the politicians have tried to water down it's meaning to such a point, now a portion of society feels it's no longer needed. I'm afraid, they believe their government officials will protect them. In these times (with socialism being so main stream) defending the 2A is the most important aspect of the voting process. At this time, it's most important to support ANY candidate that has our same beliefs.

You may not like Donald Trump (usually on a personal note instead of political view), but he's the best option we have and that's undeniable. He's not a polished politician. He's not a politician at all. That's why some won't like him. They want that smooth talking, slicked up guy who plays the part. But that's why many like him. He's a polished turd, but a turd that gets things done for AMERICA. He's not out there to get rich. He doesn't owe anyone in the political arena.

If you don't like him (for whatever reason), hold your nose and vote for him. If not, I truly believe this election will color our country for decades to come. Socialism isn't pretty, no matter how they paint it. Peal back it's layers and it's a red communist flag under it all.

See my last comment ... it applies here too.

 

[MtnCreek]

Willing to destroy the country cause muh social security and healthcare. We get it.

 

[rustyinbend]

Willing to destroy the country cause muh social security and healthcare. We get it.

Um ... no ... you clearly don't get it.

 

[Not a Sniper]

I hope you get my point that any single issue is (a) situational, and (b) personal ... and those can, in any reasonable person, be expected to shape and influence a voting decision.

Any single issue is not "situational and personal." 2A is constitutional. The constitution is the basis of our country and freedoms and liberties. It is what we have sworn an oath to defend.

I did not swear to protect abortions, healthcare or social security. Nor, does the constitution - those ARE individual and personal.

And while you correctly are worried about your health/healthcare, the truth is it doesn't compete with the constitution in my view.

 

[Dewey7271]

A vote due to early retirement so you can keep healthcare? Wow.
A number of points occur to me here.
A) Should have put back more if you knew this was going to be an issue. With some health issues, it was certainly going to be an issue. Prior planning prevents future failure.
B) Trump has said many times he’s covering pre-existing so guess it had to be something else.
C) If health coverage is key, keep working. Sorry but you either plan and account for costs or keep working. Asking other people to pick up the slack for your lack of planning is selfish and ridiculous. If you don’t have enough to cover living needs, discretionary income AND full anticipated healthcare costs you absolutely should not retire. Becoming someone else’s problem is arrogant and selfish. Or retire and get a side gig.
D) Retirement is a planned choice not an entitlement. No one is absolutely “entitled “ to retire it’s a choice based on quite a few factors.
E) The day it became possible to, for all intents and purposes, sweep FICA receipts into the general fund it ceased to become anyone’s social security. It’s not like a 401k where it sits and hopefully appreciates. Whatever you contribute is gone immediately. Current FICA receipts cover a hair over 70% of current payouts.
F) I could write a treatise on this so I’ll stop.

The key here is someone pushed your pertinent buttons on hot issues, said the other guy isn’t going to let you do what you want or maybe manipulated you to ignore facts and instead follow emotion and basically bought your vote. You’d have been comfortable in the late 19th and early 20th centuries when votes were actually paid for in some circles.
Perhaps it was motivated by hatred or class envy. As mentioned in prior threads where money is concerned emotions are wrong 100% of the time.

 

[rustyinbend]

Any single issue is not "situational and personal." 2A is constitutional. The constitution is the basis of our country and freedoms and liberties. It is what we have sworn an oath to defend.

I did not swear to protect abortions, healthcare or social security. Nor, does the constitution - those ARE individual and personal.

And while you correctly are worried about your health/healthcare, the truth is it doesn't compete with the constitution in my view.

Finally ... a decent argument. Coming at this from a viewpoint of "Constitutionality Trumps All" (no pun intended) ... is actually a very reasonable and valid way to look at this debate. Thank you.

 

[Not a Sniper]

Finally ... a decent argument. Coming at this from a viewpoint of "Constitutionality Trumps All" (no pun intended) ... is actually a very reasonable and valid way to look at this debate. Thank you.

I didn't really come to argue; and I feel for your situation. You are a brother who served - we should all be our brothers keeper.

When I vote, it is simply for the asshole that will screw with that constitution the least. Because the more they do, the worse it will be for all.

Hope that retirement treats you well.

 

[rustyinbend]

A vote due to early retirement so you can keep healthcare? Wow.
A number of points occur to me here.
A) Should have put back more if you knew this was going to be an issue. With some health issues, it was certainly going to be an issue. Prior planning prevents future failure.
B) Trump has said many times he’s covering pre-existing so guess it had to be something else.
C) If health coverage is key, keep working. Sorry but you either plan and account for costs or keep working. Asking other people to pick up the slack for your lack of planning is selfish and ridiculous. If you don’t have enough to cover living needs, discretionary income AND full anticipated healthcare costs you absolutely should not retire. Becoming someone else’s problem is arrogant and selfish. Or retire and get a side gig.
D) Retirement is a planned choice not an entitlement. No one is absolutely “entitled “ to retire it’s a choice based on quite a few factors.
E) The day it became possible to, for all intents and purposes, sweep FICA receipts into the general fund it ceased to become anyone’s social security. It’s not like a 401k where it sits and hopefully appreciates. Whatever you contribute is gone immediately. Current FICA receipts cover a hair over 70% of current payouts.
F) I could write a treatise on this so I’ll stop.

The key here is someone pushed your pertinent buttons on hot issues, said the other guy isn’t going to let you do what you want or maybe manipulated you to ignore facts and instead follow emotion and basically bought your vote. You’d have been comfortable in the late 19th and early 20th centuries when votes were actually paid for in some circles.
Perhaps it was motivated by hatred or class envy. As mentioned in prior threads where money is concerned emotions are wrong 100% of the time.

A) My job (and entire department) were eliminated as my company cut costs as a result of the pandemic. My retirement was not a "choice".

B) Trump has had 4 years to do that and has been unable to deliver on that recurring promise. That "Amazing Plan" has been "2 weeks away" for several years now. It's nowhere on the visible event horizon.

C) Sounds easy ... just go get a job. Not so easy at 62, and during a pandemic and with record high unemployment.

D) Um ... I don't even know how to react to that silliness as it's applied to my situation. Sufficed to say ... even though I'd "planned" on working to 65, I've saved well and am ready financially for retirement. That said, between "now" and "Medicare", I'm not anxious to lose access to affordable healthcare. My COBRA is affordable ($1,500-ish/mo) for the next 18 months. After that, I'd depend on the Affordable Care Act to get me to 65 and Medicare. If the ACA is killed ... I'll spend a ridiculous amount on healthcare that last 18 months, and with my pre-existing conditions, it might be unaffordable.

E) Huh? What's your point? That Social Security needs legislative attention to ensure solvency? We are in total agreement.

F) I'm sure you could. Thank you for stopping.

 

[rustyinbend]

I didn't really come to argue; and I feel for your situation. You are a brother who served - we should all be our brothers keeper.

When I vote, it is simply for the asshole that will screw with that constitution the least. Because the more they do, the worse it will be for all.

Hope that retirement treats you well.

Thank you, Sir ... I see many week-day rifle range visits in the coming years.

 

[FS1]

I would say this whole election comes down to this. Do you want to live under a Constitution or a Communist Manifesto?

To me, it’s that simple.

 

[Dewey7271]

Ok, I’ll play.
A) So was mine a while back. I moved on.
B) Know it doesn’t work for you but hes done pretty much everything else he promised so I’ll go with him on this. With reservations because the other side already fouled it up once.
C) I’m self-employed AND older than you, try again. Pandemic is a fact, work around it. Myself and a number of others do. By the way, Indeed is polluted with jobs.
D) If you’re financially ready then good for you. Nice job, sincerely. So am I and have been for 10 years. I like working.
E) That was for others not aware of that. If it didn’t apply, ignore it.
F) Goes both ways. You should probably stop also. When you find yourself in a hole the first rule is to stop digging. You’ve obviously made up your mind and already voted. We’re not going to convince you and you’re not going to convince me. Truce?

 

[rustyinbend]

Ok, I’ll play.
A) So was mine a while back. I moved on.
B) Know it doesn’t work for you but hes done pretty much everything else he promised so I’ll go with him on this. With reservations because the other side already fouled it up once.
C) I’m self-employed AND older than you, try again. Pandemic is a fact, work around it. Myself and a number of others do. By the way, Indeed is polluted with jobs.
D) If you’re financially ready then good for you. Nice job, sincerely. So am I and have been for 10 years. I like working.
E) That was for others not aware of that. If it didn’t apply, ignore it.
F) Goes both ways. You should probably stop also. When you find yourself in a hole the first rule is to stop digging. You’ve obviously made up your mind and already voted. We’re not going to convince you and you’re not going to convince me. Truce?

Truce unconditionally accepted.

 

[tomcatmv]

The problem is the whole concept of being a "Single Issue Voter". Yes ... I 'm a 2A advocate. I'm also a fan of many other things that are antithetical to the current President personally and policy-wise. At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate? I vote on a preponderance of my advocacies ... not on a single consuming issue. I realize I'm in the wrong forum for that perspective to be embraced, but I'm encouraged by the fact that the glory of democracy is when people of good conscience and righteous intent, can disagree in civil discourse, remain friends, and participate fully in that democracy.

FIFY We live in a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy.

 

[Rthur]

FIFY We live in a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy.

Word.

R

 

[SilentStalkr]

A) My job (and entire department) were eliminated as my company cut costs as a result of the pandemic. My retirement was not a "choice".

B) Trump has had 4 years to do that and has been unable to deliver on that recurring promise. That "Amazing Plan" has been "2 weeks away" for several years now. It's nowhere on the visible event horizon.

C) Sounds easy ... just go get a job. Not so easy at 62, and during a pandemic and with record high unemployment.

D) Um ... I don't even know how to react to that silliness as it's applied to my situation. Sufficed to say ... even though I'd "planned" on working to 65, I've saved well and am ready financially for retirement. That said, between "now" and "Medicare", I'm not anxious to lose access to affordable healthcare. My COBRA is affordable ($1,500-ish/mo) for the next 18 months. After that, I'd depend on the Affordable Care Act to get me to 65 and Medicare. If the ACA is killed ... I'll spend a ridiculous amount on healthcare that last 18 months, and with my pre-existing conditions, it might be unaffordable.

E) Huh? What's your point? That Social Security needs legislative attention to ensure solvency? We are in total agreement.

F) I'm sure you could. Thank you for stopping.

So, here is what I don’t get. I get not being a single issue voter, most arent, myself included. with that said you have listed some of your concerns, which are certainly valid, but why all the doomsday thinking? This goes for both sides.

You mention maybe needing to rely on the ACA at some point and are worried that your bills are going to skyrocket and so forth. As mentioned, Trump already said he is protecting pre-existing conditions so I wouldn’t worry about that too much. Aside from that, why does everything think that the gov is going to give everyone the cold backhand if they overturn the ACA?? Just because they get rid of a terrible ramrodded rushed piece of legislation doesn’t mean they are going to leave everyone out in the cold. Why can’t they abolish and replace it with something better and simply agree to abolish it but leave it in place until they get a better plan? Why is that so hard to see? I think that is the goal. Trump has not said he is going to just dump everyone. He has said that he is getting rid of the ACA but that doesn’t mean he will leave everyone out in the cold, unlike Biden who has made it very clear he fully intends to take ARs. There is a difference.

My point is we have become so polarized people can’t come to the middle anymore. I think your fears of Trump leaving 20 mil people without any help is unfounded. It’s not his character. Just saying. Whereas it’s pretty clear that Biden and fam are on the opposite end of the spectrum and would sell you out because they already have. Don’t even get me started on his 47 years in office kick...Anyways enjoy your time brother, get out and shoot. Don’t worry so much. It’s all going to be ok.

 

[jakelly]

The problem is the whole concept of being a "Single Issue Voter". Yes ... I 'm a 2A advocate. I'm also a fan of many other things that are antithetical to the current President personally and policy-wise. At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate? I vote on a preponderance of my advocacies ... not on a single consuming issue. I realize I'm in the wrong forum for that perspective to be embraced, but I'm encouraged by the fact that the glory of democracy is when people of good conscience and righteous intent, can disagree in civil discourse, remain friends, and participate fully in that democracy.

I like the way you continue to paint the guys here with your broad brush of unreasoning zealotry. This must be the third or fourth thread I’ve watched you be treated respectfully while advocating your democratic centrist beliefs, while you continue to revile folks here as mob members.

And why? Why are we all being labeled according to the meanest thing someone said? Are you really on the fence? Or do you have some malice toward President Trump and his supporters that taints your perception? Tell you what, go to a birdwatching forum and interject your pro-2A and thoughts on the environment, let us know how they respond to your centrist positions. Tell us all about their tolerance and compassion. Oh BTW, make sure to repeatedly label them based upon the actions of their most abusive members.

I guess you skipped over the election fraud links...

 

[OldSalty2]

So, here is what I don’t get. I get not being a single issue voter, most arent, myself included. with that said you have listed some of your concerns, which are certainly valid, but why all the doomsday thinking? This goes for both sides.

You mention maybe needing to rely on the ACA at some point and are worried that your bills are going to skyrocket and so forth. As mentioned, Trump already said he is protecting pre-existing conditions so I wouldn’t worry about that too much. Aside from that, why does everything think that the gov is going to give everyone the cold backhand if they overturn the ACA?? Just because they get rid of a terrible ramrodded rushed piece of legislation doesn’t mean they are going to leave everyone out in the cold. Why can’t they abolish and replace it with something better and simply agree to abolish it but leave it in place until they get a better plan? Why is that so hard to see? I think that is the goal. Trump has not said he is going to just dump everyone. He has said that he is getting rid of the ACA but that doesn’t mean he will leave everyone out in the cold, unlike Biden who has made it very clear he fully intends to take ARs. There is a difference.

My point is we have become so polarized people can’t come to the middle anymore. I think your fears of Trump leaving 20 mil people without any help is unfounded. It’s not his character. Just saying. Whereas it’s pretty clear that Biden and fam are on the opposite end of the spectrum and would sell you out because they already have. Don’t even get me started on his 47 years in office kick...Anyways enjoy your time brother, get out and shoot. Don’t worry so much. It’s all going to be ok.

Well summarized imo.

Trump has explicitly said on many occasions and IIRC, cruz echoed as recently as the ACB hearings - that pre-existing conditions should be covered.

They might be lying of course...

However, it is also imo that the majority of people are for covering pre-existing issues, on both sides. I could be wrong ofc. Just in my own general public observations.

ACA was the first go, lets review what been working and what isnt. Find cost savings, streamline while also improving service options for legitimate health issues (sorry mc d's).

 

[BullGear]

So, here is what I don’t get. I get not being a single issue voter, most arent, myself included. with that said you have listed some of your concerns, which are certainly valid, but why all the doomsday thinking? This goes for both sides.

You mention maybe needing to rely on the ACA at some point and are worried that your bills are going to skyrocket and so forth. As mentioned, Trump already said he is protecting pre-existing conditions so I wouldn’t worry about that too much. Aside from that, why does everything think that the gov is going to give everyone the cold backhand if they overturn the ACA?? Just because they get rid of a terrible ramrodded rushed piece of legislation doesn’t mean they are going to leave everyone out in the cold. Why can’t they abolish and replace it with something better and simply agree to abolish it but leave it in place until they get a better plan? Why is that so hard to see? I think that is the goal. Trump has not said he is going to just dump everyone. He has said that he is getting rid of the ACA but that doesn’t mean he will leave everyone out in the cold, unlike Biden who has made it very clear he fully intends to take ARs. There is a difference.

My point is we have become so polarized people can’t come to the middle anymore. I think your fears of Trump leaving 20 mil people without any help is unfounded. It’s not his character. Just saying. Whereas it’s pretty clear that Biden and fam are on the opposite end of the spectrum and would sell you out because they already have. Don’t even get me started on his 47 years in office kick...Anyways enjoy your time brother, get out and shoot. Don’t worry so much. It’s all going to be ok.

He's a never Trumper and I doubt any logic will turn him around. If he's worried about his bills skyrocketing, he should be terrified of the Demwits. But alas, he just never going to be a supporter of President Trump,

 

[Ravenworks]

Um ... no ... you clearly don't get it.

I get it, you sucked on the Government's tit for how many years and suddenly the VA isn't good enough for you.
I get affordable health care, you're preaching to the choir about it.
Since Obama care MY CARE has gone to shit.
Try paying $2,500 a month for insurance with a deductible of $3,700.
I'm on Medicare now and the insurance still sucks, the health care in this country has turned into Walmart Care.
It works just enough to keep you alive by jumping through hoops.

I live by Cleveland Clinic, the most well respected hospital in the WORLD.
I use to get an appointment in a week,now it takes months.
And
We don't see doctors anymore, no we see Nurse Practitioners.
I'm personal freinds with several doctors,they refuse the nurse practitioner mantra, they told me the new doctors need them to make a living because the pay from Obama care is so bad.

Gunny,I am truly ashamed to see you flying your Marine corps service on your tag.
The first value of the corp is we are all one.
The second value of the corp is everyone is a rifleman.

Don't tell me you was one of those guys with rank that sat in his hooch drinking a warm beverage and staying dry while your troops were out in it.

Don't forget where you came from.

 

[Rthur]

Lol, didn't take long to make people believe healthcare is a right now.
The best part is others paying for it when things go to shit...
Stick a fork in this MFr, it's done.

R

 

[jakelly]

I get that ... I really do. But that is a very personal and specific belief (albeit broadly shared in this particular forum). In another venue, that singular consuming issue would be "Abortion", or maybe "Healthcare", or a myriad of other things. As I approach retirement in 14 days, and become responsible for my own healthcare costs (I'm 62 and three years away from Medicare), and with a complex set of pre-existing conditions to account for ... I could argue that affordable healthcare should be that "isolated advocacy" that overrides all other considerations. There are many other examples of situationally urgent issues that could impact each particular voter in different and very personal ways. If my AR's get outlawed and I could only shoot my bolt guns, I'd be VERY angry and have to make tough decisions about legal compliance (or not) ... but it likely won't result in my death or financial ruin (although I'm sure I'd get that argument). BUT ... if my access to affordable healthcare is lost ... well ... I hope you get my point that any single issue is (a) situational, and (b) personal ... and those can, in any reasonable person, be expected to shape and influence a voting decision.

I'm not seeking "agreement" (this is the WRONG place for that) ... just advocating for "understanding".

And leave my pets out of this ... dammit !!!

Situational and personal?!? God help us all if animal instinct becomes our norm.

Finally ... a decent argument. Coming at this from a viewpoint of "Constitutionality Trumps All" (no pun intended) ... is actually a very reasonable and valid way to look at this debate. Thank you.

It’s not "Constitutionality Trumps All" the Constitution is simply our best effort to embody the spirit of liberty. It is “Preservation of Life, Liberty, and Property are All Important”. The document was written to ensure these God given rights. The rights are the gold, everything else falls in the tailings pile.

Where does the rubber meet the road regarding these rights in our current political environment? Abortion? Taxation? Free speech? Personal protection? Where does the left stand on these rights? As a centrist, can you name any left wing policy that upholds and protects these God-given essential rights to a greater extent than right wing policy? Because I have a hard time finding even one...

 

[rustyinbend]

For @Ravenworks ...

I was in the Marine Corps for 16 years and left after Desert Storm as my enlistment ended in 1992 ... I did NOT retire. Since then, I haven't gotten a cent from the government, or the VA. I made a great career for myself after my service. You know not of what you speak.

Social Security when I retire, will be the first dollar I've ever received from any government agency after I left the Corps.

BTW ... I spent half of my time in the Marine Corps as a C-130 Loadmaster, and the other half as an Aerial Navigator ... hence the dual wings. Much of it in very dangerous duties.

 

[oneshot86]

For @Ravenworks ...

I was in the Marine Corps for 16 years and left after Desert Storm as my enlistment ended in 1992 ... I did NOT retire. Since then, I haven't gotten a cent from the government, or the VA. I made a great career for myself after my service. You know not of what you speak.

Social Security when I retire, will be the first dollar I've ever received from any government agency after I left the Corps.

BTW ... I spent half of my time in the Marine Corps as a C-130 Loadmaster, and the other half as an Aerial Navigator ... hence the dual wings. Much of it in very dangerous duties.

non of my business but why get out at 16, you were in the wing

 

[Ravenworks]

For @Ravenworks ...

I was in the Marine Corps for 16 years and left after Desert Storm as my enlistment ended in 1992 ... I did NOT retire. Since then, I haven't gotten a cent from the government, or the VA. I made a great career for myself after my service. You know not of what you speak.

Social Security when I retire, will be the first dollar I've ever received from any government agency after I left the Corps.

BTW ... I spent half of my time in the Marine Corps as a C-130 Loadmaster, and the other half as an Aerial Navigator ... hence the dual wings. Much of it in very dangerous duties.

I think you are worried about no one but yourself, you've proved it within your own post.
Sorry Jimmy, I'll respect a buck privates opinion before yours.
A private is the most selfless person in the world, you reek of entitlement through time and grade.

 

[rustyinbend]

non of my business but why get out at 16, you were in the wing

Reasonable question. Came back from a sub-year deployment, and almost immediately popped in the computer for an unaccompanied year in Japan. Having a new toddler at home in El Toro and having spent so much of my marriage and fatherhood deployed or flying extended TransPac's' and TransLant's, etc. ... I just decided I'd done my bit for King and Country. I opted out of reenlisting, and took a job in the Silicon Valley ... been there ever since.

 

[rustyinbend]

I think you are worried about no one but yourself, you've proved it within your own post.
Sorry Jimmy, I'll respect a buck privates opinion before yours.
A private is the most selfless person in the world, you reek of entitlement through time and grade.

I'll defend forever your right to your opinions, however uninformed and insulting they may be. I'm just glad you aren't my neighbor. Life is still full of simple joys. Time to check out of this "interesting" forum, and do more important things.

 

[Flintdog2011]

The problem is the whole concept of being a "Single Issue Voter". Yes ... I 'm a 2A advocate. I'm also a fan of many other things that are antithetical to the current President personally and policy-wise. At what point does an isolated advocacy become SO important, that it offsets complete and total socio-economic and ethical disagreement with literally "everything else" about a particular candidate? I vote on a preponderance of my advocacies ... not on a single consuming issue. I realize I'm in the wrong forum for that perspective to be embraced, but I'm encouraged by the fact that the glory of democracy is when people of good conscience and righteous intent, can disagree in civil discourse, remain friends, and participate fully in that democracy.

Stop saying that filthy word “Democracy”.
The politicians and educators have used that word for so long that citizens have been brain washed into thinking we are a democracy and every person should have some voice in how our government works. We are a Constitutional Republic, where citizens vote to elect Representatives. Those Representatives can be government officials or electors. I and you and everybody else DO NOT choose “LEADERS”.... When the American citizens remember this fact, a lot of this government corruption and overreach will stop.

 

[SilentStalkr]

I get it, you sucked on the Government's tit for how many years and suddenly the VA isn't good enough for you.
I get affordable health care, you're preaching to the choir about it.
Since Obama care MY CARE has gone to shit.
Try paying $2,500 a month for insurance with a deductible of $3,700.
I'm on Medicare now and the insurance still sucks, the health care in this country has turned into Walmart Care.
It works just enough to keep you alive by jumping through hoops.

I live by Cleveland Clinic, the most well respected hospital in the WORLD.
I use to get an appointment in a week,now it takes months.
And
We don't see doctors anymore, no we see Nurse Practitioners.
I'm personal freinds with several doctors,they refuse the nurse practitioner mantra, they told me the new doctors need them to make a living because the pay from Obama care is so bad.

Gunny,I am truly ashamed to see you flying your Marine corps service on your tag.
The first value of the corp is we are all one.
The second value of the corp is everyone is a rifleman.

Don't tell me you was one of those guys with rank that sat in his hooch drinking a warm beverage and staying dry while your troops were out in it.

Don't forget where you came from.

yeah, this whole crap about having to see nurse practitioners pisses me off to no end. I haven’t seen a real doc, anywhere, in I dont know how long. I don’t know whether they are overwhelmed by the system or just don’t have time for the reg folk anymore. I’d say since obamacare pretty much everyone’s care has gone to shit to some extent.

 

[vh20]

I get that ... I really do. But that is a very personal and specific belief (albeit broadly shared in this particular forum). In another venue, that singular consuming issue would be "Abortion", or maybe "Healthcare", or a myriad of other things. As I approach retirement in 14 days, and become responsible for my own healthcare costs (I'm 62 and three years away from Medicare), and with a complex set of pre-existing conditions to account for ... I could argue that affordable healthcare should be that "isolated advocacy" that overrides all other considerations. There are many other examples of situationally urgent issues that could impact each particular voter in different and very personal ways. If my AR's get outlawed and I could only shoot my bolt guns, I'd be VERY angry and have to make tough decisions about legal compliance (or not) ... but it likely won't result in my death or financial ruin (although I'm sure I'd get that argument). BUT ... if my access to affordable healthcare is lost ... well ... I hope you get my point that any single issue is (a) situational, and (b) personal ... and those can, in any reasonable person, be expected to shape and influence a voting decision.

I'm not seeking "agreement" (this is the WRONG place for that) ... just advocating for "understanding".

And leave my pets out of this ... dammit !!!

You didn’t “get” a single word I said, and are being willfully ignorant.

 

[Snuby642]

It is looney tunes. As I said, the Republic is dying. I’d be surprised if America is around by 2025.

Yup

 

[jakelly]

Definitely willfully ignorant.

Nothing will change your fundamental belief system when you are your own source of authority. Also, without a source outside of yourself, you won’t defend anyone’s right “forever”. You’ll crumble when faced with persecution or death.

I’m actually honored that @rustyinbend never engaged me. I’ve either got the high ground or I’m on ignore.

 

[theLBC]

I get that ... I really do. But that is a very personal and specific belief (albeit broadly shared in this particular forum). In another venue, that singular consuming issue would be "Abortion", or maybe "Healthcare", or a myriad of other things.
... I hope you get my point that any single issue is (a) situational, and (b) personal ... and those can, in any reasonable person, be expected to shape and influence a voting decision.

I'm not seeking "agreement" (this is the WRONG place for that) ... just advocating for "understanding".

when "liberals" used to argue that a "clump of cells" wasn't a living person, i thought it was at least a legitimate point of debate on abortion.

but democrats or "liberals" no longer draw the line at the first trimester, before the fetus is "viable" and could survive outside the womb.

now democrats advocate for abortion on demand at any point up to the point of birth, at the cost of taxpayers.


similarly,
liberals used to be associated with the idea that our kids and their education should be one of our highest priorities, and no cost should be spared to provide every child with a quality education and a fair chance to succeed.

any rational adult would agree with this, and so do i.

but now "liberals" and democrats protect teachers, unions and votes, rather than advocate for our kids.
they continue to blame a lack of funding for public school systems that in some cases, graduate <25% of the kids.

obama spent $7 billion dollars on a tiny number of schools and proved that no amount of money will fix these failure factories unless you replace the principal and all the teachers (essentially creating a brand new learning environment).

and still democrats blame funding and fight against school choice. why?
because every child's future they can sabotage and trap into poverty is another slave on their welfare plantation and another vote for democrats.

if you still support democrats, you might be a monster.

 

[Ravenworks]

More ballot stealing, this time it's on Biden

 

[Forgetful Coyote]

 

[BytorJr]

I hear this same healthcare shit from my libtard neighbor. Trump is going to take. Our daughter’s health insurance. Note. People who say healthcare’s are fools because what they inarticulately are implying is insurance. It’s the left shoulder want to not only take away but DESTROY healthCARE. Does anybody with a single active neuron think the left could have gotten us this close to covid vaccine and now we have cures via antibodies??

Also. It was pointed out above that indeed it is a single issue election. One issue and one issue alone. Does one believe in THE Constitution and Bill of Rights? That’s it. That’s what this election is all about.

So if one wants their precious government subsidizesd low cost health insurance to pay for health CARE go and see how that’s working in Venezuela. I’m sure it’s cheap.

Hold on. There is a caravan of black cars pulling up across street. Holy shit. It’s Trump and by damn he just grabbed the girls health insurance - he TOOK it- holy shit. I cannot believe it. Orange is bad. Ok. Caravan driving off. Wait. Here comes another car. You have got to be kidding me. It’s pedo joe and he’s consoling the girl.

Now. Tell me again how it’s not one issue?

 

[Leland T]

Being retired since 2013, and living on a fixed income. Healthcare, Social Security, and 2nd Amendment Rights are all concerns of mine as well..
But having open boarders, and free healthcare for all. How long do you think any form of health care will be sustainable? The first quick fix will be to grab money out of social security until that is slowly depleated. We can demand the rich/ large corporations to pay their fair share in taxes but they will just move their companies off shore creating more unemployment. AS a nation we simply can't impliment programs we have no means to $$$ pay for.

 

[theLBC]

I hear this same healthcare shit from my libtard neighbor. Trump is going to take. Our daughter’s health insurance. Note. People who say healthcare’s are fools because what they inarticulately are implying is insurance. It’s the left shoulder want to not only take away but DESTROY healthCARE. Does anybody with a single active neuron think the left could have gotten us this close to covid vaccine and now we have cures via antibodies??

Also. It was pointed out above that indeed it is a single issue election. One issue and one issue alone. Does one believe in THE Constitution and Bill of Rights? That’s it. That’s what this election is all about.

So if one wants their precious government subsidizesd low cost health insurance to pay for health CARE go and see how that’s working in Venezuela. I’m sure it’s cheap.

Hold on. There is a caravan of black cars pulling up across street. Holy shit. It’s Trump and by damn he just grabbed the girls health insurance - he TOOK it- holy shit. I cannot believe it. Orange is bad. Ok. Caravan driving off. Wait. Here comes another car. You have got to be kidding me. It’s pedo joe and he’s consoling the girl.

Now. Tell me again how it’s not one issue?

plus they are liars. they say 100s of millions will lose coverage...
there are ~9 million on the ACA,.
there are over 150 million on employer provided insurance.

 

[Dewey7271]

Just to interject.
Fun healthcare facts.
Do you know the number of uninsured prior to ACA?
31 million
Number post ACA
30 million.
Feel free to check. You have to dig to get to it. They hide it a little.
Basically destroyed healthcare to actually cover a million people.
U.S. Population- approx 328 million
Coverage increase due to ACA- .00304

 

[ken226]

Can i get Geico to cover my pre-existing car crash?

Premiums are expensive. It sure would be easier if i could wait until after a crash to get insurance...

 

[Ravenworks]

Can i get Geico to cover my pre-existing car crash?

Premiums are expensive. It sure would be easier if i could wait until after a crash to get insurance...

Now wait a minute, going all Red Ball is a little to much.
ROFL