U.S. marked clip slotted 40x action?

[USMCSGT0331]

I'm convinced PT&G put the 40X on that receiver. It doesn't look like any other 40X marking, and as you noted, it's a Remington 700 serial number. I doubt they are messing with serial numbers.
DW

It could very well be that PTG welded up the 700 and remarked it with 40-X. Here's the OP's PTG receiver, notice how long the dash between the 40 and the X is, that's not normal. Also notice how there's no registered trademark symbol to the left of the word Remington. All of the regular 40X receivers I've seen (not including the laser engraved 40X-BR receivers and the titanium receivers) have the registered trademark symbol to the left of the Remington marking. I cropped this image to focus on the markings, but if you look at the OP's photos in this thread, his receiver lacks this registered trademark symbol.

Here's one of the earliest 40X centerfire receivers I've come across, notice how the serial number doesn't have a letter suffix (it's early):

Other early Remington 700 and 40X receivers have the word Remington underlined, that's a dead giveaway to the receivers being pretty old (1960's and 1970's vintage?), and they have the smaller size dash between the 40 and the X:

And some more recent Remington 40X receivers that don't have the word Remington underlined. These receivers still have the registered trademark symbol, and thry have the smaller size dash between the 40 and the X:

Even the old .22LR Remington 40X receivers have the registered trademark symbol to the left of the Remington marking, and the smaller size dash between the 40 and the X:

40X receiver without a serial number in the photo. Notice the registered trademark symbol to the left of the Remington marking, and the smaller size dash between the 40 and the X:

Here's the OP's receiver markings vs. the markings on the 2 original XM3's that I've owned:

Remington had different variations of the Model 700 markings, so I'm not going to post a bunch of photos of them. Just notice that the OP's receiver is in a similar serial number range as my two XM3's, but it lacks the Model 700 marking. Either Remington really messed up this receiver, or PTG welded up the 700 and marked it with 40-X (or more accurately 40------X).

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Damn, looks like a few of us had the same idea for a post at the same time! Well done, gentlemen!

 

[USMCSGT0331]

I agree. Stainless 700 receiver, filled and remarked “MODEL 40-X” Or possibly never marked 700 if it was from a bankruptcy. If it was manufactured and put on the books as a Model 700, would changing that be a problem? Similar to altering a SN?
Check the size and placement of the ‘MODEL 40-X” on these rifles. Yours almost looks like the MODEL 40-X is touching the Remington. Also the alignment is not the same. These are from rifles for sale online.

View attachment 8596218


View attachment 8596233

View attachment 8596219

View attachment 8596236

Again, not piling on, but the more facts and references we post, the less likely someone else gets taken.

Greg

You make a good point about the Model 40---X alignment on OP's receiver vs. known Remington original 40-X receivers.

Here's the OP's receiver (top) vs. an original Remington receiver that's unmodified (bottom). You can check the markings on OP's receiver vs. all of the unmodified Remington 40-X photos that are in this thread. There's only 1 single lone receiver that's photographed in this discussion thread that is different than all the rest. On OP's receiver, the R and M begin at about the same point on the receiver. All the other receivers that aren't from PTG show the M starting at about the middle of the R. I hope this makes sense, but this is not looking good for the PTG receiver:

 

[Jrb572]

There is no trade mark on my Remington SS receiver

 

[Jrb572]

Also just checked a few XM3 on the CMP. The S action must not have the trade mark thing.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

There is no trade mark on my Remington SS receiver View attachment 8596299

That's because the Model 700's didn't have the trademark, only the 40-X had it. Since the trademark is missing on OP's "40---X" receiver, it stands to reason that it's a remarked Model 700 receiver (alone with other defining characteristics).

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Also just checked a few XM3 on the CMP. The S action must not have the trade mark thing.

No Model 700 had the trademark, only the 40-X receivers had it.

 

[Jrb572]

That's because the Model 700's didn't have the trademark, only the 40-X had it. Since the trademark is missing on OP's "40---X" receiver, it stands to reason that it's a remarked Model 700 receiver (alone with other defining characteristics).

Ah got it
Learned something new. I guess I’ve never owned a 40x to see the trade mark logo

 

[Pondskipper]

Well I talked to my gunsmith earlier and he did tell me it’s for sure carbon steel and when he blasted the exterior before applying cerakote he didn’t see anywhere on it that would suggest it was welded or tampered with in that regard, he did tell me that you could visibly tell the letters US were definitely different and done at a different time from the rest of it and he also uncovered in the notch for the bolt handle on the action body where it’s got a laser etched label code in it

 

[Pondskipper]

The code in the bolt handle cut is the data matrix type.

 

[Pondskipper]

Another valid point he made was that it’s a federal offense to alter the make model and serial number of the receiver because it is tampering with the forward and backward traceability in terms of ownership and point of origin, and since he saw no signs of that other than someone clearly adding the U.S. markings over the serial number which he 100% thinks ptg did themselves along with that excuse for a clip slot job. He believes it could have very well been a screwup on Remingtons part with it having a 700 serial number but 40X on the body and was likely just never put out into circulation because of it. In the grand scheme of things I guess it doesn’t really matter, will still be a fun rifle either way but I do plan to make this known for everyone else in the future in a very public way. I for one won’t ever do business with them again.

 

[Pondskipper]

Quick update, I tried to reassure Tiny that no one had any beef with him here about anything and though he read it, he absolutely won’t respond to it which makes me wonder if he knows something we don’t. David still hasn’t read or replied to anything yet and neither has PTG’s Facebook account.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Quick update, I tried to reassure Tiny that no one had any beef with him here about anything and though he read it, he absolutely won’t respond to it which makes me wonder if he knows something we don’t. David still hasn’t read or replied to anything yet and neither has PTG’s Facebook account.

Tiny has a very good reputation, I've never once heard a negative thing about him. So he's definitely good to go as a gunsmith! I've shot original XM3's that were built by him, and they always shot about half an MOA at 100 yards. I'd love to hear what he has to say about the PTG receivers and what's going on. No matter what he says, I don't think anything will ever hurt his good reputation, especially if he's a whistleblower and gives our community information about fraudulent products. That would actually make him look even better in our eyes! You can screenshot this and send it to him if you want. No one is angry with Tiny about anything, and he's a respectable gunsmith.

 

[Pondskipper]

I sent it to him, we will see what happens I suppose.

 

[Softtail103]

All yours USMCSGT0331

 

[USMCSGT0331]

I just got my M40a5 from McMillan. It has a G date code.

Nice custom rifle, but that's all it is, a custom rifle. There is absolutely no way that it's an M40A5 clone. It looks like a very nice rifle, and you're probably going enjoy it for a long time, but there's no reason to call it an M40A5. This designation and nomenclature actually means something, and we shouldn't just make up names for custom rifles that have nothing in common with the actual military rifles and their civilian clone builds. My personal opinion, others will have their own opinion on this.

 

[Softtail103]

.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Clone M40a5. Happy now? I emailed McMillan and told them to stop using the name M40a5. Should I also call GA Precision who advertise it on the their website?

I tried to be nice, I complemented your rifle, I clearly said that my post was my opinion and other people's opinions might very on this topic. And you respond with a passive aggressive attitude. Yeah man, sure, go call these companies and tell them they're wrong. You don't need my permission to do so, just go ahead and do it. Better yet, email those company's a link to this thread so that they can read this. Do it.

However, before you call up GA Precision and tell them that their M40A5 clone builds are wrong, you might want to see exactly what their clone builds look like. So, here's a screenshot of their website showing their M40A5 clone build:

And here's your custom rifle:

Notice how these 2 rifles have absolutely nothing in common beyond a Remington Model 700 receiver and Badger M5 bottom metal. Are you able to see these differences? Do you understand what an M40A5 clone is? Or is there a different reason for you posting in this thread?

There's literally no reason for you to drop you rifle in this thread, and yet here you are. This is a thread about fake PTG 40X receivers, not M40A5's. So why post your custom rifle here? Maybe you read my previous post in this thread where I specifically mentioned sniper rifle nomenclature, so you knew that at least someone would say something about your custom rifle being called an M40A5.

So, congrats, you got the exact response that you knew that you were going to get. This isn't the first time people have purposely done this in threads that are irrelevant to what they posted. You knew exactly what you were doing when you posted your custom rifle in a thread that's completely irrelevant to your rifle, and you got the response you wanted. It's that simple. We all know it, this isn't the first time this shit has happened in this forum, and it certainly won't be the last time it happens.

Did you have fun? Was this everything that you hoped it would be? I played my role to perfection, you're welcome.

To @Pondskipper, please accept my apologies for the massive thread derail.

 

[Pondskipper]

I tried to be nice, I complemented your rifle, I clearly said that my post was my opinion and other people's opinions might very on this topic. And you respond with a passive aggressive attitude. Yeah man, sure, go call these companies and tell them they're wrong. You don't need my permission to do so, just go ahead and do it. Better yet, email those company's a link to this thread so that they can read this. Do it.

However, before you call up GA Precision and tell them that their M40A5 clone builds are wrong, you might want to see exactly what their clone builds look like. So, here's a screenshot of their website showing their M40A5 clone build:

View attachment 8597681

And here's your custom rifle:

Notice how these 2 rifles have absolutely nothing in common beyond a Remington Model 700 receiver and Badger M5 bottom metal. Are you able to see these differences? Do you understand what an M40A5 clone is? Or is there a different reason for you posting in this thread?

There's literally no reason for you to drop you rifle in this thread, and yet here you are. This is a thread about fake PTG 40X receivers, not M40A5's. So why post your custom rifle here? Maybe you read my previous post in this thread where I specifically mentioned sniper rifle nomenclature, so you knew that at least someone would say something about your custom rifle being called an M40A5.

So, congrats, you got the exact response that you knew that you were going to get. This isn't the first time people have purposely done this in threads that are irrelevant to what they posted. You knew exactly what you were doing when you posted your custom rifle in a thread that's completely irrelevant to your rifle, and you got the response you wanted. It's that simple. We all know it, this isn't the first time this shit has happened in this forum, and it certainly won't be the last time it happens.

Did you have fun? Was this everything that you hoped it would be? I played my role to perfection, you're welcome.

To @Pondskipper, please accept my apologies for the massive thread derail.

Apologies? Hell I was eating popcorn reading this

 

[Pondskipper]

Muh m40a5 iz finushed

 

[Pondskipper]

Still no reply from Tony and Kiff still hasn’t read my messages though the ptg FB page did but didn’t reply. The (Sorta40) will be done Friday and here’s some of the photos of the rail and action after correcting and decking that shitty clip slot before it got blasted, the barrel screwed in and got coated.

 

[RemCustom6]

One other side note, from what I have read Remington never made a 40-X long action, knew a guy that had a 40-X .300 Win Mag, was a short action.

John

Not true, we did make Remington 40X long actions. Most all were built into 338 Lapua rigs but a few were 300 Win Mags as well. Pretty limited numbers but they do exist.

 

[Pondskipper]

Not true, we did make Remington 40X long actions. Most all were built into 338 Lapua rigs but a few were 300 Win Mags as well. Pretty limited numbers but they do exist.

Can you share any information on how this receiver ended up with a remington 700 serial number but marked 40x by chance?

 

[RemCustom6]

We did have 40X actions that were marked with a more standard 700 serial number series. That is especially common post 2000 or so. During my time at the Custom Shop I bet we saw more than 10 different serial number variations.

I have seen and heard a lot of what PTG is doing to all of the actions and components that they got from/through the Remington bankruptcy and more so from Kiff’s ties with Ken Da’Arcy who was the CEO of Remington when everything fell in the shitter, and I believe that POS is still the CEO.

Yeah. I believe this to be a legit action but in my opinion the U.S. stamp is definitely a PTG add on.

 

[Pondskipper]

We did have 40X actions that were marked with a more standard 700 serial number series. That is especially common post 2000 or so. During my time at the Custom Shop I bet we saw more than 10 different serial number variations.

I have seen and heard a lot of what PTG is doing to all of the actions and components that they got from/through the Remington bankruptcy and more so from Kiff’s ties with Ken Da’Arcy who was the CEO of Remington when everything fell in the shitter, and I believe that POS is still the CEO.

Yeah. I believe this to be a legit action but in my opinion the U.S. stamp is definitely a PTG add on.

I sincerely appreciate your expertise and clarification , that does clear up a whole lot of questions about it and given we couldn’t see a single sign of tampering with the serial number or model number when it was blasted down to the base metal, that makes a lot more sense. I wasn’t as overly butthurt about it given I absolutely plan of running the snot out of it but at the same time know and understand that if someone who was mislead like myself and had every intention of building a 100% correct safe queen that they would understandably be bent out of shape and PTG’s practices are definitely unethical to say the least not to mention blatantly lying to my face about it.

 

[Pondskipper]

That goes for everyone who took the time to look into this and share insight for that matter, I appreciate all of you! And a special thanks to usmcsgt0331 for the insight and comedic relief in contending with the troll. I’ll post some photos when the “Sorta-40” gets finished up if you guys would like to see it and keep you posted if I hear anything back from David Kiff.

 

[RemCustom6]

I would be very surprised if Kiff gets back to you. His practice of doing things like this goes way back. The man has no morals.

 

[Overwatch260]

A little late to the party but here's another example of the old style 40X markings circa 1966 or so

 

[308pirate]

That's the most horrible clip slot I've ever seen,

I think I could have done better with my Bosch drill and Dremel

 

[Pondskipper]

I would be very surprised if Kiff gets back to you. His practice of doing things like this goes way back. The man has no morals.

Yeah I’m pretty sure I won’t hear back from him either.

 

[Pondskipper]

All done.

 

[Pondskipper]

Kiff replied but it’s too long to screenshot so I’m going to copy and paste.

 

[Pondskipper]

Yes, AJ,
Please let them know. I have done my own research on this and confirmed these events with ex Custom Shop 2112 Armorer Tiny Briggs also Garrett from Dakota, Remington Custom Shop and Tim and Dwitt from Remington Defense, Ilion New York Custom shop.
Also, LtCor Norm Chandler from Iron Brigade Armory, George Gardner from GA Precision, and countless others, also the fellow Jim Harrison who marked them during and after the Remington Arms bankruptcy. It all makes sense. They we not true 1988 through 2019 of M24 SWS or R, G or E M24 or 1966 through 2019 M40's.
They were made during and after the bankruptcy but never made it to Ukraine because the bankruptcy attorney stopped all sales.
Yes, several companies over 4 years' time got these from one place or another.
I received 2,000 Receivers from Dakotas Remington Custom Shop, and Garrett told me some of those fagoosys were in there.
But, you need to remember, with all the guys I mentioned helping me sort this out, taught me the truth behind this with Yair Netanyahu from Israel and Eric from MDT,
Also, Saeed Alghfeli from Bynuna Defense, Dubai UAE. They stressed that this type of marked bankruptcy barreled action are now being marked, blueprinted, and built into Remington Arms
Model 700 M24 and built into both IDF M24 and Ukrainian M40s, although I have never seen The Ukraine M40s finished. I now Owen a Real Remington Arms IDF M24, and we looked to see if we still have a Remington Arms lasered M40, but I don't.
I was going to have LtCor Norm Chandler and 2112 Armorer Dwitt "Tiny" Briggs built one for me. You can not get a Remington Action now. We have all the last of everything. We have the last 395 real M24 Barreled Actions along with 96 real RACS and MSR chassis and Rifles. We purchased the remaining assets of Remington Arms Defense bankruptcy parts for 2 million dollars. Don't loud mouth folks know you get bad with the good when you purchased over 9,678 Rifles, barreled actions, and screwed up receivers along with the rare and good ones?
AJ, not too many folks would help me like this when I missed all this nonsense and Shot Show being in the hospital trying to get well. Believe me, a kidney infection with stones hurts.
Thank you very much, Dave Kiff

 

[Pondskipper]

AJ,
When I get back to work Monday or Tuesday, I will send you pictures of the IDF M24 lasered and real M24 Barreled Actions along with pictures of the Ukrainian M40s and Ukrainian Ukrainian M24 SWS Rifles being made now. I have just switched the MK13 builds over to Chris Higgins, the original Captain, who designed the MK13 with Jerry Stiller and I back during the war.
I also am Contracting Retired Veitnam Sniper LtCor Norm Chandler and 2112 Armorer Dwitt Tiny Briggs at Iron Brigade Armory to build real M40s, A1, A3, .
Then George Gardner at GA Precision is building our M24 SWS, M2010, XM2010 Rifles.
I will send you a few to test if you would check them out or anyone on your board. People who know me know I try not to cheat folks.
Although having 200 employees, we'll some have treated folks badly. But try and find good help, my friend. Again, AJ, you can share this also. The last thing I want is to have folks afraid of uneducated people's words. I thank you very much, God bless.
I need to settle down and get better

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Holy fuck, I have no idea where to even begin with this stupid shit! Does he have any other names to drop? That seems like a hobby of his at this point.

"They we not true 1988 through 2019 of M24 SWS or R, G or E M24 or 1966 through 2019 M40's.
They were made during and after the bankruptcy"

Yeah, no shit. He finally admits they're fake guns, and yet he sells them to people as the real deal. Fucking scumbag.

"People who know me know I try not to cheat folks."

Holy fuck, this is the absolute most insane thing Kiff has ever written! There's literally a saying on this forum - "There's 2 types of people in the gun world, those who have been screwed over by Dave Kiff, and those who will be screwed over by Dave Kiff at some point in the future." The first time I heard that saying it was from a vendor who used to do business with PTG. The guy sells fake shit left and right, and lies through his teeth. All he knows is cheating folks, otherwise he would be selling people fake receivers and 40X scope bases.

 

[Pondskipper]

He just offered me a job making 180k

 

[Pondskipper]

 

[Jrb572]

He just offered me a job making 180k

Why did he out of nowhere offer you 180k a year?

 

[Pondskipper]

Anyway, that’s all I’ve got so far, wish tiny would reply so we could hopefully get to the bottom of this.

 

[Pondskipper]

Why did he out of nowhere offer you 180k a year?

I genuinely don’t know, he just tossed that out there out of left field but at this point I don’t believe it nor would I leave where I’m at.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

And what role at PTG would be a $180k per year job? Or does he have another company managing hedge funds? I can't think of anything at PTG that would ever pay that much. Maybe laser engraving receivers? Lol.

Ask him if you can do it part time, 100% remote. Might as well get some money out of this, but good luck with that.

 

[Pondskipper]

And what role at PTG would be a $180k per year job? Or does he have another company managing hedge funds? I can't think of anything at PTG that would ever pay that much. Maybe laser engraving receivers? Lol.

Ask him if you can do it part time, 100% remote. Might as well get some money out of this, but good luck with that.

tempting but hard pass, i don’t believe i would be comfortable with my associates

 

[Pondskipper]

Wants to send me XM2010s for testing, WTH? I missed that part too

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Wants to send me XM2010s for testing, WTH? I missed that part too

Testing for what? I guess the US military XM2010 testing over a decade ago wasn't enough? What's left to test? Seriously, WTF

 

[Jrb572]

Wants to send me XM2010s for testing, WTH? I missed that part too

Maybe that’s the 180k a year Testing Ukrainian rifles. Shit I’ll take that job

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Kiff just posted this as a response to someone over on the M14 forum:

https://www.m14forum.com/threads/he...rs.547078/page-2?post_id=5023964#post-5023964

"You are incorrect, Everything you have received came from Pacific Tool purchasing first the Remington Custom Shop leftovers and then recently Remington Defense in Ilion New York.
If a handle came off a bolt it wasn't a PTG bolt as everyone knows PTG makes Military MK13 Stiller and Remington one piece bolts with integral Handles. Not Silver braze handles. PTG, also has a contract with the new Remington (RemArms) to make new 700, one piece bolts, bottom metal and takeapart Alpha bolts.
Although RemArms are getting two piece bolts from Spartan Michigan. Did you mention you purchased a left over short chambered Barreled Action for $399. Then you bitched and received a factory bolt?
PTG payed over 2 million dollars for Remington, Remington Custom Shop and Defense parts. We received 47 hacked up Remington Custom Shop Receivers along with 5,800 Short chambered Barreled Action for $365, each then sold them to folks for $399, and $425. We did receive 12 marked Remington Arms M40 and 12 Remington Arms M24 Recivers. PTG sold exactly what they purchased. Tim and Tiny from the New York Custom Shop and Garrett from the Dakota Custom Shop both told me those were marked and manufactured as tests. Garrett, 2112 Armorer Tiny nor Tim had anything to do with them, but did all say they seen them laying on shelves in New York and Dakota.
After the purchase of Remington Defense, PTG received more M24 SWS Barreled Actions and IDF M24 barreled actions. The M40, M24 and MK13 mod 0 Remington barreled receivers caught in the bankruptcy all read correctly.
The Remington Arms marked M24 barreled actions were all added on during the few days of the bankruptcy and US added for completion of sniper rifles. The left over imperfect laser and roll stamped receivers were sold to us along with the real McCoys.
Now we see several companies marking them the same way for IDF M24 sales to Israel.
We have all 395 of the last original M24 SWS, R and G stamped barreled actions. People should get there facts correct before they mouth off.
All parts PTG sell, came with reports, that led PTG to believe were real came from Remington Custom Shop, Remington Defense or Dakota. Not forged by PTG. I bet you delete this because you don't want folks to se the truth"

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Maybe that’s the 180k a year Testing Ukrainian rifles. Shit I’ll take that job

No shit! I hereby take back all my criticism of Kiff and PTG if I get to test random rifles for $180,000 per year! Might as well get paid to shoot stuff! Lol

 

[Jrb572]

Kiff just posted this as a response to someone over on the M14 forum:

https://www.m14forum.com/threads/he...rs.547078/page-2?post_id=5023964#post-5023964

"You are incorrect, Everything you have received came from Pacific Tool purchasing first the Remington Custom Shop leftovers and then recently Remington Defense in Ilion New York.
If a handle came off a bolt it wasn't a PTG bolt as everyone knows PTG makes Military MK13 Stiller and Remington one piece bolts with integral Handles. Not Silver braze handles. PTG, also has a contract with the new Remington (RemArms) to make new 700, one piece bolts, bottom metal and takeapart Alpha bolts.
Although RemArms are getting two piece bolts from Spartan Michigan. Did you mention you purchased a left over short chambered Barreled Action for $399. Then you bitched and received a factory bolt?
PTG payed over 2 million dollars for Remington, Remington Custom Shop and Defense parts. We received 47 hacked up Remington Custom Shop Receivers along with 5,800 Short chambered Barreled Action for $365, each then sold them to folks for $399, and $425. We did receive 12 marked Remington Arms M40 and 12 Remington Arms M24 Recivers. PTG sold exactly what they purchased. Tim and Tiny from the New York Custom Shop and Garrett from the Dakota Custom Shop both told me those were marked and manufactured as tests. Garrett, 2112 Armorer Tiny nor Tim had anything to do with them, but did all say they seen them laying on shelves in New York and Dakota.
After the purchase of Remington Defense, PTG received more M24 SWS Barreled Actions and IDF M24 barreled actions. The M40, M24 and MK13 mod 0 Remington barreled receivers caught in the bankruptcy all read correctly.
The Remington Arms marked M24 barreled actions were all added on during the few days of the bankruptcy and US added for completion of sniper rifles. The left over imperfect laser and roll stamped receivers were sold to us along with the real McCoys.
Now we see several companies marking them the same way for IDF M24 sales to Israel.
We have all 395 of the last original M24 SWS, R and G stamped barreled actions. People should get there facts correct before they mouth off.
All parts PTG sell, came with reports, that led PTG to believe were real came from Remington Custom Shop, Remington Defense or Dakota. Not forged by PTG. I bet you delete this because you don't want folks to se the truth"

Israel I thought it was Ukrainian

 

[Pondskipper]

He knows I’m not a hobbyist or avg plinker and wants to be able to say I bought off on them to others so they must be good, don’t think I’ll be having any of that because what’s going on is wrong. I know you guys don’t know me or the stuff I normally do but he does unfortunately and is trying to take advantage of that if that makes any sense.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

He knows I’m not a hobbyist or avg plinker and wants to be able to say I bought off on them to others so they must be good, don’t think I’ll be having any of that because what’s going on is wrong. I know you guys don’t know me or the stuff I normally do but he does unfortunately and is trying to take advantage of that if that makes any sense.

That does make sense, thank you for the clarification! But come on man, don't you want Kiff to name drop the fuck out of you in his next wall of text to someone?? That has to be the greatest honor ever! Lol